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All-Time Draft #12, Part I

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Old
09-18-2009, 04:32 PM
  #76
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Everyone can PM me their picks. I don't pick for a good long while.

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Old
09-18-2009, 06:25 PM
  #77
Leafs Forever
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Hmm, my trip took shorter than I thought it would..

Solid drafting so far, although I am slightly suprised at Bourque and Potvin's draft position. Although perhaps it has something to do with drafting with 12 more teams..

Drafting near the end will be an interesting experience; but it could have some very good benefits, with any luck.

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Old
09-18-2009, 07:16 PM
  #78
VanIslander
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someone please PM Bobby Ryan Getzlaf

Quote:
The Jim Robson Division and Foster Hewitt Division are DONE.

So the ONLY teams to post now are those from the Bob Cole Division:

(in any order - but only teams in this division post now, before the next division)

CanadiensFan - Syracuse Bulldogs DONE
Mr Bugg - Kimberley Dynamiters DONE
GodBlessCanada & raleh - Medicine Hat Tigers DONE
MadArcand - Hartford Whalers DONE
Cup 2010 Sens Rule - Ottawa 67's DONE
seventieslord & jareklajkosz- Regina Pats DONE
Bobby Ryan Getzlaf - New York Golden Blades
Leafs Forever - Cairo Desert Dogs DONE

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Old
09-18-2009, 07:18 PM
  #79
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remind Macleaf too that he has less than 4 hours left on his clock

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Old
09-18-2009, 07:56 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Solid drafting so far, although I am slightly suprised at Bourque and Potvin's draft position. Although perhaps it has something to do with drafting with 12 more teams..
People seem to get into a panic regarding having a top Dman. IMO, you should pick the best available for your first pick regardless of position. Pick a forward now & a Dman in round 2 & 3 & you have a damn nice 1stD pairing & also the nucleus of your first forward line.

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Old
09-18-2009, 08:13 PM
  #81
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The Mooseheads select Patrick Roy.

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Old
09-18-2009, 08:24 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappyline View Post
People seem to get into a panic regarding having a top Dman. IMO, you should pick the best available for your first pick regardless of position. Pick a forward now & a Dman in round 2 & 3 & you have a damn nice 1stD pairing & also the nucleus of your first forward line.
Got to agree with the bold; you should go for the BPA- worry more-so towards team building after the 1st round.

Solid pick with Roy. Although I wouldn't take him quite yet, you can't go wrong with the best playoff goalie of all-time.

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09-18-2009, 08:24 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappyline View Post
People seem to get into a panic regarding having a top Dman. IMO, you should pick the best available for your first pick regardless of position. Pick a forward now & a Dman in round 2 & 3 & you have a damn nice 1stD pairing & also the nucleus of your first forward line.
But IMO there are fewer defenders one could successfully defend as a #1 in an ATD context (as GBC said, probably around only 20) than there are #1 centers.

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Old
09-18-2009, 08:36 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post
But IMO there are fewer defenders one could successfully defend as a #1 in an ATD context (as GBC said, probably around only 20) than there are #1 centers.
You missed my point. Sure you have a great #1D but maybe your #2d is not as good as others. There are no right or wrong answers. its the team as a whole that matters. I won ATD #9 with a second string goalie (usually a back up)& a second tier #1 D. its how you build your team that counts.

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Old
09-18-2009, 08:38 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post
But IMO there are fewer defenders one could successfully defend as a #1 in an ATD context (as GBC said, probably around only 20) than there are #1 centers.
Exactly. And team building is the name of the game in this thing. If we're just ranking the best players ever then we're doing literally the same thing that's happening over on the history board. Potvin was the best player to build a team around for us. The next two best skaters IMO are both C, and a very good #1 C can be had in round two or even three.

Also After Orr, Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux, Harvey, Shore, Bourque, Hull, Beliveau, and Rocket the BPA is probably a goalie if you're simply ranking. GBC and I agree on a lot, but if we decided to go with a goalie with #11, oh boy...you'd all still be waiting. And we'd probably argue so much we'd never team up together in one of these things again!

I guess my point is that the BPA was probably not Potvin, but the guy who probably is is not the guy we want to build our team around.


Last edited by raleh: 09-18-2009 at 08:43 PM.
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Old
09-18-2009, 08:52 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raleh View Post
Exactly. And team building is the name of the game in this thing. If we're just ranking the best players ever then we're doing literally the same thing that's happening over on the history board. Potvin was the best player to build a team around for us. The next two best skaters IMO are both C, and a very good #1 C can be had in round two or even three.

Also After Orr, Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux, Harvey, Shore, Bourque, Hull, Beliveau, and Rocket the BPA is probably a goalie if you're simply ranking. GBC and I agree on a lot, but if we decided to go with a goalie with #11, oh boy...you'd all still be waiting. And we'd probably argue so much we'd never team up together in one of these things again!

I guess my point is that the BPA was probably not Potvin, but the guy who probably is is not the guy we want to build our team around.
Potvin is certainly a good pick. he went 11th in the last draft also. Interesting that he went ahead of 2D ranked ahead of him in the top 100. If Hull. beliveau, rocket had been still available would you have went for one of them before Potvin? just curious.

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09-18-2009, 08:56 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappyline View Post
Potvin is certainly a good pick. he went 11th in the last draft also. Interesting that he went ahead of 2D ranked ahead of him in the top 100. If Hull. beliveau, rocket had been still available would you have went for one of them before Potvin? just curious.
I suppose it's not giving away a secret to answer this question haha. We definitely would have taken Hull, Beliveau, or Rocket if any of them were available. I can only speak for myself, not GBC for sure, but I would have taken those guys ahead of Bourque as well. Not taking anything away from the Bourque selection, which was a very good one.

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09-18-2009, 10:03 PM
  #88
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This is actually the second straight draft in which we thought we would get Bourque, only to have him go sooner than we expected. (In ATD 11, we picked 10th, but were surprised when Eagle traded up).

Once I took a long look at the draft order, I knew Hull wouldn't be available - call it the pappy factor. And I figured Beliveau and Richard would go nine and 10. But if one of them would have slipped, we would have gone with a forward.

Once you get past the Richard/Beliveau/Hull/Shore/Harvey group - who I think should go five to nine, depending on priorities - I don't think there's much to choose between 10 and, say, 18. That's why I'm not a fan of the 10-14 slots.

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Old
09-18-2009, 10:09 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
This is actually the second straight draft in which we thought we would get Bourque, only to have him go sooner than we expected. (In ATD 11, we picked 10th, but were surprised when Eagle traded up).

Once I took a long look at the draft order, I knew Hull wouldn't be available - call it the pappy factor. And I figured Beliveau and Richard would go nine and 10. But if one of them would have slipped, we would have gone with a forward.

Once you get past the Richard/Beliveau/Hull/Shore/Harvey group - who I think should go five to nine, depending on priorities - I don't think there's much to choose between 10 and, say, 18. That's why I'm not a fan of the 10-14 slots.
Hrm.. you are underrating at least 2 players that in my opinion would not be a huge stretch to take in the top-10.

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Old
09-18-2009, 10:12 PM
  #90
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i'm having a tough time with this pick...

while most won't consider this player the bpa, he certainly is the player the thistles wanted to build their team around. easily a top-10 all-time defenceman and, in my opinion, top-5 all-time. he provides an incredible two-way presence to the blueline and, the versatility to line up as a centre for face-offs...

leonard "red" kelly (d)


there's no better post then the one eaglebelfour made last draft - so, i'll just copy that...

Stanley Cup Champion (1950, 1952, 1954, 1955, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1967)
Stanley Cup Finalist (1948, 1949, 1956, 1960)
First All-Star Team Defense (1951, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1955, 1957)
Second All-Star Team Defense (1950, 1956)
James Norris Memorial Trophy (1951**, 1952**, 1954)
Lady Byng Memorial Trophy (1951, 1953, 1954, 1961)
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1969)

Top-10 NHL in scoring (6th, 8th, 9th) *As a D*
Top-5 Scoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 4th, 4th, 5th)
Top-5 Goalscoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Scoring (6th) *As a C*
Top-10 Hart Nomination (2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 8th, 9th, 10th)
Top-5 Norris Nomination (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd) *Lost 4 years of prime as the Norris was not awarded*
Top-5 Lady Bing Nomination (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 4th)

''I think the biggest mistake the Red Wings ever made was to trade Red Kelly. We won nothing without him. - Gordie Howe

- #22 on The Hockey News' list of the 100 Greatest Hockey Players
- #18 on History of Hockey list of the 100 Greatest Hockey Players
- #14 on Joe Pelletier list of the 36 Greatest Hockey Players
- He was unanimously voted in the 1st All-Star team in 1951, 1952 and 1953.
- He could log up to 50 minutes of ice time in key games.
- XXXXX XXXXXXX called him the key component of the Detroit Red Wings dynasty of the 1950s.
- In 1954, he won the first ever James Norris Memorial Trophy. However, prior to 1954, he was the only defenseman to receive Hart consideration in 1950 and was by far the defenseman with the most Hart consideration in 1951 (3rd; XXXX XXXXXXXXXXX 7th) and in 1953 (3rd, no defenseman in the top-5).
- He was inducted into the Hall of Fame in 1968, only one year after he retired.

Defense/Physicality:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
Yet as good as he was offensively, he was better defensively. He had an uncanny knack of reading plays and breaking them up, and he controlled the puck in his own zone adeptly. To make his defensive legend even more impressive, Kelly excelled without taking many penalties himself. He took just 327 penalty minutes in 1316 career games and won the Lady Byng trophy as the game's most gentlemanly player 4 times. Given the nature of the position, it is almost unheard of to have a defenseman win the most gentlemanly player award once, let alone four times.

Although don't think Kelly didn't know how to handle himself. A former boxing champion in his youth, Kelly could handle himself if need be.
"I had a temper. I had red hair," Kelly laughs. "I was the welterweight boxing champ at St. Mike's. I could take care of myself. XXX XXXXXXX taught me you don't win games in the penalty box. You've got to stay on the ice. Players would try to get you off the ice sometimes but you're more valuable to a team when you're on the ice." - Red Kelly

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Old
09-18-2009, 10:15 PM
  #91
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VanIslander -- i tried to send you a pm but, your inbox was full. you're up!

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Old
09-18-2009, 10:16 PM
  #92
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Oops, nvm. I thought he was ranked lower than that. Good pick.

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Old
09-18-2009, 11:36 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jareklajkosz View Post
Hrm.. you are underrating at least 2 players that in my opinion would not be a huge stretch to take in the top-10.
Curious as to who they are. I can think of only one other that might fit in with this group--Richard/Beliveau/Hull/Shore/Harvey group

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Old
09-19-2009, 12:05 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by papershoes View Post

leonard "red" kelly (d)

One day, he'll get picked as the 5th best D in the draft, where he should be. Excellent selection! (Can you believe we were able to get Kelly in the 20's a couple of drafts ago!)

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Old
09-19-2009, 06:43 AM
  #95
VanIslander
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The Chicago Blackhawks select Stan The Man from Sokolče Mikita.



Four early seasons of 100+ PIMs followed later by two Lady Byngs in the same back-to-back seasons he also got his third and fourth Art Ross trophies and double Hart trophies, not to mention his fifth and sixth 1st team all-star center selections. He retired in 1980 as 2nd in all-time scoring to Gordie Howe.

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Old
09-19-2009, 11:11 AM
  #96
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I love Mikita. He's a great guy and is fairly easy to build a top-line around. Great offensively and defensively. Can both score and pass. I would have taken him sooner (although in all this, I am likely a bit bias)

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Old
09-19-2009, 12:08 PM
  #97
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I have MXD's pick, so PM me when MacArcand has picked.

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Old
09-19-2009, 01:30 PM
  #98
pappyline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
I have MXD's pick, so PM me when MacArcand has picked.
I also have MXD's pick. However, we may be waiting a while as I believe Madarcand is away for the weekend.

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Old
09-19-2009, 01:43 PM
  #99
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Somebody please PM Bobby Ryan Getzlaf and tell him his New York Golden Blades need a roster thread post ASAP.

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Old
09-19-2009, 01:49 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Somebody please PM Bobby Ryan Getzlaf and tell him his New York Golden Blades need a roster thread post ASAP.
Done.

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