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The 10th Annual Jason Bonsignore Award

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Old
04-05-2004, 04:22 PM
  #26
Howard35
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ive seen nystrom play recently, and let me tell you he definitly belongs on the list, every shift he was one of the worse forwards out there for michigan....

anyway... kuznetsov and jesse wallin are both horrible

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Old
04-05-2004, 04:25 PM
  #27
Grift69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokeyClause
I think Taticek or Nystrom have a better chance at the Bonnie award than Upshall.
I too am also really high on Upshall.

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Old
04-05-2004, 04:25 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsilon
It's more of the "omg this guy isn't over in North America yet - BUST" attitude that you see frequently, as if bringing a guy along slowly nowadays automatically makes him junk.
Hmm... you're referring to Koivu.

I see.

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Old
04-05-2004, 05:45 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db23
I am getting a lot of flack for suggesting that certain top 10 picks could turn out to be total flops, so I went back 10 years in the draft to check things out. That led to the "Jason Bonsignore Award" in honour of the 4th overall pick in the 1994 draft. I offer some annual nominees for the award, suggest your own.

1994 - Jason Bonsignore
1995 - Terry Ryan
1996 - Alex Volchkov
1997 - Daniel Tkaczuk
1998 - Jeff Heerema
1999 - Pavl Brendl
2000 - Lars Jonsson, Brent Krahn (tie)
2001 - Pascal Leclaire
2002 - Peter Taticek, Eric Nystrom (tie)
2003 - Andrei Kastitsyn

The worst offenders at the draft board seem to be Canadian teams, interestingly enough. Calgary, Montreal, Edmonton, along with the Rangers.

Since you arrival on these board I have been impressed by your lack of hockey knowledge and your crappy posts. You act like you were holding the truth while you obviously don't have a clue of what you are talking about. I would go as far to say that you have probably never see one of those guy that you label as bust. Kastitsyn doesn't have a pro contract yet and you are already calling him a bust. I mean what Thomas Vanek, Braydon Coburn, Hugh Jessiman or Michalek have done more this year than Kastitsyn? Squat. Still, they are good prospects. I would also add that Pascal Leclaire, Peter Taticek and Eric Nystrom are, IMO, far from reaching the "Bust" status. It isn't because high first rounders don't hit the NHL right away that they are bust.

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Old
04-05-2004, 06:03 PM
  #30
Cayouche5
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No suprise here db23 always come to the habs board to say our prospects are crap he always say Kastitsyn is a bust he can't even play in russia bla bla bla man the guy is 18 years old.

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04-05-2004, 06:26 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
1995 - Terry Ryan, Steve Kelly
1996 - Alexandre Volchkov, Johnathan Aitken
1997 - Daniel Tkaczuk
1998 - Michael Rupp, Manny Malhotra, Rico Fata,
1999 - Brian Finley, Tim Connolly, Kris Beech, Pavel Brendl
2000 - Brent Krahn
2001 - Stanislav Chistov
2002 - Scottie Upshall
2003 - Braydon Coburn
Upshall and Coburn? Please!
Let's give the 19 year olds a chance before labeling them busts.

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Old
04-05-2004, 06:32 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cayouche5
No suprise here db23 always come to the habs board to say our prospects are crap he always say Kastitsyn is a bust he can't even play in russia bla bla bla man the guy is 18 years old.
Yes, but he's massively in love with Komisarek. That love fest cancels out his anti-AK vibes.

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Old
04-05-2004, 06:33 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db23
2001 - Pascal Leclaire
2002 - Peter Taticek, Eric Nystrom (tie)
2003 - Andrei Kastitsyn
Laaaaaaaame. I think it's a bit too early to call any of these guys flops. ESPECIALLY when they've done nothing to suggest that they are. I don't know much about Taticek or Nystrom but Pascal and Andrei are both very talented players and are still developing. There's nothing that makes them flops so far.

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Old
04-05-2004, 06:41 PM
  #34
tom_servo
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No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees. I think it's fun.

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:01 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom_servo
No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees. I think it's fun.
You can keep telling them this, but they just won't listen

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:02 PM
  #36
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The Canucks sure drafted a bunch of bums for a while there but these two stick out..

91 - 7th overall Alex Stojanov
92 - 21st overall Libor Polasek

Only good thing that came out of Stojanov was that Pittsburgh was kind enough
to give us Naslund for him. =)

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:14 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanCanFanEDM
Only good thing that came out of Stojanov was that Pittsburgh was kind enough
to give us Naslund for him. =)
Well that would've been good enough for me
Still, that was a horrible trade for Pittsburgh...

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:15 PM
  #38
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The aptly named Bonsignore award could go to an Oiler every year since they picked him.
94 - Bonsignore
95 - Steve Kelly
96 - Boyd Devereaux
97 - Michel Riesen (14th overall)
98 - Michael Heinrich (13th overall)

The last two are just outside proper Bonsignore Award consideration, but still. That's a damn awful track record. The way things are looking right now,
99 - Jani Rita (13th overall)
may soon be on the list. I am losing patience.

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:26 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
1995 - Terry Ryan, Steve Kelly
1996 - Alexandre Volchkov, Johnathan Aitken
1997 - Daniel Tkaczuk
1998 - Michael Rupp, Manny Malhotra, Rico Fata,
1999 - Brian Finley, Tim Connolly, Kris Beech, Pavel Brendl
2000 - Brent Krahn
2001 - Stanislav Chistov
2002 - Scottie Upshall
2003 - Braydon Coburn
Upshall has been very good as a rookie in the AHL, Chistov had a bad soph season, but there's definetely a worse bust from 2001(here's looking at you, Svitov), and wile Coburn took a a bit of a step backwards, from what I've heard, the Huge Specimen had a worse season(I'm probably wrong though). I'd also probably put in Alexei Smirnov as 2000's Bonsignore instead of Krahn.

My list:

1995: Steve Kelly
1996: Alexandre Volchkov
1997: Daniel Tkaczuk
1998: Michael Rupp
1999: Pavel Brendl
2000: Alexei Smirnov
2001: Alexander Svitov
2002: Eric Nystrom
2003: Hugh Jessiman

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Old
04-05-2004, 07:31 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom_servo
No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees. I think it's fun.
One thing that most of the "Bonnie" winners shared in common is that in the year following the draft they did not improve their stats or move up a level of competition. From that you can get an idea of which of the newer candidates is legitimate. From 2001, Leclaire never improved his stats in the Q. Actually they got worse each year. He has never posted a GA average under 3 at any level. From 2002, Nystrom's stats at the U of M have gotten worse each year that he has been there. From 2003, Kastitsyn hasn't improved at all in the RSL and actually was demoted a couple of level's for most of the year. So they are my picks.

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04-05-2004, 09:07 PM
  #41
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How in the world is Leclaire a bust.

He is a 21 year old goalie, a mere TWO years removed from his draft.

On top of that, he has shown improvement. When Leclaire first got to Syracuse last season, the organization changed part of his style and pads some. The kid has shown signifigant improvement from last year to this year.

His GAA are down half a goal a game...
His SV is up roughly .25 points. from .890 to .915 Thats a pretty big jump.

In his first two games of NHL action he didnt look out of place at all. If you go by the stat sheets alone, his NHL stats wont blow you away, but if you actually watched the game you would understand. He played very well, and the CBJ completly sucked.

Since when is a goalie labled a bust 2 years after his draft while showing great improvement in his game. What does he have to do.

I am not saying leclaire will be a vezina winning goalie... but come on, he is 21.

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:19 PM
  #42
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If only you researched this thread half as well as you did Pascal Leclaire.

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:22 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanCanFanEDM
Only good thing that came out of Stojanov was that Pittsburgh was kind enough
to give us Naslund for him. =)

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:25 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by db23
I am getting a lot of flack for suggesting that certain top 10 picks could turn out to be total flops, so I went back 10 years in the draft to check things out. That led to the "Jason Bonsignore Award" in honour of the 4th overall pick in the 1994 draft. I offer some annual nominees for the award, suggest your own.

1994 - Jason Bonsignore
1995 - Terry Ryan
1996 - Alex Volchkov
1997 - Daniel Tkaczuk
1998 - Jeff Heerema
1999 - Pavl Brendl
2000 - Lars Jonsson, Brent Krahn (tie)
2001 - Pascal Leclaire
2002 - Peter Taticek, Eric Nystrom (tie)
2003 - Andrei Kastitsyn

The worst offenders at the draft board seem to be Canadian teams, interestingly enough. Calgary, Montreal, Edmonton, along with the Rangers.

How can you say anyone drafted last year is really a bust? Kastsytsin is not a bust at all IMO.

Petr Taticek was hurt badly with groin problems in SSM but he played through and had a bad year. In San Antonio, he damaged ligaments in his elbow and played poorly for the first half of the season. Lately, he has come on and in the 4 games after his return, he had about 2 goals and 4 assists. He will take a longer time to develop but keep in mind, his potential is supposedly that of a 3rd line center. He IMO will be in the NHL someday.

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:32 PM
  #45
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tom_servo said:

No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees.

So I will say:

No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees.

Is anyone listening this time?

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:39 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kubina_Fan
tom_servo said:

No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees.

So I will say:

No one is labeling anyone a bust. These are merely early nominees.

Is anyone listening this time?
I will quote you just in case anyone ignores your post.

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:47 PM
  #47
Patty Ice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marmax
I mean what ... Michalek have done more this year than Kastitsyn?
Play in the NHL?

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Old
04-05-2004, 09:51 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ejh18
How in the world is Leclaire a bust.

He is a 21 year old goalie, a mere TWO years removed from his draft.

On top of that, he has shown improvement. When Leclaire first got to Syracuse last season, the organization changed part of his style and pads some. The kid has shown signifigant improvement from last year to this year.

His GAA are down half a goal a game...
His SV is up roughly .25 points. from .890 to .915 Thats a pretty big jump.

In his first two games of NHL action he didnt look out of place at all. If you go by the stat sheets alone, his NHL stats wont blow you away, but if you actually watched the game you would understand. He played very well, and the CBJ completly sucked.

Since when is a goalie labled a bust 2 years after his draft while showing great improvement in his game. What does he have to do.

I am not saying leclaire will be a vezina winning goalie... but come on, he is 21.
Still, the top AHL goalies had averages under 2 per game. I think, there was about 10 of them under 2 per game. Their Save % were up around .930 to .950. So Pascal was near the bottom in both categories. The other thing is (not meaning to be cruel) he just LOOKS like he was born to lose. Every picture I've seen of him looks like a mug shot of a suspected car thief who is supporting a drug habit.

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Old
04-05-2004, 10:10 PM
  #49
Blind Gardien
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Can I retroactive the Bonnies through the modern draft era? (Starting 1980, say).

1980 - Doug Wickenheiser (#1, MTL) (not a total bust... but #1?)
1981 - Doug Smith (#2, LA)
1982 - Gord Kluzak (#1, BOS) (not his fault tho' -- Yaremchuk, Trottier #7,8 otherwise)
1983 - Andrew McBain (#8, WAS)
1984 - Craig Redmond (#6, LA)
1985 - Jim Sandlak (#4, VAN)
1986 - Neil Brady (#3, NJ)
1987 - Wayne McBean (#4, LA)
1988 - Darrin Shannon (#4, PIT), Daniel Dore (#5, QUE)
1989 - Dave Chyzowski (#2, NYI)
(aside: to my mind, there is a bit of a quantum leap forward in the quality of drafting starting in the 90's, esp. 1993 onwards, compared to earlier years when you could find half or more of 1st rounders busting or just being cup-of-coffee players... partly due to the European influence, and partly due to smarter management teams putting more emphasis on scouting).
1990 - Scott Scissons (#6, NYI)
1991 - Pat Falloon (#2, SJ) (but for pure bust - Alek Stojanov #7, VAN)
1992 - Todd Warriner (#4, QUE)
1993 - Jesper Mattsson (#18, CAL) (you might want Daigle #1...)
1994 - Bonsignore (#4, EDM)
1995 - Steve Kelly (#6, EDM), Terry Ryan (#8, MTL)
1996 - Alexandre Volchkov (#4, EDM)
1997 - Daniel Tkachuk (#6, CAL)
from 1998 onwards, it's more like predicting who will be the busts, per the poster...
1998 - Jeff Heerema (#11, CAR) Hon.Mention: Rupp, Henrich, Desrochers, Chouinards
1999 - Denis Shvidki (#12, FLO - the surest bet for busthood)... ample room for Connolly, Finley, Beech, Pyatt, even Lundmark to be top-10 busts
2000 - Nikita Alexeev (#8, TB) - HM: Krahn, Hainsey, Kriukov
2001 - Stan Chistov (#5, ANA) - I hate to say it, because I picked him at the time, tho' I still think he'll be decent, maybe not just the star I envisaged. HM: Umberger more likely for pure busthood, Jens Karlsson also
2002 - Taticek (#9, FLA)
2003 - Vanek (#5, BUF), HM: Jessiman
2004 - Ovechkin (#1, PIT) (kidding! )

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Old
04-05-2004, 10:21 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien
Can I retroactive the Bonnies through the modern draft era? (Starting 1980, say).

1980 - Doug Wickenheiser (#1, MTL) (not a total bust... but #1?)
1981 - Doug Smith (#2, LA)
1982 - Gord Kluzak (#1, BOS) (not his fault tho' -- Yaremchuk, Trottier #7,8 otherwise)
1983 - Andrew McBain (#8, WAS)
1984 - Craig Redmond (#6, LA)
1985 - Jim Sandlak (#4, VAN)
1986 - Neil Brady (#3, NJ)
1987 - Wayne McBean (#4, LA)
1988 - Darrin Shannon (#4, PIT), Daniel Dore (#5, QUE)
1989 - Dave Chyzowski (#2, NYI)
(aside: to my mind, there is a bit of a quantum leap forward in the quality of drafting starting in the 90's, esp. 1993 onwards, compared to earlier years when you could find half or more of 1st rounders busting or just being cup-of-coffee players... partly due to the European influence, and partly due to smarter management teams putting more emphasis on scouting).
1990 - Scott Scissons (#6, NYI)
1991 - Pat Falloon (#2, SJ) (but for pure bust - Alek Stojanov #7, VAN)
1992 - Todd Warriner (#4, QUE)
1993 - Jesper Mattsson (#18, CAL) (you might want Daigle #1...)
1994 - Bonsignore (#4, EDM)
1995 - Steve Kelly (#6, EDM), Terry Ryan (#8, MTL)
1996 - Alexandre Volchkov (#4, EDM)
1997 - Daniel Tkachuk (#6, CAL)
from 1998 onwards, it's more like predicting who will be the busts, per the poster...
1998 - Jeff Heerema (#11, CAR) Hon.Mention: Rupp, Henrich, Desrochers, Chouinards
1999 - Denis Shvidki (#12, FLO - the surest bet for busthood)... ample room for Connolly, Finley, Beech, Pyatt, even Lundmark to be top-10 busts
2000 - Nikita Alexeev (#8, TB) - HM: Krahn, Hainsey, Kriukov
2001 - Stan Chistov (#5, ANA) - I hate to say it, because I picked him at the time, tho' I still think he'll be decent, maybe not just the star I envisaged. HM: Umberger more likely for pure busthood, Jens Karlsson also
2002 - Taticek (#9, FLA)
2003 - Vanek (#5, BUF), HM: Jessiman
2004 - Ovechkin (#1, PIT) (kidding! )
Oooh...scary. Return Of The Retro Clunkers!
Whistling Past The Graveyard. Attack of the Killer Tomatos!

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