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Betts - why didn't you sign him?

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Old
09-25-2009, 10:40 PM
  #1
Banger
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Betts - why didn't you sign him?

Flyer fan here and we're probably going to sign him the next day or two for reportedly around $600K. Came to camp as a tryout and has earned a spot and has looked very solid for his role...4th line center, physical, very good Pker...so what's the dirt why didn't the Rangers sign him? Not a Tort guy? Did he want too much money?

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09-25-2009, 10:43 PM
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Flyer fan here and we're probably going to sign him the next day or two for reportedly around $600K. Came to camp as a tryout and has earned a spot and has looked very solid for his role...4th line center, physical, very good Pker...so what's the dirt why didn't the Rangers sign him? Not a Tort guy? Did he want too much money?
We have younger guys who are ready to play in the nhl so we let him go. He was great for us though. Played his heart out here.

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09-25-2009, 10:50 PM
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I think Betts was a bit too one-dimensional for Torts' liking. Good PKer with solid defensive ability but zero offensive skill.

Torts is all about "offense, offense, offense" and Betts didn't exactly fit the mold. As evidenced by Gaborik's shorthanded goal last night, he wants the PK to capitalize on the transition, and Betts couldn't get anything going offensively.

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09-25-2009, 10:51 PM
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Blair Betts is the kind of guy you want to have paired up with you in a foxhole. He does the work. He's not glamorous, his stat sheet leads you to believe he's an afterthought, but he's good to save you probably a goal against per game. With the roster you guys have, he might lead your forwards in icetime just killing penalties.

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09-25-2009, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
I think Betts was a bit too one-dimensional for Torts' liking. Good PKer with solid defensive ability but zero offensive skill.

Torts is all about "offense, offense, offense" and Betts didn't exactly fit the mold. As evidenced by Gaborik's shorthanded goal last night, he wants the PK to capitalize on the transition, and Betts couldn't get anything going offensively.
it's funny the Flyers are going in the opposite direction..after Richards/Carter nearly breaking the all time short handed record last year they were looking for PKers to lighten their load so they got Betts/Laperriere.

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09-25-2009, 11:18 PM
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Blair Betts is the kind of guy you want to have paired up with you in a foxhole. He does the work. He's not glamorous, his stat sheet leads you to believe he's an afterthought, but he's good to save you probably a goal against per game. With the roster you guys have, he might lead your forwards in icetime just killing penalties.
LOL, I think you're right. He strikes me as a heart and soul guy. I think he's going to be a nice addition. The Flyers don't need offense, they were looking for a role player who could player center, decent faceoff guy and cheap.

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09-25-2009, 11:28 PM
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it's funny the Flyers are going in the opposite direction..after Richards/Carter nearly breaking the all time short handed record last year they were looking for PKers to lighten their load so they got Betts/Laperriere.
Yup, you guys have more than enough offense so Betts makes sense. The Rangers.... not so much.

Betts is a good teammate, though. He understands his role and will never complain about lack of ice time. Just seems like an overall nice guy, quiet and softspoken.

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09-25-2009, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by SML View Post
Blair Betts is the kind of guy you want to have paired up with you in a foxhole. He does the work. He's not glamorous, his stat sheet leads you to believe he's an afterthought, but he's good to save you probably a goal against per game. With the roster you guys have, he might lead your forwards in icetime just killing penalties.
Now that's strongly overrating him. Are you saying we would have gave up 300 goals against without him last year (compared to just 218 with him last year?)

He might have helped stop a few scoring chances here and there with his 9 minutes of ice time..that's about it.

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09-25-2009, 11:40 PM
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Because he wasn't a well-rounded hockey player (nice way of putting it).

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09-25-2009, 11:45 PM
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Now that's strongly overrating him. Are you saying we would have gave up 300 goals against without him last year (compared to just 218 with him last year?)

He might have helped stop a few scoring chances here and there with his 9 minutes of ice time..that's about it.
I think he's referring to the fact that the Flyers are going to take penalties...

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09-25-2009, 11:49 PM
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Anthony Mauro
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I think he's referring to the fact that the Flyers are going to take penalties...
There's no way a sane person can quantify amount of goals saved through blocked shots. Especially when the claim is a goal a game.

Betts is a forward. Consider how many point, half board shots are labeled quality scoring chances.

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Old
09-25-2009, 11:51 PM
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LOL, I think you're right. He strikes me as a heart and soul guy. I think he's going to be a nice addition. The Flyers don't need offense, they were looking for a role player who could player center, decent faceoff guy and cheap.
you're gonna love him. great penalty killer and a tenacious shot blocker. solid in the faceoff circle and fearless.

there just wasn't any room for him on our club

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Old
09-25-2009, 11:53 PM
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Greg NYR
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most consistant ranger since the lockout, brought it every night. sad to see him go

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09-26-2009, 12:16 AM
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i think that unless you are a fighter it is hard keeping a job on any club for an extended period of time on the 4th line. i always saw the 4th line as a place to slowly introduce younger guys and see if they could cut it. But having someone who is a career 4th line guy or two in the rangers case last year, blocks a spot that could be taken by young guy.

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09-26-2009, 12:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Greg NYR View Post
most consistant ranger since the lockout, brought it every night. sad to see him go
Consistent perhaps but in a very low skill range. Same dynamic took place with fans when we lost another 'heart and soul' guy who worked hard, was a great PKer and couldn't hit the side of a barn with a penny - can't even remember his name and he was never actually missed (Jeff something, IIRC).

It's easy to forget the mistakes that Betts made in giving the puck away more than he ever should have for all his defensive genius. Or that he just couldn't score no matter how easy the chance. These threads often read like eulogies - exaggerating the good and ignoring the bad.

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09-26-2009, 12:41 AM
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I think it comes down to a philosophy change - Torts feels he needs more offense from that slot and Betts doesn't really fit that style.

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09-26-2009, 12:41 AM
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most consistant ranger since the lockout, brought it every night. sad to see him go
Callahan disagrees with this.

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Old
09-26-2009, 05:19 AM
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Torts wants something very specific out of his 4th liners. He wants energy, hitting, hard skating, and 6 minutes a game. He thinks his top players should be playing top minutes and as insanely good of a PKer Betts is, Torts just doesn't think your 4th liner should be eating up minutes (PK min in this case) from your top players. That and the other reasons stated. I think Betts was looking for a raise from his 615K last year and even with you guys, it doesn't look like he will get it. If he came in Slats office and said "I will play for 600K" maybe Slats takes that deal. But when he's looking for a raise and you have cheaper kids ready to replace him, I think Slats says "thanks for your service. Good luck in your job search."

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09-26-2009, 05:42 AM
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Callahan disagrees with this.
No, Callahan had a stretch in his "sophomore" season where he was pretty bad, and even got sent down to Hartford. Of course for a young player that's not unusual, but I'd still say Betts was more consistant (although like others have said on a low skill level, but high work ethic).

I think he was maybe asking for too much at the end of last season, and thus Sather brought in Boyle. And now that Betts would probably sign for cheap there are no roster spots left.

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09-26-2009, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by FLYLine24 View Post
Now that's strongly overrating him. Are you saying we would have gave up 300 goals against without him last year (compared to just 218 with him last year?)

He might have helped stop a few scoring chances here and there with his 9 minutes of ice time..that's about it.
It might be a bit of an exaggeration, but I don't think by much. There really is no stat that's going to show you what he does exactly. But between winning key faceoffs in your zone, constantly pressuring the puck carriers, and the amount of shots he blocks, I think if you had a lazy guy playing his same role, yeah, there's probably a goals worth of mistakes to be made in there that Blair Betts doesn't make each game. We had the best PK in the league last year and he was no small part of it. Defensive effort is just that, it is EFFORT. Effort which Betts never failed to make when the team leaned on him to do so. So maybe a half a goal a game? Even a third, that's not the point. You need one shift where you absolutely HAVE to hold a lead, Put Betts in the faceoff circle if I'm the coach.

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09-26-2009, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine24 View Post
Callahan disagrees with this.
Callahan has been with us since the lockout? gee where does the time fly

Callahan was injured/sent down in a season ,so yes, betts was the most consistant ranger since the lockout.

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Old
09-26-2009, 07:57 AM
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Donald Brashear?

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Old
09-26-2009, 09:38 AM
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Our major issue is scoring and we have only 1 elite forward. We need scoring from everywhere so bad they are probably looking for Lundqvist to chip in a few. He does what he does very well, but for New York it isn't enough in the team concept.

Now for a team like Philly, with what 7 thirty goal scorers, they can afford to have a specialist like him. He'll score more for you than he did for us just by being surrounded with so many threats, even on the 4th line. He won't generate too much 5 on 5 but he's safe and smart. Plus he's a lock to turn in amazing pk performances. If you wanted to improve that end of special teams you got a good player.

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09-26-2009, 10:07 AM
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Betts is good at what he does--penalty kill, faceoffs etc.--it's just that he doesn't have a creative (in terms of offense) bone in his body and he's really not that physical. He is excellent team guy who will give up his body to make a play or block a shot and never complain--he's never going to be more than a 4th liner though and at the point where the Rangers are at there are too many younger guys moving up the food chain who offer more. At 27 or 28 it was time for him to go.

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09-26-2009, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by SML View Post
It might be a bit of an exaggeration, but I don't think by much. There really is no stat that's going to show you what he does exactly. But between winning key faceoffs in your zone, constantly pressuring the puck carriers, and the amount of shots he blocks, I think if you had a lazy guy playing his same role, yeah, there's probably a goals worth of mistakes to be made in there that Blair Betts doesn't make each game. We had the best PK in the league last year and he was no small part of it. Defensive effort is just that, it is EFFORT. Effort which Betts never failed to make when the team leaned on him to do so. So maybe a half a goal a game? Even a third, that's not the point. You need one shift where you absolutely HAVE to hold a lead, Put Betts in the faceoff circle if I'm the coach.
I like betts too, but seriously, stop making up stats. even half a goal or a third per game is absurd. u make it sound like every defensive play made would have resulted in a goal otherwise.

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