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News & Notes 2009 II

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Old
07-30-2009, 02:01 PM
  #1
Langway
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News & Notes 2009 II

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
I do like Mike Green, but if I were picking Canada's Olympic team right now, I think it's no better than 50/50 that I'd have him in that top seven.
Yeah, I tend to agree. I'd probably take Niedermayer & Boyle both if I were looking for that type of defenseman. 2014...he'll be there (assuming NHLers are, which I tend to think will get sorted out).

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07-30-2009, 02:08 PM
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It cracks me up seeing people talk about Mike Green like he has the defensive ability of Phil Housely of Dimitry Mironov. He's easily one of the top 15 d-men in the league at stopping the other team from scoring, which is the whole point of defense.

That would be quite a bit of motivation for him if he was left off the olympic team after missing the last 2 all-star games. When was the last time a guy finished on the first team all-star team and missed the mid-season allstar game?

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07-30-2009, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foy View Post
He's easily one of the top 15 d-men in the league at stopping the other team from scoring, which is the whole point of defense.
I like Mike Green as much as the next guy, but I feel that is quite unsubstantiated.

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07-30-2009, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reyna View Post
I like Mike Green as much as the next guy, but I feel that is quite unsubstantiated.
look at that post in the last thread about his defensive value. I believe he was in the top 5. Every time some stats wonk tries to create a rubric to measure d-men and talk about how awful Mike Green is, Green ends up in the top 10 on their statistical measurement. Most of that is because when Green is on the ice the other team doesn't even have the puck, as opposed to play in his own end, but hey, I don't care how he gets it done so long as it gets done.

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07-30-2009, 02:22 PM
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Whoever may be criticizing Green for not playing D, it's not the statheads. Stats love Green, even defensively.

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07-30-2009, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foy View Post
look at that post in the last thread about his defensive value. I believe he was in the top 5. Every time some stats wonk tries to create a rubric to measure d-men and talk about how awful Mike Green is, Green ends up in the top 10 on their statistical measurement. Most of that is because when Green is on the ice the other team doesn't even have the puck, as opposed to play in his own end, but hey, I don't care how he gets it done so long as it gets done.
The best defence is a great puck-possession offense.

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07-30-2009, 02:29 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foy View Post
look at that post in the last thread about his defensive value. I believe he was in the top 5. Every time some stats wonk tries to create a rubric to measure d-men and talk about how awful Mike Green is, Green ends up in the top 10 on their statistical measurement. Most of that is because when Green is on the ice the other team doesn't even have the puck, as opposed to play in his own end, but hey, I don't care how he gets it done so long as it gets done.
That same link also said that Zach Parise and Pavel Datsyuk are better forwards than Ovechkin. I suppose if you agree with that, then there's no reason to say Mike Green isn't top 15 defensively.

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07-30-2009, 02:35 PM
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Here's the disconnect.

Mike Green is effective at preventing the puck from going into his own net.

On the other hand, Mike Green is average at defending odd man rushes, one on one coverage, and making an outlet pass under pressure.

The first does not negate the second.

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07-30-2009, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Here's the disconnect.

Mike Green is effective at preventing the puck from going into his own net.

On the other hand, Mike Green is average at defending odd man rushes, one on one coverage, and making an outlet pass under pressure.

The first does not negate the second.
See, that's the caveat I keep using. I would say he's above average at odd-man rushes and outlet passes.

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07-30-2009, 02:42 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foy View Post
See, that's the caveat I keep using. I would say he's above average at odd-man rushes and outlet passes.
Passing under pressure is, in my lowly opinion, the weakest part of his game.

And honestly, when he makes a defensive mistake, a lot of times his skating is just so damn good that he can recover and make the right play.

He does things his own way, and it works. It's a little nerve wracking, but 30 goals make that pill a little easier to swallow.

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Old
07-30-2009, 02:53 PM
  #11
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You know who I think is best on our team at outlet passes under pressure? I'm probably going to get flayed alive for this, but Jeff Schultz. It's the one thing he does better than any other d-man on this team. He gets the damn puck going the other way when it is on his stick.

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07-30-2009, 03:02 PM
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I think Poti is the man for the job. Its hard to say though, teams dont really put much pressure on defensemen nearly as much as they used to. They gum up the walls and intercept the little chips up and boards and what not. The old school true test used to be when the defensemen was just about to get nailed. Who can make that pass. I think its gotta be Poti regardless of how teams forecheck us.

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07-30-2009, 03:04 PM
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3 regulars, and 3 different opinions. Go figure.

To me, Pothier is far and away the best passer on our blueline.

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07-30-2009, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
3 regulars, and 3 different opinions. Go figure.

To me, Pothier is far and away the best passer on our blueline.
It's not like any of us have said that it was Erskine that was great at passing. The differing opinions is a direct result of how balanced our d is. We've got a whole bunch of second pair d-men, and not a lot of top d-men.

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07-30-2009, 03:07 PM
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Erskine is the best skater of the bunch though.

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Old
07-30-2009, 03:11 PM
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I think the lack of hitting make it harder to tell who is our standout breakout passer. They all can be ok on any given night. I agree Sarge is a little bit under the radar though. And its tough to overlook Green, our own Norris runner up. But to me, if a defensemen cant glance up real quick and find a forward or way to clear the puck up ice, they probably shouldnt be defensemen. A lot of it has to do with forwards getting into position to receive a pass. I cant tell you how many times in roller hockey I am on D getting pressure all my teammates flat footed behind opposing players. Over and over. Impossible to breakout.

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Old
07-30-2009, 07:00 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Erskine is the best skater of the bunch though.
erskine > coffey, without question.

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Old
07-30-2009, 09:48 PM
  #18
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I was browsing the Hawks board and saw a video clip on Keith's training and noticed Green in the background. The website has some clips of Green's workouts and stuff, kind of interesting.
http://stacktv.stack.com/video.aspx?...6621281001_364

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Old
07-30-2009, 10:54 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foy View Post
You know who I think is best on our team at outlet passes under pressure? I'm probably going to get flayed alive for this, but Jeff Schultz. It's the one thing he does better than any other d-man on this team. He gets the damn puck going the other way when it is on his stick.
That's cause he is scared ****less when he has the puck, he treats the puck like it has swine flu tbh rofl.



sad photochop i know but i are damn drunk atm.

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07-31-2009, 12:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkproducer View Post
That's cause he is scared ****less when he has the puck, he treats the puck like it has swine flu tbh rofl.



sad photochop i know but i are damn drunk atm.
, did you do something to his lips as well?

I do have to say, you are a great drunk speller.

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Old
07-31-2009, 08:37 AM
  #21
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wow haha, ya i just flipped his lips..man i was pretty drunk tho. It does seem I spell better when I am drunk, kinda sad really. Back to shultz tho, I'm not his biggest fan but I do think he can be ok at times lol.


Last edited by Darkproducer: 07-31-2009 at 09:09 AM.
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Old
07-31-2009, 09:24 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Here's the disconnect.

Mike Green is effective at preventing the puck from going into his own net.

On the other hand, Mike Green is average at defending odd man rushes, one on one coverage, and making an outlet pass under pressure.

The first does not negate the second.
I guess it depends on what you mean when you say "negate". What is the risk of an odd man rush? Or one on one situations? Or outlet passes under pressure? The answer is the same for all 3: giving up goals.

If the other team is scoring at a low rate when Green is on the ice, then that fact speaks for itself and obviously whatever else he's doing *does* negate his deficiencies in some of the classic 'defensive' skill sets. In that sense, I mean negate as "fully offsetting".

On the other hand, if you mean "negate" just to say that he has significant room to improve in spite of his good goals against numbers and GAA doesn't render irrelevant his areas of weakness, then yes, I wholeheartedly agree.

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Old
07-31-2009, 12:38 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by init2winit View Post
I was browsing the Hawks board and saw a video clip on Keith's training and noticed Green in the background. The website has some clips of Green's workouts and stuff, kind of interesting.
http://stacktv.stack.com/video.aspx?...6621281001_364

Great find....awesome....thanks.

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Old
07-31-2009, 08:14 PM
  #24
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Not sure if this has been posted already, but Juice signed the 1 year arby deal for $1.375 M, about half way between his ask and our offer.

I thought Juice was solid in the playoffs. Among the D men I wanted to see him stick around for another year before moving on.

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Old
08-01-2009, 03:42 AM
  #25
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I thought Green was pretty horrible in the playoffs, but other than that I think his defensive deficiencies are greatly overstated. He is probably at least average-above average and that, combined with his offensive talents, make him a great defenseman.

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