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All-Time Draft #12, Part IV

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:20 PM
  #101
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Wow is this ever a hard choice. Hold on a moment.

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:23 PM
  #102
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Well, with as many teams as need coaches and have back-to-back picks below me, I guess I have to go with

Pete Green, Coach

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:24 PM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jareklajkosz View Post
So?

Gilmour was better at everything else. Much better from what I understand.
MacKay was a great defensive player; maybe better than Gilmour. MacKay was also a great play-off performer.

The only thing that Gilmour is better at is being over-rated.

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10-19-2009, 11:28 PM
  #104
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Can someone take a list for my next pick?

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:35 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
MacKay was a great defensive player; maybe better than Gilmour. MacKay was also a great play-off performer.

The only thing that Gilmour is better at is being over-rated.
I see you will not be convinced. Tread this path at your own peril, though.

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:49 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by jareklajkosz View Post
I see you will not be convinced. Tread this path at your own peril, though.
Show me why Gilmour is better...

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Old
10-19-2009, 11:51 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Show me why Gilmour is better...
It was shown all over the place in the leafschat finals!!

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:10 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by jareklajkosz View Post
It was shown all over the place in the leafschat finals!!
You just kept saying he was better.... without actually backing it up.

It is pretty clear that MacKay was better offensively.

Defensively, both guys were considered elite in their times.

Play-offs, both guys were great.

Where is Gilmour better?

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:14 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by pitseleh View Post
pappy steals D Lars-Erik Sjoberg from me.
Was plan B if we didn't get Vadnais.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jareklajkosz View Post
I see you will not be convinced. Tread this path at your own peril, though.
The thing is, if your a Leafs fan you can't view Gilmour objectively. His 5 seasons there included his absolute peak. But, he simply doesn't have great career value. Leafs fans view him as an icon and a hero because he was increadible for his 1st two full seasons there, arguably better than Sakic or Yzerman's best years. But, beyond that he wasn't an elite player.

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:37 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Only if he is paired with an elite defensive force to cover his weaknesses. Rafalski is a great defensive system player but pretty bad one on one. Basically, he's really smart and skilled but doesn't have the size to handle most guys one on one. Perfect guy to pair with Scott Stevens or Nicklas Lidstrom, but if he's the best defensive guy on the pairing... watch out.
He's likely going to play with Derian Hatcher... who has size, is extremely physical and a rock defensively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cup 2010 Sens Rule
Kevin Stevens - Bobby Clarke - Daniel Alfredsson
Pete Mahovolich - Adam Oates - Brett Hull
Vic Hadfield - Jeremy Roenick - Alexander Mogilny

Which is better?
Brendan Shanahan - Bryan Trottier - Tim Kerr
Brian Propp - Ron Francis - Sergei Makarov
Don Marcotte - Joel Otto - Terry O'Reilly


But I actually like Sather's top 9 better, much more defensive capability in there. You only have Clarke and Mahovlich, and I guess Alfredsson (though I always found him grossly overrated).

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:48 AM
  #111
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Vladimir Krutov - Mario Lemieux - Hooley Smith
____________ - Darryl Sittler - ___________
Tommy Phillips - Art Chapman - Blair Russel

Valeri Vasiliev - Ernie Johnson
Jan Suchy - Bert Colbert
__________ - Red Dutton

Clint Benedict

I don't have a full second line yet, but how does thislook so far?

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:52 AM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Vladimir Krutov - Mario Lemieux - Hooley Smith
____________ - Darryl Sittler - ___________
Tommy Phillips - Art Chapman - Blair Russel

Valeri Vasiliev - Ernie Johnson
Jan Suchy - Bert Colbert
__________ - Red Dutton

Clint Benedict

I don't have a full second line yet, but how does thislook so far?
You can get a better 3rd line LW than you can get two second line wingers. Phillips should be on the 2nd line. Hell, for my money, he should be on the 1st line.

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Old
10-20-2009, 12:56 AM
  #113
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Smith-Sakic-Aurie
Andreychuk-Dionne-Leach
Gottselig-Poulin-X
X-X-X

Bourque-Blake
Lowe-Foote
X-X

X

HOWEVER, I'm considering going with

Andreychuk-Sakic-Leach
Smith-Dionne-Aurie (more like the Triple Crown line: rebound specialist, Dionne, gritty corner guy)

That second top six will be my PP setup either way, but I'm not sure if they're suitable for ES play as well.

Thoughts?

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:02 AM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
You can get a better 3rd line LW than you can get two second line wingers. Phillips should be on the 2nd line. Hell, for my money, he should be on the 1st line.
Phillips is better than Krutov, that's for sure, but I'm not sure I want to load up one line. Smith and Lemieux should be dynamite together, and Krutov's power game should mess really well too. Even with Krutov there, I should have one of the strongest 1st lines, and that leaves Phillips to prop up another line.

Our "3rd line" will probably play more than the 2nd line. Between matchng up vs. other 1st lines and special teams, they'll play a lot.

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:03 AM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Phillips is better than Krutov, that's for sure, but I'm not sure I want to load up one line. Smith and Lemieux should be dynamite together, and Krutov's power game should mess really well too. Even with Krutov there, I should have one of the strongest 1st lines, and that leaves Phillips to prop up another line.

Our "3rd line" will probably play more than the 2nd line. Between matchng up vs. other 1st lines and special teams, they'll play a lot.
Then aren't they your 2nd line?

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:04 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post
Smith-Sakic-Aurie
Andreychuk-Dionne-Leach
Gottselig-Poulin-X
X-X-X

Bourque-Blake
Lowe-Foote
X-X

X

HOWEVER, I'm considering going with

Andreychuk-Sakic-Leach
Smith-Dionne-Aurie (more like the Triple Crown line: rebound specialist, Dionne, gritty corner guy)

That second top six will be my PP setup either way, but I'm not sure if they're suitable for ES play as well.

Thoughts?
To me Andreychuk is a 4th line guy who plays PP. I'm not sure he's a real top-6 forward in this thing.

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:06 AM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
Then aren't they your 2nd line?
In terms of ice time, yes. In terms of role, no.

I've always looked at it this way:
First = offensive line
Second = offensive line
Third = defensive line
Fourth = energy line

In terms of ice time, a good 3rd line will play a lot.

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:22 AM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
In terms of ice time, yes. In terms of role, no.

I've always looked at it this way:
First = offensive line
Second = offensive line
Third = defensive line
Fourth = energy line

In terms of ice time, a good 3rd line will play a lot.
I've always worked on the idea:
First = most ice-time
Second = 2nd most ice time
Third = 3rd most
Four = least ice time

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:31 AM
  #119
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Steelers pick Brenden Morrow, LW

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:34 AM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
I've always worked on the idea:
First = most ice-time
Second = 2nd most ice time
Third = 3rd most
Four = least ice time
As it stands right now, they likely will be the 2nd line(on your system). Depends how things pan out

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Old
10-20-2009, 01:36 AM
  #121
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I think the second line is generally considered to be the line with players that get second unit PP time. That's not necessarily the same as the line that will get the second most even strength minutes.

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Old
10-20-2009, 02:09 AM
  #122
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I have a question here: assuming someone was coach/player, can a team fill both a player and coach slot with him with one pick? Or can another team pick him in the other role?

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Old
10-20-2009, 02:12 AM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadArcand View Post
I have a question here: assuming someone was coach/player, can a team fill both a player and coach slot with him with one pick? Or can another team pick him in the other role?
no you must draft him as a player and then again as a coach

Look at Hap Day as an example of this

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Old
10-20-2009, 02:13 AM
  #124
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coach and player are different, and can be picked by different teams.

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Old
10-20-2009, 02:14 AM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
I've always worked on the idea:
First = most ice-time
Second = 2nd most ice time
Third = 3rd most
Four = least ice time
thats isn't always true -sometimes checkers will play the 2nd most

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