HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Van-Fla

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-20-2009, 02:43 AM
  #1
94eleven
fka Loosemonkeys
 
94eleven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Denver, Colorado
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,168
vCash: 500
Van-Fla

To Florida: Kevin Bieksa, Michael Grabner, VAN 2010 1st

To Vancouver: Nathan Horton, Keaton Ellerby, FLA 2010 2nd

I believe this should work cap-wise (correct me if I'm wrong), is the value there? I would have to think a Florida defence of:

Mccabe
Bieksa
Allen
Kulikov
Koistenen
Leopold
Seidenberg
edit: Ballard

Would be an impressive top-8. Grabner is a possible top-6 NHL forward who has scored 40+ goals in the AHL last year. The 1st speaks for itself.

Vancouver gets a top-6 forward that would strengthen their offensive attack and help hold the fort until Sedin and Demitra return (if Demitra ever come back). Ellerby represents the first true top-end defensive prospect Vancouver has had since Bourdon (with all apologies to Edler). The 2nd rounder replaces the one that Vancouver dealt.

Thoughts?


Last edited by 94eleven: 10-20-2009 at 11:15 AM.
94eleven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 08:47 AM
  #2
ShootIt
Registered User
 
ShootIt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 561
Country: United States
Posts: 7,078
vCash: 500
I like the proposal. I've always been a fan of Grabner.


How many years left on Bieska's contract though?

ShootIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 08:49 AM
  #3
Bob Barker
Registered User
 
Bob Barker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,280
vCash: 500
I think the Canucks say no. Bieksa is the best player in this deal and they have to give a 1st.

Bob Barker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 09:14 AM
  #4
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,972
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
The GM says Horton's not on the block so sounds like a dead-proposal to me.

Also, you totally forgot Keith Ballard who's in their top 4.

Coolburn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 11:04 AM
  #5
Peter
Registered User
 
Peter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alberta
Posts: 3,671
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by loosemonkeys View Post
To Florida: Kevin Bieksa, Michael Grabner, VAN 2010 1st

To Vancouver: Nathan Horton, Keaton Ellerby, FLA 2010 2nd

I believe this should work cap-wise (correct me if I'm wrong), is the value there? I would have to think a Florida defence of:

Mccabe
Bieksa
Allen
Kulikov
Koistenen
Leopold
Seidenberg

Would be an impressive top-7. Grabner is a possible top-6 NHL forward who has scored 40+ goals in the AHL last year. The 1st speaks for itself.

Vancouver gets a top-6 forward that would strengthen their offensive attack and help hold the fort until Sedin and Demitra return (if Demitra ever come back). Ellerby represents the first true top-end defensive prospect Vancouver has had since Bourdon (with all apologies to Edler). The 2nd rounder replaces the one that Vancouver dealt.

Thoughts?
From the Canuck's perspective I would definetly do this WHEN M. Schneider comes off of IR. I doubt Gillis moves Bieska while Salo and Schneider are both out.

Grabner is redundant right now to the Canucks - he will be replaced short-term by Shirokov and long term by Demitra (if he ever comes back this year).

Horton gives us the #2 center we need (Kesler with Horton and Raymond will look beautiful!!!) and Ellerby is a nice addition.

Peter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 11:13 AM
  #6
94eleven
fka Loosemonkeys
 
94eleven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Denver, Colorado
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,168
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolburn View Post
The GM says Horton's not on the block so sounds like a dead-proposal to me.

Also, you totally forgot Keith Ballard who's in their top 4.
You are right I did, not sure how I did that. It would probably mean Seidenberg or Leopold could/would be dealt since they are UFA's at the end of the season, but that could bring them back another forward.

94eleven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 11:14 AM
  #7
94eleven
fka Loosemonkeys
 
94eleven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Denver, Colorado
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,168
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShootIt View Post
I like the proposal. I've always been a fan of Grabner.


How many years left on Bieska's contract though?
Bieksa is a UFA after next season and makes $3.5 mil this season and next with a $3.75 mil cap hit.

94eleven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 11:45 AM
  #8
DownInFlames
 
DownInFlames's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: NE1-But-Cancuks
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,392
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barker View Post
I think the Canucks say no. Bieksa is the best player in this deal and they have to give a 1st.
Horton's better than Bieksa. Horton is the best player in this deal. Interesting proposal though. I didn't think Florida would want to remove scoring from their lineup for more defensive help. Doesn't seem to address Florida's needs as their D hasn't been what's letting them down this season. From the Canucks point of view their D is too ravaged by injuries to do this right now. It could happen, as another poster said, when their injured players return to action. Right now I don't see it working for either team. When healthy I think Florida would want something a little more than Grabner (substitute the 1st to a 2nd or 3rd).

DownInFlames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 12:13 PM
  #9
Boooooth10
Registered User
 
Boooooth10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 6,730
vCash: 500
Horton has been our best forward for us in the past couple of games. I wouldn't trade him for what you're offering.

Boooooth10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 12:54 PM
  #10
NFITO
hockeyinsanity*****
 
NFITO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,868
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
Horton gives us the #2 center we need (Kesler with Horton and Raymond will look beautiful!!!) and Ellerby is a nice addition.
personally, I'd rather keep Kesler at center... or at least bring in a player that is competent at center - and Horton isn't it, who's best on right wing.

If you add Horton, he would slide on to the right side beside the Sedins... free up Burrows to rejoin Kesler... but again Horton does not improve the center ice situation in Vancouver because he's just not very good at center and has played his best on right wing.

NFITO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 12:54 PM
  #11
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 47,385
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barker View Post
I think the Canucks say no. Bieksa is the best player in this deal and they have to give a 1st.
There's no way the Canucks say no. It brings in a top 6 forward with grit who can score, and a top defensive prospect.

For Florida it gets rid of a guy who's career has gone stagnant on that team, and brings in a former 1st round pick with a ton of speed, and a very good offensive defenseman, as well as a first round pick.

I think it's a solid proposal for both teams.

__________________
http://www.vancitynitetours.com
y2kcanucks is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 01:00 PM
  #12
Steveorama
Registered User
 
Steveorama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Mississauga, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,858
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by loosemonkeys View Post
To Florida: Kevin Bieksa, Michael Grabner, VAN 2010 1st

To Vancouver: Nathan Horton, Keaton Ellerby, FLA 2010 2nd

I believe this should work cap-wise (correct me if I'm wrong), is the value there? I would have to think a Florida defence of:

Mccabe
Bieksa
Allen
Kulikov
Koistenen
Leopold
Seidenberg
edit: Ballard

Would be an impressive top-8. Grabner is a possible top-6 NHL forward who has scored 40+ goals in the AHL last year. The 1st speaks for itself.

Vancouver gets a top-6 forward that would strengthen their offensive attack and help hold the fort until Sedin and Demitra return (if Demitra ever come back). Ellerby represents the first true top-end defensive prospect Vancouver has had since Bourdon (with all apologies to Edler). The 2nd rounder replaces the one that Vancouver dealt.

Thoughts?
Actually, this is one of the better trades, value-wise, I have seen on these boards.
It would never happen of course, but it is an intriguing proposal that would help both teams in a lot of ways.
Grabner for Ellerby is basically a swap of propects who are both starting to lose a bit of their shine...but the Canucks need a defensive prospect right now more than a forward prospect, and the reverse is true in Florida.
Bieksa and a first for Horton and a second seems reasonable, particularly if you believe that the Canucks will finish substantially higher in the standings than the Panthers this year.
As a Canucks fan, I would do it. Biggest risk to the Canucks is their oft-injured defensive corps. But having Horton play RW with the Sedins is a very intriguing idea.
I have always thought that Horton would be a better winger than centre...he is crappy on faceoffs and I think removing the defensive requirements of playing centre would allow his offensive game to flourish. Playing with the Sedins would not hurt, either...

Steveorama is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 02:11 PM
  #13
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,218
vCash: 500
Add in Rypien, we'll toss in Tarnasky. LOVE Rypien!


Btw, Nate doesn't give you a 2nd line center, that experiment didn't work last season. As proof, Florida went out and got Reinprecht and Moore, and now have Weiss, Reino, Moore, Kreps, and Campbell as centers. Nate's just far better suited on the wing.

Is Grabner up, though? Is he ready? This seems to fall back into our problem with getting Kabs for Horton, we lose offense, we need NHL ready offense in return.

__________________
So you're saying there's a chance!
Laus723 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 02:20 PM
  #14
Pacem
Registered User
 
Pacem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Langley
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,327
vCash: 500
Why does Florida need another defenseman?

Pacem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 02:34 PM
  #15
JonathanHuberdoh
HFBoards Partner
 
JonathanHuberdoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Towanna
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,526
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to JonathanHuberdoh
Quote:
Originally Posted by loosemonkeys View Post
To Florida: Kevin Bieksa, Michael Grabner, VAN 2010 1st

To Vancouver: Nathan Horton, Keaton Ellerby, FLA 2010 2nd

I believe this should work cap-wise (correct me if I'm wrong), is the value there? I would have to think a Florida defence of:

Mccabe
Bieksa
Allen
Kulikov
Koistenen
Leopold
Seidenberg
edit: Ballard

Would be an impressive top-8. Grabner is a possible top-6 NHL forward who has scored 40+ goals in the AHL last year. The 1st speaks for itself.

Vancouver gets a top-6 forward that would strengthen their offensive attack and help hold the fort until Sedin and Demitra return (if Demitra ever come back). Ellerby represents the first true top-end defensive prospect Vancouver has had since Bourdon (with all apologies to Edler). The 2nd rounder replaces the one that Vancouver dealt.

Thoughts?
Relatively fair trade but it's full of holes that will never let it happen. Why would we need 8 defenseman? Be realistic.

Florida has the same problem as Vancouver. Scoring. Why would we trade our best sniper for MORE defense. And also package him with our 2nd best defensive prospect?

Grabner is good and all, but we don't need more defense coming back. Horton only goes if more offensive help is coming back.

JonathanHuberdoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 02:38 PM
  #16
BIG
Registered User
 
BIG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,139
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
From the Canuck's perspective I would definetly do this WHEN M. Schneider comes off of IR. I doubt Gillis moves Bieska while Salo and Schneider are both out.

Grabner is redundant right now to the Canucks - he will be replaced short-term by Shirokov and long term by Demitra (if he ever comes back this year).

Horton gives us the #2 center we need (Kesler with Horton and Raymond will look beautiful!!!) and Ellerby is a nice addition.
There have been rumblings that Demitra might just retire, apparently he has tendonitis in his shoulder.

BIG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 02:47 PM
  #17
Biggzy*
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 3,454
vCash: 500
Grabner and Bieksa don't really do much for us. Switch to Edler and Shirokov.

Biggzy* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 03:12 PM
  #18
NFITO
hockeyinsanity*****
 
NFITO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,868
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biggzy View Post
Grabner and Bieksa don't really do much for us. Switch to Edler and Shirokov.
wouldn't trade Edler one for one for Horton.

The Canucks are relying on Edler to be their #1 dman... he is among the most valuable assets the team has, and one of the players they are least likely to move.

NFITO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 03:18 PM
  #19
Biggzy*
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 3,454
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
wouldn't trade Edler one for one for Horton.

The Canucks are relying on Edler to be their #1 dman... he is among the most valuable assets the team has, and one of the players they are least likely to move.
Well thats pretty much what Horton is to the Panthers.

Biggzy* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 04:40 PM
  #20
doglover8891
rajinikanthfan1
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 484
vCash: 500
as a canuck fan i would do it in a heartbeat

as a panthers fan i would do this because bieksa would be a good replacement of jay bo and grabner would be a great replacement for nathan horton he is injured and i tried on nhl 2010


nathan hortan

for

grabner
schneider
first round pick

doglover8891 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 05:06 PM
  #21
BadHammy*
MSL For Hart!
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Right Behind Me!
Posts: 10,444
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacem View Post
Why does Florida need another defenseman?
You see, but they don't...

BadHammy* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 05:36 PM
  #22
eklunds source
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Ed Snider's basement
Posts: 7,920
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sportsrules View Post
as a panthers fan i would do this because bieksa would be a good replacement of jay bo and grabner would be a great replacement for nathan horton he is injured and i tried on nhl 2010

eklunds source is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 07:04 PM
  #23
Ronaldo
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Ronaldo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 36,780
vCash: 55
I would do this from a Canucks POV.

Ronaldo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 07:18 PM
  #24
Luck 6
\\_______
 
Luck 6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 7,471
vCash: 500
Ya, I'd do it from Vancouver's perspective although I'd hate to see Bieksa go and I'd love to see what Grabner could do; he's looking very good out there right now.

Why is everyone so sure Florida wouldn't do something like this? It could be a pre-cursor trade where they trade another one of their defenseman; it isn't outside the realm of possibility. Grabner could fill in for Horton on the RW and Bieksa adds a lot of grit and offensive ability to the blueline.

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Raymond-Kesler-Horton
Samuelsson-Wellwood-Bernier
Rypien-Johnson-Hansen

Salo-Mitchell
Edler-Ehrhoff
Schneider-O'Brien

Pretty good lines for us too

Luck 6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-20-2009, 11:36 PM
  #25
Kagee*
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,093
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
personally, I'd rather keep Kesler at center... or at least bring in a player that is competent at center - and Horton isn't it, who's best on right wing.

If you add Horton, he would slide on to the right side beside the Sedins... free up Burrows to rejoin Kesler... but again Horton does not improve the center ice situation in Vancouver because he's just not very good at center and has played his best on right wing.
Agreed with most this a fairly even trade value wise, as its tough to trade away those guys especially with Grabner finally getting some time to shine, as he seems to be playing pretty fierce offensive wise in front of the net and what not, I can see why he scores a lot in the AHL.

Plus with the injuries currently the team has, Bieksa is needed right now.

However I agree about acquiring a centerman, I have a slight disagreement with nuckfan, while Kesler is good playing center, he is a bit more effective playing on the wing, just like Horton. So to reiterate I really think acquiring a true centerman would benefit the team imo.

Plus Im a bit tentative to trade a 1stRP away.

Kagee* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:48 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.