HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Habs ranked 13th in HF's annual organizational rankings

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
10-23-2009, 09:39 AM
  #76
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Pretty much common knowledge (let alone common sense) that our prospects are over-hyped on this board. If you disagree - fine.
Well I don't know what others think of our prospects, I don't care either, I watch them all myself and form my own opinions. I have provided my opinions on all our prospects, I said they had no business being rated 2nd overall, what a joke but then again I could care less where HF ranks our prospects as they can't even put together a good list of our prospects imo.

But you saying all our prospects are overrated, well let's just say I'm not surprised, you seem to hate everything about the Habs, so why would it be any different for our prospects. As for common knowledge, that's not saying much around here, there are a bunch of really good/smart posters but there's also a ton of crap around here, I can't count how many times I've read something that was completely false especially about our prospects, as a lot of people here seem to think they are experts on everything when it's clear from reading their posts they aren't watching them play.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 10:08 AM
  #77
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Well I don't know what others think of our prospects, I don't care either, I watch them all myself and form my own opinions. I have provided my opinions on all our prospects, I said they had no business being rated 2nd overall, what a joke but then again I could care less where HF ranks our prospects as they can't even put together a good list of our prospects imo.

But you saying all our prospects are overrated, well let's just say I'm not surprised, you seem to hate everything about the Habs, so why would it be any different for our prospects. As for common knowledge, that's not saying much around here, there are a bunch of really good/smart posters but there's also a ton of crap around here, I can't count how many times I've read something that was completely false especially about our prospects, as a lot of people here seem to think they are experts on everything when it's clear from reading their posts they aren't watching them play.
I stick by my opinion that PK Subban is our only top end prospect - and I've seen him play about 50 times (not that that makes me an expert).

Bennett is not a great prospect, neither is Fischer or Quailer, IMO.

Leblanc could be one but that remains to be seen.

Our quality of prospects have been hurt by the McDonagh trade and the lost pick in the Tanguay deal. I would put us in the bottom 10 in the league in terms of quality.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 10:14 AM
  #78
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
I stick by my opinion that PK Subban is our only top end prospect - and I've seen him play about 50 times (not that that makes me an expert).

Bennett is not a great prospect, neither is Fischer or Quailer, IMO.

Leblanc could be one but that remains to be seen.

Our quality of prospects have been hurt by the McDonagh trade and the lost pick in the Tanguay deal. I would put us in the bottom 10 in the league in terms of quality.
I agree, Subban is the only top end prospect, unless Leblanc is better then I think he will be.

How many times have you seen Bennett play? Do you watch a lot of pre school hockey?

Fischer and Quailer are not great prospects, no one in our system is outside of Subban. That doesn't mean they can't be solid NHLers. Quailer reminds me of Pacioretty, but taller and not physical at all, and Pac is more of a setup guy while I think Quailer will be more of a goal scorer.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 10:36 AM
  #79
Whitesnake
Year of the Snake
 
Whitesnake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Lorraine
Country: Canada
Posts: 43,636
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Quailer reminds me of Pacioretty, but taller and not physical at all, and Pac is more of a setup guy while I think Quailer will be more of a goal scorer.
I agree with your non-physical part but funnily enough I think that Quailer might end up being a better setup guy, reason why I would have love to see the move at center this year.

Whitesnake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 10:47 AM
  #80
TheCH*
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,060
vCash: 500
I am surprised we are not lower. With Sergei about to go, the only real notable is Subban.

TheCH* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:02 AM
  #81
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
I agree, Subban is the only top end prospect, unless Leblanc is better then I think he will be.

How many times have you seen Bennett play? Do you watch a lot of pre school hockey?

Fischer and Quailer are not great prospects, no one in our system is outside of Subban. That doesn't mean they can't be solid NHLers. Quailer reminds me of Pacioretty, but taller and not physical at all, and Pac is more of a setup guy while I think Quailer will be more of a goal scorer.
Never seen Bennett play, nor Quailer. Saw Fischer twice. I see these guys as average prospects that other teams have. Fischer is a bust, IMO. When you can't even make the US junior team and are picked in the 1st round, that cannot be good.

I've said previously - it's time that Timmins pays more attention to the OHL - the best players are coming from there right now.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:09 AM
  #82
BeastScottThornton*
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Never seen Bennett play, nor Quailer. Saw Fischer twice. I see these guys as average prospects that other teams have. Fischer is a bust, IMO. When you can't even make the US junior team and are picked in the 1st round, that cannot be good.

I've said previously - it's time that Timmins pays more attention to the OHL - the best players are coming from there right now.
After seeing who Timmins had Leblanc ahead of on his draft list, I'd be happy if he started paying attention to any league. The guy couldn't spot bluechip talent if it came up and hit him in the face.

BeastScottThornton* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:22 AM
  #83
TinordiandSubban
Registered User
 
TinordiandSubban's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
After seeing who Timmins had Leblanc ahead of on his draft list, I'd be happy if he started paying attention to any league. The guy couldn't spot bluechip talent if it came up and hit him in the face.
You mean blue chippers like who? Scott Thornton? Why is Scott Thornton your user name? Do you like slow, lumbering, heavy skaters with a 20 goal max upside?

How about Brent Bilodeau? Terry Ryan? David Wilkie? Matt Higgins?

Those were some blue chips right there!

Put em through the wood chipper.

TinordiandSubban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:29 AM
  #84
BeastScottThornton*
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by inBobwetrust View Post
You mean blue chippers like who? Scott Thornton? Why is Scott Thornton your user name? Do you like slow, lumbering, heavy skaters with a 20 goal max upside?

How about Brent Bilodeau? Terry Ryan? David Wilkie? Matt Higgins?

Those were some blue chips right there!

Put em through the wood chipper.
And why is a distinctly average, over the hill GM in your username? Guess both our usernames involve people who can't hack it anymore.

BeastScottThornton* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:49 AM
  #85
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Never seen Bennett play, nor Quailer. Saw Fischer twice. I see these guys as average prospects that other teams have. Fischer is a bust, IMO. When you can't even make the US junior team and are picked in the 1st round, that cannot be good.

I've said previously - it's time that Timmins pays more attention to the OHL - the best players are coming from there right now.
I figured as much, I mean why wait till you see them to call them average prospects. But I'm not surprised, many people talk like they know and watch our prospects, when it's clear they don't. As for Fischer not making the USA team, I've said it before, USA takes kids from the USNDTP first, and Fischer snubbed them, they took his teammate instead (Fairchild) and Fischer was clearly better then him in the NCAA (and still is imo) so I wouldn't call him bust for that reason. Not saying he won't be a bust, cause I don't know, but anyone that follows the USA program knows their history towards the USNDTP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
After seeing who Timmins had Leblanc ahead of on his draft list, I'd be happy if he started paying attention to any league. The guy couldn't spot bluechip talent if it came up and hit him in the face.
Why would he need to pay attention to any league, if he can't spot bluechip talent then it doesn't matter what he's watching no?

At least we have you here to set us straight on things to let us know how badly our prospects suck and how bad of a job our scouts are doing.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:50 AM
  #86
BeastScottThornton*
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
I figured as much, I mean why wait till you see them to call them average prospects. But I'm not surprised, many people talk like they know and watch our prospects, when it's clear they don't. As for Fischer not making the USA team, I've said it before, USA takes kids from the USNDTP first, and Fischer snubbed them, they took his teammate instead (Fairchild) and Fischer was clearly better then him in the NCAA (and still is imo) so I wouldn't call him bust for that reason. Not saying he won't be a bust, cause I don't know, but anyone that follows the USA program knows their history towards the USNDTP.



Why would he need to pay attention to any league, if he can't spot bluechip talent then it doesn't matter what he's watching no?

At least we have you here to set us straight on things to let us know how badly our prospects suck and how bad of a job our scouts are doing.
And when I'm not around, you can always turn on the TV and see for yourself.

BeastScottThornton* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 11:54 AM
  #87
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
And when I'm not around, you can always turn on the TV and see for yourself.
Which I do, every year. I've seen every prospect (except Simila) so I don't need to read anyones opinion, especially ones that only come up with he sucks or so and so is average. Yawn.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:07 PM
  #88
BeastScottThornton*
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Which I do, every year. I've seen every prospect (except Simila) so I don't need to read anyones opinion, especially ones that only come up with he sucks or so and so is average. Yawn.
It's one thing to watch, and another thing entirely to know what your watching for. To be fair, you wasting your time watching crap divisions like the ECAC skews your overall standards so you should be open to opinions of others.

BeastScottThornton* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:13 PM
  #89
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
It's one thing to watch, and another thing entirely to know what your watching for. To be fair, you wasting your time watching crap divisions like the ECAC skews your overall standards so you should be open to opinions of others.
Everyone that follows college hockey knows the ECAC is the weak conference in the NCAA but they still produce NHLers, you seem to have a thing with pointing out the obivious.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:16 PM
  #90
TinordiandSubban
Registered User
 
TinordiandSubban's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
And why is a distinctly average, over the hill GM in your username? Guess both our usernames involve people who can't hack it anymore.
Ahhh go comb your mullet.

Can't hack it. pffft. Bob's got nothing more to prove.

But think about this while you're polishing the frame on your Drake Berehowsky rookie card: there are only two GMs in the past tenty years that have been able to build dynasties based on an innovative approach to the game and taking a strategy that goes against conventional thinking. Lou Lamiorello is one, Ken Holland is the other.

I'd like to go on the record as saying that Bob's going to be the third and what we say last night is the beginning of a long run of success for the team that Bob built and he will earn a rightful place in history as one of the greatest GMs of all time.

InBobwetrust

TinordiandSubban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:20 PM
  #91
BeastScottThornton*
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by inBobwetrust View Post
Ahhh go comb your mullet.

Can't hack it. pffft. Bob's got nothing more to prove.

But think about this while you're polishing the frame on your Drake Berehowsky rookie card: there are only two GMs in the past tenty years that have been able to build dynasties based on an innovative approach to the game and taking a strategy that goes against conventional thinking. Lou Lamiorello is one, Ken Holland is the other.

I'd like to go on the record as saying that Bob's going to be the third and what we say last night is the beginning of a long run of success for the team that Bob built and he will earn a rightful place in history as one of the greatest GMs of all time.

InBobwetrust


Cute.

BeastScottThornton* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:31 PM
  #92
smon
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,982
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by inBobwetrust View Post
But think about this while you're polishing the frame on your Drake Berehowsky rookie card
To be honest, this has to be one of the most amusingly bizarre insults ever. Man...

smon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:44 PM
  #93
TinordiandSubban
Registered User
 
TinordiandSubban's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,359
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by smon View Post
To be honest, this has to be one of the most amusingly bizarre insults ever. Man...
He hasn't denied it.

TinordiandSubban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 12:52 PM
  #94
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
I figured as much, I mean why wait till you see them to call them average prospects. But I'm not surprised, many people talk like they know and watch our prospects, when it's clear they don't. As for Fischer not making the USA team, I've said it before, USA takes kids from the USNDTP first, and Fischer snubbed them, they took his teammate instead (Fairchild) and Fischer was clearly better then him in the NCAA (and still is imo) so I wouldn't call him bust for that reason. Not saying he won't be a bust, cause I don't know, but anyone that follows the USA program knows their history towards the USNDTP.
Ok. I've haven't seen them play so they are both blue chip prospects. Oh, the excuses come fast and furious for Fischer.

I guess I didn't see Eric Tangradi playing for Team USA last year.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 01:00 PM
  #95
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Ok. I've haven't seen them play so they are both blue chip prospects. Oh, the excuses come fast and furious for Fischer.

I guess I didn't see Eric Tangradi playing for Team USA last year.
So why then did Team USA take Fischer's teammate Cade Fairchild who was on the 2nd pairing at Minnesota when Fischer was on the 1st pairing? As i've said i'm concerned about his development and not a big fan of his, but calling him a bust for not making Team USA seems like crap to me. Fischer could easily be a bust but not for not making Team USA. They will take players that aren't from the USNDTP, I never said they didn't but there's a clear basis towards the National program.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 01:08 PM
  #96
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
So why then did Team USA take Fischer's teammate Cade Fairchild who was on the 2nd pairing at Minnesota when Fischer was on the 1st pairing? As i've said i'm concerned about his development and not a big fan of his, but calling him a bust for not making Team USA seems like crap to me. Fischer could easily be a bust but not for not making Team USA. They will take players that aren't from the USNDTP, I never said they didn't but there's a clear basis towards the National program.
In my opinion, he's a bust.

Normally guys playing college are signed after 2 years and brought up to at least the AHL and nothing that I've seen or read tells me this guy was a good pick.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 02:02 PM
  #97
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
In my opinion, he's a bust.

Normally guys playing college are signed after 2 years and brought up to at least the AHL and nothing that I've seen or read tells me this guy was a good pick.
He could well be a bust, but guys don't always leave college after two years and you need to look at what ones are true freshman and which ones spent a year in the USHL cause many of the kids from the USHS need more time to develop since they are playing at a lower level of competition.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 02:09 PM
  #98
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
He could well be a bust, but guys don't always leave college after two years and you need to look at what ones are true freshman and which ones spent a year in the USHL cause many of the kids from the USHS need more time to develop since they are playing at a lower level of competition.
He's closing in on 22. Had he developped as expected he would at minimum be in Hamilton by now.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 02:26 PM
  #99
montreal
Time to Get Down
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Hungary
Posts: 23,272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
He's closing in on 22. Had he developped as expected he would at minimum be in Hamilton by now.
Well it's clear he hasn't developed as expected as he's had some injury problems and it appears he hasn't been working hard enough according to an interview he did, which is another concern. Perhaps he's just a slow developer, since not everyone develops along the same timeframe. I don't think it's a big deal that he didn't turn pro yet. On saturday night, take a look at rangers Matt Gilroy, he's 25 and was the best player in the NCAA last year. The Yotes have Kevin Poter who was just called up the other day, he spent 4 years at Michigan but looks like he could be a good one.

I think the problem is especially with some in Canada is that they don't understand or follow the NCAA, USHS, USHL, USNDTP, etc..... everyone wants to be an expert around here but not many are. You said you saw Fischer play two games, and yet you are completely sure of yourself that he's a bust, because he didn't play for Team USA (which is a crap reason) and because he didn't turn pro after two years (so was Gilroy a bust last year, yet something like 28 teams tried to sign him over the summer). I could go one but I don't see why I should, you always seem to be bashing the Habs and anything to do with the Habs, and in truth you could be right, Fischer could easily be a bust. Me I will just wait and see, I have him ranked as our 10th best prospect because he has the physical tools, skating, speed, frame (needs to fill out and get stronger though) he is a puck mover and he is sound positionally, so there are things there that are interesting, so I'm hoping in Hamilton the coaching staff can work with him and get more out of him.

montreal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
10-23-2009, 02:59 PM
  #100
gusfring
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,968
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Well it's clear he hasn't developed as expected as he's had some injury problems and it appears he hasn't been working hard enough according to an interview he did, which is another concern. Perhaps he's just a slow developer, since not everyone develops along the same timeframe. I don't think it's a big deal that he didn't turn pro yet. On saturday night, take a look at rangers Matt Gilroy, he's 25 and was the best player in the NCAA last year. The Yotes have Kevin Poter who was just called up the other day, he spent 4 years at Michigan but looks like he could be a good one.

I think the problem is especially with some in Canada is that they don't understand or follow the NCAA, USHS, USHL, USNDTP, etc..... everyone wants to be an expert around here but not many are. You said you saw Fischer play two games, and yet you are completely sure of yourself that he's a bust, because he didn't play for Team USA (which is a crap reason) and because he didn't turn pro after two years (so was Gilroy a bust last year, yet something like 28 teams tried to sign him over the summer). I could go one but I don't see why I should, you always seem to be bashing the Habs and anything to do with the Habs, and in truth you could be right, Fischer could easily be a bust. Me I will just wait and see, I have him ranked as our 10th best prospect because he has the physical tools, skating, speed, frame (needs to fill out and get stronger though) he is a puck mover and he is sound positionally, so there are things there that are interesting, so I'm hoping in Hamilton the coaching staff can work with him and get more out of him.
You have your opinion - I have mine.

A 1st round pick that has seemingly not developed is an issue. IN MY OPINION this will end up being a wasted pick.

My opinion is clear - I don't think he'll will end up being a player. What is yours? Wait and see? OK, fine.

gusfring is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:47 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.