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I Don't Want Ziggy

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Old
04-11-2004, 05:09 PM
  #1
Venom_17
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I Don't Want Ziggy

Ok I know I'm going to get blasted for this, but it is my opinion.

I would rather take thr 4-6+ million that we would spend on Ziggy and use it on someone else. Sure, Ziggy is good. But he gets hurt WAY to much. Missing all those games cause you got a puck in the face? Give me a break. The guy owns a poddle and says Madonna is his favorite artist? Come on now, I see a trend developing here.

Let's get some grit on this team. Klatter, Army, Avery, Lappy, Norstrom, Brown, Frolov, Gleason, etc. Let's build in this vein. Look at a team like San Jose. McLaren, Hannan, Rathje, Marleau, Ricci, Thornton, Cheechoo, Dimitrakos. The softest player on that team is Damphousse, and at least he stays relatively healthy. Thats the way I want this team to be built.

Sorry to break up the Ziggy lovefest . This is only my opinion. Does anyone else agree with me?

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Old
04-11-2004, 05:37 PM
  #2
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Well, I dont know how you could want to give up a guy who potentially could have won the scoring title, if he didnt get injured.

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04-11-2004, 05:40 PM
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Let me see... how can I put this nicely?

NO.


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04-11-2004, 06:07 PM
  #4
Mindcircus
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...

He's a great player no doubt, but i've mentioned before how injury prone he is. He's a marshmallow and there's no reason to suspect he'll be healthy the whole year next year either. If we lose Ziggy though, we might as well start over and go young.

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04-11-2004, 06:29 PM
  #5
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It's not even worth discussing frankly until the Owners and players work something out... 90% of the team are free agents. We have no idea what's going to happen to the league or the team... You're entitled to your opinion, however it's a bit premature.


Last edited by Face Wash: 04-11-2004 at 06:37 PM.
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04-11-2004, 07:26 PM
  #6
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ziggy would probably stay a lot healthier if (a) he had some linemates with size who could create some space for him, and (b) a secondary scoring unit to take some of the pressure and attention of the other teams' top d-pairing off ziggy.

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04-11-2004, 07:32 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navigator
ziggy would probably stay a lot healthier if (a) he had some linemates with size who could create some space for him, and (b) a secondary scoring unit to take some of the pressure and attention of the other teams' top d-pairing off ziggy.
Yeah, and if we didn't have a pansy for a coach.

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04-11-2004, 07:53 PM
  #8
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....I see we have some more Sydney Crosby fans

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Old
04-11-2004, 08:43 PM
  #9
Venom_17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyLUC20
Let me see... how can I put this nicely?

NO.


That's a resounding "no" regarding someone who has not really done much for us, besides getting hurt. Sure he's popular, but you have to look past that...what can he do for us in the long run, especially if he is not healthy. Besides, didn't Zig complain that we were going in the wrong direction last year? Without Ally and Deader we will REALLY be going in the wrong direction in his eyes. He said that when they were expected to return.

P.S. Its funny how Corvo was berated for assaulting a female but when Zig beat his wife no one said boo.

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04-11-2004, 09:37 PM
  #10
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I don't mean that as a slam against anyone here, I just mean that people don't look at him objectively.

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04-11-2004, 09:52 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom_17
That's a resounding "no" regarding someone who has not really done much for us, besides getting hurt. Sure he's popular, but you have to look past that...what can he do for us in the long run, especially if he is not healthy. Besides, didn't Zig complain that we were going in the wrong direction last year? Without Ally and Deader we will REALLY be going in the wrong direction in his eyes. He said that when they were expected to return.

P.S. Its funny how Corvo was berated for assaulting a female but when Zig beat his wife no one said boo.
Yea Ziggy only had 41 pts. in 35 games I would say that he didnt do much of anything. With regards to injury, if he had people that could defend him he wouldn't be injured. Like Stumpel or Straka are gonna stick up for him.

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04-11-2004, 10:36 PM
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Ziggy has averaged only 50 games per season the last 6 seasons. He's also one of the top 15 talents in the league. Ziggy is also a franchise player and you just don't let guys like that go.

Its a tough decision, to re-sign him or not. His injury proneness definately decreases his value (or at least it should). And then theres the looming CBA. I say re-sign him (at around $5M) because he is the pride and joy to many kings fans. Theres *more* to ziggy than just the stats and injuries.

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Old
04-11-2004, 10:39 PM
  #13
Mindcircus
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...

Ok if he wants to be stood up for then he should leave anyway right? It's not like we're just going to be a Flyer type hockey team next year.

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04-11-2004, 11:28 PM
  #14
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If there one thing the KINGS have to do this offseason its sign Ziggy...

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04-12-2004, 01:11 AM
  #15
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I really can't believe this thread. But then again, we'll never get past mediocrity with this club and really passive fans. Detroit RedWings have been old the last five years. Yet, they still continue to do their damage, and supposedly with a weak farm and prospects, they now have young star players blending right in with their old stars. This is the cancer with this club and if Ziggy leaves, i'll pretty much be done. I've bled these colors forever, and i've made that comment forever....but i'm getting older and quite frankly i'm tired of this *****!

Ziggy is finesse............But it seems to be rocket science to some. Yes, he's fragile, SO PROTECT HIM! Wayne was 160lbs.........with loads of protection around him. Seeing Ziggy protect himself against Tie Domi this year, was just more icing on the cake. The rest of the Kings just stood around and watched! Disgraceful!

You people think an 11 game losing strak was bad............No Ziggy, and you'll be competing with Pittsburgh's record this year! We'll be pathetic!

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Old
04-12-2004, 01:12 AM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeppelin97
Ziggy has averaged only 50 games per season the last 6 seasons.
Actually he has averaged 60 games in the last six. Also, in his last season on the Island he missed those thirty games due to a holdout and not to injury. If we take the last five seasons, then his average comes out to 62.2; which isn't great. It would probably be a lot higher had it not been for this season, and you've got to admit that it was a pretty freaky injury.


Last edited by Legionnaire: 04-12-2004 at 01:22 AM.
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Old
04-12-2004, 03:50 AM
  #17
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...

Basically it boils down to him being one the best players in the league... but for how long?

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Old
04-12-2004, 06:13 AM
  #18
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The question comes down to whether or not the Kings can replace his offense through free-agency, or with a prospect immediately ready to step it up this coming season -- just to keep the team from regressing. Unless the labor agreement dramatically changes everything the answer is clearly: neither. In an effort to replace Palffy the Kings would be forced to (over) pay as much if not more in a league-wide bidding war for another 31 yr old UFA most likely much less productive than Palffy.

Productive high end offensive talent comes at a premium in the NHL. When Hossa's name was mentioned recently a couple of Senator fans were quick on the spot to suggest (without blinking) "we might consider Frolov and Grebs ... for starters". The truth is that's about right because even if the Kings wouldn't be the ones to bite, someone else around the league would offer up, if given the opportunity, an equivalent package of rising star & top flight prospect in exchange for the known commodity.

In a roundabout way I look upon signing Palffy as a possible step forward in the Kings youth movement. Consider that 2-3 D-man Schnieder brings an Avery and a #1 in return, and 3rd line center Smolinski's trade deadline market value is Gleason and a #1. What might a world class player like Palffy bring? If the Kings are limping along again next season it's good consolation to envision the reality of playoff teams such as Tor, Van, Bos, Phi, or any number of others lining up with "this is our year to win the Cup- NOW!" offers. It would be awfully nice for Dave Taylor to be in a position to consider - "hmmm, team 'A's can't miss goaltender prospect and a #1 this year, or team 'B's hot center prospect and a #1 next year?" That's leverage, and that's one reason why Palffy should be signed if the price is at all right. He walks and the Kings get nothing in return.


Last edited by LinkGtz23: 04-12-2004 at 07:24 AM.
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Old
04-12-2004, 10:43 AM
  #19
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This may be a case of out of sight out of mind. The dude is a stud. The guy makes everyone on the ice around him better. Guys like him don't grow on trees and are special talents in the league for sure. I like LinkGtz23 suggestion, it makes some sense in that he is a high end talent and is most valuable to are team either playing or in trading to restock in a hurry.

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Old
04-12-2004, 10:55 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom_17
That's a resounding "no" regarding someone who has not really done much for us, besides getting hurt.
He was also among the league leaders in scoring every year he's been in LA. This was the first time he missed a significant amount of time since his holdout with the Islanders. Get a grip. I bet you'll be the first people on here if the Kings don't re-sign Ziggy and the Kings average less than 2.5 goals a game next year because there is no one who can score consistently except Ziggy. Not only do they need to re-sign Ziggy, they need to take the money they're not going to give Allison or Deadmarsh and bring in 2 or 3 guys who can be a supporting cast, so if Ziggy does go down again, the Kings have guys who can put the puck in the net (Jozef Stumpel doesn't count)

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Old
04-12-2004, 11:02 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mindcircus
Ok if he wants to be stood up for then he should leave anyway right? It's not like we're just going to be a Flyer type hockey team next year.

The Flyer type of hockey is to re-sign him and tell him he will only get 3rd line ice time and trade away all the youngsters, and THEN struggle to put the puck in the net and barely reach 20 goals. Just make sure he has a +/- over 30.

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04-12-2004, 11:26 AM
  #22
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I think that Ziggy is the kind of player that *IF* we were to decide to keep a team together with the intention of trying to win the cup at all costs this year that you simply CAN'T let go.

He is the best RW in the game today in my opinion when it comes to two way playing and scoring with little talent to dish him the puck. Imagine how much better he would be doing if he were a Senator or a Red Wing or an Av. Imagine if he were being fed by Floppa or Sakic, he would break the 100 point mark without a doubt.

He has said he Will Not sign for less than what he were making this past season.

So, if we are going to go in the direction of trying to sign some UFAs and try to make a run (not what we have been doing) then Ziggy has to stay.

If we were going to try and make a couple of tweeks over this and next season to actually become an elite team then you would have to sign him and deal him once he gets up in scoring (which he will) and then send him off for prospects and picks.

No Ziggy and we might have a shot at Crosby the number one center that could be the best to come along in a decade, of course, it would take another two years before he would be with us sooooooo........

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Old
04-12-2004, 03:38 PM
  #23
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Ziggy is Ziggy...he has carried this team since he came here. The guy is one of the best forward in the league. We, can't let a guy with his abilities just leave. Any line he is on that line is the teams best offensive line. This team has talent. If, we just make a few decisions we should be able to be cup contenders. If we hadn't been injured I think we would be making a run right now. So what we have to do is either get Deader and Ally back or replace one of them. Ziggy is the center piece of the team. Frolov isn't ready to be the center piece. Even if he is he's not going to put up Ziggy's numbers. I think this tread is ridiculous.
ZIGGY IS THE BEST

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04-12-2004, 07:34 PM
  #24
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Ok, Ziggy is a damn good player, I admit that. BUT I am just saying that his point totals in the regular season don't mean a damn thing if we aren't in the playoffs. If he plays 60 games a year, what good is he to us at 5 mill? We can't make the playoffs getting 60 games from him. I am saying that we should get a couple more guys that can stay healthy, a center that can play with Fro. I think there is no doubt who is our franchise now: Fro or Ziggy? The litmus test is to ask: who is more untouchable? Clearly, if there is ANY doubt that we will resign Ziggy, Fro is more untouchable. A 22 year old who will score 60 points next year is our franchise.
And comparing Ziggy to Gretzky is not even valid. Give me a break...
Furthermore, this is a tough decision that DT needs to make. I don't see how my opinion can be considered "riduculous" seeing as how people want to pay 5 million dollars a year to a guy that plays sixty games.

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04-12-2004, 08:23 PM
  #25
Face Wash
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom_17
P.S. Its funny how Corvo was berated for assaulting a female but when Zig beat his wife no one said boo.
Funny, I don't remember Ziggy even being charged with anything much less convicted.

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