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Old
11-08-2009, 09:31 AM
  #1
Dagoon44
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We are all on the soap box and angry

I want to start this off by saying I am 39 years old and have loved this team for 37 years. I have the jersey my mom bought me at 2 still hanging in my closet and have a tattoo of the Ranger goalies of the 70's across my back. I live and die on every game , shot , pass, and goal. The last few years I got into the bar and sports memorabilia business and started getting close to a bunch of player in the NHL , NBA and NFL and getting a lot of inside info and a look into how these guys think and live. Late last year the Rangers needed a change in their coaching and I want to admit that i agreed but the second I heard Torts named mentioned I was angry and worried that his hard A22 style and iron fist approach would not work here and that this buzz words like mental toughness and team tough would burn out quickly. I had the inside info on Colton Orr and leaked a lot of it to the boards and you guys all said he is a no good a dime a dozen and not worth the money, 4 years I agree he wasn't worth but what you guys forget is he asked the Rangers for 2 yrs and 800,000 and was rejected then the islanders offered 4 years and The LEafs jumped in and upped the money and he left. Torts stated Orr wouldn't handle reduced ice tie well and not a good fit ? Orr should have only played 4mins a game he would be fine. Those 6 mins wasted on Voros are better used ? Last night our enforcer Huggy Bear is out injured (not his fault ) people get hurt. But to see his idea of team toughness watch the captain get his head taken off and no one not Avery not Redden not Staal did anything about it ? That's team tough ? No that Torts brain washed system with players fearing taking a penalty will result in a benching. Let me ask you this if Mara was on the ice last night would he have whispered in the guys ear ???? The mere fact Avery is quoted as saying Drury would have wanted the 2 points is a result of fear of losing more ice time. The Rangers fast start fooled a lot of fans into thinking we were a contender and that Torts had installed a better system and team but once other teams figured out we were soft they have pounded the defense and even the goalie without fear of repercussion from this team . I am far from Hanks biggest fan but the guy is the franchise and best player and he is being run regularly and no on has stepped up once to handle it ? Tough team thinking my A##. We are something like 2 and 8 in last 10 and fading fast the trip out west proved we are small and timed . Guys like Evgeny Artyukhin and Neil would have been good fits in New York but we go smaller all the time. The last time we had a team toughness was 1995 under Campbell. Torts can not and will not admit mistakes and his in game ability to change his game plain is horrible. He was and is a bad choice for this team in my opinion, When I said the team was soft early on people bashed me and now it is the buzz when I said Orr and MAra were run out of NY and would be missed you all crapped on my posts but now because injuries to Hank and others it is the rage to complain we are soft and have no team toughness lol . I know that I love old school hockey and fighting and hitting is part of that and you younger kids on here were not exposed to what hockey was and thats not your fault it is the game you grew up on but the NHL is a sport that allows fighting and intimidation and as long as it does you need to have guys willing to do it and under torts and his iron fist we simply don't have a team first thinking process. I beg you to say that if that hit was in Phillie or Chicago or even Dallas that there would not have been retaliation ? The Rangers are playing in fear of their coach and his benching and screaming has worn their mental state down and when players are playing scared or afraid to make mistakes they are playing their game. It is going to be a long few weeks with the injuries and this sucks but we need to go out and grab a winchester or a Evgeny Artyukhin and start to get gritter and bigger and faster. I am going to my kids playoff game and watch athletes with heart and passion play a game they love. Enjoy the day and please if you want make counter points do it just don't tear into me because OF my hate for Torts

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11-08-2009, 09:40 AM
  #2
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Dagoon I like to read what you write but please for all of us with ADD, ADHD and other sorts or mental shortcomings please use paragraphs. We dont care if they are "correct" paragraphs just break it up so we can read it

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11-08-2009, 09:46 AM
  #3
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This should help a bit



I want to start this off by saying I am 39 years old and have loved this team for 37 years. I have the jersey my mom bought me at 2 still hanging in my closet and have a tattoo of the Ranger goalies of the 70's across my back. I live and die on every game , shot , pass, and goal. The last few years I got into the bar and sports memorabilia business and started getting close to a bunch of player in the NHL , NBA and NFL and getting a lot of inside info and a look into how these guys think and live.

Late last year the Rangers needed a change in their coaching and I want to admit that i agreed but the second I heard Torts named mentioned I was angry and worried that his hard A22 style and iron fist approach would not work here and that this buzz words like mental toughness and team tough would burn out quickly. I had the inside info on Colton Orr and leaked a lot of it to the boards and you guys all said he is a no good a dime a dozen and not worth the money, 4 years I agree he wasn't worth but what you guys forget is he asked the Rangers for 2 yrs and 800,000 and was rejected then the islanders offered 4 years and The LEafs jumped in and upped the money and he left. Torts stated Orr wouldn't handle reduced ice tie well and not a good fit ? Orr should have only played 4mins a game he would be fine. Those 6 mins wasted on Voros are better used ? Last night our enforcer Huggy Bear is out injured (not his fault ) people get hurt.

But to see his idea of team toughness watch the captain get his head taken off and no one not Avery not Redden not Staal did anything about it ? That's team tough ? No that Torts brain washed system with players fearing taking a penalty will result in a benching. Let me ask you this if Mara was on the ice last night would he have whispered in the guys ear ???? The mere fact Avery is quoted as saying Drury would have wanted the 2 points is a result of fear of losing more ice time.

The Rangers fast start fooled a lot of fans into thinking we were a contender and that Torts had installed a better system and team but once other teams figured out we were soft they have pounded the defense and even the goalie without fear of repercussion from this team . I am far from Hanks biggest fan but the guy is the franchise and best player and he is being run regularly and no on has stepped up once to handle it ? Tough team thinking my A##. We are something like 2 and 8 in last 10 and fading fast the trip out west proved we are small and timed . Guys like Evgeny Artyukhin and Neil would have been good fits in New York but we go smaller all the time. The last time we had a team toughness was 1995 under Campbell.

Torts can not and will not admit mistakes and his in game ability to change his game plain is horrible. He was and is a bad choice for this team in my opinion, When I said the team was soft early on people bashed me and now it is the buzz when I said Orr and MAra were run out of NY and would be missed you all crapped on my posts but now because injuries to Hank and others it is the rage to complain we are soft and have no team toughness lol .

I know that I love old school hockey and fighting and hitting is part of that and you younger kids on here were not exposed to what hockey was and thats not your fault it is the game you grew up on but the NHL is a sport that allows fighting and intimidation and as long as it does you need to have guys willing to do it and under torts and his iron fist we simply don't have a team first thinking process. I beg you to say that if that hit was in Phillie or Chicago or even Dallas that there would not have been retaliation ?

The Rangers are playing in fear of their coach and his benching and screaming has worn their mental state down and when players are playing scared or afraid to make mistakes they are playing their game. It is going to be a long few weeks with the injuries and this sucks but we need to go out and grab a winchester or a Evgeny Artyukhin and start to get gritter and bigger and faster. I am going to my kids playoff game and watch athletes with heart and passion play a game they love.

Enjoy the day and please if you want make counter points do it just don't tear into me because OF my hate for Torts.

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11-08-2009, 09:49 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dagoon44 View Post
I want to start this off by saying I am 39 years old and have loved this team for 37 years. I have the jersey my mom bought me at 2 still hanging in my closet and have a tattoo of the Ranger goalies of the 70's across my back. I live and die on every game , shot , pass, and goal. The last few years I got into the bar and sports memorabilia business and started getting close to a bunch of player in the NHL , NBA and NFL and getting a lot of inside info and a look into how these guys think and live. Late last year the Rangers needed a change in their coaching and I want to admit that i agreed but the second I heard Torts named mentioned I was angry and worried that his hard A22 style and iron fist approach would not work here and that this buzz words like mental toughness and team tough would burn out quickly. I had the inside info on Colton Orr and leaked a lot of it to the boards and you guys all said he is a no good a dime a dozen and not worth the money, 4 years I agree he wasn't worth but what you guys forget is he asked the Rangers for 2 yrs and 800,000 and was rejected then the islanders offered 4 years and The LEafs jumped in and upped the money and he left. Torts stated Orr wouldn't handle reduced ice tie well and not a good fit ? Orr should have only played 4mins a game he would be fine. Those 6 mins wasted on Voros are better used ? Last night our enforcer Huggy Bear is out injured (not his fault ) people get hurt. But to see his idea of team toughness watch the captain get his head taken off and no one not Avery not Redden not Staal did anything about it ? That's team tough ? No that Torts brain washed system with players fearing taking a penalty will result in a benching. Let me ask you this if Mara was on the ice last night would he have whispered in the guys ear ???? The mere fact Avery is quoted as saying Drury would have wanted the 2 points is a result of fear of losing more ice time. The Rangers fast start fooled a lot of fans into thinking we were a contender and that Torts had installed a better system and team but once other teams figured out we were soft they have pounded the defense and even the goalie without fear of repercussion from this team . I am far from Hanks biggest fan but the guy is the franchise and best player and he is being run regularly and no on has stepped up once to handle it ? Tough team thinking my A##. We are something like 2 and 8 in last 10 and fading fast the trip out west proved we are small and timed . Guys like Evgeny Artyukhin and Neil would have been good fits in New York but we go smaller all the time. The last time we had a team toughness was 1995 under Campbell. Torts can not and will not admit mistakes and his in game ability to change his game plain is horrible. He was and is a bad choice for this team in my opinion, When I said the team was soft early on people bashed me and now it is the buzz when I said Orr and MAra were run out of NY and would be missed you all crapped on my posts but now because injuries to Hank and others it is the rage to complain we are soft and have no team toughness lol . I know that I love old school hockey and fighting and hitting is part of that and you younger kids on here were not exposed to what hockey was and thats not your fault it is the game you grew up on but the NHL is a sport that allows fighting and intimidation and as long as it does you need to have guys willing to do it and under torts and his iron fist we simply don't have a team first thinking process. I beg you to say that if that hit was in Phillie or Chicago or even Dallas that there would not have been retaliation ? The Rangers are playing in fear of their coach and his benching and screaming has worn their mental state down and when players are playing scared or afraid to make mistakes they are playing their game. It is going to be a long few weeks with the injuries and this sucks but we need to go out and grab a winchester or a Evgeny Artyukhin and start to get gritter and bigger and faster. I am going to my kids playoff game and watch athletes with heart and passion play a game they love. Enjoy the day and please if you want make counter points do it just don't tear into me because OF my hate for Torts
I see what you're saying, but this post seems more of an attempt to dish out a plate of crow. I liked Orr. Couldn't have cared less if he signed with us or not, but I never had any big issues with his play. However, in my opinion Orr fighting other 4th liners doesn't really enhance our team toughness. Our lack of "intestinal fortitude" has dogged this team since the lockout, since Orr was claimed from Boston, and since Orr was replaced by "Huggy Bear". It is an issue a 4th line pugilist can't remedy. The team simply has no physical presence on the ice. Sather continues to construct small/soft hockey teams. Until he decides that team toughness is more than just a coach's philosophy, we will continue to suffer when teams play us hard.

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Old
11-08-2009, 09:49 AM
  #5
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I agree the team is soft, but not because of Torts. We just don't have that Chris Neil or Chris Pronger edgy type of player. Dude, I was as pissed off as anyone last night when Glencross wasn't floored, but honestly wasn't shocked about it.

BTW I'm 38 and have watched this team religiously for only 30 years. I'm impressed you were watching the Rangers at 2yo. At that age I was still filling diapers and eating toys

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11-08-2009, 10:33 AM
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Good points Dagoon. I usually always agree with you when it comes to team toughness, or the lack there of. This team is a pathetic excuse for a hockey team if you ask me. I'd be embarrassed to be a part of it.

But you know this message board. They are completely against what you preach. They'd be very happy with a team that never touched anyone. They're young and naive. That's the main problem.

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11-08-2009, 10:35 AM
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I agree with a lot of what you said Dagoon. Last night was a travesty. So you aren't gonna stick up for your captain when he gets blindsided. You aren't gonna stick up for your franchise goalie when he gets run 3 times in one game like in Toronto. What needs to happen for this team to stand up for each other? Does someone have rip down the retired number banners and urinate on them at center ice?

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11-08-2009, 10:39 AM
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If Torts really emasculated these guys I would be surprised... The rest of the NHL does a great job of that already!

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11-08-2009, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
I agree with a lot of what you said Dagoon. Last night was a travesty. So you aren't gonna stick up for your captain when he gets blindsided. You aren't gonna stick up for your franchise goalie when he gets run 3 times in one game like in Toronto. What needs to happen for this team to stand up for each other? Does someone have rip down the retired number banners and urinate on them at center ice?
Sadly, I don't think this current collection of players would even care if that happened.

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11-08-2009, 11:14 AM
  #10
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Right on Dagoon...Right on!

I have to sound off too here. Team toughness failed once again. Sorry Avery, you are one of my favorites...But 'the game was too close to retaliate?' YOU RETALIATE ON THE NEXT F`IN SHIFT!!!! First minute of the game you lose you captain to a dirty hit? ...YOUR CAPTAIN?????? And nobody does a thing? I can't agree with that at all, not one bit. I would still be just as mad if they won the game last night. They went into a tough building against one of the most physical teams in the league, and while they played hard...They didn't play physical.

Not even getting into the whle how many times can I run your All-Star netminder...We all know this is an issue at this point. Now Hank nursing an injury, what happens when he gets run again? I mean look from Wade Redden, a shoulder push from Staal? If there isn't a player on this team that can stand up and knock someone in the chops after a play like that, then Sather needs to get on the F`in phones and get a guy in here that will.

Enough is enough already!

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11-08-2009, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by abev View Post
Dagoon I like to read what you write but please for all of us with ADD, ADHD and other sorts or mental shortcomings please use paragraphs. We dont care if they are "correct" paragraphs just break it up so we can read it
LOL ok next time I will take a minute and claim down

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11-08-2009, 11:44 AM
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I am not trying at all to dish out the crow . I am just stating facts that I was 100% against Torts as coach and the reasons why. Torts is a fake and phony. He swore up and down he would never coach Avery and he was a disgrace to the league and so on then he steps in and took the job in a second and coached Avery. I feel he took the personal task of breaking Sean and has done it but it also ruined Sean as a player.

Tort has a rep for singling out players and forcing them to either make it his way or he simply benches or cuts ice time and they go away at the first chance. Andre Roy is a prime example he just lost a fight and was angry at the Philadelphia arena for replaying a knock down lose to Cote he was angry and yelling at the REF and Torts starts to scream at him like a animal the Flyers see this and the taunting got worse and Roy got a 10 min penalty and Torts sent him to the locker room and that was the end of Roy.

The Rangers last had a team built to win in 1994 Graves rode shotgun to Messier and Beuk to Leetch, The rest of the guys were able to handle themselves will enough to you got he 4th line and Kocur was there to bash anyone who go out of line. Tikkanen Mactavish Wells and Hartman all never backed down and played with grit and never would have let what happened last night go down

The team is a reflection of their coach and lately this team is gutless and without balls , to me that sounds like a bully and that sounds like Torts

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11-08-2009, 12:02 PM
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10-7-1 and have played a average of 3 games more then any other team in the conference . By next week they will be out of a playoff spot. So if making a easy sarcastic post is your way to make light then fine but this team is sinking fast.

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11-08-2009, 12:04 PM
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Agree with everything you said, great post.

It really is frustrating. I wonder if it would have been any different if Brashear was playing last night. Something tells me it wouldn't have.

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11-08-2009, 12:07 PM
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Guys did anyone see the pre game warm up where Mcgratton hit Dubinsky? That only happens when your team is soft and other teams feel they can intimidate you . The move was bush but hey they have a big strong team and we don't.

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11-08-2009, 12:47 PM
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I agree with the point you made about the team playing scared of their own coach.

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11-08-2009, 01:44 PM
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The Rangers are playing in fear of their coach and his benching and screaming has worn their mental state down and when players are playing scared or afraid to make mistakes they are playing their game. It is going to be a long few weeks with the injuries and this sucks but we need to go out and grab a winchester or a Evgeny Artyukhin and start to get gritter and bigger and faster. I am going to my kids playoff game and watch athletes with heart and passion play a game they love. Enjoy the day and please if you want make counter points do it just don't tear into me because OF my hate for Torts
I can't agree with you here. I don't think Torts would bench someone for beating Glencross after that hit. He lets Rozival take three bonehead penalties a game and still puts him out. I, like you I would think, understand that players make mistakes and you can't demand perfection and then scream when you don't get it because nobody will benefit from that. That being said, I don't think that is what Torts is doing. Who has really gotten benched? Dubi and Higgins for about half of one game and Avery had his minutes cut. He wasn't demanding perfection from any of them, he was asking that they not GIVE the other team goals. That is perfectly reasonable. And Torts screams. These guys are professional athletes and grown men. They should all be able to handle a coach screaming at them for making unnecessary and stupid plays and they should all know that they are going to be held accountable. 3 benchings in 18 games. If their mental states are worn, its not Torts' fault or anyone else but their own, again they're grown men and professional athletes.

I don't belive that anyone on the ice was held back because they were scared of Torts, they're simply too soft, none of them have been that kind of player ever except for Avery. So, where we do agree is that we need at least one big guy who is willing to throw his weight around and not take it from anybody.

Also, not to you Dagoon, but to some of the other replies, how on earth does how long you have been watching the team affect how much you like them or how serious of a fan you are? I wasn't born when some of you were watching the Rangers, and you weren't born when some of your parent's generation was. That doesn't mean that they were bigger fans than you or you are bigger fans than the younger people. We all love the team, its not a contest.

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11-08-2009, 01:53 PM
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Were they any different under Renney?

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11-08-2009, 01:58 PM
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Were they any different under Renney?
Dagoon said he thought Renney should've been fired but Tortorella wasn't the right guy for the job either.

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11-08-2009, 02:01 PM
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Also, not to you Dagoon, but to some of the other replies, how on earth does how long you have been watching the team affect how much you like them or how serious of a fan you are? I wasn't born when some of you were watching the Rangers, and you weren't born when some of your parent's generation was. That doesn't mean that they were bigger fans than you or you are bigger fans than the younger people. We all love the team, its not a contest.
I don't think anyone questioned love or loyalty by age... they questioned wisdom and better judgment.

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11-08-2009, 02:22 PM
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Im 50 ...been watching this franchise for 40+ years .. last night reminds me of the gutless teams of the 70's that were beaten up by the Flyers and Bruins on a regular basis.

Almost ashamed to be a Ranger fan today...your captain takes a cheap shot to the head and not one player does a damn thing about it......gutless, heartless group.

I used to like this group of players. ....fun team to watch ...but last night really turned me off this group.

Seriously doubt if I'll go to any more games this season....**** them all.

also...why can a Linesman call a high stick penalty 3 minutes after it happens but youre telling me not one of the 4 idiot zebras on the ice saw the hit...this lg is a joke .. they have taken the greatest sport in the world and run it into the ground.

Yes I know Im overreacting ...but Im really pissed at the refs... the NHL and mostly at the heartless group of players wearing a Ranger sweater last night.

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11-08-2009, 03:12 PM
  #22
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Dagoon said he thought Renney should've been fired but Tortorella wasn't the right guy for the job either.
The only solution: Dagoon should coach the team.

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11-08-2009, 03:21 PM
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Good points Dagoon. I usually always agree with you when it comes to team toughness, or the lack there of. This team is a pathetic excuse for a hockey team if you ask me. I'd be embarrassed to be a part of it.

But you know this message board. They are completely against what you preach. They'd be very happy with a team that never touched anyone. They're young and naive. That's the main problem.
Yep Balej seems a lot like that to me too. Been banging my head against the wall with the whole grit/toughness thing here. Just seems like generational differences of opinions about what it takes to win.

Everybody was expecting/worried the Rangers were going to get plastered all over the ice and POOF like magic they were. Wait till the Flyers get a hold of this team.

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11-08-2009, 03:28 PM
  #24
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Guys did anyone see the pre game warm up where Mcgratton hit Dubinsky? That only happens when your team is soft and other teams feel they can intimidate you . The move was bush but hey they have a big strong team and we don't.
That irritated the **** out of me too. Dubi (god love him ) looked over his shoulder and it seemed like (and rightfully so) wanted no part of McGratton. Classic case of pre-game intimidation.

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11-08-2009, 04:30 PM
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I can't gauge how much our softness is a reflection of Tortorella's coaching style because I'm obviously not in anyway affiliated with the team. That said, I've been on plenty of sports teams where we weren't necessarily fond of our coach but our teammates were our teammates, 'C' on the chest or not. If the instinct to defend or protect your teammates isn't innately bound into their DNA, then I'm not sure what coach in professional sports could change that.

I really thought with guys like Dubinsky, Avery, Callahan, Boyle, Byers, Staal, Girardi, Voros, Brash and Higgins that we had enough grit/toughness and straight forward North American style of players, as a whole, to get by in the New 21st century NHL. Let's face it, this league isn't nearly as tough as it used to be, therefore a team composed of the players above should possess enough heart to not get pushed around on a nightly basis. I believe this because we've been shown glimpses of it in the past from each of them.

As a fan I can't place the direct blame upon Tortorella's coaching style or Sather's construction of the team because frankly if any group of players, let alone this one who has the ability to do so, doesn't stand up for their franchise net minder or captain, then they're clearly lacking in heart on an individual and collective basis. You should be able to protect your own despite your coach or management.

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