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Old
11-12-2009, 10:27 AM
  #26
CharlieGirl
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
If almost half the league is dropping in value...I would love to see Bettman's discussion of this article.
I'd love to see someone justify blocking Jim Balsillie's bid of $212 million or whatever it was for a Phoenix franchise worth $138 million.

If someone is going to offer me 1.5 times the value of anything I own, it's theirs, and I don't think twice about it.

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11-12-2009, 10:32 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I'd love to see someone justify blocking Jim Balsillie's bid of $212 million or whatever it was for a Phoenix franchise worth $138 million.

If someone is going to offer me 1.5 times the value of anything I own, it's theirs, and I don't think twice about it.
JB wanted to offer so much that the Phoenix owners backed him in an attempt to force the NHL to approve him as an owner.

The NHL did not back off. The NHL is stupid.

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11-12-2009, 10:37 AM
  #28
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Yeah, it's a huge factor. Merchandise revenue is also huge. That's why the Leafs have so much more revenue, for example.
It's kinda cool that Comcast-Spectacor owns the Flyers, Sixers, Wachovia Spectrum, Wachovia Center, CSN, and multiple other rinks (Flyers Skate Zone). Completely lease-free and they own the channel that plays all their games.

Quite a recipe for success actually.

Edit: the list of stuff Comcast owns is ridiculous, WOW

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11-12-2009, 10:39 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I'd love to see someone justify blocking Jim Balsillie's bid of $212 million or whatever it was for a Phoenix franchise worth $138 million.

If someone is going to offer me 1.5 times the value of anything I own, it's theirs, and I don't think twice about it.
In fairness to them, they had a very good reason for turning that down...they could not allow a precedent to be set for owners to go outside of the league bylaws to sell/buy teams. While their policy towards PHX has been faulty, and their refusal to play ball with Balsilie has been shortsighted, IMO, the way he went about things down there was way over the top.

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11-12-2009, 11:20 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
In fairness to them, they had a very good reason for turning that down...they could not allow a precedent to be set for owners to go outside of the league bylaws to sell/buy teams. While their policy towards PHX has been faulty, and their refusal to play ball with Balsilie has been shortsighted, IMO, the way he went about things down there was way over the top.
I don't disagree that both Balsillie and the previous owner went about things the wrong way, but if I'm the previous owner and I see an opportunity to get all of my money out of a sinkhole, I'd take it too. Especially when I know the other option is to go along with the NHL, lose a ******** of money, and pretend to be happy about it.

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11-12-2009, 11:30 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I don't disagree that both Balsillie and the previous owner went about things the wrong way, but if I'm the previous owner and I see an opportunity to get all of my money out of a sinkhole, I'd take it too. Especially when I know the other option is to go along with the NHL, lose a ******** of money, and pretend to be happy about it.
Oh, I understand the approach of everyone involved. I think the NHL needs to get past the fact that they hate JB, and the fact that they're married to some of these not-so-great market. The issue with team areas also needs to be reconsidered, while putting a team in Toronto's zone will certainly have some impact, there is no way it wouldn't be better for the league to have a couple more teams in Canada.

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11-12-2009, 11:32 AM
  #32
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It would take a complete collapse of the auto industry, and given that the gov't has decided they are "too big to fail" I wouldn't count on it happening. But...Detroit itself is already dead economically.

Worth the read on the state of Detroit: http://theurbanophile.blogspot.com/2...y-and-new.html
I saw that linked from http://detroit.blogs.time.com/ which I highly recommend. I think that TIME's coverage of Detroit all year will be VERY interesting, and I think Philadelphia has a lot of lessons to learn from Detroit.

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Old
11-12-2009, 11:38 AM
  #33
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And sliding in at number 11, the "model franchise"

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11-12-2009, 11:42 AM
  #34
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I saw that linked from http://detroit.blogs.time.com/ which I highly recommend. I think that TIME's coverage of Detroit all year will be VERY interesting, and I think Philadelphia has a lot of lessons to learn from Detroit.
Philadelphia does, but Philadelphia is already on a different trajectory than Detroit. Many similar problems, though. Philadelphia was near a full scale collapse like that which happened in Detroit in the late 80s, early 90s...and has largely staved it off to that degree.

Great book to read on Philly (if you haven't) is A Prayer For the City by Bissinger (guy that wrote Friday Night Lights). Really gets into the whole situation then and how they were very cognizant of what was going on in Detroit.

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11-12-2009, 11:45 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Philadelphia does, but Philadelphia is already on a different trajectory than Detroit. Many similar problems, though. Philadelphia was near a full scale collapse like that which happened in Detroit in the late 80s, early 90s...and has largely staved it off to that degree.

Great book to read on Philly (if you haven't) is A Prayer For the City by Bissinger (guy that wrote Friday Night Lights). Really gets into the whole situation then and how they were very cognizant of what was going on in Detroit.
Oh, absolutely. But the story is not fully played out yet in either city.

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11-12-2009, 12:05 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Yeah, it's a huge factor. Merchandise revenue is also huge. That's why the Leafs have so much more revenue, for example.
To be fair, the League does give the Leafs a dollar every time they lose.

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11-12-2009, 12:25 PM
  #37
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To be fair, the League does give the Leafs a dollar every time they lose.
BURN!

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Old
11-12-2009, 12:27 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Philadelphia does, but Philadelphia is already on a different trajectory than Detroit. Many similar problems, though. Philadelphia was near a full scale collapse like that which happened in Detroit in the late 80s, early 90s...and has largely staved it off to that degree.

Great book to read on Philly (if you haven't) is A Prayer For the City by Bissinger (guy that wrote Friday Night Lights). Really gets into the whole situation then and how they were very cognizant of what was going on in Detroit.
Not sure if this is what you are alluding to (I didn't read the book, is it about sports in the city or the economy of the city?), but didn't the Eagles try to move out of town like the Colts did in the middle of the night? I remember a couple years ago hearing about that happening a while back and like Howard Eskin actually broke the story and pretty much prevented it. Was someone messing with me/am I going insane, or did this actually happen?

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11-12-2009, 12:47 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Not sure if this is what you are alluding to (I didn't read the book, is it about sports in the city or the economy of the city?), but didn't the Eagles try to move out of town like the Colts did in the middle of the night? I remember a couple years ago hearing about that happening a while back and like Howard Eskin actually broke the story and pretty much prevented it. Was someone messing with me/am I going insane, or did this actually happen?
That book is about the politics/economics of the city. Bissinger followed Ed Rendell around when he first came in as mayor. The book is absolutely fascinating, and a "should read" for any Philadelphian that wants to get a feel for what was going on with the city and the hows and whys of the decision making back then.

I'm not an Eagles fan, and was young back then...I do believe there was talk of moving the Eagles back in the day, though. I think it was mostly a pressure thing, however.

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11-12-2009, 02:43 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Not sure if this is what you are alluding to (I didn't read the book, is it about sports in the city or the economy of the city?), but didn't the Eagles try to move out of town like the Colts did in the middle of the night? I remember a couple years ago hearing about that happening a while back and like Howard Eskin actually broke the story and pretty much prevented it. Was someone messing with me/am I going insane, or did this actually happen?
Off the top of my head, the then-owner Leonard Tose wanted to move the team to the southwest, Albuquerque or something. He was actually half way out of town before some people stepped up to stop it. Must have been quite frightening for birds fans.

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11-12-2009, 04:19 PM
  #41
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I understand what you're saying, but if CSN had such a stake in the Flyers, you'd think they'd cover them a bit more/do a better job covering them.

I can't turn on CSN without seeing the Eagles, Phillies, or the freaking Sixers.

Flyers get the back-end of whatever half-hour slot they can find and use it for injury updates while the Sixers coverage goes in depth into coaching philosophies, key players, etc.

If CSN has an serious interest in the Flyers, their other programing certainly doesn't show it.
This I can not stand. They suck, their coach is more of a retard than John Stevens, and i dont know anyone who can name 3 players on the team. **** the sixers, the Flyers atleast make noise. CSN, I agree, does a half assed job to cover them.

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11-12-2009, 06:45 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Off the top of my head, the then-owner Leonard Tose wanted to move the team to the southwest, Albuquerque or something. He was actually half way out of town before some people stepped up to stop it. Must have been quite frightening for birds fans.
I don't know what the football/sports climate was back then, but I can't imagine that happening in Philly today.

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11-12-2009, 06:52 PM
  #43
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I don't know what the football/sports climate was back then, but I can't imagine that happening in Philly today.
Any competent owner makes money hand over fist in today's NFL, so I doubt it would happen too many places.

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11-13-2009, 02:36 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
It would take a complete collapse of the auto industry, and given that the gov't has decided they are "too big to fail" I wouldn't count on it happening. But...Detroit itself is already dead economically.

Worth the read on the state of Detroit: http://theurbanophile.blogspot.com/2...y-and-new.html
Just out of curiosity, how did you have that website so readily available? Are you working on fixing Detroit or something?

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11-13-2009, 02:38 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Off the top of my head, the then-owner Leonard Tose wanted to move the team to the southwest, Albuquerque or something. He was actually half way out of town before some people stepped up to stop it. Must have been quite frightening for birds fans.
When that took place, it was talk of going to Phoenix. We had the Philadelphia Stars back then in the USFL, who were good by USFL standards (played in the championship every year, winning the last two, although the last one was when they were in Baltimore). Some folks wanted to jettison the Eagles and move the Stars to the NFL, not that that would have happened.

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11-13-2009, 02:41 PM
  #46
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To be fair, the League does give the Leafs a dollar every time they lose.
Surely they would be worth a lot more if that were the case...

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11-13-2009, 03:09 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Off the top of my head, the then-owner Leonard Tose wanted to move the team to the southwest, Albuquerque or something. He was actually half way out of town before some people stepped up to stop it. Must have been quite frightening for birds fans.
It was Arizona, most likely Phoenix. The Cardinals' NFL team was still located in St. Louis.

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11-13-2009, 05:04 PM
  #48
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When that took place, it was talk of going to Phoenix. We had the Philadelphia Stars back then in the USFL, who were good by USFL standards (played in the championship every year, winning the last two, although the last one was when they were in Baltimore). Some folks wanted to jettison the Eagles and move the Stars to the NFL, not that that would have happened.
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It was Arizona, most likely Phoenix. The Cardinals' NFL team was still located in St. Louis.
Ah, I must have had The Simpsons on my mind for some reason. Close enough though. The owner was being a cheapskate, held the town hostage, and very nearly left before the taxpayers gave in for whatever he asked for. It was before my time, but that's the gist of the story as I've been told.

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11-13-2009, 05:46 PM
  #49
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Ah, I must have had The Simpsons on my mind for some reason. Close enough though. The owner was being a cheapskate, held the town hostage, and very nearly left before the taxpayers gave in for whatever he asked for. It was before my time, but that's the gist of the story as I've been told.
Wasn't Leonard Tose (sp?) the one who wanted to sue the casinos for continually bringing him drinks "making" him lose all his money gambling?

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11-13-2009, 11:15 PM
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Wasn't Leonard Tose (sp?) the one who wanted to sue the casinos for continually bringing him drinks "making" him lose all his money gambling?
Haha, yup. He actually did sue them, but lost.

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