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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

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Old
11-13-2009, 08:17 PM
  #1
Blackhawkswincup
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Chi-Min

To Hawks
C Eric Belanger
G Josh Harding
2nd round pick

To Wild
LW/RW Kris Versteeg

The Wild get a young top 6 forward and the hawks get a vet C to replace Bolland , A good young goalie to be our #1 in future and a solid pick?

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Old
11-13-2009, 08:19 PM
  #2
Coldplay
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I think you're overvaluing Versteeg a little.

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Old
11-13-2009, 08:29 PM
  #3
Blackhawkswincup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
I think you're overvaluing Versteeg a little.
Maybe but Belenger is a UFA after season , Harding is an RFA due a raise and a 2nd is solid pick.

Versteeg has alot of potential

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Old
11-13-2009, 09:16 PM
  #4
Wildlife
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
To Hawks
C Eric Belanger
G Josh Harding
2nd round pick

To Wild
LW/RW Kris Versteeg

The Wild get a young top 6 forward and the hawks get a vet C to replace Bolland , A good young goalie to be our #1 in future and a solid pick?
As a Wild fan I would never do this. Drop the pick to a lower one and then I would. Belanger may be a UFA at the end of the season, there's always the potential to resign him. He also wouldn't be cheap to aquire right now considering his hot start. Harding is young and filled with potential just like Versteeg. That makes the 2nd too high of a pick.

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Old
11-13-2009, 09:51 PM
  #5
saywut
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Harding + Belanger for Ladd?

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Old
11-13-2009, 10:19 PM
  #6
salty justice
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Versteeg is certainly the most valuable piece of this deal. Belanger has very little value as a rental and no backup in the league is worth much more than a 3rd. Would you trade a 3rd and a 2nd for a young, talented 2nd liner?

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Old
11-13-2009, 10:27 PM
  #7
Blackhawkswincup
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saywut View Post
Harding + Belanger for Ladd?
When Hossa is back and if Ebbett continues to suck/ Huet falters or something that might be something to think of.

But the CAP wont work as its too much coming back to Hawks

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Old
11-13-2009, 10:32 PM
  #8
eklunds source
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salty justice View Post
Versteeg is certainly the most valuable piece of this deal. Belanger has very little value as a rental and no backup in the league is worth much more than a 3rd. Would you trade a 3rd and a 2nd for a young, talented 2nd liner?
Minnesota doesn't caren't about Belanger's value as a rental, because to the Wild he isn't a rental.

He's a top-6 forward in Minnesota and performing well for them - just because he's a UFA doesn't mean they can't POSSIBLY resign him.

Also, Harding may not have value around the league, but he is their backup goaltender so they're not just going to move him for ***** and giggles.

Would Chicago trade Madden (rental, has little value), Niemi (unproven backup), and a 2nd for Martin Erat?

No- just because those pieces aren't individually valuable around the league doesn't mean the players don't have value to Chicago.

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Old
11-13-2009, 10:46 PM
  #9
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If I was Chicago I would do that deal and shop Huet, Harding is ready I think to get a chance in the NHL as a starter, I mean hes already better than Huet. Although, I do think that you could get more than that for Versteeg.

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Old
11-14-2009, 11:05 AM
  #10
Bubba88
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belanger + harding for Ladd (OR Versteeg)

as hawk.... make the deal.

as wild... is dubli(what ever)wyk the backup you need? yes... backstrom plays well and 70 games... so lets do this trade.

versteeg for belanger? i think the wild won't make the POs and so, they add a scorer for twoway center.

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Old
11-14-2009, 12:01 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salty justice View Post
Versteeg is certainly the most valuable piece of this deal. Belanger has very little value as a rental and no backup in the league is worth much more than a 3rd. Would you trade a 3rd and a 2nd for a young, talented 2nd liner?

... i can think of a few that are t.. Rask first easy... harding has more value then a 3rd.. Ellis has more then a 3rd .. who ever u want to call the back up in ANA just bc there a back up doesnt mean they have no value..

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Old
11-14-2009, 01:43 PM
  #12
Bullrun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eklunds source View Post
Minnesota doesn't caren't about Belanger's value as a rental, because to the Wild he isn't a rental.

He's a top-6 forward in Minnesota and performing well for them - just because he's a UFA doesn't mean they can't POSSIBLY resign him.

Also, Harding may not have value around the league, but he is their backup goaltender so they're not just going to move him for ***** and giggles.

Would Chicago trade Madden (rental, has little value), Niemi (unproven backup), and a 2nd for Martin Erat?

No- just because those pieces aren't individually valuable around the league doesn't mean the players don't have value to Chicago.
Belanger was on the 4th line in minnesota coming out of camp. Since then PMB was injured, Sheppard has been sucking it up and Brodziak has established a solid 3rd line with Kobasew and Clutterbuck.

I really don't think the wild have ever planned on re-signing Belanger. Fletcher will probably try to trade him around the deadline since this team desperately needs prospects. The team also desperately needs sheppard to earn the 2nd center role...but who knows how that will work

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Old
11-14-2009, 01:54 PM
  #13
Bullrun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Maybe but Belenger is a UFA after season , Harding is an RFA due a raise and a 2nd is solid pick.

Versteeg has alot of potential
Harding was an RFA last summer too. I don't think trading for an RFA is quite as undesirable as many make it out to be. Its not like harding is going to hold out or anything.

Also, its been known that Fletcher is determined to keep all of this year's picks if possible. This is partly why the kobasew deal involved next years 2nd. So I find it really unlikely that any of this years high picks are moving, specially with the wild doing so poorly.

The reason the value seems so far off at first glance is that the Wild have few tradable pieces and this actually makes a bigger impact than you'd think.

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Old
11-14-2009, 03:37 PM
  #14
saywut
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
When Hossa is back and if Ebbett continues to suck/ Huet falters or something that might be something to think of.

But the CAP wont work as its too much coming back to Hawks
Is it really that tight? Ladd is 200k less Belanger, and Harding is slightly less than 300k more than Niemi(3 goalies won't stay up). Thats like ~400k or so at this point.

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Old
11-14-2009, 07:07 PM
  #15
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As much as the wild need a finisher, Belenger is the only decent 2nd center we have, so he isn't going anywhere atleast until deadline, Harding isn't going anywhere until deadline, and tbh this is a lil over priced for versteeg maybe if you took the pick out or made it a 3rd possibly would this deal be acceptable.

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Old
11-14-2009, 08:27 PM
  #16
saywut
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grN1g View Post
As much as the wild need a finisher, Belenger is the only decent 2nd center we have, so he isn't going anywhere atleast until deadline, Harding isn't going anywhere until deadline, and tbh this is a lil over priced for versteeg maybe if you took the pick out or made it a 3rd possibly would this deal be acceptable.
Belanger is not a 2nd line center. That is the problem with the Wild right now.

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Old
11-14-2009, 08:42 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hensel View Post
Harding is ready I think to get a chance in the NHL as a starter, I mean hes already better than Huet.

Based on? ??? ????

Oh, that's right, based on nothing you are just making something up and stating it as fact.

Harding has proven NOTHING as a starter at the NHL level. he played some decent games in net for a team that employed the most obstructionistly tight, clutch and grab, lets try to win 0-0 team in the NHL and put up decent numbers. We will all find out how good he is if he ever gets a chance someday but please don't speak of your opinions as if they were proven facts.

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Old
11-14-2009, 09:03 PM
  #18
BigT2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brevard View Post
Based on? ??? ????

Oh, that's right, based on nothing you are just making something up and stating it as fact.

Harding has proven NOTHING as a starter at the NHL level. he played some decent games in net for a team that employed the most obstructionistly tight, clutch and grab, lets try to win 0-0 team in the NHL and put up decent numbers. We will all find out how good he is if he ever gets a chance someday but please don't speak of your opinions as if they were proven facts.
Well he was injured at the beginning of the season and he did just stop 38SOG from a high powered Washington team. And that is with a team "that has no identity at this point and their defense has been out the window" in the NHL. Not to mention he would be better leaps and bounds than Huet has been, and wouldn't demand a $5M contract. Not to mention over the last few years he has been in the .900% for his save percentage.

Looking at their stats over the last 3 seasons, they are almost the same. So please explain how Harding wouldn't be an asset to your team long term considering you are a franchise that will need to figure out a way to drop two overpayments on players (huet and campbell) in order to sign your three core players.

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Old
11-14-2009, 09:48 PM
  #19
salty justice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Predsrule View Post
... i can think of a few that are t.. Rask first easy... harding has more value then a 3rd.. Ellis has more then a 3rd .. who ever u want to call the back up in ANA just bc there a back up doesnt mean they have no value..
There really isn't a true backup in Anaheim, it's more of a 1a, 1b type tandem. When was the last time a backup goaltender was traded for much more than a 3rd? I suppose Kiprusoff was traded for a 2nd, but I can't think of a time when a backup ever fetched much more than that.

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Old
11-14-2009, 10:48 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
To Hawks
C Eric Belanger
G Josh Harding
2nd round pick

To Wild
LW/RW Kris Versteeg

The Wild get a young top 6 forward and the hawks get a vet C to replace Bolland , A good young goalie to be our #1 in future and a solid pick?

I'd consider it with the pick taken out.

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Old
11-15-2009, 12:14 AM
  #21
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The 2nd point would be a sticking point that, IMO, makes the deal a no-go for Minnesota.

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Old
11-15-2009, 12:16 AM
  #22
detredWINgs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salty justice View Post
There really isn't a true backup in Anaheim, it's more of a 1a, 1b type tandem. When was the last time a backup goaltender was traded for much more than a 3rd? I suppose Kiprusoff was traded for a 2nd, but I can't think of a time when a backup ever fetched much more than that.
Harding is 25 years old playing behind a $5M Vezina nominee. Hes not going to be the 1B in that situation, regardless of whether or not he can be. We're talking about a 25 year old whos never gotten a chance - not Ty Conklin or the like. Hes hardly destined to be a backup goalie for the rest of his NHL career.

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Old
11-15-2009, 12:42 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brevard View Post
Harding has proven NOTHING as a starter at the NHL level. he played some decent games in net for a team that employed the most obstructionistly tight, clutch and grab, lets try to win 0-0 team in the NHL and put up decent numbers. We will all find out how good he is if he ever gets a chance someday but please don't speak of your opinions as if they were proven facts.
If "proven NOTHING" means that he has proven to have the potential to be a #1 for 5-10 years (like he has at every other level), than fine.

Before you criticize someone's "facts", be careful with yours too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by salty justice View Post
When was the last time a backup goaltender was traded for much more than a 3rd? I suppose Kiprusoff was traded for a 2nd, but I can't think of a time when a backup ever fetched much more than that.
Vesa Toskala? Mike Smith? Dwayne Roloson? Tuukka Rask?

Not all were traded for pure draft picks, but all were inferior-to-the-starter 1B/backups at the time they were traded, and they all garnered value more than a 3rd.

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Old
11-15-2009, 04:48 AM
  #24
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Originally Posted by saywut View Post
Belanger is not a 2nd line center. That is the problem with the Wild right now.

I know, im simply stating that Belanger is the only center we have that can actually play our 2nd line.

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Old
11-15-2009, 09:15 AM
  #25
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Well he was injured at the beginning of the season and he did just stop 38SOG from a high powered Washington team. And that is with a team "that has no identity at this point and their defense has been out the window" in the NHL. Not to mention he would be better leaps and bounds than Huet has been, and wouldn't demand a $5M contract. Not to mention over the last few years he has been in the .900% for his save percentage.

Looking at their stats over the last 3 seasons, they are almost the same. So please explain how Harding wouldn't be an asset to your team long term considering you are a franchise that will need to figure out a way to drop two overpayments on players (huet and campbell) in order to sign your three core players.

If you think the only way to resolve the TKK signing situation is to move either or both of Huet and Campbell then we probably shouldn't be discussing this because you don't have the knowledge about the Hawks to do it fairly.

But that's ok, it's only the internet and it's all in fun.

In my original post I was responding to a Wild fan's statement about Josh Harding. That statement was """ I mean hes already better than Huet.""

Then in your post which is critical of my opinion you write""" Looking at their stats over the last 3 seasons, they are almost the same.""

but manage to also quip. ""he would be better leaps and bounds than Huet has been,""

Again this is based on nothiing but your opinion and actually you yourself show is probably a wrong opinion. Lets look at some things that are factual.
Harding (when the starter was healthy)
A) played limited action in a backup role.
B) Played (most but not all) against the kinds of teams backups play against
C) Played for the most committed to defense coach. Limiting chances against.

Huet
A) played as a split time starter/backup for pretty much all of the last 3 years.
B) played against all teams in all situations
C) Montreal & Washington don't play solid defensive systems (nor do the Hawks).

Mind you I never said Harding won't be good or even great when/if he gets his chance. All I am pointing out is you cannot claim something as true that has not yet happened. Nobody knows if Harding in a full time starters role would be better or worse than Huet is. ... And the data in front of us based on the previous experience (all things considered) actually leans in Huet's favor.

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