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11/16/09 Has anyone stopped caring?

View Poll Results: Has anyone stopped caring?
Yep, as a fan I have 29 25.66%
The players have 8 7.08%
The coaching staff has 0 0%
No, effort is there still 12 10.62%
No, as I fan I still care 52 46.02%
Other, please explain 12 10.62%
Voters: 113. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-16-2009, 02:35 PM
  #101
CupofOil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmminvisiblecola View Post
Who cares about the Detroit Lions which have been an inept organization for many years, Oilers fans expect better. Fine you seem to be happy with mediocrity considering you cheer for the LIONS, however as Oilers fans we would like to see a team that plays with emotion and is proud to wear the sweater.
Obviously i care about the Lions and i was just using it as an analogy If you're a fan, you're a fan, it shouldn't matter what sport you watch or what your team did in the past. Now, of course we want a team to be proud of but to just care about the team when they're good is the definition of a fairweather fan..... I'm as frustrated as anybody over the mediocrity that has reigned supreme in Oiler land but i ALWAYS cheer and care for the Oilers even if the caring level is at a lower level sometimes.

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11-16-2009, 02:35 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by nafrelio View Post
WHICH ARE YOU?

Oiler Fan A - You cheer without real hope in success. Be a "true fan" who cares so much that you need to create false hope/delusion to pretend that you are engaged (you are really disengaging from the reality that is your team). Be aware that hurt, anger, and despair will come your way since your hope is based on delusion. Be mad at others because they don't believe your delusions and abandon you to cheer, and thus despair alone. Be mad at other so called "fans" because their despair threatens the "truth" of your delusion of hope. You use every win to bolster your delusion.

Oiler Fan B - You don't cheer as loud when failure appears inevitable. You care so much that you place your hope in better years ahead in order to tolerate and/or ignore the present without completely disengaging from it. You fear that if you care too much in the present, you'll only be disappointed. Thus, you change the object of your hope from the present team to the future team. You hover on these boards, scouring stats and reviews of prospects yet to make the team, soaking in any news of the next one - the messiah of Oiler hockey - the one who will bring hope and wipe out disappointment and delusions. You immerse yourself in the draft and hope for a dive for the top five. Sometimes you feel guilty that you cannot sustain a delusion as the "true fans" do. You use every loss to bolster your hope in the future. The bright future as you picture it, is at least partly a delusion.

Oiler Fan C - Stop watching, disengage from hockey and start cheering for Tiger Woods who will never let you down. When Tiger lets you down, keep searching for something with lasting value. You realize that hockey, like most things in life, is meaningless - a chase after the wind (credit to the writer of Ecclesiastes and Copper and Blue as posted recently on his blog ). Soon, however, you reengage the game of hockey and your love: the Oilers. You become grateful for what you can enjoy as a fan - a nice goal, a good game, stable concession prices, loud hecklers from the cheap seats, the sound of the puck on the sticks, etc. You cease to want to decifer between who is a true fan and who is not. When you decide to care about the team, it is because you want to, not because you need to. This all sounds like a delusion too.

Anyone else having a slow day at the office?

Ha ha! Nice, I think that there are still other varying degrees out there, but I likely fit A a little better. Still wearing blue today as it is game day. I do plan on watching the game and I keep hoping for something strange to happen at the end each game, you know, that thing I sorta remember, where suddenly we get two points? I dunno, maybe I remember it all wrong.

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11-16-2009, 02:39 PM
  #103
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I will always care. My problem is caring too much.
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11-16-2009, 02:44 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
Obviously i care about the Lions and i was just using it as an analogy If you're a fan, you're a fan, it shouldn't matter what sport you watch or what your team did in the past. Now, of course we want a team to be proud of but to just care about the team when they're good is the definition of a fairweather fan..... I'm as frustrated as anybody over the mediocrity that has reigned supreme in Oiler land but i ALWAYS cheer and care for the Oilers even if the caring level is at a lower level sometimes.
So a fan who chastises the team for losing even when they care is supposedly a fairweather fan?

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11-16-2009, 02:50 PM
  #105
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I'm not getting into this bulls*** argument.

The "true fan" vs. "fairweather fan" debate will forever go on...

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11-16-2009, 02:51 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nafrelio View Post
WHICH ARE YOU?

Oiler Fan A - You cheer without real hope in success. Be a "true fan" who cares so much that you need to create false hope/delusion to pretend that you are engaged (you are really disengaging from the reality that is your team). Be aware that hurt, anger, and despair will come your way since your hope is based on delusion. Be mad at others because they don't believe your delusions and abandon you to cheer, and thus despair alone. Be mad at other so called "fans" because their despair threatens the "truth" of your delusion of hope. You use every win to bolster your delusion.


Oiler Fan B - You don't cheer as loud when failure appears inevitable. You care so much that you place your hope in better years ahead in order to tolerate and/or ignore the present without completely disengaging from it. You fear that if you care too much in the present, you'll only be disappointed. Thus, you change the object of your hope from the present team to the future team. You hover on these boards, scouring stats and reviews of prospects yet to make the team, soaking in any news of the next one - the messiah of Oiler hockey - the one who will bring hope and wipe out disappointment and delusions. You immerse yourself in the draft and hope for a dive for the top five. Sometimes you feel guilty that you cannot sustain a delusion as the "true fans" do. You use every loss to bolster your hope in the future. The bright future as you picture it, is at least partly a delusion.

Oiler Fan C - Stop watching, disengage from hockey and start cheering for Tiger Woods who will never let you down. When Tiger lets you down, keep searching for something with lasting value. You realize that hockey, like most things in life, is meaningless - a chase after the wind (credit to the writer of Ecclesiastes and Copper and Blue as posted recently on his blog ). Soon, however, you reengage the game of hockey and your love: the Oilers. You become grateful for what you can enjoy as a fan - a nice goal, a good game, stable concession prices, loud hecklers from the cheap seats, the sound of the puck on the sticks, etc. You cease to want to decifer between who is a true fan and who is not. When you decide to care about the team, it is because you want to, not because you need to. This all sounds like a delusion too.

Anyone else having a slow day at the office?

I'm "B" with a shot of "A". I'm not writing off our current lineup, but I'm not dreaming about a Cup parade down Whyte Ave either.

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Old
11-16-2009, 02:51 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hmminvisiblecola View Post
So a fan who chastises the team for losing even when they care is supposedly a fairweather fan?
You're not comprehending what i'm saying...... What i'm saying is that being critical of the team is part of being a fan but when a "fan" stops caring about whether the team loses or not then all of a sudden starts rooting for that team when they are playing better then that's the definition of a fairweather fan.

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11-16-2009, 03:04 PM
  #108
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There is nothing wrong with debating how you can make the Oilers a better team but it ends up turning into some kind of huge trade your 4th liners for Superstars Kind of debate

There is also the if we finish last this year and draft "Young Superstar here" we will be so much better the following year kind of people.

You have to realistically look at our current players and figure out who should and could be dealt for something tangible in return.

Horcoff with his contract is not going to be traded and if he is then it will be for another player with a bad contract. You can't package Horcoff up with Nillson and a 2nd and expect Lecavallier in return.

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11-16-2009, 03:08 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
You're not comprehending what i'm saying...... What i'm saying is that being critical of the team is part of being a fan but when a "fan" stops caring about whether the team loses or not then all of a sudden starts rooting for that team when they are playing better then that's the definition of a fairweather fan.
It would seem you're trying to impose your values on others.

Many of us remained true blue through the bleak 90's and sad first half of the decade.

The team could not compete in those years because of economic realities but we were promised a competitive team once the economic landscape was levelled.

Well, it's been level now for 5 years and the team is not competitive.

What's worse is the team often doesn't "care" enough to give a full 60 minute effort and Oiler management doesn't "care" to fix the glaring holes on the team.

If players and management don't "care" enough to be competitive, why should fans?

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11-16-2009, 03:08 PM
  #110
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I'd say I've stopped caring, as far as whether we win or lose this year. Obviously I'd rather we make the playoffs and see some of our current underachievers play to their potential, but at this point it seems obvious we're missing some pretty key pieces. If we keep losing and can get one of those missing pieces via the draft, I'll live. Right now, we're banking on MPS, Eberle, Gagner and Petry to hit their top potential in order for us to be real cup contenders. Being that it's incredibly unlikely all those guys realize their full potential, I wouldn't be against seeing a Taylor Hall thrown into the mix. This way, we have a much better shot at developing a couple of stars that can carry the team. Of course, if we can swing some sort of a trade for a superstar, or a top pick, we wouldn't need to lose this year.

Most of this is due to me being unable to catch a full game since late October with all these bloody PPVs in a row. When I'm able to start watching games again, these losses will start to sting again.

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11-16-2009, 03:10 PM
  #111
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Our beer league team is called the Peter North Stars...our logo is a tipped over mayonnaise delivery truck....
Bwahaha, if yer serious... that's an absolute beauty... props

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11-16-2009, 03:11 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by OntOilFan View Post
I'm pretty much there.

It's been a slow grind since that 2006 cup run, but my care level is at an all-time low.

This team has degenerated into one of the running jokes of the NHL.

I used to post on here 15 times a day. Now, I might post that often in a week.

You can only get your hopes up only to have them crushed so many times before you stop getting your hopes up ...
Leaf fans say hi.

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11-16-2009, 03:15 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by A Vandelay View Post
I'm not getting into this bulls*** argument.

The "true fan" vs. "fairweather fan" debate will forever go on...
Oh of course it will, my question was supposed to be more of "who here is ready to give up?" or do you think that that team has thrown in the towel. I don't think that if the play as of late has you down that you are any less of a fan than anyone else.

Hopefully I'll have a happy cheerful poll for tomorrow right? Like how many years in a row are we winning the cup after this year?

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11-16-2009, 03:17 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dashingsilverfox View Post
It would seem you're trying to impose your values on others.

Many of us remained true blue through the bleak 90's and sad first half of the decade.

The team could not compete in those years because of economic realities but we were promised a competitive team once the economic landscape was levelled.

Well, it's been level now for 5 years and the team is not competitive.

What's worse is the team often doesn't "care" enough to give a full 60 minute effort and Oiler management doesn't "care" to fix the glaring holes on the team.

If players and management don't "care" enough to be competitive, why should fans?

This is the bottom line, if you are a true fan you ALWAYS care about how you're team does no matter the circumstance, do you get mad and frustrated at the team and management yes but in the end you always cheer and care for your team.
Also, to say that the team and management don't care is ridiculous, did it ever occur to you that perhaps the team is just not good enough at this point and that management has their hands tied because of management ineptitude over the past couple of years..... Not doing your job well and not caring are two different things

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11-16-2009, 03:18 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Leaf fans say hi.
And Vanouver fans

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11-16-2009, 03:20 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dashingsilverfox View Post
It would seem you're trying to impose your values on others.

Many of us remained true blue through the bleak 90's and sad first half of the decade.

The team could not compete in those years because of economic realities but we were promised a competitive team once the economic landscape was levelled.

Well, it's been level now for 5 years and the team is not competitive.

What's worse is the team often doesn't "care" enough to give a full 60 minute effort and Oiler management doesn't "care" to fix the glaring holes on the team.

If players and management don't "care" enough to be competitive, why should fans?
I thought you gave up your tickets? Who is us then?

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11-16-2009, 03:32 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
This is the bottom line, if you are a true fan you ALWAYS care about how you're team does no matter the circumstance, do you get mad and frustrated at the team and management yes but in the end you always cheer and care for your team.
Also, to say that the team and management don't care is ridiculous, did it ever occur to you that perhaps the team is just not good enough at this point and that management has their hands tied because of management ineptitude over the past couple of years..... Not doing your job well and not caring are two different things
There's no question Lowe damaged the organization with his sweetheart contracts but do you really believe all Tambellini could do was sign Mike Comrie and make a sideways move in goal?

Why is Robert Nilsson still on the roster?

Why didn't the Oilers sign a centre who can win faceoffs when many were available for a song?

If Comrie was the answer, what was the question?

Who signed Khabibulin for 4 freaking years?

Why do the Oilers have four puck moving defensemen and not one true shutdown defender?

Just a few questions. I can pose some others if you like.

And, of course, the team is "not good enough at this point" as you've said.

What is management doing about it?

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11-16-2009, 03:35 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I thought you gave up your tickets? Who is us then?
I didn't know you had to be a season ticket holder to be a "true fan".

Are you?

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11-16-2009, 03:37 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dashingsilverfox View Post
There's no question Lowe damaged the organization with his sweetheart contracts but do you really believe all Tambellini could do was sign Mike Comrie and make a sideways move in goal?

Why is Robert Nilsson still on the roster?

Why didn't the Oilers sign a centre who can win faceoffs when many were available for a song?

If Comrie was the answer, what was the question?

Who signed Khabibulin for 4 freaking years?

Why do the Oilers have four puck moving defensemen and not one true shutdown defender?

Just a few questions. I can pose some others if you like.

And, of course, the team is "not good enough at this point" as you've said.

What is management doing about it?

They tried hard for Heatley and you know how that turned out, with all the contracts that this team is tied up in, it would have been difficult to make any moves and it's tough to move any of these contracts because of the Lowe overpayments so what else could they do? Anyway, i took issue with you saying that they don't care which is ridiculous considering how hard they went after Heatley, maybe they care too much in a way, it's going to take time to clean up the mess.
Anyway, back to the topic at hand

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11-16-2009, 03:38 PM
  #120
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The Heatley try looks even more foolish now considering Penner and Smid's play.

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11-16-2009, 03:46 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by dashingsilverfox View Post
Who signed Khabibulin for 4 freaking years?
Who would you have preffered as our goalie? Anderson would have been an option I guess but Khabbi was a good choice and he wouldnt have signed here without those terms, he had no intention of coming here at all but the offer was to hard to turn down. Of course now he loves it here but still...

We could always buy him out or burry his contract in the minors if we have to in the futur, no worries

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11-16-2009, 03:47 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
They tried hard for Heatley and you know how that turned out
And ignored guys like Glencross and Kotalik who they desperately needed while they chased the big fish with starry eyes.

Some posters are insistent that Glencross turned down an offer from the Oilers to sign with Calgary but I have yet to see any concrete evidence supporting that...theory. Especially when they are believed mostly by others of the "Narnia" variety

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11-16-2009, 03:49 PM
  #123
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I don't know why Khabibulin is even in that equation. He's been the least of the team's worries along with Penner, Smid and Visnovsky.

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11-16-2009, 03:51 PM
  #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dashingsilverfox View Post
There's no question Lowe damaged the organization with his sweetheart contracts but do you really believe all Tambellini could do was sign Mike Comrie and make a sideways move in goal?

Why is Robert Nilsson still on the roster?

Why didn't the Oilers sign a centre who can win faceoffs when many were available for a song?

If Comrie was the answer, what was the question?

Who signed Khabibulin for 4 freaking years?

Why do the Oilers have four puck moving defensemen and not one true shutdown defender?

Just a few questions. I can pose some others if you like.

And, of course, the team is "not good enough at this point" as you've said.

What is management doing about it?

The Oiler management like so many of its fans are stuck in the 80s and want some kind of super finesse team.

I have been saying for years I would rather have had guys like Hejda,Commodore, and Montador on our blueline than Vishnovsky,Gilbert and Grebs.

They had one in Marty Reasoner and let him go. I am still not sure why having Marty at 1.1 million a year playing on the 3rd/4th line getting his 25-30 points a year would have been a bad thing.

Don't get me started about Stoll/Greene trade either.

People think Eberle or MPS are going to be the savior around here but until they realize that Edmonton as a team needs to change its phillosophy(btw Quinn is trying to do just this. Listen to his after game interviews. He is 100 percent right about why this team loses.)

look at the teams above us in the NW. Compare the Defenses.

Adam Foote,Brett Clarke,Scott Hannah,Kyle Quincey,Kyle Cumisky, John Michael Lyles

Dion Phaneuf,Robyn Regher,Jay Bouwmeester,Mark Giodarno,Corey Sarich,Adam Pardy

Christian Erhoff,Kevin Bieska,Willie Mitchell,Alexander Edler,Sami Salo,Aaron Rome

I would take anyone of those over the Oilers D right now. Because they all play a simple but effective game.

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11-16-2009, 03:52 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
They tried hard for Heatley and you know how that turned out, with all the contracts that this team is tied up in, it would have been difficult to make any moves and it's tough to move any of these contracts because of the Lowe overpayments so what else could they do? Anyway, i took issue with you saying that they don't care which is ridiculous considering how hard they went after Heatley, maybe they care too much in a way, it's going to take time to clean up the mess.
Anyway, back to the topic at hand
The pursuit of Heatley is exactly the topic at hand since it plays to why it's tough to care when management doesn't get it.

They are much more focused on creating a splash than building a winner.

The team needs an extreme makeover and chasing rainbows like Heatley, Hossa, Nylander and Jagr don't address that issue.

All I had hoped for this season was progress and, if anything, this team is worse than last year.

I'd wager they finish with fewer than 85 points.

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