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Who would you rather keep? Brule or Cogliano?

View Poll Results: Who would you keep?
Brule 133 76.00%
Cogliano 21 12.00%
Neither/Both/NA 21 12.00%
Voters: 175. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
12-01-2009, 01:58 AM
  #76
Seanzie888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfect_Drug View Post
Are there been any examples of seasoning time in the AHL hurting a prospect's development?
One could make the argument that O'Sullivan has suffered from having played in the A. He was extremely successful in the AHL level—in fact he was rookie of the year in the AHL. He has yet to transfer that success into NHL performance. Doesn't mean he never will, it just means he hasn't made it there yet.

As for the question of the thread, Brule has to be the guy. He can hit, he can win draws (of our players who have taken over 100 draws, he is #1[51.8%]. Only Comrie is better and he's only taken 40!) and he has great hands. Anyone who watched Vancouver Giants games when Brule played for them knows just how impressive he is.

I don't see him being more than a 2nd or 3rd line center, but that's something the Oilers need right now. It would be nice to see someone keep their spot for a long time. Actually, Brule between Pisani and Moreau would have been a great checking line if Pisani could have remained healthy. However, since that isn't going to happen maybe Stone fills that void.

As for Cogliano, I do believe him to have high level talent, however, he rarely gets scoring line time. I also believe that if the Oilers were to move him up in the line up that would leave no room for Eberle when he comes up. Since Eberle would be a better fit in the top six than Cogliano (because he's a winger and we have too many Centers), that makes Cogs expendable.

There's also the added bonus that Cogliano is very highly valued in the NHL. Many believe him to be a future star. There is no way we can know if he will pan out or not. All we can do is capitalize on his value now and get someone in return who is already able to help this franchise.

Obviously I'm not suggesting that Cogs alone would yield a high end forward however, I believe the Oilers to have the available components to create a package that would yield a high end forward. The Oil have a surplus of young, small, skilled forwards that could be traded for the quality players they need. Does that mean that it will happen? The only person that really knows—despite what Eklund says—is Tamballini.

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Old
12-01-2009, 10:27 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Rooooooooooxxxanne View Post
I'm amazed at how undervalued Cogliano is right now...

I'd rather keep him than Brule to be honest... because i still feel Cogliano has a lot of untapped potential, but I can understand why people would rather keep Brule given how well he has played for us.
This is the developmental bias of the board. Every newer prospect is shinier and better than old. In this case I think it rings true but on this board all of Gagner, Cogs, and Nilsson were considered future stars in the making based on a very short sample of kidline success together.

This board has pretty much a disposable view of players to be discarded once people tire of seeing the same mistakes or perceived limitations.

If this boards membership served as GM the average age of the team would scratch 20.

hfboards after all.

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Old
12-01-2009, 10:32 AM
  #78
MeestaDeteta
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Brule provides a specific skill set that the Oil are lacking.

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Old
12-01-2009, 10:36 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Stiffler's Mom View Post
I think we should keep both. Cogliano reminds me of a young Kris Draper. Excellent penalty killer with tons of speed, tenacity, and an offensive contributor. Cogliano is too good to give up.
There is little in Cogs game that reminds me of Kris Draper. He doesn't exhibit the hockey mind that Draper does.

fwiw Cogliano is the worst pker on this club right now.

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Old
12-01-2009, 10:38 AM
  #80
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I'd keep Brule and Cogliano both. Probably will be able to resign Cogs for cheap after this season.

O'Sullivan and Nilsson I think should be gone. Nilsson should be buried in the AHL next season.

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Old
12-01-2009, 10:54 AM
  #81
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I just don't see Cogs being a top 6 forward, on any team. He doesn't have the shot, the moves or the hockey sense needed to play there. He can skate really fast, and is sensing he needs to play with an edge to improve his game. His defensive game will improve with time and experience. That will make him a fine third line centre in the Todd Marchant mold no matter where he plays. And there is no shame in that. He is what he is.

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12-01-2009, 11:08 AM
  #82
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The math bloggers are out to prove Brule is getting nothing but "lucky bounces" and that because this is a contract year, he should be trade bait.

How many times do we have to make the mistake of losing a valuable, 3rd line forward who plays physical, can skate, and contributes offensively? They've done it with Stoll and with Glencross, two players the Oilers could desperately use right now. Not to mention, like Brule, both players were in their contract years before shipping out. That didn't stop them from continuing to contribute with their new teams. Trading Brule would be making the same mistake.

Not to mention, the "math" didn't favour Glencross during his stint with the Oil. Look at him in Calgary now, even the advanced math favours him something ridiculous (one of Calgary's best). Same can be said for Stoll, he's one of LA's most reliable forwards.

Sure, the numbers don't favour Brule just yet, but he's still young and developing. Of course he's playing weaker competition, that's how you break-in youngsters. You let them be successful (hell, let them dominate) their competition gradually, from juniors/college on up. Columbus failed to do this with Gilbert before, and Quinn-Renney are getting it right this time around.

Really, I don't understand the logic of trading away an up and coming player just because his value is high. Not to mention, trading away a player who brings everything that this team sorely lacks. The Brule for Torres deal was one of Lowe's better moves, it reeks of Ken Holland insight (finding a player who lost his way, reshape his development and watch him flourish). I bet Brule could be re-signed for 2-3 years at a reasonable rate, and have a helluva opportunity to outperform that contract.

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Old
12-01-2009, 11:21 AM
  #83
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Brule, for sure. Plus he can fight !

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12-01-2009, 11:43 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Vandelay View Post
The math bloggers are out to prove Brule is getting nothing but "lucky bounces" and that because this is a contract year, he should be trade bait.

How many times do we have to make the mistake of losing a valuable, 3rd line forward who plays physical, can skate, and contributes offensively? They've done it with Stoll and with Glencross, two players the Oilers could desperately use right now. Not to mention, like Brule, both players were in their contract years before shipping out. That didn't stop them from continuing to contribute with their new teams. Trading Brule would be making the same mistake.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Put the brakes on. First of all yes we do miss those players. But I along with many other make the Stoll for Vish trade everyday of the week. The problem with Glencross was that we didn't retain and should ahve been shipped out for something. Instead we lost him for nothing.

Brule is gonna be a solid player but the dumbass management better not sign him to a 4 year 3 million per contract extension.

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12-01-2009, 11:51 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
There is little in Cogs game that reminds me of Kris Draper. He doesn't exhibit the hockey mind that Draper does.

fwiw Cogliano is the worst pker on this club right now.
What you say is true for sure. But I can speak for myself and say I have never been a fan of Cogliano.

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12-01-2009, 11:52 AM
  #86
GSC
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Put the brakes on. First of all yes we do miss those players. But I along with many other make the Stoll for Vish trade everyday of the week. The problem with Glencross was that we didn't retain and should ahve been shipped out for something. Instead we lost him for nothing.

Brule is gonna be a solid player but the dumbass management better not sign him to a 4 year 3 million per contract extension.
I'm not saying the Visnovsky trade was a bad one, but Stoll has yet to be replaced, that's all. Brule is the closest player we have to a Jarret Stoll as of now.

There is no question that Glencross should have been re-signed. He would've made less than Moreau to bring a helluva lot more to the table.

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12-02-2009, 02:56 AM
  #87
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Here's some "math" in favor of Brule:

Have you noticed how he is the leader in faceoff percentage on a puck possession first team?

Or how he is one of the few small forwards on the team who is not afraid to throw his weight around and actually has an impact?

Or the fact that he has almost 10 more points than Cogliano in fewer games?

Not to mention Brule will probably, based on his history (one full season and his injuries), sign a contract that is lower in cost than Cogliano because both Cogs and the organization believe him to be a future star. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Cogs ended up with a 3 mil contract and Brule a 2-2.5 mil contract.

Brule is the player that should be taking over the spot vacated by Stoll. The problem is: currently Horc and Gagner are occupying the 2nd line center spot (switching back and forth).

That suggests that one of them has to go. We know Gagner isn't going to be traded unless the package is amazing. So that leaves Horc. Despite the fact that Horc's contract is an albatross, there are other teams out there that consider him a worth while acquisition.

Just look at the Heatley package from the summer. I, and I know I'm not alone, thought that Penner was untradable however, when he was included in the package as someone that Murray wanted I was stunned! After that you can't rule anything out.

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Old
12-02-2009, 04:28 AM
  #88
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Cogliano reminds me a bit of Kesler in his first few seasons with the Canucks. Skates fast, has a bad shot that doesn't look like it could break glass. I still think the potential is there to turn it around though. There are plenty of other options I'd move on the Oilers ahead of these two, especially given you have no idea whether Brule will be able to sustain this level of play (though I'm rooting for him)

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12-02-2009, 05:27 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Vandelay View Post
The math bloggers are out to prove Brule is getting nothing but "lucky bounces" and that because this is a contract year, he should be trade bait. .
This is precisely (or similar to) why I think both should be retained. Why should the Oilers use either one as "trade bait"?

Brule is set to take Stoll's place, you are right. however, Stoll needed a new start after a huge concussion along iwth a year and a half of slump/suckage. everyone knew he woudl come out of it...but everyone knew it would only happen if he was moved. I, for one, welcomed the trade for the good of the player.

Glencross was part of what in basketball is called a brick. I am sure most people will know what I mean by that.

Cogliano is viewed to be a future star. Brule seems to be coming into his own and possibly becoming a future valued contributor (at least) if not star.

Cogliano is the fastest in the league (most likely), has a nose for the net, and is learning how to get dirty. He is 21? 22? If he was on the top 2 lines, he would be the 3rd highest scorer, I am almost convinced of it. he knows where to be to receive a puck and reminds me a lot of Cammalleri. I can't see any reason to get rid of him now. So many people seem to be down on him, but I see more improvement in his game than Gagner's by far (although I am not stupid enough to not recognize what Gagner can do). The two of them are what makes me quite convinced that blowing up the team is wrong...that making a few key moves to lessen the cap burden while changing the leadership core on the team is what will make this team successful. I mean...Cogliano for Lucic, sure I woudl do the trade...but don't throw him out there just to make a trade while he seems valuable! If he seems valuable, then why can't he remain that way...for your team??

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