HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Gainey trying to make another splash - trade talk!

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-30-2009, 05:38 PM
  #126
FerrisRox
Registered User
 
FerrisRox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,300
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by otto bond View Post
You may under value our players. From what I saw, Horton talent wise and plays wise is similor to Andrei. Sergei has great potential and has a good playoff experience. Horton may have a better start then Andrei but to me we would be giving more in this deal. The kicker here is that Sergei may go to the KHL. Thats wen I stop laughing and think real hard about this deal.
No, I don't think that's it.

If you think that Nathan Horton and Andrei Kostitsyn are similar talent-wise, then we're not even remotely on the same page.

Horton brings a helluva a lot more to the table then Kostitsyn. Despite the idiotic claim in this thread that Horton is "softer than Latendresse" the guy is a power forward in the mould of Jeremy Roenick.

He's 24 years old and putting up points at nearly a point a game pace. If you think you could give up Kostitsyn and Kotitsyn and land a player of that ilk, I think you're incredibly niave.

Then again, you think Sergei is somehow worth something because of his "good playoff experience" which is usually used to describe players that have advance to a Cup Final or won it, not a guy who's won the first round. You also leave out the part where he refuses to report to the AHL and demands to be dealt. Guess what, teams don't like guys like that and usually don't find them to be valuable.

This trade is a laughable it's so biased toward the Canadiens. The best part is, you're not sure you'd do it if you were Montreal.

FerrisRox is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 05:41 PM
  #127
Lafleurs Guy
Registered User
 
Lafleurs Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 20,893
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleatus View Post
To Toronto: Andrei Kostitstyn, and PK Subban.
To Montreal: Jason Blake.
Quit trying to make up for the fact that you don't have a draft pick this year.

Lafleurs Guy is online now  
Old
11-30-2009, 05:43 PM
  #128
Em Ancien
Sexy 2nd Rounder
 
Em Ancien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mount Real Life
Posts: 8,881
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
Horton brings a helluva a lot more to the table then Kostitsyn. Despite the idiotic claim in this thread that Horton is "softer than Latendresse" the guy is a power forward in the mould of Jeremy Roenick.

If you think that Nathan Horton and Andrei Kostitsyn are similar talent-wise, then we're not even remotely on the same page.


What's idiotic is somebody who has never seen Horton play try to make him look like a PF. The guy is not even remotely close to being a power forward, unless you stretch power forward to big body that can play in the top 6.

I've seen quite a few Panthers' games (since I also follow the Thrashers and am following the Panthers for fantasy purposes). The guy is more talented than AK, no doubt. But power forward?

Em Ancien is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 07:47 PM
  #129
otto bond
Registered User
 
otto bond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,854
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTLPacman67 View Post


What's idiotic is somebody who has never seen Horton play try to make him look like a PF. The guy is not even remotely close to being a power forward, unless you stretch power forward to big body that can play in the top 6.

I've seen quite a few Panthers' games (since I also follow the Thrashers and am following the Panthers for fantasy purposes). The guy is more talented than AK, no doubt. But power forward?
Well, I have not seen Horton play all that much but enought to say that he compares equal to Andrei's Talent IMHO. Horton is a better skater but Andrei has better vision and shot, Horton's release is better. Andrei lack of confidence and could realy skyrocket if he can bring in confidence. They both have talent but to say Horton is a cut above is just silly. I say pretty equal

otto bond is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 08:02 PM
  #130
otto bond
Registered User
 
otto bond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,854
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
No, I don't think that's it.

If you think that Nathan Horton and Andrei Kostitsyn are similar talent-wise, then we're not even remotely on the same page.

Horton brings a helluva a lot more to the table then Kostitsyn. Despite the idiotic claim in this thread that Horton is "softer than Latendresse" the guy is a power forward in the mould of Jeremy Roenick.

He's 24 years old and putting up points at nearly a point a game pace. If you think you could give up Kostitsyn and Kotitsyn and land a player of that ilk, I think you're incredibly niave.

Then again, you think Sergei is somehow worth something because of his "good playoff experience" which is usually used to describe players that have advance to a Cup Final or won it, not a guy who's won the first round. You also leave out the part where he refuses to report to the AHL and demands to be dealt. Guess what, teams don't like guys like that and usually don't find them to be valuable.

This trade is a laughable it's so biased toward the Canadiens. The best part is, you're not sure you'd do it if you were Montreal.
It sound like you only base you opinion on stats. I'm sorry but Sergei is a talented yougn player who was fortunate enought to play playoff hockey. He did very well and has more value then you think. Just cause he's still in MTL, means nothing. Perhaps it was not enough for Gainey to pull the trigger but I dought that....From the comment I eard BG say was that yes the player wants to play in the NHL, if not in MTL, then trade me and Bob said that it was Day to Day in his situation. Bob could have pull the trigger but didn't want to in my mind. After what happen was that Sergei was offered a contract by the KHL for good money and why would he not consider this.......makes other team wait this out a bit....trying to buy low sort of speak.
Also, players are always pulling **** like this.....look at Lindros, Pavelec, Heatley just to name a few. Just cause it's Montreal, it bigger then it should be. Look at Radulov, nashville would welcome him back in a heart beat.

otto bond is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 08:20 PM
  #131
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,438
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by otto bond View Post
Well, I have not seen Horton play all that much but enought to say that he compares equal to Andrei's Talent IMHO. Horton is a better skater but Andrei has better vision and shot, Horton's release is better. Andrei lack of confidence and could realy skyrocket if he can bring in confidence. They both have talent but to say Horton is a cut above is just silly. I say pretty equal
I totally agree. The issue with AK is not a lack of talent, because we've seen him go on PPG on several spans of 20 games in the last two seasons, its rather confidence. His good sequence last year ended with the publication of the infamous "gangster" relationship.

Horton and AK are different players indeed... but the talent level cannot be said to be higher for one or the other. Only time will tell which one of the two will get the most success.

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 08:24 PM
  #132
otto bond
Registered User
 
otto bond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,854
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
I totally agree. The issue with AK is not a lack of talent, because we've seen him go on PPG on several spans of 20 games in the last two seasons, its rather confidence. His good sequence last year ended with the publication of the infamous "gangster" relationship.

Horton and AK are different players indeed... but the talent level cannot be said to be higher for one or the other. Only time will tell which one of the two will get the most success.
Thank you Ozymandias. I would go on and say that Andrei is more of a Pf then Horton is...but again, that's my 2 cents.

otto bond is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 09:42 PM
  #133
Bonnafide*
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 10
vCash: 500
Gainey will bring back Kovalev.
Posted via Mobile Device

Bonnafide* is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 10:16 PM
  #134
malkinfan
Registered User
 
malkinfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada
Country: Slovenia
Posts: 3,144
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to malkinfan
Some Russians from the KHL to consider besides the ones already mentioned: Sushinsky, Zubov, Kozlov, Vishnevsky, Markov, Filatov, Mozyakin.

malkinfan is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 10:22 PM
  #135
Habsfan18
The Future
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,212
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by malkinfan View Post
Some Russians from the KHL to consider besides the ones already mentioned: Sushinsky, Zubov, Kozlov, Vishnevsky, Markov, Filatov, Mozyakin.
Well, that's a name from the past. Maxim Sushinsky.

He played pretty well for the Wild, if I remember correctly. Then he kinda just randomly went back to Russia.

Habsfan18 is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 10:43 PM
  #136
Jabba11
Hockey Lobby
 
Jabba11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,455
vCash: 500
I think Eric Staal would be available because the Hurricanes know that whitout Cam Ward in the lineup, they will eventually finish even more last in the league, then so they whould draft Taylor Hall, Staal's replacement. If Montreal could by any chance get into a trade with Carolina, I'd go like this:

To CAROLINA:

Andrei Kostitsyn
Sergei Kostitsyn
Ryan O'byrne
1st round pick 2011-2nd round 2012

To MONTREAL:

Eric Staal

But anyways, don't think Staal's stock is that high as much as Toronto gave up for Kessel since Staal's production this year is far from nice. 3 goals 6 assists in 17 games...-7 too.

Jabba11 is offline  
Old
11-30-2009, 11:43 PM
  #137
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,540
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
I think Eric Staal would be available because the Hurricanes know that whitout Cam Ward in the lineup, they will eventually finish even more last in the league, then so they whould draft Taylor Hall, Staal's replacement. If Montreal could by any chance get into a trade with Carolina, I'd go like this:

To CAROLINA:

Andrei Kostitsyn
Sergei Kostitsyn
Ryan O'byrne
1st round pick 2011-2nd round 2012

To MONTREAL:

Eric Staal

But anyways, don't think Staal's stock is that high as much as Toronto gave up for Kessel since Staal's production this year is far from nice. 3 goals 6 assists in 17 games...-7 too.
Carolina is already dead last in the league. If they keep it up, they'll have the most chances to get the #1 overall pick.
So they could very well end up with Taylor Hall and still have Staal.
I really don't understand why the Canes would move him. It would be completely stupid and senseless.

Staal is a 100pt player, 40-50G scorer. He's worth more than Kessel who only scored 19G once (36) and never gathered more than 60pts.
Doesn't really matter if he's having a bad year, it won't affect his value.
Crosby is only averaging a 1pt/gp ratio this year, that's a big drop in production for him. You think his value dropped??..

Value for such talented players will only decrease if their production constantly drop over a number of years.


Staal will not be moved. It makes zero sense.

Kriss E is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 12:40 AM
  #138
Yanstar274
Registered User
 
Yanstar274's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal
Posts: 115
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
I think Eric Staal would be available because the Hurricanes know that whitout Cam Ward in the lineup, they will eventually finish even more last in the league, then so they whould draft Taylor Hall, Staal's replacement. If Montreal could by any chance get into a trade with Carolina, I'd go like this:

To CAROLINA:

Andrei Kostitsyn
Sergei Kostitsyn
Ryan O'byrne
1st round pick 2011-2nd round 2012

To MONTREAL:

Eric Staal

But anyways, don't think Staal's stock is that high as much as Toronto gave up for Kessel since Staal's production this year is far from nice. 3 goals 6 assists in 17 games...-7 too.
Come...on...would you trade Markov for 2 unproven players, 2 picks and 1 inconsistent foward. I believe Staal is a franchise center and Caroline won't let him go.

And im sure, Carolina will finish the year with more points than the Leafs even with Ward out.

And even if they get Hall, why can't they have two elite centers like Pittsburgh (Malkin-Crosby) , Tampa Bay (Lecavalier-Stamkos) and Philadelphia (Richards-Carter)

Yanstar274 is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 12:51 AM
  #139
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,438
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Carolina is already dead last in the league. If they keep it up, they'll have the most chances to get the #1 overall pick.
So they could very well end up with Taylor Hall and still have Staal.
I really don't understand why the Canes would move him. It would be completely stupid and senseless.

Staal is a 100pt player, 40-50G scorer. He's worth more than Kessel who only scored 19G once (36) and never gathered more than 60pts.
Doesn't really matter if he's having a bad year, it won't affect his value.
Crosby is only averaging a 1pt/gp ratio this year, that's a big drop in production for him. You think his value dropped??..

Value for such talented players will only decrease if their production constantly drop over a number of years.


Staal will not be moved. It makes zero sense.
Dude, it does, financially.

Carolina is in deep doodoo financially. Not as deep as Phoenix, or Tampa, but close. I'd think they'd start by other players, but if they can't, they might think of moving him.

It's becoming very precarious for a lot of teams in south. I think we might see a team or two move in the next 2-3 years. If those teams have already been determined (well, Phoenix is already there), then Bettman would probably pull any trade that involves a firesale by the concerned team. Or else, it might just happen. We've seen weirder things in the NHL.

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 02:07 AM
  #140
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,540
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Dude, it does, financially.

Carolina is in deep doodoo financially. Not as deep as Phoenix, or Tampa, but close. I'd think they'd start by other players, but if they can't, they might think of moving him.

It's becoming very precarious for a lot of teams in south. I think we might see a team or two move in the next 2-3 years. If those teams have already been determined (well, Phoenix is already there), then Bettman would probably pull any trade that involves a firesale by the concerned team. Or else, it might just happen. We've seen weirder things in the NHL.
Yes, but I'm skeptical as to the ''trade because of financial reason'' theory.
TB has been in big doodoo for a little bit now, they had a deal in place to ship us Vinny, if we believe what was said, yet they still kept him. That's a contract they should have been extremely glad to part ways with considering their situation.

Carolina will have about 20M freed up with their upcoming UFAs next summer. They have 6 players with contracts going past the next year. Their situation is not bad to the point of having to absolutely get rid of Staal.

Kriss E is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 06:40 AM
  #141
marchabsfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 876
vCash: 500
gainey trying to make a splash? he finally decided to go swimming

marchabsfan is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:13 AM
  #142
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FerrisRox View Post
No, I don't think that's it.

If you think that Nathan Horton and Andrei Kostitsyn are similar talent-wise, then we're not even remotely on the same page.

Horton brings a helluva a lot more to the table then Kostitsyn. Despite the idiotic claim in this thread that Horton is "softer than Latendresse" the guy is a power forward in the mould of Jeremy Roenick.

He's 24 years old and putting up points at nearly a point a game pace. If you think you could give up Kostitsyn and Kotitsyn and land a player of that ilk, I think you're incredibly niave.

Then again, you think Sergei is somehow worth something because of his "good playoff experience" which is usually used to describe players that have advance to a Cup Final or won it, not a guy who's won the first round. You also leave out the part where he refuses to report to the AHL and demands to be dealt. Guess what, teams don't like guys like that and usually don't find them to be valuable.

This trade is a laughable it's so biased toward the Canadiens. The best part is, you're not sure you'd do it if you were Montreal.
Comparing him to JR is a joke. JR was never a power forward though he tried to play like one despite his less than great size(6' 190lbs at best). JR brought a lot of passion and intensity which is greatly lacking in Horton's game.

If you don't see Horton as soft and unmotivated then you have not watched a lot of Folrida games. He has a lot of skill, similar package to Lats(but not as big and better carrying the puck) and has gotten top 6 ice time his whole career, he's had good but not great numbers.

He is a lot like AK in that at times you get the impression he doesn't care enough.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:20 AM
  #143
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yanstar274 View Post
Come...on...would you trade Markov for 2 unproven players, 2 picks and 1 inconsistent foward. I believe Staal is a franchise center and Caroline won't let him go.

And im sure, Carolina will finish the year with more points than the Leafs even with Ward out.

And even if they get Hall, why can't they have two elite centers like Pittsburgh (Malkin-Crosby) , Tampa Bay (Lecavalier-Stamkos) and Philadelphia (Richards-Carter)
Hall is not a center.

That being said, the only way Carolina trades Staal is if his contract is too much financially, would be interesting to see the offers. He is not a superstar but a top 10 NHL center.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:26 AM
  #144
Habblues
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sec 9 Fredericton NB
Country: Canada
Posts: 806
vCash: 500
Gomez Rumour

Eklund on Hockey buzz is saying Bob is willing to trade gomaz for Horton ? He wouldn`t be crazy enough to do that ? Horton is no better than latts.


Last edited by Habblues: 12-01-2009 at 07:45 AM.
Habblues is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:28 AM
  #145
Komarov47
Registered User
 
Komarov47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Helsinki
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,692
vCash: 500
Link?

Maybe not that much crazy, Horton is younger and is more powerful than Scott

Komarov47 is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:30 AM
  #146
ECWHSWI
5M? insulting!!!
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 15,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habblues View Post
Many sites are saying Bob is willing to trade gomaz for Horton ? He wouldn`t be crazy enough to do that . Horton is no better than latts.

Dont remember Lats getting 60 pts in a season...




ECWHSWI is online now  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:30 AM
  #147
Tuggy
Registered User
 
Tuggy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Saint John
Country: Canada
Posts: 29,307
vCash: 50
I'd do it 10 times out of 10, but I don't believe it to be true.

Tuggy is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:33 AM
  #148
Komarov47
Registered User
 
Komarov47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Helsinki
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,692
vCash: 500
And why the hell the Panters would trade one of their best power forward for Gomez??

Komarov47 is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:34 AM
  #149
Habblues
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sec 9 Fredericton NB
Country: Canada
Posts: 806
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Big Bear View Post
And why the hell the Panters would trade one of their best power forward for Gomez??
Is he that good ? i`ve never been all that impressed with him......lazy.

Habblues is offline  
Old
12-01-2009, 07:36 AM
  #150
Komarov47
Registered User
 
Komarov47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Helsinki
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,692
vCash: 500
Trading Gomez now would be a mistake, let him play half the season with Gionta and Cammy and see if his points grow. Let's wait and see

Komarov47 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:55 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.