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Who should oilers trade most and for what?

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Old
12-03-2009, 05:49 PM
  #26
hemsky88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SR17 View Post
We'll give you Mueller for Cogliano, or Gagne??
If we had Gagne i highly doubt we would trade a LW sniper to you if we had him. If you are talking about Gagner then i still probably say no.

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Old
12-04-2009, 01:02 AM
  #27
Seanzie888
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Originally Posted by Daryn Duliba View Post
Do you honestly believe that?

I think we have had a bad team for so long, people in this town have become "Vancouverized". You can't create a championship team building around a mediocre player.

Hemsky is a mediocre player - after six full season in the NHL it is time to realize he just ain't going to get any better. He is what he is and that is mediocre. He cannot carry this team on his back, he is not the player to build around. He is a complimentary player and will never be a dominant, superstar, leader type. Nothing wrong with that but when you factor in his give aways and disappearing acts he is worth about $4 million.

With Hemksy carrying the team, we have missed the playoffs three years in a row. How does that make Hemsky an incredible bargain? Hemsky is a complimentary player like Kovalev or Gomez, not the kind of player you build a championship team around.

If the Hemsky contract is the bargain you say it is, we shouldn't have a problem trading him for someone that can really lead this team to contention.

I do honestly believe that he is one of the best bargains in the NHL. He may not be the best bargain, true. There are better deals out there. I mean that new contract Savard signed is incredible! However, even though Hemer wasn't having as amazing or in-your-face start to the year he still scored 22 pts in 22 games. That's 2 years in a row he's been a ppg player before injury. Due to some bad luck and a brutal hit from behind he's out again. However, he was on pace for a great season.

Another note here is that there are only 8 point per game players who get payed less than Hemer and 3 of them are not finished their entry level deals, like Stamkos. A couple others are shots in the dark who have come up playing great with great players, like Rene Bourque and Afinogenov. But in all actuality Hemsky's contract is one of the best bargains around.

The 8 are:
*Stamkos 29 Pts in 26 Gms @ 3.725 mil with bonuses
*Backstrom 28 in 28 @ 2.4 mil with bonuses
*Peverley 26 in 25 @ 0.487 mil
Kane 26 in 26 @ 3.725 mil with bonuses (although after his new contract kicks in he won't be)
Koivu 26 in 26 @ 3.25 mil
Afinogenov 25 in 25 @ 0.8 mil
Bourque 21 in 21 @ 1.35 mil
Hunter 13 in 13 (woopie...) @2 mil

*denotes entry level deal

Does that mean I wouldn't trade him? No. If the right deal came around that gave us either a larger star or a great prospect acquisition, I would do it. But right now, with the cap rumored to be in decline, the Oilers need to look to make deals that allow us to not only draft a high end prospect, but also clear cap space for the next 2 years so that when our prospects are ready to play, the Oil can sign the veterans to support them for a playoff push.

Wholesale and "Dive for 5" baby! I'd like to see us come up with a couple first rounders and some open cap space and we'll be primed for a decent squad in a couple years. Everyone else had to do it at some point (unless you're the Red Wings and their ungodly scouting staff!). Look at L.A. They have a great future with young, high skilled prospects at every position. With the right mix of veterans they will be a major player in the West for several years. I took them a long time and I don't want the Oil to have to wait for 7 or 8 years like them but a short term rebuild (like 2 or 3 years) where we pick up a high end prospect at all 3 positions (G, D, F) and then we can build around them. But of course this is Edmonton, and there is no way we would stand for 3 or 4 more years of crappy hockey...


Last edited by Seanzie888: 12-04-2009 at 02:06 PM.
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Old
12-04-2009, 07:47 AM
  #28
eastcoasteh
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Right now, I say we trade for Biron...JDD is SHAKY....for a big man, he looks small in the net.

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Old
12-04-2009, 09:07 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Cogliano for Mueller + 3rd
O'Sullivan for Backes
Grebeshkov for 1st
Moreau for 3rd
Gilbert for expiring contract + 3rd

Penner-Brule-Hemsky
Eberle-Backes-Gagner
Mueller-Horcoff-Stone
Jacques-Potulny-Stortini

thats looks more like a Quinn team.
Okay for forwards but you gave up 2 defenceman.Who plays defence?

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Old
12-04-2009, 02:14 PM
  #30
ponokanocker
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Grebeshkov and O'Sullivan for anyone.
I can see why LA got rid of O'Sullivan now! He just seems to be a constant floater out there unless there's a chance to score, and never digs hard for the loose pucks in his own end.

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Old
12-04-2009, 02:19 PM
  #31
Petro Points
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Originally Posted by winfive View Post
Okay for forwards but you gave up 2 defenceman.Who plays defence?
~27M upfront + Souray, Visnovsky, Smid, Staios = ~42M with goalies ~46M

Im sure we would be able to find us 2 Dmen with the remainder of the cap room.. With Grebs and Gilbert gone.. Chorney could take one spot... giving us plenty of room to get another big shutdown #5 Dman.. (Arsene, Peckham = 7\8 D)

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Old
12-04-2009, 02:25 PM
  #32
Little Fury
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryn Duliba View Post
Do you honestly believe that?

I think we have had a bad team for so long, people in this town have become "Vancouverized". You can't create a championship team building around a mediocre player.

Hemsky is a mediocre player - after six full season in the NHL it is time to realize he just ain't going to get any better. He is what he is and that is mediocre. He cannot carry this team on his back, he is not the player to build around. He is a complimentary player and will never be a dominant, superstar, leader type. Nothing wrong with that but when you factor in his give aways and disappearing acts he is worth about $4 million.
Hemsky is not a mediocre player. He's not a superstar PPG player, but he's not mediocre. Since the lockout he's been one of the top RW in the league.

Quote:
With Hemksy carrying the team, we have missed the playoffs three years in a row. How does that make Hemsky an incredible bargain?
Because it's a team sport?

Quote:
Hemsky is a complimentary player like Kovalev or Gomez, not the kind of player you build a championship team around.
Maybe. Doesn't make trading him a good idea.

Quote:
If the Hemsky contract is the bargain you say it is, we shouldn't have a problem trading him for someone that can really lead this team to contention.
If Hemsky is as bad as you say, why would anyone trade a gamebreaker for him?

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Old
12-04-2009, 02:27 PM
  #33
I am the Liquor
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O'Sullivan, Gilbert and Nilsson. We need to get tougher and all three of these cream puffs are a big part of the problem. I would also move Hemsky for a good return. If we are going to rebuild, Souray or Visnovsky should be moved for picks/prospects as well. If there is any possibility of moving Khabibulin or Horcoff we should take it, just to dump salary, if it were possible. Dont re-sign Comrie. Let Pisani go. These moves would make the team much better imo.

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Old
12-04-2009, 03:18 PM
  #34
WoolyWhatsIt
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If I was tambelinni, I would pick up the phone and call Scott Howsen from Columbus and am trying to acquire Nikita Filatov. If columbus wants a playoff run they could use a guy whose been there before. Like a Ethan Moreau, Steve Staios guy. I offer up this deal and see if Howsen bites:

Ethan Moreau
Andrew Cogliano
3rd round pick

FOR

Nikita Filatov



what you think?

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Old
12-04-2009, 03:56 PM
  #35
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Trade Souray and Visnosky for some picks, waive Moreau, draft first or second and start the rebuild!

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12-04-2009, 05:03 PM
  #36
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Very few trades are occurring, so any moves we see would be very small I'd expect (unlike what most of us are hoping for). I don't agree that we need to see another goalie...what for? I know I was one of the fans clamouring to see the kids like Deslauriers up and getting his ice time. If he looks shaky, well...so be it. Let's see what we have in the kid, let him play. I hope Khabibulin gets well soon, but if not it's an opportune time to see what Dubnyk brings as well.

At least one vet and one youngster need to go, once people get healthy. I'd still say Nilsson / Pouliot and one of Gilbert / Strudwick. I'd be unhappy as a fan to see Cogliano go, but the numbers and relegating his role to the 3rd / 4th line suggest he may move sooner rather than later.

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Old
12-04-2009, 05:21 PM
  #37
NMK
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Its about being healthy for this team, not trades. Who could we trade right now anyway? We can't do a quantity for quality trade because we're so short right now as it is. The players who are injured won't be traded, and the ones who are healthy are generally performing as they should be. When your best forward and starting goalie are injured, and your best defenseman has missed half the season, plus all the other guys who've missed significant time this year already; Grebs, Pisani, Staios, JFJ, Brule, Comrie, etc... We're bound to be out of the playoffs. Worst case scenario, we end up with a solid pick in next year's draft to add to prospects Eberle and MPS. I still say this core has a solid shot of being a very good team if they can just stay healthy for a season.

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12-04-2009, 06:06 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NMK View Post
I still say this core has a solid shot of being a very good team if they can just stay healthy for a season.
Injuries are a fact of life, they're gonna happen every year. If anything, the injury problems the Oilers have seen this year merely exposes the lack of depth at every position. If your team is hurting because its missing guys like Mike Comrie, JFJ and Ryan Stone, you probably weren't very good to begin with.

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Old
12-04-2009, 06:21 PM
  #39
tiger_80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryn Duliba View Post
Do you honestly believe that?

I think we have had a bad team for so long, people in this town have become "Vancouverized". You can't create a championship team building around a mediocre player.

Hemsky is a mediocre player - after six full season in the NHL it is time to realize he just ain't going to get any better. He is what he is and that is mediocre. He cannot carry this team on his back, he is not the player to build around. He is a complimentary player and will never be a dominant, superstar, leader type. Nothing wrong with that but when you factor in his give aways and disappearing acts he is worth about $4 million.

With Hemksy carrying the team, we have missed the playoffs three years in a row. How does that make Hemsky an incredible bargain? Hemsky is a complimentary player like Kovalev or Gomez, not the kind of player you build a championship team around.

If the Hemsky contract is the bargain you say it is, we shouldn't have a problem trading him for someone that can really lead this team to contention.
Yes, he's a complimentary player like Kovalev and Gomez. I'd say he's better than Kovalev now. But Kovalev makes 5M per. and Gomez 7.5M. We can always trade Hemsky, but I am afraid we won't be able to get back a player of equal stature for the same money.

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12-04-2009, 06:23 PM
  #40
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Re-build.

Keep Penner, Hemsky, Gagner, Brule, Smid.

Move anybody else for the right price.

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12-04-2009, 06:24 PM
  #41
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Eberle for Carolina's 1st

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12-04-2009, 06:29 PM
  #42
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Moreau, STaios, Gilbert or Grebs (Smid has stepped in to a top 4 role).

I would be happy with that. Keep every one else.

also I would say trade Pisani, but really, who would want him?

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Old
12-04-2009, 06:39 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Cogliano for Mueller + 3rd
O'Sullivan for Backes
Grebeshkov for 1st
Moreau for 3rd
Gilbert for expiring contract + 3rd

Penner-Brule-Hemsky
Eberle-Backes-Gagner
Mueller-Horcoff-Stone
Jacques-Potulny-Stortini

thats looks more like a Quinn team.
Mueller and a 3rd? why the third? Mueller has more points over his career than Cogliano even with the horrendous start hes had. even up, maybe. with the third? no.

Backes - a 30 goal scorer with size, grit, leadership and fight... can play any forward spot... for a midget with some decent hands. no.

Grebs is overrated. a first would be a stretch. hes too small. doesnt shoot and can be a complete hit or miss when handling the puck. hes OK but a 1st is kind of ridiculous unless its from a 25-30 team - MAYBE.

Moreau blows. if they can get anything of use for him it would be a win. maybe a third at the trade deadline - a huge MAYBE.

the Gilbert one is too ambiguous to comment on.

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12-04-2009, 06:42 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbiezyg View Post
Flip Comrie, Potulny, Strudwick at the deadline for anything. Keep one of moreau or staios.
Tambo would be a fool to trade Potulny. Ryan does a lot of things really well and the Oilersneed smart players like that. Especially considering this appears to be a team full of dummies. I would sooner see Brule go than Potulny. He probably has more perceived value anyway.

Aside from Potulny not one player you mentioned has any value in terms of a trade.

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Old
12-04-2009, 06:53 PM
  #45
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Trade Souray for picks/prospects
Package Cogliano + Gilbert for a defensive dman (let's call him XXXX)
Dump Nilsson + Comrie + Moreau
Hopefully get the #1 pick
Sign Jagr

O'Sullivan Hall Jagr
Penner Gagner Brule
Paajarvi Horcoff Hemsky
Jacques Poltuny Stone

Visnvosky Smid
Grebeshkov XXXX
Chorney UFA/Staios

Khabibulin
Deslauries

That looks like a playoff team to me. I win

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Old
12-04-2009, 06:58 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemskyfanboy83 View Post
Trade Souray for picks/prospects
Package Cogliano + Gilbert for a defensive dman (let's call him XXXX)
Dump Nilsson + Comrie + Moreau
Hopefully get the #1 pick
Sign Jagr

O'Sullivan Hall Jagr
Penner Gagner Brule
Paajarvi Horcoff Hemsky
Jacques Poltuny Stone

Visnvosky Smid
Grebeshkov XXXX
Chorney UFA/Staios

Khabibulin
Deslauries

That looks like a playoff team to me. I win
You might win an intramural shinny game, but that lineup is way too soft to win in the nhl.

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Old
12-04-2009, 07:01 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
Tambo would be a fool to trade Potulny. Ryan does a lot of things really well and the Oilersneed smart players like that. Especially considering this appears to be a team full of dummies. I would sooner see Brule go than Potulny. He probably has more perceived value anyway.

Aside from Potulny not one player you mentioned has any value in terms of a trade.
Potulny does not have a lot of trade value. Too small a sample of games.

I'd rank the trade value of current players in such a way:
very moveable and should deliver a good return:

Penner, Visnovsky, Souray, Gagner (because of age, draft pedigree and perceived potential), Grebeshkov, Smid, Brule, Cogliano.

Moveable, but not worth much:
Gilbert, Staios, O'Sullivan, Potulny, JFJ, Stone, Comrie, Stortini

have negative trade value--i.e. you can move them, but will have either to add picks or take back another bad contract:

Horcoff, Moreau, Nilsson.

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Old
12-04-2009, 07:04 PM
  #48
Hemskyfanboy83
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
You might win an intramural shinny game, but that lineup is way too soft to win in the nhl.
How so?

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Old
12-04-2009, 07:14 PM
  #49
I am the Liquor
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How so?
Well you have two forwards that bring a physical game, four if you want to count Brule and Penner. You have three d that are physical. Do I really need to point this out to you? Also I think Eberle makes the team before MPS does.

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Old
12-04-2009, 07:21 PM
  #50
Hemskyfanboy83
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Well you have two forwards that bring a physical game, four if you want to count Brule and Penner. You have three d that are physical. Do I really need to point this out to you? Also I think Eberle makes the team before MPS does.
You think the team is too soft yet you want Eberle over Paajarvi? Paajarvi is bigger stronger and plays a harder style of hockey than Eberle.

As for the rest of the team. Jacques, Stone, and Brule all bring an in your face type of game. How many physical forwards do other teams have? Chicago/Pitsburgh/Detroit don't have too many more.

Then you add 2 of the strongest/biggest forwards in the league in Penner and Jagr. They might not hit a lot but try to get the puck off them. Hall and Paajarvi both bring good size and in the case of Paajarvi he loves to crash the net. Hemsky has no problem going into the corners and Poltuny plays hard.

The only softer players on the team would be Gagner, O'Sullivan and Horcoff.

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