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ATD 12 Rene Lecavalier Final: 1 Detroit Falcons vs. 6 Renfrew Millionaires

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Old
12-06-2009, 01:20 AM
  #26
overpass
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
Come on now, if I understand well, you take the year the players were born, and extrapolate as to where they should of been in their prime? I don't think anyone is silly enough to buy that as a serious analyst. Unless I read you wrong, but if it's what you really wanted to say, you have some BIG explaining to do.

Terry Sawchku peak was between the season 1050-51 and 1954-55. Here's the competition he had to face:

Maurice Richard, Max Bentley, Milt Schmidt, Ted Kennedy, Roy Conacher, Elmer Lach, Bernard Geoffrion, Bert Olmstead, Jean Béliveau, Sid Smith, Doug Harvey, Bill Gadsby etc ...

The goaltenders he was facing were: Jacques Plante, Gump Worsley, Johnny Bower, Harry Lumley, Turk Broda, Chuck Rayner and Al Rollins.
It's absolutely what I intended to do. Can you explain to me what the problem is?

Roy Conacher was 34 in 1950. Max Bentley was 30. Milt Schmidt and Elmer Lach were 32. It's completely correct to say that they were past their prime. If they had some success during those years, it was magnified by the fact that their younger counterparts were not keeping up.

Similarly, Jean Beliveau and Bernard Geoffrion were both 19 in 1950, and were hardly a factor for most of Sawchuk's peak. They belonged to the next generation of players, who had no trouble sweeping aside their disappointing elders. Look at the 1957-58 season. The highest scoring forward who was 30 or older was Ted Lindsay, who was 34th in scoring with 39 points at age 32. Gordie Howe was the old man among top forwards at age 29.

Do I need to explain further? You can throw out some impressive names of scorers that Sawchuk faced, but very few of them were in their prime from 1950 to 1955. This was the time period when the shallow group of forward talent born in the 1920s affected the NHL most. And then, of course, the two best forwards born in this period were on his team.

Edit: my point is regarding forwards, but if you want to get into goalies...I guess he faced Plante and Broda in the playoffs, but for the most part they barely played in this period. It would be more accurate to say he faced Lumley, Rollins, McNeil, and Henry, with a touch of Rayner, Worsley, Bower, Gelineau, and Plante.


Last edited by overpass: 12-06-2009 at 01:30 AM.
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Old
12-06-2009, 01:34 AM
  #27
EagleBelfour
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EVERY players I named finished in the top-10 in points between 1951 and 1955. I couldn't care less if they were 20, 30 or 40 years old: between 1950 and 1955 they were all playing great hockey against the Detroit Red Wings and Terry Sawchuk.

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12-06-2009, 01:46 AM
  #28
seventieslord
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
EVERY players I named finished in the top-10 in points between 1951 and 1955. I couldn't care less if they were 20, 30 or 40 years old: between 1950 and 1955 they were all playing great hockey against the Detroit Red Wings and Terry Sawchuk.
someone had to finish top-10 in points, right?

To be perfectly honest, overpass has a really good point here, and I applaud him for looking at Sawchuk from an angle I've never thought of looking from before.

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12-06-2009, 01:56 AM
  #29
EagleBelfour
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someone had to finish top-10 in points, right?

To be perfectly honest, overpass has a really good point here, and I applaud him for looking at Sawchuk from an angle I've never thought of looking from before.
You're kidding? Wow I respect your opinion alot so I must not understand at all what he means.

The early 50's is one of the most stacked ERA of great hockey players. Roy Conacher at 34 was still an incredible hockey player and better than a Gus Bodnar or Gaye Stewart in their peak. If he's telling that the early 50's is a crossside between two generation, I can understand, but at the end the talent in the 50's was just incredible and a Jean Béliveau and Bernard Geoffrion in their early 20's was still better than any ''no names'' that should of been in their peaks: they were generational talent that were incredible even early in their career. The older players like Milt Schmidt and Max Bentley were still unbelievable talents. they were far form over the hill.

At the end, Terry Sawchuk still face up one of the heaviest talent in the history of the game. A better objection would be that he played on a stacked team, which he did, but he still dominate the league like no other did before (and in my opinion no others did afterwards).

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12-07-2009, 05:18 PM
  #30
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Detroit wins the best-of-seven series in seven games.

Three stars:
Dominik Hasek
Terry Sawchuk
Milt Schmidt

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Old
12-07-2009, 10:57 PM
  #31
overpass
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Congrats on the win EagleBelfour, and thanks for a great series. Good luck representing the Lecavalier!

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12-07-2009, 11:06 PM
  #32
EagleBelfour
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Congrats on the win EagleBelfour, and thanks for a great series. Good luck representing the Lecavalier!
Thanks! You were a very good opponent yourself.

I'll try my best

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