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12-07-2009, 08:46 AM
  #101
CupofOil
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Originally Posted by hemskysuncle View Post
trading Souray just doesn't make sense. he brings things that no other d-man on the Oilers brings - authority...proven last game where I think he made his proper return after his concussion.

If you are going to trade a d-man from the Oilers, trade something we have a lot of - soft puckmovers - Gilbert Grebs and Visnovsky - as much as i like any of them, or anyone likes any of them, they are the "abundance" that the oilers have (along with small "skilled" unproven forwards)...not rugged leaders with leg breaking slapshots.

I believe that Souray will be the one traded for various reasons, he probably holds higher value around the league than any of the other defensemen, his play will most likely be declining sooner than any of the other defensemen so might as well maximize his value while it's still high and i do believe that there might be some legs to the rumors that he wanted out to be closer to his kids or whatever the case may be, just my opinion..... It's going to either be him or Visnovsky imo and if i had to choose between the two, i would trade Souray first and i think Oiler management is thinking the same way.
With all this being said, i would hate to see Souray go but such is life in a cap world, there's too much money tied up in our defensemen.

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12-07-2009, 08:48 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by OilerzFRLife View Post
souray nilsson 1st round pick for kovalchuk (assuming he will sign with us)
Add Gagner and Eberle or MPS and Atlanta MIGHT consider the offer

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12-07-2009, 08:54 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
Add Gagner and Eberle or MPS and Atlanta MIGHT consider the offer
If he's not resigning with them I don't think they'd get that much for him. There's no way the Oilers include Eberle or MPS in a deal for an impending UFA. I'd be very surprised to see them deal Gagner too.

Cogs, though, could be the odd man out in such a situation.

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12-07-2009, 09:00 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Fishy Scales View Post
If he's not resigning with them I don't think they'd get that much for him. There's no way the Oilers include Eberle or MPS in a deal for an impending UFA. I'd be very surprised to see them deal Gagner too.

Cogs, though, could be the odd man out in such a situation.
If Kovy doesn't sign an extension beforehand, then there's no way that i trade anything of value for him.

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12-07-2009, 09:08 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
If Kovy doesn't sign an extension beforehand, then there's no way that i trade anything of value for him.
Atlanta are still in a ****y position regardless of whether Kovy wants to re-sign with the team he's traded to or not. I don't see any reason to pay through the nose even if he agrees to immediately re-sign.

We couldn't fit him under the cap anyway.

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12-07-2009, 09:27 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by Fishy Scales View Post
Atlanta are still in a ****y position regardless of whether Kovy wants to re-sign with the team he's traded to or not. I don't see any reason to pay through the nose even if he agrees to immediately re-sign.

We couldn't fit him under the cap anyway.
I doubt that'll be an issue.. There is a lot of dead weight that we are carrying around that can be moved or bought out. We also now have plenty of cheap good players on the roster.. Smid, Potulny, Brule, Jacques, Stone to name a few.
Aside from Hemsky and Penner no forward on our team needs to make over 2M\yr..

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12-07-2009, 09:39 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
I doubt that'll be an issue.. There is a lot of dead weight that we are carrying around that can be moved or bought out. We also now have plenty of cheap good players on the roster.. Smid, Potulny, Brule, Jacques, Stone to name a few.
Aside from Hemsky and Penner no forward on our team needs to make over 2M\yr..
You make it sound like getting rid of bad contracts is easy. Buying people out is hardly in ideal solution, and I don't think they'll bury people like Staios or Moreau in the minors.

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12-07-2009, 09:44 AM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishy Scales View Post
You make it sound like getting rid of bad contracts is easy. Buying people out is hardly in ideal solution, and I don't think they'll bury people like Staios or Moreau in the minors.
You don't even have to, you can move those guys in deals to clubs looking for veteran leadership for the playoffs.

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12-07-2009, 09:59 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Fishy Scales View Post
You make it sound like getting rid of bad contracts is easy. Buying people out is hardly in ideal solution, and I don't think they'll bury people like Staios or Moreau in the minors.
True .. but buying out guys like Nilsson and Pouliot should not be a problem especially if we are talking about someone like Kovalchuk. Not resigning Pisani, Comrie and Grebeshkov would also free up a lot of cap space.

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12-07-2009, 10:23 AM
  #110
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great so everyone wants to trade a valuable vet for more prospects and picks and the Oilers once again are at square one. The Vicious Cycle continues while the teams that are cup contenders are keeping their vets. same old same old.....

The Oilers need Souray, trading him would be stupid.

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12-07-2009, 11:05 AM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
great so everyone wants to trade a valuable vet for more prospects and picks and the Oilers once again are at square one. The Vicious Cycle continues while the teams that are cup contenders are keeping their vets. same old same old.....

The Oilers need Souray, trading him would be stupid.
Although I agree with you, the Oilers have too much money on their blueline. The Oilers have one of the highest priced blueline for marginally a top 15 quality blueline.

We need to move somebody. I'd rather it Souray than Vish.

We need more money in our top line to secure someone that can score goals!!

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12-07-2009, 11:07 AM
  #112
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I really haven't changed my stance from the off-season when the rumours were swirling. If the return was decent trading Souray would not be the worst thing.

Interestingly, Grebs is close to returning and this rumour pops up.

Could be more smoke - but with Grebs now in Florida (according to the Edmonton Sun) a dman being traded does seem like a possibility

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12-07-2009, 11:15 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by hockeyaddict101 View Post
I really haven't changed my stance from the off-season when the rumours were swirling. If the return was decent trading Souray would not be the worst thing.

Interestingly, Grebs is close to returning and this rumour pops up.

Could be more smoke - but with Grebs now in Florida (according to the Edmonton Sun) a dman being traded does seem like a possibility
we would be getting Grebs back and putting strudwick in the PB as the 7th Dman. why does that mean a trade is coming.

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12-07-2009, 11:19 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
we would be getting Grebs back and putting strudwick in the PB as the 7th Dman. why does that mean a trade is coming.
The Oilers are going to trade one of their dman as they have way to much money tied in the back end.

Doesn't mean it is going to happen now, but I could see it being Souray (if he waves his no trade clause of course) as he has a fair amount of value.

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12-07-2009, 11:19 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by cfrancis View Post
Although I agree with you, the Oilers have too much money on their blueline. The Oilers have one of the highest priced blueline for marginally a top 15 quality blueline.

We need to move somebody. I'd rather it Souray than Vish.

We need more money in our top line to secure someone that can score goals!!
Does it really matter if its money spent right? Souray is a good deal at 5.6M and so is Visnovsky. Trading Souray will still leave us with 3 overpriced Dmen in Staios, Gilbert and Grebeshkov.. How about we trade our problems instead of accomodating them at the expense of our good players.

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12-07-2009, 11:20 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
great so everyone wants to trade a valuable vet for more prospects and picks and the Oilers once again are at square one. The Vicious Cycle continues while the teams that are cup contenders are keeping their vets. same old same old.....
Operative phrase here is "teams that are cup contenders". The Oilers aren't; not even close.

Since Souray is already at an age where we can expect his play to decline and injuries to take their toll, we're better off trading him now before he turns into Steve Staios 2.0. If the return is prospects and picks, more the better as those might actually be useful by the time this team is in a position to make a go at it.

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The Oilers need Souray, trading him would be stupid.
Need him for what? 8-12th place?

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12-07-2009, 11:30 AM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Little Fury View Post
Operative phrase here is "teams that are cup contenders". The Oilers aren't; not even close.

Since Souray is already at an age where we can expect his play to decline and injuries to take their toll, we're better off trading him now before he turns into Steve Staios 2.0. If the return is prospects and picks, more the better as those might actually be useful by the time this team is in a position to make a go at it.

Need him for what? 8-12th place?
what makes you think our team will be better in 3 yrs? And if thats what you really belive then we should also trade away Hemsky, Penner, Khabibulin and Visnovsky.

IMO this team would be ready to "make a go at it" next season if we could turn some of our suck into a solid shutdown Dman and a star forward.

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12-07-2009, 11:32 AM
  #118
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Garrioch is a twit so I take his rumors and pretty much dismiss them. Although I do agree that Souray could be on the block, I would have to say it is most likely to a California team first and then another western team. Souray has family issues so I can't see him moving further away.

I do trade Souray if the return will help us going forward. Souray has injury problems and by the time we are ready to contend I don't see him being anywhere close to the player he is today.

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12-07-2009, 11:34 AM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Fury View Post
Operative phrase here is "teams that are cup contenders". The Oilers aren't; not even close.

Since Souray is already at an age where we can expect his play to decline and injuries to take their toll, we're better off trading him now before he turns into Steve Staios 2.0. If the return is prospects and picks, more the better as those might actually be useful by the time this team is in a position to make a go at it.



Need him for what? 8-12th place?
I totally agree Little Fury. What's the point of keeping him now when we aren't contending, and won't be in the near future? Get a list of teams he is willing to go to, and get the best possible deal for prospects/picks from one of the teams and make the deal. At the deadline, deal players, like Moreau and Staios, that will not be effective in 3/4 years when we might be able to turn things around.

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12-07-2009, 11:35 AM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Fury View Post
Operative phrase here is "teams that are cup contenders". The Oilers aren't; not even close.
Since Souray is already at an age where we can expect his play to decline and injuries to take their toll, we're better off trading him now before he turns into Steve Staios 2.0. If the return is prospects and picks, more the better as those might actually be useful by the time this team is in a position to make a go at it.



Need him for what? 8-12th place?

and if the Oilers keep trading away vets for picks and prospects they never will be, and they will continue to be the Farm team for the rest of the NHL. But that seems to be what some of the fans want, and lots of the posters here as well.

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12-07-2009, 11:40 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
what makes you think our team will be better in 3 yrs? And if thats what you really belive then we should also trade away Hemsky, Penner, Khabibulin and Visnovsky.

IMO this team would be ready to "make a go at it" next season if we could turn some of our suck into a solid shutdown Dman and a star forward.
How do you propose we turn "our suck" into a star forward? Teams don't want our suck to begin with, let alone for their stars.
Hemsky, Penner and Visnovsky could still be very effective in 3/4 years. Khabibulin not so much, but I don't think we could give him away without taking on another bad contract, so what's the point? His signing was just another bad example of management picking up a player to tread water.

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12-07-2009, 11:42 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by ponokanocker View Post
How do you propose we turn "our suck" into a star forward? Teams don't want our suck to begin with, let alone for their stars.
Hemsky, Penner and Visnovsky could still be very effective in 3/4 years. Khabibulin not so much, but I don't think we could give him away without taking on another bad contract, so what's the point? His signing was just another bad example of management picking up a player to tread water.
No, it wasn't. It was a risk because of his injury proneness, but he is a good goaltender who played well for us until he got injured.

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12-07-2009, 11:43 AM
  #123
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Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
and if the Oilers keep trading away vets for picks and prospects they never will be, and they will continue to be the Farm team for the rest of the NHL. But that seems to be what some of the fans want, and lots of the posters here as well.
The point of trading away vets for picks and prospects is to hopefully develop a superstar. What's the point of constantly being a team that "might" make the playoffs? I realize that the draft is a crapshoot, and a rebuild may take longer than what you hope for, but I hate being a bubble team. Once we get a superstar, then you add vets because they might actually want to come here.

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12-07-2009, 11:44 AM
  #124
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Originally Posted by MerryJ99 View Post
and if the Oilers keep trading away vets for picks and prospects they never will be, and they will continue to be the Farm team for the rest of the NHL. But that seems to be what some of the fans want, and lots of the posters here as well.
you make no sense... we traded away Brewer, Lynch, Woywitka for Pronger and look what mess he got us into... then we traded our picks for Penner and now he is totally crippling us. Oil history wouldve been much brighter had we kept our picks\prospects.. Traded Brewer for another prospect + 3rd ala Satan, Whitney, Comrie, Smyth etc.

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12-07-2009, 11:49 AM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Fishy Scales View Post
No, it wasn't. It was a risk because of his injury proneness, but he is a good goaltender who played well for us until he got injured.
I agree that it would have been a very good signing, if we were missing that piece of the puzzle to put us over the top. I am not unhappy with his play at all, and think it is good value for the salary. But we are still missing a big star to put us over the top. Without that, I think signing other pieces is kind of pointless when it pushes you against the cap. I would have much rather seen us go with the young goal keepers, had a rough year, and gotten a top pick. Management/ownership would have tried to sell a rebuild to the fans though, and I'm not sure that would have gone over too well considering Katz's was supposed to come in here and be our saviour with his deep pockets.

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