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Last place is the only way to save this franchise

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Old
12-14-2009, 02:30 PM
  #1
RainingRats
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Last place is the only way to save this franchise

Once again, we are on the outside of the playoff race. There is a lot of hockey to be played but anybody who is realistic knows it will be a major uphill climb. Another slow start has handicapped this team. I don't think we will make the playoffs. 10th place in the East is reasonable leaving us out of the lottery and picking in an unfavorable position.

I propose we do whatever it takes to ensure as close to finishing in last place as possible. I would start by trading Vokoun. It will be hard but I would go as far as to give him away. He is the number one reason why we are not fighting Carolina for last place. With Clemmenson and Salak in net it will almost ensure a lottery pick.

I would also trade Moore, Dvorak, Leopold, and Siedenberg. This does two things. Further depletes the roster but more importantly gives prospects a legitimate chance to get plenty of nhl experience. Ellerby and Garrisson who both have shots at roster spots next year can iron out mistakes while not having to worry about costing this team wins because they are not important. Same with Matthias, Repik, and Salak. Let them get the kinks out when it doesn't matter.

I firmly believe a guy like Hall could turn this team around. Next year we will be young but we will not be as inexperienced. Booth and Stillman, keys to our weak offense will and have been out for a while. With the season written off we will not have to rush them which is especially important for Booth.

Last place is the only way to save this franchise. Another pick around 10th place will not have an impact as great as one of the top picks especially since we cannot supplement via free agency. The only way to get elite talent is through the draft.

Lately we haven't been good enough to make the playoffs and not bad enough to get a difference maker. This is the worst possible place you can end in the standings.

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12-14-2009, 02:48 PM
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BabyJagrov
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We got our elite talent man...

Those are Weiss and Horton... And I'm not kidding there !

Frolik, along with Kulikov and Markstrom, should be mentionned there... Olesz could have been !

I'm still a big believer in this team as always. And I can't recall when we actually were terrible in a game...

If this team can't make the playoffs, and we are looking at another top 12 pick... I'll take it ! And hope all our other supposed gems break out before this pick can have any impact on our team... We are building a pretty organisation here buddy !


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12-14-2009, 02:49 PM
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We dont need to finish last, we need to draft better, which we have these past 2-3 years. If we have a staff that knows how to find talent , then will be okay. I mean look at detriot they got there superstars , later in the draft. So to say we need to finish last , to save the franchise , is wrong in my opinion. We need to follow detroit, buffalo, san jose expample by finding ways to draft our own superstars.

Making all those trades you proposed would set us back, because we would be too young next season, and be giving our youngsters a bigger role , which we dont know all of them can handle.

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12-14-2009, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BabyJagrov View Post
We got our elite talent man...

Those are Weiss and Horton... And I'm not kidding there !

Frolik, along with Kulikov and Markstrom, should be mentionned there... Olesz could have been !

I'm still a big believer in this team as always. And I can't recall when we actually were terrible in a game...

If this team can't make the playoffs, and we are looking at another top 12 pick... I'll take it ! And hope all our other supposed gems break out before this pick can have any impact on our team... We are building a pretty organisation here buddy !

If you think Weiss and Horton are our elite talent I'm not sure what to say. You are very optimistic.

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12-14-2009, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
If you think Weiss and Horton are our elite talent I'm not sure what to say. You are very optimistic.
So are you. Isn't this draft one of the weakest of recent years, and the #1 ranked prospect nothing spectacular?

We've already been there...we got Horton. Actually, that was a better draft I believe.

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12-14-2009, 02:52 PM
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RainingRats
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Originally Posted by PanthersFanatic12 View Post
We dont need to finish last, we need to draft better, which we have these past 2-3 years. If we have a staff that knows how to find talent , then will be okay. I mean look at detriot they got there superstars , later in the draft. So to say we need to finish last , to save the franchise , is wrong in my opinion. We need to follow detroit, buffalo, san jose expample by finding ways to draft our own superstars.

Making all those trades you proposed would set us back, because we would be too young next season, and be giving our youngsters a bigger role , which we dont know all of them can handle.
Siedenberg, Leopold, and Moore are only signed for one year.

A top pick helps a lot more. The only difference between 30th place and 17th is you get a shot at a franchise player.

Detroit got lucky with Zetterberg and Datysuk. If they knew they were going to be so good they would have drafted them much earlier instead of waiting.

"which we don't know all of them can handle" this is why we test them out this season.

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12-14-2009, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Acadmus View Post
So are you. Isn't this draft one of the weakest of recent years, and the #1 ranked prospect nothing spectacular?

We've already been there...we got Horton. Actually, that was a better draft I believe.
The top picks are really good. Of course tehy're still prospects but they're really good. The rest of the draft isn't that deep which is why finishing with the 10th overall is even more of a waste.

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12-14-2009, 02:54 PM
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The GMs of the teams who received the top three picks in the last NHL draft said if they could have they would have chosen Hall over Tavares, Duchene, and Hedman easily. Hall plays on a very talented Spitfires club, but that doesn't curb his attributes at all. He still possesses lightning speed, incredible transitions, great hands, and most importantly, he's a game breaker already. I would choose drafting Taylor Hall over the 8th seed any day.

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12-14-2009, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
If you think Weiss and Horton are our elite talent I'm not sure what to say. You are very optimistic.
There was about 20 players who were point-per-game guys last year in the NHL...

Yeah... I think Horton and Weiss are elite... They can certainly enter that top 25-30 so players in the NHL !

If you can't see that, well I'm not sure what to say ! You're very blind !

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12-14-2009, 02:54 PM
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12-14-2009, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by tino561 View Post
The GMs of the teams who received the top three picks in the last NHL draft said if they could have they would have chosen Hall over Tavares, Duchene, and Hedman easily. Hall plays on a very talented Spitfires club, but that doesn't curb his attributes at all. He still possesses lightning speed, incredible transitions, great hands, and most importantly, he's a game breaker already. I would choose drafting Taylor Hall over the 8th seed any day.
I would love to make the playoffs and anything could happen once you get to the dance but even if we did make the playoffs I don't see how we could beat a #1 or #2 seed in a 7 game series. Hall could turn this team around.

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12-14-2009, 02:56 PM
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care to elaborate?

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12-14-2009, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
Siedenberg, Leopold, and Moore are only signed for one year.

A top pick helps a lot more. The only difference between 30th place and 17th is you get a shot at a franchise player.

Detroit got lucky with Zetterberg and Datysuk. If they knew they were going to be so good they would have drafted them much earlier instead of waiting.

"which we don't know all of them can handle" this is why we test them out this season.
Well I would assume one , if not two of the three we will try and resign. Also if we try to insert more youngsters in the line up and make our team young next season wont we be telling the fans, we are full fledge in rebuilding mode and to not expect us to make the playoffs this season or next season. There are other teams in the nhl who draft well, and fill out there rosters quite nicely with their draft picks. Which we only started to do these last few years. We need tweaking , not a complete overhaul. Plus, what message would we send the fans , if we give up now and purposly do things to ensure we lose often. The new owners for sure arent thinking your way and nor do they want to give the fans the idea, we arent going hard at our goals right away.

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12-14-2009, 03:02 PM
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Well I would assume one , if not two of the three we will try and resign. Also if we try to insert more youngsters in the line up and make our team young next season wont we be telling the fans, we are full fledge in rebuilding mode and to not expect us to make the playoffs this season or next season. There are other teams in the nhl who draft well, and fill out there rosters quite nicely with their draft picks. Which we only started to do these last few years. We need tweaking , not a complete overhaul. Plus, what message would we send the fans , if we give up now and purposly do things to ensure we lose often. The new owners for sure arent thinking your way and nor do they want to give the fans the idea, we arent going hard at our goals right away.
With the team we have now there is no guarantee of winning. Losing at home has been a regular thing this season. Not much will change. At least it will appear that we're trying to change things instead of just being mired in mediocrity.

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12-14-2009, 03:09 PM
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I think that finishing last would be devastating to team morale and should be avoided at all cost. Guys like Weiss, Horton, Booth, and Olesz have only known defeat so far in their professional career. We need to start building a culture of winning and accountability. We don't want to pass the loser mentality on to guys like Frolik, Kulikov, Markstrom, Ellerby, Repik, so on and so forth.

We don't need the #1 pick to win in this league. We must draft smart and develop our talent smart. We need to sign the right veteran leader UFAs who have come from a winning tradition that they can pass on to our younger guys.

The last thing we need is to finish dead last in the standings.

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12-14-2009, 03:12 PM
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I think that finishing last would be devastating to team morale and should be avoided at all cost. Guys like Weiss, Horton, Booth, and Olesz have only known defeat so far in their professional career. We need to start building a culture of winning and accountability. We don't want to pass the loser mentality on to guys like Frolik, Kulikov, Markstrom, Ellerby, Repik, so on and so forth.

We don't need the #1 pick to win in this league. We must draft smart and develop our talent smart. We need to sign the right veteran leader UFAs who have come from a winning tradition that they can pass on to our younger guys.

The last thing we need is to finish dead last in the standings.
Dead last might be bad in the short term but I can't see it being much different than missing the playoffs AGAIN. The loser mentality is all that they've known anyway. At least they can get some hope of a turnaround.

We don't need it but it will more than anything else. I believe it is the best way to become a winner again. Until this team is a consistent winner nobody will show up and they'll be giving away tickets which will go unclaimed. Finishing in 9th last year probably hurts more than last place.

This team as it stands is probably not going to make the playoffs. Once again, they will be losers.

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12-14-2009, 03:13 PM
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I am actually speechless when it comes to this season because of how unpredictable it is. Flyers aren't dominating as everyone thought they would be, and the Panthers are only 2 points out of the 8th and final playoff spot even though we seem to be playing slightly miserable hockey. We are without Leading scorer David Booth as well as Stillman, who was on a hot streak playing along side of Reinprecht. Who's to say that when those two players return to the lineup ( 100% I hope) that this team doesn't get a much offensive boost?

I would like to see them make the playoffs, and I think it could definately bring back some fans and get this team's "reputation "going. At the same time, if we are a lock for missing the playoffs, I'd like to draft Taylor Hall and finally get someone whom we can truely build a team around, instead of waiting for Horton to be that guy.

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12-14-2009, 03:16 PM
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I am actually speechless when it comes to this season because of how unpredictable it is. Flyers aren't dominating as everyone thought they would be, and the Panthers are only 2 points out of the 8th and final playoff spot even though we seem to be playing slightly miserable hockey. We are without Leading scorer David Booth as well as Stillman, who was on a hot streak playing along side of Reinprecht. Who's to say that when those two players return to the lineup ( 100% I hope) that this team doesn't get a much offensive boost?

I would like to see them make the playoffs, and I think it could definately bring back some fans and get this team's "reputation "going. At the same time, if we are a lock for missing the playoffs, I'd like to draft Taylor Hall and finally get someone whom we can truely build a team around, instead of waiting for Horton to be that guy.
The standings are weird but Philly has three games in hand, iirc. Booth could be out for a while plus he hasn't been working out so it is reasonable to expect him to take a while to get back in game form.

The playoffs will only matter if we can win a series.

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12-14-2009, 03:17 PM
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... and the Panthers are only 2 points out of the 8th and final playoff spot even though we seem to be playing slightly miserable hockey.
I'm pretty sure, just going off memory, that our opponents have several games in hand on us.

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12-14-2009, 03:17 PM
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If you have pride in your team and organization, you don't tank. It's that simple.

And, RR, Seidenberg and Leopold only signed for one year? Sign them both up, fast. They've been very good.

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12-14-2009, 03:19 PM
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If you have pride in your team and organization, you don't tank. It's that simple.

And, RR, Seidenberg and Leopold only signed for one year? Sign them both up, fast. They've been very good.
Pride is long gone. I take it you haven't been a fan of this team very long. It serves a legitimate purpose to turn this franchise around and make them relevant again so people pay to see them. They literally cannot give tickets away.

They've been good which is why they have trade value.

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12-14-2009, 03:24 PM
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Pride is long gone. I take it you haven't been a fan of this team very long. It serves a legitimate purpose to turn this franchise around and make them relevant again so people pay to see them. They literally cannot give tickets away.

They've been good which is why they have trade value.
Resign Leopold to a multi-year deal and trade Seidenberg with Campbell or Kreps at the deadline for a scorer...

Then hope we make it !

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12-14-2009, 03:27 PM
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You're right about me not having been with Florida for very long, and that does explain a lot. If I had, perhaps I'd be seeing things exactly like you. At the same time, there may be a positive in not seeing things that way too. Coming in fresh, I like what I see here. You have a very young team. They're getting better all the time. The glass is definitely much more than half full IMO. A tweak here, a tweak there, and you're in and set for a long time.

Personally, I think that if anyone gets traded, it will be Vokoun. I'm a Vokoun liker, not a hater, but as GP has often said, you can get a lot of return for him and use some of that money/etc. to pick up decent (not great) goaltending and pack the lineup with better people.

I'd hate to see him go, but as I see it, it's a win-win. Vokoun's going to a better team, and the Panthers will become better as a result. But there's no doubt, IMO, about this one thing: we need one more solid piece to the puzzle.

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12-14-2009, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by BabyJagrov View Post
Resign Leopold to a multi-year deal and trade Seidenberg with Campbell or Kreps at the deadline for a scorer...

Then hope we make it !
That will not get us a scorer.

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12-14-2009, 03:34 PM
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You're right about me not having been with Florida for very long, and that does explain a lot. If I had, perhaps I'd be seeing things exactly like you. At the same time, there may be a positive in not seeing things that way too. Coming in fresh, I like what I see here. You have a very young team. They're getting better all the time. The glass is definitely much more than half full IMO. A tweak here, a tweak there, and you're in and set for a long time.

Personally, I think that if anyone gets traded, it will be Vokoun. I'm a Vokoun liker, not a hater, but as GP has often said, you can get a lot of return for him and use some of that money/etc. to pick up decent (not great) goaltending and pack the lineup with better people.

I'd hate to see him go, but as I see it, it's a win-win. Vokoun's going to a better team, and the Panthers will become better as a result. But there's no doubt, IMO, about this one thing: we need one more solid piece to the puzzle.
Seeing how Kessel has turned around Toronto has made me Jealous. They probably wont make the playoffs but things look a lot brighter there.

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