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12-23-2009, 10:42 AM
  #1
tripler0425
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Kovalchuk

I just read a report on espn and it says that the Flyers recently offered Jeff Carter, Giroux and Parent for Kovalchuk. What does everyone feel about that offer?

http://http://insider.espn.go.com/nhl/features/rumors

Price set for Ilya?
11:32AM ET
Ilya Kovalchuk | Thrashers | Interested: Flames?, Kings?, Flyers?, Bruins?, Maple Leafs?
Top Email

Is Ilya Kovalchuk officially on the block? For the first time, GM Don Waddell admitted that there may be troubles in his negotiations with his star. "Our position is different than his position right now," Waddell told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution earlier this week. "Their position is fixed years with money and we have a different side of that."

It's rumored he wants a 10-year deal worth $11.3 million a season -- the maximum allowable contract in accordance with the collective bargaining agreemenet -- but GM Don Waddell has said he isn't willing to give it. Of course, there are plenty of suitors willing to either "rent" Kovy for the rest of the season, or take on his potentially massive salary in a long-term deal.

According to one rumor, the pricetag for Kovalchuk in trade may have been set by the Flyers over the past week: a package of Jeff Carter, Claude Giroux and Ryan Parent was allegedly offered in exchange for the Thrashers forward.

Here's an updated list of where he might end up:

Toronto Maple Leafs: They might save up and spend it all in one place.

Boston Bruins: The Bruins have the pieces, but they have money issues -- and Kovalchuk wants a lot of money.

Philadelphia Flyers: The Flyers may also be interested, but there's a lot they have to take care of before working out a deal of this magnitude.

Los Angeles Kings: There was a lot of buzz about this one, but two sources say this rumor is false.

Calgary Flames: Calgary GM Mike Gillis' denied the rumors, as did other Flames sources in the media, but it's possible they are playing this one close to the vest.

KHL: KHL president Alexander Medvedev might also swoop in with a huge deal. He said he's already talked to Kovalchuk and can offer a better deal than the NHL because of tax laws.

Colorado Avalanche -- Here's why.

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12-23-2009, 10:44 AM
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DeadPhish5858
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Thats way too much for him. Im not a big fan of Kovalchuk anyway.

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12-23-2009, 10:45 AM
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sa cyred
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Wow hell no. Thats ALOT to give up right there...

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12-23-2009, 10:46 AM
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tripler0425
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Yeah I think it is too much to give up as well especially if we can't sign him. Regardless it is too much to give up.

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12-23-2009, 10:49 AM
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Haute Couturier
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No way. I don't see how they can expect to get much more than they received for Hossa. I wouldn't give Giroux straight up for an impending UFA.

It's nice to dream about Kovy on our team, but I don't think we need another hefty contract on the books.

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12-23-2009, 10:49 AM
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Shadow Flyer
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If that was the package offered for an UFA, who it would likely cost $8-10 million to resign, Homer should be replaced now. Like, right now.

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12-23-2009, 10:50 AM
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I would do it. Kovalchuk is a top 5 forward right now. Carter may be in time, but isn't right now. Giroux will never score goals they way Kovalchuk does, though he will likely be a better two way player and better playmaker. Parent is nothing too special. I like him, but trading him won't have any real effect on the team. I wouldn't want to trade Carter or Giroux (let alone both of them) unless they got a player like Kovalchuk in return. Also I would say the deal would have to be contingent on signing him because trading that much for a rental would be ridiculous.

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12-23-2009, 10:53 AM
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whatthef
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowFlyer View Post
If that was the package offered for an UFA, who it would likely cost $8-10 million to resign, Homer should be replaced now. Like, right now.
I've read a few times he's looking for the max which I think is $11.4 million per year. Kovalchuk is my favorite player not on the Flyers and I would love to have him on the team, but that would be to much to give IMO. Also, I don't see how we could afford to resign him with all the big contracts we already have. I'd be happy to do Hartnell and Carter for him though, provided we could resign him.

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12-23-2009, 10:53 AM
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Too much going there, and no way would I give Kovalchuk 11 Million as much as I'd love him here.

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12-23-2009, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Also I would say the deal would have to be contingent on signing him because trading that much for a rental would be ridiculous.
And how exactly do you manage to pay Kovy what he wants within the salary structure of this team?

I've seen lotsa people who want Kovalchuk, and I have yet to see anyone show me how it makes sense for this team, both now and in the future. All I've seen is "Kovalchuk is great we will win and stuff" as the reasoning we should mortgage even more of our future than we already have.

Brilliant.

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12-23-2009, 11:04 AM
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If it was Hartnell and not Giroux I could maybe go with it. Also, it's ESPN, what the hell do they know about hockey? They barely talk about it.

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12-23-2009, 11:07 AM
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If it was Hartnell and not Giroux I could maybe go with it. Also, it's ESPN, what the hell do they know about hockey? They barely talk about it.
ESPN doesn't know what Hockey is.



I'd give Kovalchuk 11 a year, for like 4 years then bring it down.

11, 11, 11, 11, 9, 9, 7, 5, 5, 3
= 10 years at $8.2 (more then fair)

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12-23-2009, 11:14 AM
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flountown
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I would say a realistic cap hit you could expect in Atlanta for Kovalchuk is about 10 million, but traded to a consistent contender and great hockey market. I have a feeling he would settle for a front loaded contract with a cap hit of around 8+ like the Irish said.

I am not nuts on giving up Giroux, and contract-wise, I wonder if it would be smarter to deal Coburn. But this deal would definitely need to be contingent upon an extension.

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12-23-2009, 11:19 AM
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IrishSniper87
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I would not move Giroux in any Kovy deal. Gagne, Parent, Coburn, Carter, Hartnell are all fair game though.

I want Richards and Giroux to center the top 2 lines.

Kovalchuk-Giroux-JVR
Gagne-Richards-Briere
stuff
more stuff

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12-23-2009, 11:21 AM
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SolidSnakeUS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
ESPN doesn't know what Hockey is.



I'd give Kovalchuk 11 a year, for like 4 years then bring it down.

11, 11, 11, 11, 9, 9, 7, 5, 5, 3
= 10 years at $8.2 (more then fair)
Only if we can knock off Hartnell and Carter. I really wish it would be Coburn instead of Parent, but to be honest, sadly, I think Coburn is more of the offensive d-man. The thing is, we would have to sign everyone else so DAMN CHEAP. We have so many expensive d-men that it hurts. I mean, if we had d-men at the price of someone like the Coyotes or Vancouver, then it wouldn't be so much of a problem. But we have 2 d-men well over 6 million. If only we could do Hartnell, Carter and Pronger for Kovy and Enstrom. That would be amazing haha. But I'm sure they wouldn't go for it. Hopefully if we do get him that his agent would be more reasonable and just go for like 8 million instead of 11 million. If they were to do Hartnell, Carter and Coburn/Parent, I'd say ask for Valabik or a 1st back with Kovy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
I would not move Giroux in any Kovy deal. Gagne, Parent, Coburn, Carter, Hartnell are all fair game though.

I want Richards and Giroux to center the top 2 lines.

Kovalchuk-Giroux-JVR
Gagne-Richards-Briere
stuff
more stuff
Gagne should stay. He's worth his money healthy. And a great team player and has skill (of course).

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12-23-2009, 11:24 AM
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The ESPN deal would force another move by the Flyers to add bodies while not getting any significant cap relief this season ($200,000 with Kovy). I call shenanigans on the ESPN deal.
As for realistic packages, Carter, Hartnell and Parent for Kovy and throw-in skater is very doable for both sides. It gives the Flyers cap room to survive this season and offers some future room for Kovy's massive new deal. The Thrashers have plenty of cap room this season and are structured well for future seasons (to re-sign their FAs or sign new ones).

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12-23-2009, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
Only if we can knock off Hartnell and Carter. I really wish it would be Coburn instead of Parent, but to be honest, sadly, I think Coburn is more of the offensive d-man. The thing is, we would have to sign everyone else so DAMN CHEAP. We have so many expensive d-men that it hurts. I mean, if we had d-men at the price of someone like the Coyotes or Vancouver, then it wouldn't be so much of a problem. But we have 2 d-men well over 6 million. If only we could do Hartnell, Carter and Pronger for Kovy and Enstrom. That would be amazing haha. But I'm sure they wouldn't go for it. Hopefully if we do get him that his agent would be more reasonable and just go for like 8 million instead of 11 million. If they were to do Hartnell, Carter and Coburn/Parent, I'd say ask for Valabik or a 1st back with Kovy.



Gagne should stay. He's worth his money healthy. And a great team player and has skill (of course).
I love Gagne, I really do, but injuries are such a huge issue on a cap strapped team, especially one that has Briere on it as well. We have almost 12 mill tied up in 2 guys who have hardly played any games together and this is their 3rd season on the same team.

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12-23-2009, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
I love Gagne, I really do, but injuries are such a huge issue on a cap strapped team, especially one that has Briere on it as well. We have almost 12 mill tied up in 2 guys who have hardly played any games together and this is their 3rd season on the same team.
You can really only blame Babcock for hurting Gagne though, not the Flyers haha. Briere has been healthy pretty much and Gagne is pretty much getting his bearings back and he will score. I have a feeling Gagne and Powe will score tonight. But still, Hartnell, Carter, Coburn, Syvret, Carcillo, Asham and Cote are all free game if you ask me.

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12-23-2009, 11:30 AM
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I like Gagne too, but we can't deal two top 6 centers and only get a winger in return. Unless you guys expect Briere to switch back to center, but I think he has been playing really well at the wing due to the lesser defensive responsibilities.

So logically, moving Hartnell, Gagne, or JVR (Not saying I want to, just presenting the position based argument) would make more sense.

I also think that if anything were added on Atlanta's side, it would be a goaltender. They currently have two great young guys who seem to be taking over for Lehtonen, so I could see Lehtonen being the extra piece, not sure of his salary off the top of my head though.

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12-23-2009, 11:30 AM
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That is such a stupid and rediculous offer. Giving up the rights to a solid young defenseman, a previous 45 goal scorer in a funk, and a solid playmaker in a sophmore slump.

Not even forsberg/hossa/Pronger brought anything close to that.

No deal!

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12-23-2009, 11:32 AM
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You'd need more salary than that going back for Kovy.

Taking off the rose colored glasses... value wise it isn't horrible. It's just insane in a cap world to only have 1 real salary getting sent back the other way.

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12-23-2009, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
ESPN doesn't know what Hockey is.



I'd give Kovalchuk 11 a year, for like 4 years then bring it down.

11, 11, 11, 11, 9, 9, 7, 5, 5, 3
= 10 years at $8.2 (more then fair)
I say take away two 11's and the 3. I believe that would leave us at $8.14.

11, 11, 9, 9, 7, 5, 5 = 7 years at $8.14, me thinks

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12-23-2009, 11:41 AM
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Haute Couturier
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You'd need more salary than that going back for Kovy.

Taking off the rose colored glasses... value wise it isn't horrible. It's just insane in a cap world to only have 1 real salary getting sent back the other way.
I disagree. Value wise it's atrocious.

Look at the returns for impending UFAs Forsberg and Hossa.

Giroux is better than any of the players dealt for those two and we're supposed to give up Carter and Parent as well? That's highway robbery. I know we have to deal someone to make cap space, but we shouldn't overpay Atlanta just do to that.

If we were to bring on a hefty contract as Kovy will command then we absolutely have to get rid of Briere's albatross contract.

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12-23-2009, 11:43 AM
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As stated above though, no way i would do this deal.

Carter and Hartnell I would definitely think about!

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12-23-2009, 11:46 AM
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I would onkly give that much if he signed a cheaper deal

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