HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > International Tournaments
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Damian Cox: Canada's constant home-ice advantage is killing WJCs

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-24-2009, 08:59 AM
  #76
Macca
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 155
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slovakiaforever View Post
IMO if an Euopean country wants to improve, of which improving the interest is a big part, it can just easily host the WHC, which still is the best way to promote hockey in Europe. When Sweden hosted the WJC in 07ī I think they did quite a lot of promotion and still outside of SWE games the attendance werenīt any superior to the European countries.

Canadians got their traditions, weīve got our own with the WHC. And please donīt even start with the without the best players tourney crap, the WHC is still better quality hockey than the WJC. IMO when I look at the Slovak or Czech WJC roster, the majority of those players donīt even have a chance to suit up ina friendly NT game sometime in the future, yet alone the WHC, letīs not even speak about teams like Latvia ro Austria, with all respect to them.
That's great the WHC is supported in Europe. The WHC was held in Canada last year and the support was amazing. In Canada we support every level of hockey. I guess that's the difference. I respectfully disagree with your quality of hockey comparison.


Last edited by Macca: 12-24-2009 at 09:05 AM.
Macca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:07 AM
  #77
Jussi
I am siege face
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 43,436
vCash: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post

The World Junior Championships are pretty popular here in Sweden on TV, if we think the team has a decent chance. If not, the tournament is pretty dead here. So basically the Forsberg generation, the Sedin generation and now this generation has managed to gather some interest. Between that, not very much.
This is basically the reason why European countries have little interest in hosting it. Because junior development is cyclical, especially outside of North America, there's no guarantee that you'll have decent crop of players when it'll be your county's turn to host. Imagine if Sweden decides they want host say 2014, and they end up having a really bad year talentwise and the team really sucks. They would end up taking a really big hit financially because no one cares about the other countries.

Generally in Finland the situation is even worse, we've had a few really bad years with talent and outside of RGP and Vatanen, there doesn't seem to anything similar coming in a while. Not to mention that the WJC games are currently aired on pay tv so you have even smaller interest/knowledge of the tournament.

Jussi is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:08 AM
  #78
slovakiasnextone
Registered User
 
slovakiasnextone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Slovakia
Country: Slovakia
Posts: 4,726
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macca View Post
That's great the WHC is supported in Europe. The WHC was held in Canada last year and the support was amazing. In Canada we support every level of hockey. I guess that's the difference.
Maybe it has to do with the fact that itīs the number 1 sport in Canada and the only significant team sport that Canada has succes in?

Hockey isnīt the clear No. 1 sport in any other country and there are only like 6-7 European countries were you could consider it at least as popular as soccer- Russia, Czech republic, Sweden, Slovakia etc. Sweden for example also has handball that they are world class in, even such a small hockey crazed nation like Latvia most probably has basketball as the most popular sport.

IīMO, one of the few hardest question you could ever ask me would be whether the more popular sport in Slovakia is hockey or soccer. Plus some of our other team sports have had some succes in the last few years and although I love hockey if I for example had to choose whether Iīm gonna watch some kids play in the WJC or watch the Slovak menīs handball team play in the handball WC, Iīm gonna watch handball. Junior sports isnīt popular in Europe, itīs just the way it is, doesnīt mean that people here love the sport any less than the Canadians do.

EDIT: And btw itīs not like the WJC was always so popular in Canada as it is today, it has grown so popular especially since the punch-up in Piešťany, a part of hockey that people over here would be so eager to see, thatīs why they even chanted we want hockey back then.


Last edited by slovakiasnextone: 12-24-2009 at 09:31 AM.
slovakiasnextone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:12 AM
  #79
TorFC-TML*
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Ireland
Posts: 2,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic View Post
I was maki9ng a point towards his post where he raked Europe up as a country, and Canada and USA separated.

Don't make smug remarks about stuff you've taken out of context.
For all intents and purposes, Europe is a country.




TorFC-TML* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:16 AM
  #80
slovakiasnextone
Registered User
 
slovakiasnextone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Slovakia
Country: Slovakia
Posts: 4,726
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TorFC-TML View Post
For all intents and purposes, Europe is a country.



It is not. And if you had any knowledge of it, youīd know that quite a few of the European countries that are in the elite hockey pool are not even members of the EU- IMO Switzerland, Russia, Belarus, Norway.....?? Thatīs 4 European countries that will play at the Vabnouver Olympics.

slovakiasnextone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:16 AM
  #81
Jussi
I am siege face
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 43,436
vCash: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by TorFC-TML View Post
For all intents and purposes, Europe is a country.



Only financially or economically. Culturally and sportingwise, not even close.

Jussi is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:35 AM
  #82
Le CH
Registered User
 
Le CH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,241
vCash: 500
You would think this tournament would be successful is Russia as well... am I wrong?

Le CH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:45 AM
  #83
cska78
Registered User
 
cska78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: USA
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 10,703
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to cska78 Send a message via Yahoo to cska78
question - who cares about junior hockey in Europe? the answer is no one but hockey die-hards, now consider that most European hockey countries are still more into soccer and the percentage of die hards is tiny. Which means empty stands, horrid tv-ratings and etc. If Canada is making dough from this tournament, people are feeling up the stands, let them have it.

cska78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:49 AM
  #84
Robin Hood
Registered User
 
Robin Hood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Copenhagen
Country: Denmark
Posts: 710
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TorFC-TML View Post
For all intents and purposes, Europe is a country.




Robin Hood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 10:13 AM
  #85
MJALLTHEWAY
Registered User
 
MJALLTHEWAY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 218
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SchwenningerWildWing View Post
From a german point of view it is pretty easy. In Germany national teams are important but only when they're winning. For example in handball (a sport I think no one cares in north america) Germany was world champion a few years ago and more than 10 million watched the final. Basketball has Nowitzki and the soccer team is one of the best in the world but the hockey team never won anything except a bronze medal in 78 and hockey has not a big reputation outside the cities with a hockey team. Even the men's national team has problems to draw big crowds outside a WC, so why should anybody in Germany care for a tournament played by kids in a sport where Germany is not good. I can tell you, the WJC has zero media coverage outside some internet hockey sitesand local newspapers in the cities where some of the players are coming from. Only die hard NHL fans in Germany care about this tournament and I'm sure that hosting it in Germany would draw hardly more than 1000 spectators in games without Germany. Belive me, not even every hockey fan in Germany cares about the NHL, so why should they care about the the NHL stars from tommorow. And on a site note, I'm sure that for example luge will draw higher ratings at the olympics than the hockey games. Because Germany is a force in luge. Canada had the u20 soccer world championship. How big was the crowd there? And how interested is the casual canadian sports fan in soccer, let alone u20 soccer? See,that is how interested a casual european hockey fan is interested in the WJC. I think only Sweden is a possible host in Europe, otherwise the WJC should stay in north america
I'm pretty sure, if i remember correctly, that Canada set an attendance record for the event.

MJALLTHEWAY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 10:42 AM
  #86
SchwenningerWildWing
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Germany
Country: Germany
Posts: 577
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to SchwenningerWildWing
It was second behind Mexico 83 which is pretty amazing. Didnīt know that. So let me say it another way. Would any canadian stand up in the night to watch Canadaīs u20 soccer team when they would play in Europe. And that is the way how it is for us europeans with the WJC. Only when you are a die hard fan you get up in the night to watch a game.
And another poster said that the WJC games should be shown more on TV to increase the interest in the game. Man, in Germany not even the mens games are always on TV, so there is ZERO chance that a junior game would be on TV unless we would compete for the title.

SchwenningerWildWing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 10:43 AM
  #87
JVR
HeadHitsAreNotIllega
 
JVR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Country: Germany
Posts: 3,187
vCash: 500
Junior tournaments are not really popular here in Germany, when the U17 EC (soccer) was held here, attendance was good for games with Gemany participating but that was mostly because students got in for free.
It's not like even hardcore soccer fans get that excited for it.


I think the games should be held in Canada at least every 2nd year, it's great for the young players to play on front of big enthusiastic crowds.
Imo it is pretty much Canada's tournament.

Frohe Weihnachten SchwenningerWildWing,

JVR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 10:48 AM
  #88
v-man
Registered User
 
v-man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,888
vCash: 500
I was in Europe during Canada's U20 World Cup, and there was absolutely zero interest or coverage of it on the cable sports networks (this was in three different countries). Beach soccer was far more popular. Seems to me junior sports are simply not something they support.

v-man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 10:58 AM
  #89
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,266
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SchwenningerWildWing View Post
Would any canadian stand up in the night to watch Canadaīs u20 soccer team when they would play in Europe.
Actually about 6 years ago +/- Canada's Womens Soccer (oops Football) U20 team played in a tourney overseas which was one of the season most watched sporting events.

Ward Cornell is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 11:12 AM
  #90
Le CH
Registered User
 
Le CH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,241
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
Actually about 6 years ago +/- Canada's Womens Soccer (oops Football) U20 team played in a tourney overseas which was one of the season most watched sporting events.
Yeah OK, but the guy still has a pretty valid point...

Le CH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 11:19 AM
  #91
htpwn
Registered User
 
htpwn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Poland
Posts: 12,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiefer View Post
I can only tell from me and my friends, anyone that is interested in hockey, is interested in juniors.

Problem in Sweden though, and i suspect many other EU countries, is that the arenas take like 4-6K people. I'm sure NA can take some more for the games. If an arena looks empty in EU its because companies buy seats for people that aren't interested.
That should be banned. It's not always empty because of lack of interest amongst true hockey fans.

That's how I feel anyway. I'm sure someone will prove me wrong, this is the Internet after all.
Yup. We have the same problem for NHL clubs here in North America.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heatley#15 View Post


Please just no. I'm getting tired of seeing all Canadian crowds already. I want to see how the game is doing in Europe! I know Canadian crowds will show up. Host it in Sweden where interest is growing according to the Swedes on this board. Host it in Russia. Host it in Latvia. Host it in Switzerland. Come back to Canada for 3 years of 5 or something of the like.

Maybe you can put Bettman in charge, he's good at expanding the game. Melbourne here we come!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchwenningerWildWing View Post
It was second behind Mexico 83 which is pretty amazing. Didnīt know that. So let me say it another way. Would any canadian stand up in the night to watch Canadaīs u20 soccer team when they would play in Europe. And that is the way how it is for us europeans with the WJC. Only when you are a die hard fan you get up in the night to watch a game.
And another poster said that the WJC games should be shown more on TV to increase the interest in the game. Man, in Germany not even the mens games are always on TV, so there is ZERO chance that a junior game would be on TV unless we would compete for the title.
Not really. Soccer is actually a fairly popular sport in parts of Canada. The Toronto FC MLS Club for example averages 20000 (capacity) for 99% of its regular season games. I know it doesn't compare with a lot of the European clubs however 20000 is pretty good for a continent that supposedly doesn't care about the sport.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sovand View Post
Second.


Last edited by htpwn: 12-24-2009 at 11:26 AM.
htpwn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 11:21 AM
  #92
Maelmoor
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Maelmoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,603
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Maelmoor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Junior sports will never be big in Europe. Not only is hockey the second biggest sport in most hockey nations here (Finland excluded), but it is all about senior sport. And when it comes to the junior leagues they are not even among the 50 most popular leagues domestically. There is close to zero interest.

In Canada junior hockey is huge. It might even be the biggest domestic leagues you have.

Night and day. When you have soccer leagues (not only domestic but also Premier League, Serie A, La Liga, Champions League) and all other senior sports competing for attention you realize junior hockey doesn't have a chance over here.

The World Junior Championships are pretty popular here in Sweden on TV, if we think the team has a decent chance. If not, the tournament is pretty dead here. So basically the Forsberg generation, the Sedin generation and now this generation has managed to gather some interest. Between that, not very much.
This does sum it up in an excellent way, junior sports will never become big in Europe.

__________________
Todd Harvey, Adam Oates and Darren Puppa, you are all missed in the game of hockey!
Maelmoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 11:23 AM
  #93
Maelmoor
HFBoards Sponsor
 
Maelmoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,603
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Maelmoor
Quote:
Originally Posted by TorFC-TML View Post
For all intents and purposes, Europe is a country.





That must be the most uneducated post I ever seen here..

Maelmoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 11:53 AM
  #94
jekoh
Registered User
 
jekoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,760
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by james bond View Post
Does anyone from Europe know why u20 sports are not big in the respective countries?
Because it's a very low level of competition.

jekoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 07:18 PM
  #95
GopherState
Repeat Offender...
 
GopherState's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: X Marks The Spot
Posts: 22,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macman View Post
Look at that dummy Jackie Parker, who during the Boston tournament said the Beanpot was more important than the WJCs. And he was the U.S. coach!
I'd have to think that's true - you're severely underestimating how important the Beanpot is in Boston.

GopherState is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 07:54 PM
  #96
Ward Cornell
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,266
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherState View Post
I'd have to think that's true - you're severely underestimating how important the Beanpot is in Boston.
Well.....I guess that says it all!
While my son's grade school basketball tournament next week is more important than March Madness!
People are severely underestimating how important his Tournament is in Wiarton!


Last edited by Ward Cornell: 12-24-2009 at 08:02 PM.
Ward Cornell is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 08:13 PM
  #97
GopherState
Repeat Offender...
 
GopherState's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: X Marks The Spot
Posts: 22,783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ward Cornell View Post
Well.....I guess that says it all!
While my son's grade school basketball tournament next week is more important than March Madness!
People are severely underestimating how important his Tournament is in Wiarton!
Hey, there's probably a shot that your son's tourney gets more coverage and attendance than March Madness. That's how it is in Boston where the new Garden sells out for two Mondays in February.

While I couldn't give a **** about the Beanpot and feel that Bostonians make it out to be the greatest thing since sliced bread, it's one of those things which is a part of the local fabric. Everybody has that. For many Canadians, it's waking up on Boxing Day and tuning into the WJC to cheer for Team Canada. For me, it's the Minnesota High School tourney. And for you apparently it's your son's amazingly important basketball tournament.

GopherState is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:09 PM
  #98
CaptBrannigan
Registered User
 
CaptBrannigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Tampa
Country: United States
Posts: 2,771
vCash: 500
I don't think it would be as big a deal if it didn't mean one team getting all the perks, all the time. Letting one team set up shop in an NHL locker room and not having to move is a shockingly biased advantage, just to name one. I'm surprised that this practice occurs in the Olympics and WJC and such.

CaptBrannigan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:11 PM
  #99
razman22
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 811
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Other Little Mikey View Post
I was at the 08 tournament in the Czech Republic, and I don't feel like it's an exaggeration to say that the gold medal game was at least 75% Canadian fans. That's probably understating it, to be honest. It was also well short of a sellout, in a 10,000 seat arena. Even in Europe it seems like Canadians are the only ones who care about this tournament.
This is correct. Having attended a number of tournaments in Europe, attendance is driven by Canadians. Either Canadian people going over to watch or Canadians living/working/touring/schooling in Europe make up huge portions of the gate. The tournament is HUGE with the Canadian people but nowhere else.

Saying that, the tournament was to be in Switzerland this year. They pulled out and nobody in Europe would take it. Hence, it's in Canada again.

razman22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-24-2009, 09:44 PM
  #100
Everest
Registered User
 
Everest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 10,392
vCash: 500
This tournament is Canada's 'thing'.

Americans go to Iraq.

English go to soccer.

Canadians go to WJT's.

Everest is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. Đ2014 All Rights Reserved.