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Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

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Old
12-25-2009, 11:03 PM
  #26
OneSharpMarble
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
Not all of us hate Bieksa, so far he is struggling, but he is a 40 point gritty defenseman that makes mistakes once in a while, quite costly mistakes maybe. I'm sure Montreal would love a defenseman like Kevin.

Nope, not close. When proposing a trade, think of why other teams do it. We gain nothing out of this, we take a step back... No, a few steps back. Did I mention we add salary back?
That's funny I was wondering why in their right mind Montreal would want Bieksa in the first place.

Quite happy with Montreals vets and young upcoming talent on D for the Habs. We aren't going to add more salary to our cap just so you can run off with our promising prospects. Why don't you take some of your own advice.

Now that Markov is back I am quite sure montreal back end is quite sufficient, if you have a top six forward to move we might have more to discuss.

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Old
12-25-2009, 11:41 PM
  #27
Darth Joker
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Originally Posted by bmah03 View Post
I'll be honest I have no idea how much Montreal fans value the players in this trade so if you don't think it's good there's no need to flame it just let me know why.

To Van:
Yannick Weber (.576)
Maxim, Lapierre (.800) RFA

To Mtl:
Kevin Bieksa (3.5)
Sergei Shirokov

Why Van would do this: They pick up a talented young D man in Webber and someone in Lapierre who can play the 3rd line roll this year. But next season he can play the 4th line centre with (hopefully) Hodgson taking over the 3rd line job. They also clear some cap space.

Why Mtl would do this: They pick up a RIGHT handed top 4 D man who when on his game is a top 30ish d man in the league. He kills penalties and can play the PP too. They also add a good winger prospect in Shirokov. This also gives them potential to move someone like Hal Gill at the deadline.
Not sure if Mtl Can do this cap wise. But there is usually a way around cap if it's not a big difference.
As a Habs fan, I'd certainly do that trade. There are cap issues there for the Habs, but probably ones that can be solved while still making this trade look good for us.


A core four of Markov, Hammer, Bieksa, and Spacek would be very, very nice. Gorges and Gill would round-out a very solid top six.


I can't see Vancouver doing it though. Not unless it's to shed salary to make a bigger trade happen, perhaps...

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:11 AM
  #28
JohnHodgson
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
That's funny I was wondering why in their right mind Montreal would want Bieksa in the first place.

Quite happy with Montreals vets and young upcoming talent on D for the Habs. We aren't going to add more salary to our cap just so you can run off with our promising prospects. Why don't you take some of your own advice.

Now that Markov is back I am quite sure montreal back end is quite sufficient, if you have a top six forward to move we might have more to discuss.
Because Bieksa would be the Canadiens #3 or #4 defenseman?

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12-26-2009, 12:19 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Darth Joker View Post
As a Habs fan, I'd certainly do that trade. There are cap issues there for the Habs, but probably ones that can be solved while still making this trade look good for us.


A core four of Markov, Hammer, Bieksa, and Spacek would be very, very nice. Gorges and Gill would round-out a very solid top six.


I can't see Vancouver doing it though. Not unless it's to shed salary to make a bigger trade happen, perhaps...
Would you guys do a Weber + Fischer for Bieksa?

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:25 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
Would you guys do a Weber + Fischer for Bieksa?
The Habs would but why would the Canucks,were not rebuilding are goal is to win championship and trading away a top 4 defenceman,for prospects isn't helping are chances.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:27 AM
  #31
OneSharpMarble
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Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
Because Bieksa would be the Canadiens #3 or #4 defenseman?
He would also eat up 3.5 mill in cap space, cost us one of our better prospects and Lapierre.

I am pretty sure both of those positions are being filled just fine right now by Spacek and Gorges and to a lesser degree Mara.

Markov - Hamrlik
Spacek - Gorges
Mara - O'Byrne
MAB/Gill

How many D do the habs need exactly?

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:35 AM
  #32
Ronaldo
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
He would also eat up 3.5 mill in cap space, cost us one of our better prospects and Lapierre.

I am pretty sure both of those positions are being filled just fine right now by Spacek and Gorges and to a lesser degree Mara.

Markov - Hamrlik
Spacek - Gorges
Mara - O'Byrne
MAB/Gill

How many D do the habs need exactly?
Besides Markov that d-core is pretty mediocre,lacking mobility.And don't get me started about the age.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:39 AM
  #33
JohnHodgson
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Originally Posted by King Canuck View Post
The Habs would but why would the Canucks,were not rebuilding are goal is to win championship and trading away a top 4 defenceman,for prospects isn't helping are chances.
Because Bieksa has been really bad this year and has made a lot of mistakes, a change of scenery could do wonders for him.

Mitchell-Salo
Edler-Ehrhoff
Schneider-O'Brien
Weber
Fischer
Lukowich
Rome

Bieksa is known for his offensive abilities and toughness, I think we could live without him if we were to trade him.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:42 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
Because Bieksa has been really bad this year and has made a lot of mistakes, a change of scenery could do wonders for him.

Mitchell-Salo
Edler-Ehrhoff
Schneider-O'Brien
Weber
Fischer
Lukowich
Rome

Bieksa is known for his offensive abilities and toughness, I think we could live without him if we were to trade him.
I agree,but I think we could get a better offer for a 40-45 point physical defenceman and when on his game IMO he is a top 30 defenceman in league.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:47 AM
  #35
OneSharpMarble
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Canuck View Post
Besides Markov that d-core is pretty mediocre,lacking mobility.And don't get me started about the age.
Trading a 28yr old for a our up and coming rookie helps the age thing does it? Also trading an offensive dman like weber solves the mobility problem aswell right?

Habs have Subban knocking on the door next year so how much space will be availible on the cap and the roster if Markov, Spacek, Hamrlik, Bieksa, O'byrne, gorges, gill are all locked up?

Don't want Bieksa, solves nothing and creates more problems, he would bring very little to our top 4 that we can't solve with our own picks.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:47 AM
  #36
JohnHodgson
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Originally Posted by King Canuck View Post
I agree,but I think we could get a better offer for a 40-45 point physical defenceman and when on his game IMO he is a top 30 defenceman in league.
And how often has he been on his game this year.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:52 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by King Canuck View Post
I agree,but I think we could get a better offer for a 40-45 point physical defenceman and when on his game IMO he is a top 30 defenceman in league.
I do agree that when on his game he is a top 30 dman. But let's be honest.. when was the last time he was consistently on his game? He's barely had 2 out of 4 good games in a row this year. Let alone a solid week. When he's on his game he's a great player for the Canucks. When he's off he's really a detriment as proven by AV not playing him on the PK lately he's a liability for the team and like someone said a change in teams might be good for him.
The thing with this trade is Webber can be an impact player in the next 1 or two years I think. And Lapierre helps this team this year and then for more years. The D doesn't lose a TON, yes it does lose a bit. But the players who have stepped up are now playing bigger rolls and playing them well.
I agree that Bieksa might be able to get you better players for this year. But do we have a chance (in all honesty) at the cup this year. Sure we could make a surprise run. But adding a key young D man and shedding some salary for a little bit more of a push in the next 2 years is a lot more likely. Plus what line do you put this better "Player" that you think Bieksa can get you? Second line RW?

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:57 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
And how often has he been on his game this year.
Never said he was on his game this year,I said when he's on his game he's a top 30 defenceman in the game,why would the Canucks trade him for two unproven prospects,while Bieksa is not on his game this year,he's still on pace for roughly 40 points.

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Old
12-26-2009, 01:52 AM
  #39
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Make it Pacioretty instead of Lapierre and its done.

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Old
12-26-2009, 01:59 AM
  #40
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I had enough puke fests watching Matt Cooke turtle over and over in a Canucks uniform.

We dont need another big mouth wussy like Lapierre doing that again in Vancouver.

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:25 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
So montreal gives up another talented D from its ever shrinking farm team for a player most nucks fans hate and is locked up to a big contract for the next year and a half? Plus another one of our young bottom line players.

Nah you have to give quality to get quality and Montreal wont take on that salary for free. Montreal will need cap space to sign Plekanec. Raymond is playing very well this year so Montreal could add a pick but this isn't as far off.

To Van:
Hamrlik
Webber
Pick

To Mon:
Bieksa
Raymond
Perhaps, but most intelligent Canucks fans realize what he brings to the table, so saying the Canucks fans hate him as a reason for him being a bad player is just bad logic. Besides, Canucks fans are routinely hard on their players, there's a reason we're known as the goalie graveyard.

And I respectfully disagree with the remaining of your post as it remains tied to this logic that Bieksa is a salary dump. News Flash: Bieksa is AT MOST 500K overpaid. Furthermore, many GMs would consider him 'quality'.

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:30 AM
  #42
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double post

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:31 AM
  #43
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How about we sub in Schnieder in for Bieksa

To Van:
Yannick Weber
Maxim, Lapierre

To Mtl:
Schnieder
Sergei Shirokov

salaries would be more even and MTL get's a familiar face back.

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12-26-2009, 02:33 AM
  #44
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Still wouldnt want Lapierre

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:55 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by King Canuck View Post
The Habs would but why would the Canucks,were not rebuilding are goal is to win championship and trading away a top 4 defenceman,for prospects isn't helping are chances.
the habs would? as a 'nuck fan you have no idea what you're talking about. weber is not going anywhere except in a potential package for a top 6 forward. if that.

not for bieksa

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:56 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by quysauce View Post
How about we sub in Schnieder in for Bieksa

To Van:
Yannick Weber
Maxim, Lapierre

To Mtl:
Schnieder
Sergei Shirokov

salaries would be more even and MTL get's a familiar face back.
Matthieu Schneider?

****ing brutal

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:57 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by LostMyGlasses View Post
Make it Pacioretty instead of Lapierre and its done.
lmao for bieksa? pacioretty and weber?

gainey never does that

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Old
12-26-2009, 03:02 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by emb24 View Post
the habs would? as a 'nuck fan you have no idea what you're talking about. weber is not going anywhere except in a potential package for a top 6 forward. if that.

not for bieksa
Never knew Gainey signed up on HF.

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Old
12-26-2009, 03:04 AM
  #49
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From a Habs pov, I'd do it, but I'd want Mara to be going to VCR as part of the deal... makes the salary hit and roster manageable this year.
I don't think Vancouver does this deal, not enough for Bieksa, but if they do, I can't see them being opposed to taking Mara as well (for depth/immediate impact reasons... weber is not ready for solid NHL duties just yet, at least not on a playoff team aiming for a long run.

I'm surprised any Habs fan would say no. Weber isn't exactly a blue chip prospect, he does look good and could turn out to be a steady producer, but with Carle/Subban/Fischer all bringing similar elements to the table, we can afford to let him go.
Lapierre is decent, but Metropolit is a much better option now and to resign for the future, and Ryan White has already shown that he can bring more to the table than Lapierre has/can.

Markov - Bieksa
Hamrlik - Spacek
Gorges - O'byrne/Gill

that would give us a really competitive defense corps, one with the kind of quality depth necessary to survive the grind of the playoffs.

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Old
12-26-2009, 04:03 AM
  #50
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From a Habs pov, I'd do it, but I'd want Mara to be going to VCR as part of the deal... makes the salary hit and roster manageable this year.
I don't think Vancouver does this deal, not enough for Bieksa, but if they do, I can't see them being opposed to taking Mara as well (for depth/immediate impact reasons... weber is not ready for solid NHL duties just yet, at least not on a playoff team aiming for a long run.

I'm surprised any Habs fan would say no. Weber isn't exactly a blue chip prospect, he does look good and could turn out to be a steady producer, but with Carle/Subban/Fischer all bringing similar elements to the table, we can afford to let him go.
Lapierre is decent, but Metropolit is a much better option now and to resign for the future, and Ryan White has already shown that he can bring more to the table than Lapierre has/can.
Markov - Bieksa
Hamrlik - Spacek
Gorges - O'byrne/Gill

that would give us a really competitive defense corps, one with the kind of quality depth necessary to survive the grind of the playoffs.
I would be ok with a deal involving Mara. When I made this post I normally try to lean towards making the trade slightly better for the other team (in this case Mtl) so i don't look like such a homer. So we can have a legit hockey discussion instead of "you're an idiot" type thing. Realisticly I would accept something like.

To Van:
Webber
Lapierre
Mara (Salary)
2nd '10

To Mtl:
Bieksa
Shirokov

Van: Helps this years team with the 3rd line centre spot, next season + future with Webber and the 2nd

Mtl: A solid D man to your top 4 and a good prospect. Plus time to move one of your other D during the offseason.

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