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Gaining 25lbs?

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12-31-2009, 08:35 PM
  #1
milkshow
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Gaining 25lbs?

Alright, well I want to put on some weight. I'm wondering how I should go about this to achieve my goal for the beggining of next season. My body is still filling out and I'm looking to put on this lean muscle mass. Any tips would be great. How much would the extra 25lbs. affect my game even though I'm still growing.

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12-31-2009, 08:38 PM
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What do you currently weigh? How tall are you?

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12-31-2009, 08:45 PM
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25lbs of lean muscle? Keep in mind you'll most likely gain water and fat, so 25lbs of lean muscle in 1 year unless you're a begginer(and even then) is hard, if not impossible. Best advice would be to eat a lot, mostly clean foods and do sports-specific, compound mouvements(and variations) like the squat, deadlift, bench press, press, pull ups, chin ups, bent over rows and dips as well as assistance exercices like good mornings, glute ham raises, and whatever upper body work you like to do usually.

If you want the mass to make you better at hockey, don't go the bodybuilding route. You can definitely do 8-12 rep work, but do a lot of 1-5 rep work on the squat,deadlift, press and bench press. Add in dynamic work to improve your explosiveness.

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12-31-2009, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mememe000 View Post
What do you currently weigh? How tall are you?
14 years old, 6'1", 165lbs

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12-31-2009, 08:52 PM
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You can get 25 lbs of fat in about 6 months. 25 pounds of clean muscle will take a few years of perfect training and diet.

How to do either? Eat and train.

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12-31-2009, 08:55 PM
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I wouldn't try at all to mess with weight at that age. Just work out a lot.

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12-31-2009, 08:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liveforthegame View Post
14 years old, 6'1", 165lbs
Don't do anything but eat a little more. Be patient and let nature take it's course. You really should not do any serious weight work until you hit 16.

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12-31-2009, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
Don't do anything but eat a little more. Be patient and let nature take it's course. You really should not do any serious weight work until you hit 16.
Really? A lot of people say 12 or 13.

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12-31-2009, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by mememe000 View Post
Really? A lot of people say 12 or 13.
I said serious weight work, not light lifting. You can really cause harm doing heavy deadlifts at 13 or 14, really bad idea.

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12-31-2009, 09:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
I said serious weight work, not light lifting. You can really cause harm doing heavy deadlifts at 13 or 14, really bad idea.
I'll be turning 15 in May, and have been lifting seriously for 4 months now.

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12-31-2009, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by liveforthegame View Post
I'll be turning 15 in May, and have been lifting seriously for 4 months now.
If you're doing deadlifts at this age, stop. Your muscular system simply won't benefit from them and you'll stand more of a probability of doing harm. One of my best friends from college is a physical trainer, he injured himself this exact same way and now has a bad back for life because of it.

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12-31-2009, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
If you're doing deadlifts at this age, stop. Your muscular system simply won't benefit from them and you'll stand more of a probability of doing harm. One of my best friends from college is a physical trainer, he injured himself this exact same way and now has a bad back for life because of it.
I was advised by the deadlifts before and have stopped doing them about a month or so ago. Whats your view on squats at this age? Some people claim that they will harm someone this young, of course weightlifting at this age is a myth.

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12-31-2009, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
If you're doing deadlifts at this age, stop. Your muscular system simply won't benefit from them and you'll stand more of a probability of doing harm. One of my best friends from college is a physical trainer, he injured himself this exact same way and now has a bad back for life because of it.
Link please. The only times I've heard this, it was myth more than actual evidence. I've seen 14 year olds lift more than you can imagine. It's dangerous for teens that age only because they're overeager and not properly coached. But if he's patient, and coached, no problem there.

And to counter your friends example, I tore my back ligaments, had sciatica and a herniated disc(not lifting weights). My pain went away when I started lifting, I never do work sets of deadlifts under 300 pounds(which is a lot more than I could handle back then). That's not mentioning a guy like Louie Simmons, who had much worse injuries(broken vertabraes), yet lifts over 700 pounds.

Heck, I've seen 13-14 year old Chinese lifters squat and clean insane weights. INSANE weights.

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12-31-2009, 11:12 PM
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It's just common sense to begin with. Your connective tissue is especially sensitive.

The goal of strength training is not to bulk up. It should not be confused with weight lifting, bodybuilding, and powerlifting, which are not recommended for kids and teens. In these sports, people train with very heavy weights and participate in modeling and lifting competitions. Kids and teens who do those sports can risk injuring their growing bones, muscles, and joints. http://kidshealth.org/parent/fitness...training.html#

I'm not saying don't lift any weight, I'm saying don't do heavy weights on several certain exercises. It's common sense- go ask any MD and you will get a large consensus. Heavy weightlifting, deadlifts etc with a heavy amount of weight, at a young age, are a bad idea. I'm not going to argue common sense. Go pick up a Biology textbook and you'll see what I'm saying is correct. Let me give you a rather elementary example, if you tear a tendon at say, 14, like I did, it won't require surgery, whereas if I had only been a few years older, it would have, quoted my ER doctor on that. Ask yourself, why is that? Because that tissue is still reforming itself, it's more flexible (not the best word ) than it would be in the future.

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01-01-2010, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
It's just common sense to begin with. Your connective tissue is especially sensitive.

The goal of strength training is not to bulk up. It should not be confused with weight lifting, bodybuilding, and powerlifting, which are not recommended for kids and teens. In these sports, people train with very heavy weights and participate in modeling and lifting competitions. Kids and teens who do those sports can risk injuring their growing bones, muscles, and joints. http://kidshealth.org/parent/fitness...training.html#

I'm not saying don't lift any weight, I'm saying don't do heavy weights on several certain exercises. It's common sense- go ask any MD and you will get a large consensus. Heavy weightlifting, deadlifts etc with a heavy amount of weight, at a young age, are a bad idea. I'm not going to argue common sense. Go pick up a Biology textbook and you'll see what I'm saying is correct. Let me give you a rather elementary example, if you tear a tendon at say, 14, like I did, it won't require surgery, whereas if I had only been a few years older, it would have, quoted my ER doctor on that. Ask yourself, why is that? Because that tissue is still reforming itself, it's more flexible (not the best word ) than it would be in the future.

^^ great post ^^

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01-01-2010, 04:46 AM
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01-01-2010, 11:34 AM
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6 1, 165 lbs at 14 sounds like you're already big for your age. I'd let nature take it's course. Know what you're supposed to do at the gym, if you're not sure hir a trainer who has experience in hockey conditioning. And if you're really serious hire a nutritionist. Gaining the proper weight and knowing how and what to lift or eat is not that hard to understand it's just that most people don't know anything about it. A nutrionist will be able to break down how many calories you're burning and how many and what you'll need to eat to meet your goals. That's probably they way I'd go given your age.

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01-01-2010, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donGjohnson View Post
It's just common sense to begin with. Your connective tissue is especially sensitive.

The goal of strength training is not to bulk up. It should not be confused with weight lifting, bodybuilding, and powerlifting, which are not recommended for kids and teens. In these sports, people train with very heavy weights and participate in modeling and lifting competitions. Kids and teens who do those sports can risk injuring their growing bones, muscles, and joints. http://kidshealth.org/parent/fitness...training.html#

I'm not saying don't lift any weight, I'm saying don't do heavy weights on several certain exercises. It's common sense- go ask any MD and you will get a large consensus. Heavy weightlifting, deadlifts etc with a heavy amount of weight, at a young age, are a bad idea. I'm not going to argue common sense. Go pick up a Biology textbook and you'll see what I'm saying is correct. Let me give you a rather elementary example, if you tear a tendon at say, 14, like I did, it won't require surgery, whereas if I had only been a few years older, it would have, quoted my ER doctor on that. Ask yourself, why is that? Because that tissue is still reforming itself, it's more flexible (not the best word ) than it would be in the future.

You provide no evidence yet again(your friend is not evidence and it's a ridiculous example, he could've had a bad back for life had he injured his back at 25). Saying MDs have a consensus is not an argument, MDs are as much experts on weightlifting as they are on quantum physics. Don't believe me? Ask one of them to show you how to squat or if squats are bad for your knees. That link does the same as you do, it mentions weightlifting as a sport that's not recommended without providing any real evidence of how its affecting teens who participat in it.

Let's completely disregard that the advanced and elite weightlifters have started at a very young age, some as young as 10 years old. Your link mentions the threat of injury. You understand the irony in a that statement right? We're on a hockey forum, hockey is the most popular sport in Canada, football is the most popular sport in america. Somehow, it's alright for children to participate in FULL CONTACT sports with a high incidence of both minor and serious injuries (including ligament tears, broken bones and brain injuries). Yet it's not ok to practice weightlifting, an almost injury-free sports? Where's the common sense in that?

Most of the evidence on growth damage is very limited and derived from studies of heavy child labor. Real evidence would show you a sport(and a very popular one at that) full of weightlifters that have had no problems with lifting at a young age.

The concerns are mostly because kids that age don't have the motor skills of an adult and while being competitive, they also lack awareness of their limitations. That can make them be overeager and try lifting weights much heavier than they should.

Basically, the key here is proper supervision. With a good coach who'll make him progress at the proper rate, there's nothing wrong with any exercise, save the good morning. I wish I started lifting at that age(if not at 12-13) and with a good coach. It's actually a perfect age to start lifting if you're patient.

I also mention weightlifting because it's very cheap to start (about 75-100$ for a year), it's very sports specific (excellent for strength, speed and power) and it's great for building muscle and coordination (it's basically a deadlift, a jump and a squat)

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01-01-2010, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liveforthegame View Post
14 years old, 6'1", 165lbs
jesus kid, you're huge! And I'm not even kidding (at 14 I was 5ft 9, 120lbs...now 6ft 1, 185)

Just eat healthy and stay active. I really wouldn't recomment weight training, but invariably someone is going to direct you there. That would actually work against you in the long run. Sidney crosby for example doesn't lift alot of weights, even today (never mind the "what do I control commercial).

Instead try alot more dynamic exercises to strengthen yourself (forsberg for example was an obscenely strong 165lb'er (in juniors and modo senior hockey) who frequently knocked out men 10lbs or more heavier than him Jaromir Jagr, Peter Statsny(one of the strongest nhl'ers ever) and today, PK subban, talk about doing obscene amounts of squats, lunges, and pushups as kids.. Compare these two the the Raitis Ivanans of the world and you'll see, weights don't necessarily equal strengh

. Drink lots of milk and water, be sure to have a very balanced diet, maybe increase (slightly) the number of meals or amount of calories you consume per meal...

Again, there's size and there's FUNCTIONAL size.



again, Crosby, videod above, has stressed his preference for dynamic training over pure weight training. He now weighs above 200lbs of solid muscle as a 5ft 9 or 10 adult


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01-01-2010, 12:45 PM
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Little Nilan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the_speedster View Post
jesus kid, you're huge! And I'm not even kidding (at 14 I was 5ft 9, 120lbs...now 6ft 1, 185)

Just eat healthy and stay active. I really wouldn't recomment weight training, but invariably someone is going to direct you there. That would actually work against you in the long run. Sidney crosby for example doesn't lift alot of weights, even today (never mind the "what do I control commercial).

Instead try alot more dynamic exercises to strengthen yourself (forsberg for example was an obscenely strong 165lb'er (in juniors and modo senior hockey) who frequently knocked out men 10lbs or more heavier than him Jaromir Jagr, Peter Statsny(one of the strongest nhl'ers ever) and today, PK subban, talk about doing obscene amounts of squats, lunges, and pushups as kids.. Compare these two the the Raitis Ivanans of the world and you'll see, weights don't necessarily equal strengh

. Drink lots of milk and water, be sure to have a very balanced diet, maybe increase (slightly) the number of meals or amount of calories you consume per meal...

Again, there's size and there's FUNCTIONAL size.



again, Crosby, videod above, has stressed his preference for dynamic training over pure weight training. He now weighs above 200lbs of solid muscle as a 5ft 9 or 10 adult
What a ridiculous post.

Weight training does not work against you in any way, shape or form in the long run. How do you even come up with that? Marian Gaborik of the wild for example, has an insane back squat. Gary Roberts as well at 40 squatted big numbers. Look at this: http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=461505 Look at the guy mentioning Jay Pandolfo squats 400 pounds for reps.

Then you mention Pk Subban. WTF? The guy is the poster boy for hockey players lifting heavy weights.

And why do you mention dynamic exercises, then go on to talk about squats, lunges and push ups? Do you understand what dynamic exercises are? Do you understand squat are part of weight lifting? Not only part of, but the essential lift? And yes, Raitis Ivanans is strong, that he's skilled is an entirely different matter.

Then you mention functional size... jesus. What do you think squats, deadlift, cleans, bench presses, presses, pull ups, dips give you? LOL.

And lastly, you mention dynamic exercises and Crosby, yet you show a video of him doing, get this, weight training with cables. And not only weight training with cables, but not even dynamic exercises, he was doing mostly core work and 2 horizontal rows. this forum sometimes.

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01-01-2010, 09:50 PM
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I love when people argue against common sense and then ask why things went wrong.

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01-02-2010, 01:11 PM
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I've decided my workouts are going to be strength training and plyometrics. Does anyone have any good plyo's for me to do?

My stats are as follows: I tested on January 1st, will update them in 3 or 6 months.

Bench Press: 175lbs max
Squat: 295lbs max, this is with really good form, I could do more if not using form
Deadlift: 260lbs, I have stop doing these for the time being.
Mile Run: 4:31, I won't update this stat as I'm going to be starting up sprinting, even though I was pretty good long distance running. It kills muscle and I would say sprints are definitly more suited for hockey. I won't update this stat as I'm done long distance for now. Btw I really hate doing the 400m sprint, 100m and 200m are okay, but 400m is killer.

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01-02-2010, 01:38 PM
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Id imagine the rules don't apply to you as much given that your 6'1" and 165 already. (your the same height and weight as me by the way).

For a couple years, stay away from deadlifts. Also, I wouldnt be testing your max at squats either. Stick to a weight where your doing 6+ reps.

Adding size will likely be positive for your game, as long as its not 25 pounds of pure fat. Lean Bulk it, take it slow. And of course, Leg mass is what its all about in Hockey.

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01-02-2010, 02:17 PM
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You will throw on 15-20 pounds easy in the next couple years. I wouldnt worry about it too much. You will prob be around 185ish.

At 6'1 will want to be around 180ish when you are done growing. Unless you gain height as well.

Im 6'2 and try to stay between 185-190

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01-02-2010, 04:17 PM
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There aren't any set size and weight measurements for anyone.

I'm 6ft 4in and 240-245lbs or so and would be classified as borderline obese in the medical community if you use the generalized average weight charts per height scales ... but assure you I am not.

I have a huge upper body naturally, a 50inch chest and 36in waist. My thigh muscles are huge and I do not even work them out. Everyone is different.

That doesn't help anyone find their ideal hockey weight though but what I said is true.

I would even be willing to wager that uneeded extra weight could have negative effects with speed and quickness depending on the individual. I'm no expert on the matter for sure.

I know I feel better the lighter I get with regards to hockey but I am a big guy already and my lowest weight possible and still being strong would probably be 225lbs to 230lbs.

I'm over 40 though and it would be a lot more work to lose that weight and maintain it, too much to do for playing once or twice a week as an old man. I'm happy where I am now.

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