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Vancouver and Nashville (At the Draft)

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Old
01-06-2010, 08:09 PM
  #1
R0bert0 Lu0ng0
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Vancouver and Nashville (At the Draft)

To Vancouver:
Dan Hamhuis ($2m, UFA 2010)
2010 3rd Round Pick

To Nashville:
Cory Schneider ($0.984m, RFA 2011)

Okay, so I may be getting ahead of myself here. For all I know, Nashville may fully intend to resign both Hamhuis and both of their goalies - or maybe they see Ellis or Rinne as a 70-75 gamer next year and don't care much about their backup.

BUT.. if Hamhuis doesn't sign an extension and Nashville wants to let one of their goaltenders walk I see this trade as workable. They have tons of defensive depth, and while Chet Pickard may be playing pro hockey he's probably not going to be ready for full time NHL duty for at least a couple of years. That means that the Preds will need to either resign both goalies (who are due for raises) or pick up an inexpensive goaltender.

Schneider on the other hand is arguably ready this year, and will be ready for time next season. Barring injury he won't get a substantial opportunity in Vancouver and might be eligible for UFA at the end of next season (he needs to play a certain number of games to prevent this).

Vancouver has some cap space opening up and would like to add a younger defenseman, Hamhuis certainly fits the bill. They also need to recoup a draft pick as they don't have their 2nd in this draft.

Thoughts? Am I way off on the direction Nashville is likely to take? Is the value off?

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01-06-2010, 08:16 PM
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CloutierForVezina
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Gillis has stated before that he will not spend assets simply to acquire a player's rights*. The fact they're potentially trading away a former 1st round pick who has done nothing to diminish his value (and much to increase it) for a 3rd round pick seems to go against this mentality for Gillis.

*At least, I'm pretty sure he stated that when asked if he was going to make a play to acquire bouwmeester's rights. I could be mistaken.

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01-06-2010, 08:17 PM
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bumperkisser
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um.. i cant speak for nashville fans because i am NOT one.. but from an outsiders POV.. that is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY OFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF... IMO nashville gets screwed.. like crazy screwed...

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01-06-2010, 08:19 PM
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CloutierForVezina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumperkisser View Post
um.. i cant speak for nashville fans because i am NOT one.. but from an outsiders POV.. that is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY OFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF... IMO nashville gets screwed.. like crazy screwed...
Hamhuis is a UFA. If he's not signed by that point, getting a blue chip prospect in return for a UFA at the draft is an amazing return.

Not really sure how you think they're getting screwed.

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01-06-2010, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
Hamhuis is a UFA. If he's not signed by that point, getting a blue chip prospect in return for a UFA at the draft is an amazing return.

Not really sure how you think they're getting screwed.
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01-06-2010, 08:27 PM
  #6
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Done from Nashville's POV.

I don't think we can afford Hamhuis next year, and I have no idea what our plan for goaltending is for the future. But a 3rd round pick for a solid goaltending prospect is hard to turn down.

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01-06-2010, 08:29 PM
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JohnHodgson
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If Nashville lets us talk with Hamhuis and if there at least a fair chance he'll sign with us I would consider it.

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01-06-2010, 08:30 PM
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It would really depend on two things; how much Nashville likes their current goaltender situation and if Gillis believes he can re-sign Hamhuis.

I for one really like Hamhuis and would love to add him to the team for longer than a rental period but I am not confident the Canucks would be able to afford him on his next contract. It would probably mean Mitchell would be gone, a player who IMO the Canucks cannot afford lose. If re-signing him isn't an option then using a blue chipper like Schneider to go after a higher profile rental would be a better idea.

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01-06-2010, 08:34 PM
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chopkins
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I've never understood the point of trading away assets, especially blue-chip prospects, for a player's rights.

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01-06-2010, 08:35 PM
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considering he's unlikely to sign with Nashville anyways, given the depth they have coming up on defense, why not just wait until July 1st to make him an offer?

considering the number of decent dmen available in FA, it makes no sense to give up a solid prospect like Schneider to get his rights (and a 3rd round pick)... very few players have their rights traded prior to FA and they are nearly always top end players or most coveted UFAs... Hamhuis hits the UFA market the same time that Kubina, Gonchar, Martin, Mitchell, Volchenkov, Zidlicky, Morris, Lydman, Johansson, etc. I don't see him having any value as a UFA rights prior to July 1st.

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01-06-2010, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnHodgson View Post
If Nashville lets us talk with Hamhuis and if there at least a fair chance he'll sign with us I would consider it.
I sure would. He is worth the risk, and it will be pretty hard to get him once he hits the UFA market.

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01-06-2010, 08:43 PM
  #12
Moore Money
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
considering he's unlikely to sign with Nashville anyways, given the depth they have coming up on defense, why not just wait until July 1st to make him an offer?

considering the number of decent dmen available in FA, it makes no sense to give up a solid prospect like Schneider to get his rights (and a 3rd round pick)... very few players have their rights traded prior to FA and they are nearly always top end players or most coveted UFAs... Hamhuis hits the UFA market the same time that Kubina, Gonchar, Martin, Mitchell, Volchenkov, Zidlicky, Morris, Lydman, Johansson, etc. I don't see him having any value as a UFA rights prior to July 1st.
you don't think there will be a bidding war if Hamhuis hits the UFA market? I think he would be the most coveted Dman available and will likely get over paid by some idiot GM.

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01-06-2010, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumperkisser View Post
um.. i cant speak for nashville fans because i am NOT one.. but from an outsiders POV.. that is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY OFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF... IMO nashville gets screwed.. like crazy screwed...
You must be kidding. What amounts to the rights to negotiate a contract with a player that is going to hit UFA for a young goalie who is a former first round pick who's the reigning goalie of the year in the AHL?


Gillis wouldn't do it.

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01-06-2010, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by PoolChamp View Post
you don't think there will be a bidding war if Hamhuis hits the UFA market? I think he would be the most coveted Dman available and will likely get over paid by some idiot GM.
Volchenkov will receive Komisarek money if he hits the free market. Book it

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01-06-2010, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoolChamp View Post
you don't think there will be a bidding war if Hamhuis hits the UFA market? I think he would be the most coveted Dman available and will likely get over paid by some idiot GM.
how much less is his agent going to settle for so he can sign a contract 2 weeks before FA?

look at the previous UFA players that were dealt weeks or days before hitting UFA status... which one of them gave any sort of a discount at all?

JBo at $6.6mill... Malone at $4.5mill... Hartnell at $4.2mill... Timonen at $6.33mill... who else's rights were dealt prior to hitting UFA status who wasn't paid the same anyways?

Given the number of UFA dmen, if the Canucks need to add one, I'd rather see who's available for the best price - which means not acquiring a guy just before they hit UFA to give them a contract before seeing what else available.

I don't see the Canucks having the cap flexibility to add a $4+mill dman anyways in FA... I think their bigger priority on defense will be to retain Mitchell, who's more likely to sign at a discounted rate.

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01-06-2010, 08:57 PM
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R0bert0 Lu0ng0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
considering he's unlikely to sign with Nashville anyways, given the depth they have coming up on defense, why not just wait until July 1st to make him an offer?
Well, Schneider has a limited shelf life here in Vancouver. If we don't get something for him by the beginning of next season we are relying on either a Luongo injury or on the Canucks coaching staff to cut his starts in order to ensure that Schneider gets enough starts to remain RFA.

The idea is that we're converting Schneider into a draft pick (since we can get a similar performance out of a guy like Raycroft if it's just a handful of starts), and the rights to a player we might be able to sign for less than full market value - IMO, Jay Bouwmeester for example signed for at least half a million less than he could've had on the UFA market. (Was that entirely because it was Calgary? Who knows, but Hamhuis would be in a similar position here anyways.)

Perhaps the pick isn't high enough. A 2nd instead?

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01-06-2010, 09:09 PM
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Moore Money
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
how much less is his agent going to settle for so he can sign a contract 2 weeks before FA?

look at the previous UFA players that were dealt weeks or days before hitting UFA status... which one of them gave any sort of a discount at all?

JBo at $6.6mill... Malone at $4.5mill... Hartnell at $4.2mill... Timonen at $6.33mill... who else's rights were dealt prior to hitting UFA status who wasn't paid the same anyways?

Given the number of UFA dmen, if the Canucks need to add one, I'd rather see who's available for the best price - which means not acquiring a guy just before they hit UFA to give them a contract before seeing what else available.

I don't see the Canucks having the cap flexibility to add a $4+mill dman anyways in FA... I think their bigger priority on defense will be to retain Mitchell, who's more likely to sign at a discounted rate.
hard to argue with any of that. I just think he would be a great fit for our blueline and getting his rights would be our only chance because he'll get some ridiculous offers on the UFA market.

On the other hand, maybe he wants to be overpaid, and having his rights means **** all... Gillis seems to be good at brain washing players so you never know.

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Old
01-06-2010, 09:12 PM
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why would the nucks trade their top prospect--even if he is a goalie for a guy who will UFA 15 days after the trade--they wait 15 days and get him for free

makes no sense for nucks

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01-06-2010, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
why would the nucks trade their top prospect--even if he is a goalie for a guy who will UFA 15 days after the trade--they wait 15 days and get him for free

makes no sense for nucks
Schneider isn't our top prospect.

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01-06-2010, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
Schneider isn't our top prospect.
depends on who's list you are using]
some lists have him over hodgson and schrader

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01-06-2010, 09:34 PM
  #21
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depends on who's list you are using]
some lists have him over hodgson and schrader
I haven't seen him higher than Hodgson on anything resembling a recent list.

Schroeder is debatable.

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01-06-2010, 11:06 PM
  #22
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If there is one thing that Nashville does not need it is goaltending prospects. no deal

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01-06-2010, 11:33 PM
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I hate how Schneider will never have equal value, even if the Canucks showcase him at the NHL level. There's just no way he's getting a 1st in return.

I would love Hamhuis, but only if we move Bieksa.

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01-06-2010, 11:41 PM
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No thanks how about we just wait till July 1 to sign Hamhuis.

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Old
01-07-2010, 12:04 AM
  #25
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I hate how Schneider will never have equal value, even if the Canucks showcase him at the NHL level. There's just no way he's getting a 1st in return.

I would love Hamhuis, but only if we move Bieksa.
The only reason Schneider will never have equal value is because he's below Luongo. He's a very good goaltender who will only get better.

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