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An expensive year for FAs.

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Old
01-08-2010, 11:02 AM
  #1
BigFatCat999
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An expensive year for FAs.

Ok, let's look at the list of FAs coming up.

UFAs
Rinne
Ellis
Hamhuis
Bouillon
Tootoo
Belak
Guite

RFAs
Hornqvist
Goc
Santorelli
Thuresson
Franson
Klein
Laakso
Dekanich
Olvecky

We saw Rinne, Ellis, Hamhuis, and Tootoo coming but Bouillon, Hornqvist, Goc, Franson, and Klein as RFAs could be interesting

How much do you think the Preds will spend to get the following players?

Rinne
Hornqvist
Goc
Hamhuis
Ellis
Franson
Klein

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01-08-2010, 11:50 AM
  #2
PredsMan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post
Ok, let's look at the list of FAs coming up.

UFAs
Rinne
Ellis
Hamhuis
Bouillon
Tootoo
Belak
Guite

RFAs
Hornqvist
Goc
Santorelli
Thuresson
Franson
Klein
Laakso
Dekanich
Olvecky

We saw Rinne, Ellis, Hamhuis, and Tootoo coming but Bouillon, Hornqvist, Goc, Franson, and Klein as RFAs could be interesting

How much do you think the Preds will spend to get the following players?

Rinne
Hornqvist
Goc
Hamhuis
Ellis
Franson
Klein
Rinne-2.0-3.0, it will either be Rinne or Eliis, I expect a short term deal, he'll want more if he can put up numbers like last season.

Hornqvist-1.25-2.0, short term, to see if he repeats his success

Goc-1.0-1.25, if more than that, he walks.

Hamhuis-I doubt he'll be back, considering our depth at D, but at 2.5 to 3.5 do you keep him?

Ellis-will likely be looking for a starters spot, but if he'll stay for 1-1.5, do you keep him?

Franson-.75-1.25, not quite ready for prime time.

Klein-same as Franson, maybe a bit higher...

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01-08-2010, 02:54 PM
  #3
worstfaceoffmanever
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UFA - Length, Annual Salary
Rinne - 2 years, $2M - Has shown the ability to take over a game, but hasn't shown the ability to do it consistently.
Ellis - 1 year, $2.25M - A slight raise since his play hasn't dropped off, but he, too, has been very inconsistent. I think he could be on the way out.
Hamhuis - 2 years, $2.75M - That's the most I would offer him with the season he has had. He's too inconsistent to justify much more.
Bouillon - 1 year, $800k - I think he's gone. Even though he has played well, this was a one-year gig from the outset.
Tootoo - 3 years, $1.25M - Played well this year, deserving of a raise, but hasn't shown the ability to contribute on a consistent basis.
Belak - 1 year, $600k - I think he's gone. Served his purpose last year, but has done nothing to warrant staying around. Seems like a really cool guy, though.
Guite - 2 years, $650k - I like what I saw last night. If he can bring that on a nightly basis, I would love to have him around for another couple of years as an energy/reserve forward.

RFAs
Hornqvist - 3 years, $2M - He has definitely earned a big raise percentage-wise (which he gets at 323%), but Poile has to be cautious about overpaying for potential here: even the $2M I would offer is a bit risky. The length gives us one more go at restricted free agency with him, allowing us to sign him to one of those big core player contracts if he continues to produce.
Goc - 1 year, $750k - He has had a great season so far, but he has to show it wasn't a fluke.
Santorelli - 2 years, $622k, Two-Way - Has no leverage.
Thuresson - 2 years, $600k, Two-Way (first year only) - Has shown promise. Likely won't make it past our third line, but I think he has proven himself worthy of hanging on to.
Franson - 2 years, $800k - Has shown the ability to produce at this level. He'll have to round out his game on the fly, because we need him on the power play.
Klein - 2 year, $715k - This will get him to free agency and likely out of the organization.
Laakso - 1 year, $771k, Two-Way - I think he has a shot at the NHL, but he may just want to head back to Europe this summer instead of giving it one more shot. I can't say I would blame him.
Dekanich - 1 year, $572k, Two-Way - If he continues to play poorly, I wouldn't even tender him and try to lure Engren over here.
Olvecky - 1 year, $550k, Two-Way - He's a decent depth player, so I wouldn't mind keeping him around.

As for our other RFAs:
Dietrich - 1 year, $600k, Two-Way - Has really come along this season. Not sure he has the wheels for this level or how committed he is to playing in the NHL, but I'd gladly go on a year-to-year basis with him for the next couple of seasons to see how he develops.
Grant - No offer - I'm not sure we really need a bodyguard for our prospects, and if we do, we can grab some schmuck out of the WHL that won't expect nearly as much playing time.
Jessiman - No offer - He's terrible. Too slow, limited puck skills, and not really much of a fighter. Give his spot to Ryan Thang.
Maki - 1 year, $525k, Two-Way - There's something about Maki that I like. I can't really put my finger on it, but I'd like to see him get another shot with the Admirals to see if he can put up the numbers he did down the stretch late last season.

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01-09-2010, 11:31 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worstfaceoffmanever View Post
UFA - Length, Annual Salary
Rinne - 2 years, $2M - Has shown the ability to take over a game, but hasn't shown the ability to do it consistently.

Agree, his stats right now are working against him. Statistically, he's a midlevel Goaltender. Potiential is nice but production is better.

Ellis - 1 year, $2.25M - A slight raise since his play hasn't dropped off, but he, too, has been very inconsistent. I think he could be on the way out.

He's on his way out with the possiblity of goaltending pipeline being the reason why. If Dekanich or Pickard or Smith catch on fire I could see Nashville sign one of either Ellis or Rinne and open the backup spot for one of the prospects. Rinne is 27 and Ellis is 29 and Ellis' stats have been a slight bit better. 2.25 is too much for him but he will get that for experience.

Hamhuis - 2 years, $2.75M - That's the most I would offer him with the season he has had. He's too inconsistent to justify much more.

If I was management I'd be avoiding statistics to prove why Hamhuis deserves less. Offensive numbers are up and his giveaways and takeaways are on pace to his numbers last year. Shear fact of the matter is that Hamhuis has been Hamhuis it's just that the talent surrounding him has gotten better. I can't find one statistical number where Hamhuis has been failing.

Bouillon - 1 year, $800k - I think he's gone. Even though he has played well, this was a one-year gig from the outset.

At that price I would re-sign him. I honestly was expecting to pay more for him. With a depth chart of Weber-Suter, Klein-Franson, and Sulzer. Might be nice to sign some cheap veteran defensive experience. At least to give more of a buffer for Blum, Josi, Laakso, ETC.


Tootoo - 3 years, $1.25M - Played well this year, deserving of a raise, but hasn't shown the ability to contribute on a consistent basis.

I don't see him coming back. If you look at the forward depth chart you have the following:

Sully-Arnott-Dumont
Erat-Legwand-Ward
Hornqvist-Goc (IF re-signed)-Jones
-Smithson-O'Reilly

That leaves two forward spots for cheaper prospects. Thuresson and Spaling I believe provide just as much as Tootoo and would cost less than 1.25 million. If anything, if this team wasn't in a playoff fight I'd be trying to trade Tootoo for all he's worth.


Belak - 1 year, $600k - I think he's gone. Served his purpose last year, but has done nothing to warrant staying around. Seems like a really cool guy, though.

Ditto

Guite - 2 years, $650k - I like what I saw last night. If he can bring that on a nightly basis, I would love to have him around for another couple of years as an energy/reserve forward.

Give him a couple more games and we shall see. He might be one of the players who pushes Tootoo out the door.


RFAs
Hornqvist - 3 years, $2M - He has definitely earned a big raise percentage-wise (which he gets at 323%), but Poile has to be cautious about overpaying for potential here: even the $2M I would offer is a bit risky. The length gives us one more go at restricted free agency with him, allowing us to sign him to one of those big core player contracts if he continues to produce.

The question becomes how much RFA compensation would you take to give him up? At 2M, that's a 2nd rounder. for the dead last pick int he 2005 draft, that's phenominal return. BUT if I'm Nashville you have a once in a generation opportunity to keep a cheap 20 goal scorer and you hold on to him as much as you can. I like the idea of signing him for 3 years and waiting for the NEXT round of RFA status. Imagine if the Preds signed him and he continues on his pace AND he becomes an RFA. Sully gone, Arnott gone, Dumont gone. Hornqvist could either be the next option for the first line OR you get a metric ****ton of picks for him. It's a win win for Nashville.

Goc - 1 year, $750k - He has had a great season so far, but he has to show it wasn't a fluke.

Agreed, he can be a cheap 3rd line center and if he doesn't live up to expectations you can offer the job to Wilson/Spaling/Smithson/O'Reilly

Santorelli - 2 years, $622k, Two-Way - Has no leverage.

Agreed

Thuresson - 2 years, $600k, Two-Way (first year only) - Has shown promise. Likely won't make it past our third line, but I think he has proven himself worthy of hanging on to.

Which is enough to push Tootoo out the door

Franson - 2 years, $800k - Has shown the ability to produce at this level. He'll have to round out his game on the fly, because we need him on the power play.

And with Ryan Ellis looming it could be interesting.

Klein - 2 year, $715k - This will get him to free agency and likely out of the organization.

Klein has been a disapointment for the Preds and his development curve is very low. It might just be time for him to be shipped out the door in a trade.

Laakso - 1 year, $771k, Two-Way - I think he has a shot at the NHL, but he may just want to head back to Europe this summer instead of giving it one more shot. I can't say I would blame him.

I want to see Laakso stay for the Preds just to have another option on the big club. The cash of Europe is alluring.

Dekanich - 1 year, $572k, Two-Way - If he continues to play poorly, I wouldn't even tender him and try to lure Engren over here.

Sadly, agree. or Lindback?

Olvecky - 1 year, $550k, Two-Way - He's a decent depth player, so I wouldn't mind keeping him around.

Agree


As for our other RFAs:
Dietrich - 1 year, $600k, Two-Way - Has really come along this season. Not sure he has the wheels for this level or how committed he is to playing in the NHL, but I'd gladly go on a year-to-year basis with him for the next couple of seasons to see how he develops.

See Laakso

Grant - No offer - I'm not sure we really need a bodyguard for our prospects, and if we do, we can grab some schmuck out of the WHL that won't expect nearly as much playing time.

See Tootoo

Jessiman - No offer - He's terrible. Too slow, limited puck skills, and not really much of a fighter. Give his spot to Ryan Thang.

Someone's got to be the runt of the class....

Maki - 1 year, $525k, Two-Way - There's something about Maki that I like. I can't really put my finger on it, but I'd like to see him get another shot with the Admirals to see if he can put up the numbers he did down the stretch late last season.

Ditto
I would not be surprised to see the following on the roster next year:

Sully-Arnott-Dumont
Erat-Legwand-Ward
Hornqvist-Goc-Jones
Thuresson-Smithson-O'Reilly
Spaling

Weber-Suter
Klein-Franson
Sulzer-Blum/Laakso/Dietrich/Vet UFA

Rinne
Dekanich/Pickard/Smith/Vet UFA

The talent on the top 3 lines is pretty much set other than Goc. Wouldn't mind seeing Wilson in that position but with Hornqvist you would have a redundancy of a specific talent on one line. Sure, we are talking about a Trotz team so this will be mixed up. The two positions which are really up in the air are 3rd line center, 2defensemen and backup goal.

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01-09-2010, 12:32 PM
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token grinder
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why are you so quick to throw tootoo out? i am not his biggest fan by any means, but you can tell a difference when he is not out there. he creates room for guys. he brings an energy on the bench that no one does. he brings an energy to the crowd that no one does. heck, from a strictly marketing standpoint he is worth a million-2 million a year. whether you want to beleive it or not, the casual fan loves him and he is the face of the franchise. he isn't horrible defensivly, has hands of stone, but generally tries to pt the puck on net creating good chances. and if he is effective at taking the other team off their game because he might hit them into next week, that is something valuble. also, someone has to attempt to be the tough guy on this team. with your roster bfc, you have smithson and thuresson as tough guys. no thanks. you have to have a few guys on the roster that are tough as nails and gritty. trotz needs grit. btw, this is sirryan

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01-09-2010, 12:56 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by token grinder View Post
why are you so quick to throw tootoo out? i am not his biggest fan by any means, but you can tell a difference when he is not out there. he creates room for guys. he brings an energy on the bench that no one does. he brings an energy to the crowd that no one does. heck, from a strictly marketing standpoint he is worth a million-2 million a year. whether you want to beleive it or not, the casual fan loves him and he is the face of the franchise. he isn't horrible defensivly, has hands of stone, but generally tries to pt the puck on net creating good chances. and if he is effective at taking the other team off their game because he might hit them into next week, that is something valuble. also, someone has to attempt to be the tough guy on this team. with your roster bfc, you have smithson and thuresson as tough guys. no thanks. you have to have a few guys on the roster that are tough as nails and gritty. trotz needs grit. btw, this is sirryan
I agree. Tootoo will be back next year for sure. Unless, of course he just wants to try something else out in a different city, but we should definitely make a pitch at him.

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01-09-2010, 01:24 PM
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JohniusMaximus
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I'm with the above two posts. Especially what was said about the marketing standpoint.

I'm the most hardcore fan in my family, but we've got a bunch of casual observers around here and every single one of them is high on Tootoo. My dad alone mentions him several times when we're going to the games. I'm telling y'all, no matter what you think, #22 sells tickets out here in the non-message board, casual fan, hey what should we do tonight REAL world. Those of us on here may "know better" because we're more dedicated to the game as a whole, but as for the casual fan or family of fans who may be considering buying one more ticket on game night, I can tell you for sure Tootoo makes a difference.


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01-09-2010, 01:57 PM
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but it's not just about tickets with him. like i said, i am on the hate wagon for tootoo on ice-mostly because of the casual fan thinking he is a hockey god.(like pronger)

but i noticed it more this year when he was out there isn't a spark. we will show flashes, but i think his work ethic rubs off on the guys. and i think the guys like knowing someone has their back. and again, if toughness is a major issue (like the other night with sully and horns and noone sticking up for them) why would you get rid of one of the few guys that don't take any crap. i get letting belak go, because the goon-a-saurus is dying if not dead. tootoo is a pest that can put up 20 points or so and will stick up for himself and his teammates.

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01-09-2010, 02:27 PM
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I will say I don't know how the market will be for free agency so my numbers will probably be off

Rinne - 2-3m per year for 2 years, he has proven himself as a starting netminder but not an excellent one just yet.

Ellis - 2m for 1 year, unless he drastically outplays Rinne for the rest of the year it will be seen that Ellis is the back up and offer him that for another year or give him a shot on the open market.

Hamhuis - If he resigns for under 3 for several years ill be happy, but Im sure he can get more on the open market and he knows this so he will be gone

Bouillon - If Hamhuis is gone then resign Boullion for 1-1.5m for a year, that is a great raise and incentive to stay and doesnt break the bank for a veteran

Tootoo - This is a tough one, Tootoo knows he is a face of the franchise and he will get overpayed to stay here, how much is unknown probably around 1.5 million a year or so though.

Belak - With all the complaining about Belak, just remember Nick Tarnasky, we should give him another year for about 600k and let him be the 13th forward.

Guite - I honestly have no idea, he played well against Carolina, but terrible the first time he was up. If he continues his play then give him another 2way deal otherwise he can be easily replaced.

RFAs
Hornqvist - We will need to pay up for Hornqvist I believe he would be a primary target to get poached if we pinch pennies 2.5-3.5 a year for a couple years.

Goc - We can negotiate with Goc and hopefully he resigns for around 1m but I wouldnt mind giving him up to 1.5m

Santorelli - QO only he has shown nothing at the NHL level.

Thuresson - Give him a QO but Im sure he will negotiate some so there is a possibility of paying a bit more.

Franson - 1 year 750k, if he proves himself next year he gets paid.

Klein - Personally I would trade Klein but he can get 1m and I wouldnt be too angry.

Laakso - QO

Dekanich - QO

Olvecky - QO but look at depth he can play on the 4th line and I wouldnt be upset with a 2 year deal with the first year a 2way and the second a 1way contract.

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01-09-2010, 04:08 PM
  #10
worstfaceoffmanever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post
I would not be surprised to see the following on the roster next year:

Sully-Arnott-Dumont
Erat-Legwand-Ward
Hornqvist-Goc-Jones
Thuresson-Smithson-O'Reilly
Spaling

Weber-Suter
Klein-Franson
Sulzer-Blum/Laakso/Dietrich/Vet UFA

Rinne
Dekanich/Pickard/Smith/Vet UFA

The talent on the top 3 lines is pretty much set other than Goc. Wouldn't mind seeing Wilson in that position but with Hornqvist you would have a redundancy of a specific talent on one line. Sure, we are talking about a Trotz team so this will be mixed up. The two positions which are really up in the air are 3rd line center, 2defensemen and backup goal.
First of all, I disagree wholeheartedly on Tootoo. Watching this team with and without Jordin in the lineup, it's clear that he is the spark plug that this team needs up front. He would be tougher to replace than, say, Grant or Belak, because his reputation allows him to do what he does: get under the skin of the opposition and break their focus.

I also disagree on your lineup. The era of the SAD line has come and gone, and they need to be at least partially split up.

I think this lineup is the best choice to start next season with:

Sullivan-Arnott-Hörnqvist
Erat-Legwand-Dumont
Jones-Goc-Ward
Spaling-Smithson-Tootoo
O'Reilly, Guite

Weber-Suter
Hamhuis/Free Agent-Sulzer
Franson-Free Agent
Klein

Rinne
Free Agent

With an AHL side constructed like this:

Olvecky-Mi. Santorelli-Thuresson
Mueller?-Wilson-Ma. Santorelli
Thang-Geoffrion-Maki
McKenzie-???-Flynn

Blum-Josi
Laakso-Dietrich
Yonkman-Matheson
Ford

Pickard
Smith/Engren

If we were to add another forward (not likely considering this year's less than stellar free agent crop up front), we could send Spaling back down, bump Jones to the fourth line, and have ourselves one hell of a hockey team, plus a solid farm team to pull from as injuries start to mount.

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01-09-2010, 08:20 PM
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smitty10
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Does Sulzer have another year on his contract after this one?

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01-10-2010, 09:37 AM
  #12
worstfaceoffmanever
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Does Sulzer have another year on his contract after this one?
Yes. One more year and then he's an unrestricted free agent.

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01-10-2010, 10:39 AM
  #13
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If Tootoo can come cheap with the Preds I'd agree to bring him back. Now that I hear from you guys it sounds like the Preds were missing Tootoo when I watched their lackluster play against Anaheim. Statistcally, Tootoo is a mess, but if he adds an intangible to spark the team fine. That's the problem judging statistically vs. emperically. As for breaking up the SAD line, I'm in full agreement BUT will Sully-Arnott-Dumont accept that? Both Dumont and Sully have been disappointing.

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01-14-2010, 02:18 PM
  #14
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Tootoo will be back, thats just a given. Would be a PR disaster to let him go and he wont cost that much. I expect a 3 year 4 million dollar deal or something similar.

Rinne is the big question mark. If he gets hot and most especially if he backstops us to a playoff series win, hes going to be looking for 3 mil a year minimum, probably for 3 years.

However, if we continue the season with he and Eliis as 1a and 1b and he has a lackluster playoff performance the I can see a 2 year, 5 million dollar type deal.

Not sure what to think about ellis. obviously if he's still 1b it'll take 2 mil to resign him.

The deciding factor is obviosuly going to be how hungry other teams are for new goalies. You'd think Ellis would take a job where he would be the intended starter if one was available

hamhuis is probably gone. Cant see how poile can afford more than about his current 2.5 and you have to think hammer expects to be worth 3+ on the open market.

Buillon would certainly be nice to have for 750k or so... if he'll take it.


belak...no offer or league minimum. I prefer we go goonless.

Hornqvist and Goc are the flies in poiles salary ointment. i am sure he will keep them but you know its going to cost more than he planned. I expect 3 mil for Horn and 1.5 for Goc(who is basically having a joel Ward type year so will get a Ward type deal).


i'll do the rest later...

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01-15-2010, 01:20 AM
  #15
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Depends on the last 40 games, and depends if the cap goes down.

I guess Poile could sign someone to mid-season extension, but he's not proactive like that. Except for that one time, with Legwand, and he overpaid by $1.5-2m a year.

Would love to see a 5 year, 15million extension for Horny.

Should have traded Hamhuis in the offseason and gotten a mediocre vet (Skrastins, McKee, etc). Now we'll lose him for nothing.

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01-15-2010, 12:51 PM
  #16
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UFAs
Rinne - 4 years, 2.25M a year

Ellis- Let him explore his options. I love Danny Ellis and I hope he can be a starter one day on an Eastern Conference team. I would love to have him on our team again, but I am not sure if that is what is best for us or for Danny.

Hamhuis- Trade him. For sure.

Bouillon- 800K one year deal. I think he has been a great addition to the team, I hope he takes hamhuis spot. Just a solid player.

Tootoo- 1.25M 3 year deal Mr. Sparkplug. We need him. Enough said.
Belak- 600K two year deal
Guite- No offer.

RFAs
Hornqvist- 3 year 2M.
Goc- 2 year 1M
Santorelli 2 year $650
Thuresson 2 year $650
Franson- 3 year $900
Klein- HA

I hope we can add a top forward between now and next year. We REALLY need another 20/25 goal getter. I am not asking for Kovi, but another solid player would really help.

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01-15-2010, 04:24 PM
  #17
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I think Hornqvist at 2m/yr is pretty optimistic.

He could easily score more goals than any other Predator draft pick. How is it justified for him to get less than half of what Legwand and Erat make?

He's still pretty young, but not real young.

I think we have to ship off one of our 4.0m+ guys (Legwand, Erat, Dumont, Sullivan). Might to be easily because of NTC clauses, but it's not impossible.

And we do need to try to convince Radulov to come back, or come back and be traded.

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