Seto and Pavs and Clowe have not done much the last several games - i think their was a graphic during the Yotes game tonight (1/12) that stated they had 4 points and were minus a lot over the last several games.
I propose making a change, Put Seto with Joe and Heater and move Patty with Pavs and Clowe. Seto has done well with Joe in the past, as has everyone else. He'll get some points, re-establish momentum, confidence, etc. Patty is also like Joe in that he'll make those around him better - i think he can help Pavs and Clowe get it going again.
I don't mind one line doing all the scoring once in a while - this won't work during the playoffs - lets get them going now before the hole gets deeper. Best to have all lines scoring, confident, etc. come April...
As of this afternoon, 38.19% of the Sharks goalscoring out-put can be attributed to just Heatley & Marleau. With tonight's game now in the books, that % is obviously higher...
As of this afternoon, 38.19% of the Sharks goalscoring out-put can be attributed to just Heatley & Marleau. With tonight's game now in the books, that % is obviously higher...
I think you did your math wrong. As of this minute, they have 38% clean.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winky
Well, and to add, if you feel line changes do need to be made, at what point in the season should they be made (for chemistry)?
NOW! Let them develop the chemistry til the Olympics and then go back to the basics. And if the team is cold, go back to the alternate combos.
I think McCarthy is getting his 1 week cup-o-coffee in the NHL as a reward for some good AHL play. This gives players a chance to see what it's like, see the difference, learn expectations, etc. I smell a re-assignment coming very soon for him.
I'm glad to see they let Demers watch from the press box tonight instead of sending him to Stockton for more skating work - young players can learn allot from watching details in this way.
Well, and to add, if you feel line changes do need to be made, at what point in the season should they be made (for chemistry)?
So far this season it looks like we've been working on who can make the team in the bottom 6 and the #6 D position - the w-shuttle has been keeping busy for sure. This means, who is ready for NHL pressure, what can they do (score, check, grit, fight, etc.), can they sustain over many games and in pressure situations, etc.
After the olymics i'd start looking at chemistry lines for the playoffs as by that time we'll be past the deadline, will have determined who can add what value to the team and will be done auditioning for these rspeciive roster positions. It would be nice to develop lines and have momentum going into the playoffs.
Go with what worked last year to get Setoguchi going.
Marleau-Thornton-Setoguchi
Heatley-Pavelski-Clowe
To me, it seems the guy that needs to get going the most is Setoguchi. It's been nine games since he's contributed a goal. He's a sniper and that's what he does best. Getting him going is a requirement. Clowe and Pavelski are no doubt struggling but they seem to still be in the game and it doesn't look anything more than just a slump. I think Seto's struggles are more than a simple slump. It's a mental game right now and he needs to get off the schneid badly because his confidence doesn't seem to be there.
We have 3 skaters in Pavs, Clowe and Seto who are not scoring. The main reason I believe is Pav's has down low responsibility on the puck with this line, and consistently is losing the puck behind the net with bigger defensemen, thus limiting zone time. When little Little Joe played with Patty, Marleau was still first into the zone and took the down low responsibility. Pavelski has to get off the back wall for a primary responsibility to make him a better player and we need a bigger player for puck retrieval for the second line to work. So I would like to try:
Pavelski, Thornton, Heatley
Clowe, Marleau, Seto
Heatley has above average speed on the wing, and big and little Joe are slightly above average in skating but can make up for lesser speed with quick decision making with their passes up the ice breaking down the defense and carrying the puck into the zone more with good decisions. Joe and Heatley can go into the corners on dumps. Pavs will look more like himself taking the F2 role and high support on entry. Pavs will go to the net and shoots as well as Marleau and is happy being in the paint, so nothing is lost there. Heater will have two guys setting him up and you lose nothing on faceoffs with Pavs in reserve of Jumbo.
On the second line, you have a changeup that teams have to respect with Marleau and Seto who have played well together in the past - bringing scary speed. Marleau has always had an interesting chemistry when playing with a fast player. Seto and Marleau can score with their shot being set up from Pavs, or straight up the ice on the rush. Clowe can take the paint after the entry and all three are good at puck retrieval, and can get a cycle going to draw penalties. Again, nothing is lost on faceoffs with Clowe in reserve of Marleau as primary faceoff man.
There is only one puck and Marleau and Heater can't both score the same goal like they tried on Marleau's rebound goal in LA ... both on the same spot. We can't be a one dimensional team and let a team like the Ducks last year with no depth, checkmate the team by playing their top line on ours. We've got to get a 1A and 1B line combination going soon or the P/O's will be short again.
I thought Setoguchi and Mitchell worked quite well the couple of games right after Seto returned from injury. They seemed to have a number of good shifts per game in the offensive zone with McLaren doing his best to keep up. This could work quite well:
I think everyone is over-reacting a bit here. Why not do some double-shifting magic with Marleau and Heatley replacing Clowe and Seto for a couple of shifts on Pavs line and mving Seto and Clow up to JT's line for a few shifts. I don't think wholesale changes are necessary.
I thought Setoguchi and Mitchell worked quite well the couple of games right after Seto returned from injury. They seemed to have a number of good shifts per game in the offensive zone with McLaren doing his best to keep up. This could work quite well:
Definitely agree with keeping the first line intact. Leverage your strengths, patch weaknesses where we can.
I think missing Malhorta has a bigger impact them his stats would indicate. I agree with the Seto Mitch combo. I guess being friends helps chemistry. 2nd line has been streaky all season.
I thought Setoguchi and Mitchell worked quite well the couple of games right after Seto returned from injury. They seemed to have a number of good shifts per game in the offensive zone with McLaren doing his best to keep up. This could work quite well:
When we get to the end of the year, some of the guys that are in the minors will be options again, Ferriero, Couture, McGinn, McCarthy and maybe Vesce and McLaren. As much as we all like Mitchell, he needs to get his game going. He is a step slow and is scoring worse than Goc was. He is on pace for 4 points this year. That's not who I want in the centre of the 3rd line. For the playoffs, I might want to see a bottom 6 of:
McGinn-Malhotra-Ortmeyer
McCarthy-Nichol-Mitchell
Third line should be able to chip in dirty goals and has had chemistry. Malhotra in the F/O is better than Mitchell, especially this year. 4th line presumes McCarthy finds a comfort zone. He looked more at home in his third game versus the Yotes. But that is a fast line and one that can play defense and agitate. Should be good if we are able to roll 4 lines. Personally, I am not a Staubitz fan and don't see either he or Shelley with a ton of ice time in the P/O's ... Shelley more than Staubitz just because he plays the LW.
I don't really care what Mitchell's stats show at the moment or what year end numbers can be extrapolated from them. What needs to happen is that he finds linemates that gel with him and provide a unit that can be effective. I saw this in the Mitchell - Setoguchi pairing. His line has had good shifts even now where they get deep into the offensive zone and start a cycle, that's a sign they can contribute offensively. Mitchell's been losing 1 on 1 battles quite alot, his leg strength doesn't seem to be all there on the board battles as he's knocked off his feet pretty easy. It'll take care of itself eventually and if there's some quality linemates for him, the points will come too.
Malhotra's been playing on the second line occasionally when injures have dictated the lineup and he hasn't looked all too out of sync there either. It also allows Pavs to cheat more on faceoffs, as there's a great second option on the line.
Staubitz isn't too bad a fourth liner, he brings good energy and seems to have good chemistry on the line with Shelley and Nichol. I do think, though, that Staubitz will be a part of trade deadline dealings as he's an easily marketable player who can kind of fit on any team, especially the ones out of playoff picture. Decent skater, scrappy. Montreal would no doubt dub him the next coming of jesus as he's not slow like Laraque and he actually plays a physical game. Halak, Ryder and a 2nd for Staubitz.
Seto and Marleau need to play together. Last year the duo was great together, and this year, in the games they have played together (NYR in particular) they were lethal
So, I agree that the 2nd line isnt up to par, but why mess with changing the first line???
The first line is holding up this team. Patty and Heatley are scoring machines. Sharks are in first place. Clowe has had a bad year, and so has Mitchell, and Seto. They just need to get out of their funk. Plus when Manny comes back it has to get better
seto is a head case right now. He is questioning everything he does and thats why hes having such a hard time. He needs to get back to basics.
Pavs is getting owned on the boards, he needs to start working at it or change his game. I wish clowe could be the first one in but hes to damn slow. When Manny comes back I might be inclined to let him center the second line, move pavs to wing. Either that or they need to find someone else to play on that line who can go into the boards first. I wish Ginny was given a shot on the second line while he was here, something like
Ginny Pavs Clowe might actually work. Gins is ok on the boards, is fast enough to beat both Clowe and Pavs into the zone. The issue is, can he start scoring? Hell I might even run
I think we need McGinn in the lineup full-time. He's earned a roster spot. His hustle, speed, and great shot are exactly what we need on a game-to-game basis. I know we want to get looks at different guys, but I do not think that McGinn should have to pay the price for that.
I also don't think that Seto should get to play with Thornton on the top line. That should have to be earned.
Although, the 2nd line was actually pretty good last night. They got a several quality chances and were definitely hustling, it just didn't go in for them. If they keep doing what they did last night, they'll be just fine.
If the second line can't get out of their funk switch Malhotra and Seto for a few shifts and see how that works. Maybe even switch Pavs and Malhotra and run...
As of this afternoon, 38.19% of the Sharks goalscoring out-put can be attributed to just Heatley & Marleau. With tonight's game now in the books, that % is obviously higher...
I totally agree with that article, I've had the same thoughts as well. How about the fact that no dman other than Dan Boyle has any points in the last 4 games? It seems that those left off of Team Canada aren't producing.
As an aside, the upshot of Seto (and Pavs, to an extent, too) not producing is they lose leverage in their renegotiations. Some before his long cold spell (pre-injury) were comp-ing him against Kessel. I don't think that's the case anymore.
Pavs is still more effective than Seto but as many have pointed out, he's not handling the the back boards well.
In any case, that's for next season. I'd rather see Marleau and Seto switched.
Heater - Joe - Seto
Marleau - Pavs - Clowe
Worked decently before Seto got injured. Do it once Patty hits 40 goals ;-)
