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We could be in trouble with all of our RFA's next season

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Old
01-15-2010, 08:35 AM
  #26
jumptheshark
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am I the only one who loves the fact that most people are basing the contract ideas based upon just this year and not the previous two?

sorry ladies--you will to also lookat the previous two years for both Gagner and cogs not just this year

neither agents nor teams just talk about one season--they look at the entire length of the previous contract and not just the last

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01-15-2010, 08:39 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Real_Estate-Agent View Post
Gagner is a RFA - he has 9 goals - the season is 1/2 over..... He gets $2 million maximum... With Eberle & Omark in the system, Gagner must earn a $3 million contract...

Cogliano is a RFA - he has 6 goals.... How is that worth $2 million per season..........
Bingo. I hope they give these guys what they deserve and not overpay them. I'm scared when it comes to this organization and contracts. Cogs and Gags don't deserve good money yet. Haven't proven anything.

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01-15-2010, 08:52 AM
  #28
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Bingo. I hope they give these guys what they deserve and not overpay them. I'm scared when it comes to this organization and contracts. Cogs and Gags don't deserve good money yet. Haven't proven anything.
Agreed. I'd also like to see them in a few playoff games before we see any 5+ year contracts being handed out. 2-3 years max.

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01-15-2010, 08:52 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by BOUNCE View Post
If anyone thinks that Gagner or Cogliano deserve 2million+ I think your out of your mind. Gagner and Cogliano(if not shipped out) will sign anywhere from 1-1.5 million max on 1 or 2 year deals IMO
I agree, the only way either of them gets over 2 million per is if they sign longterm, 4 years plus. I don't think either player wants this current season to dictate what they will be paid for the next 4 or 5 years. So, I see them signing one year deals for modest raises.

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01-15-2010, 08:56 AM
  #30
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Didn't read through the thread, but i watched the segment last night. I didn't see anything that i haven't read on this board already, and i don't think we'll be fluffing any UFA's next year.

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01-15-2010, 08:56 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
am I the only one who loves the fact that most people are basing the contract ideas based upon just this year and not the previous two?

sorry ladies--you will to also lookat the previous two years for both Gagner and cogs not just this year

neither agents nor teams just talk about one season--they look at the entire length of the previous contract and not just the last
you're right in the sense that Cogs isn't going to sign long term for low money, just because he's had a poor season. They are going to want to attempt to prove themselves and earn bigger money/contracts after a good season. Either way, yes they had a couple of solid seasons the last 2 years, but they weren't that huge of seasons that would warrant a big money contract regardless of this season. They will more than likely sign 1 or 2 year deals.

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01-15-2010, 08:59 AM
  #32
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If the oilers have to move good players or not resign decent players because all our cap $ are tied up in garbage players it will be one more nail in the coffin of this regime. The unfortunate part is that these guys will NEVER admit they were wrong and will never take a tough step like minoring a high contract or looking at a buy out.

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01-15-2010, 09:15 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinCider View Post
you're right in the sense that Cogs isn't going to sign long term for low money, just because he's had a poor season. They are going to want to attempt to prove themselves and earn bigger money/contracts after a good season. Either way, yes they had a couple of solid seasons the last 2 years, but they weren't that huge of seasons that would warrant a big money contract regardless of this season. They will more than likely sign 1 or 2 year deals.
both Cogs and Gagner will be looking at about 2million a year--not big money contracts--but that is money that has to come from somewhere

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01-15-2010, 09:18 AM
  #34
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Can some one fill me in on exactly what it would cost us to buy out Horcoff's contract. When you buy out the contract is it for half the price and double the term? If that is the case I would just bite the bullet and continue with him on the roster.

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01-15-2010, 09:21 AM
  #35
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Great comparable from Mr Bugg and I think that seems pretty accurate though I'd be pretty shocked to see Brule get 2.5. As for Cogliano, I think the Oilers will move him but I also think that's a massive mistake if they get the return we expect. Sure he's been struggling offensively but what are Quinn/Renney/Tambo expecting when they play him on the fourth line with Moreau and Stortini for 90% of the season with limited to zero PP time. The most success he's ever had at this level came in about a 30 game span when he played the wing on the second line. I can't for the life of me figure out why he hasn't been given a shot there again but rather got a demotion. Play him on a line with guys with offensive flair and some size and you have a guy who IMO will consistently pot 25-30 goals starting very soon. We need to at least give him a shot before we move him for spare parts like that Lee, O'Brien deal.

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01-15-2010, 09:31 AM
  #36
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With the talks that Moreau and Staios have been told they will be dealt and the talks of Souray I really don't know if there is much to worry about. Stone, JFJ and Potulny could all be replaced with UFA's that make 600-800k, so I wouldn't go and start paying these guys too much. Potulny is about the only one showing that he has any kind of offensive ability the other two being a dime a dozen players and while I hate to lose both we need to upgrade one of them.

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01-15-2010, 09:48 AM
  #37
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I see Brule and Gagner being offered 3 year deals that resemble what O'Sullivan got from L.A., that being a 2.833M cap hit.

If they don't take multi-year deals I think they would be around 2M for one year.

Cogliano will likely get a one-year deal for around 1.75M.

Jacques gets 650K and a 1-2 year deal.

Potunly gets 800K and a 2 year deal.

Stone gets league minimum 500K and 1 year, if he even stays.

Chorney gets 1 year, 1 way QO.

No reason to lock any of these guys up long term when 3-5 years down the road the team needs to worry about Eberle, MPS and Hall/Seguin coming out of their entry level deals. Let's see what we have.

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01-15-2010, 09:56 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky4PM View Post
I see Brule and Gagner being offered 3 year deals that resemble what O'Sullivan got from L.A., that being a 2.833M cap hit.

If they don't take multi-year deals I think they would be around 2M for one year.

Cogliano will likely get a one-year deal for around 1.75M.

Jacques gets 650K and a 1-2 year deal.

Potunly gets 800K and a 2 year deal.

Stone gets league minimum 500K and 1 year, if he even stays.

Chorney gets 1 year, 1 way QO.

No reason to lock any of these guys up long term when 3-5 years down the road the team needs to worry about Eberle, MPS and Hall/Seguin coming out of their entry level deals. Let's see what we have.
I see Stone and Potulny as definite keepers for our 3rd/4th lines as they're both still fairly young and they're solid players.

There's no way in hell Gagner OR Brule should be getting 2.8/year. The only argument I could see for Gagner getting more than 2 is because of his 'potential'. I sincerely hope that isn't the case though.

I'd even keep Nilsson around for 1-1.5 for another 1-2 years and see if he can keep up his current pace.

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01-15-2010, 09:58 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky4PM View Post
I see Brule and Gagner being offered 3 year deals that resemble what O'Sullivan got from L.A., that being a 2.833M cap hit.

If they don't take multi-year deals I think they would be around 2M for one year.

Cogliano will likely get a one-year deal for around 1.75M.

Jacques gets 650K and a 1-2 year deal.

Potunly gets 800K and a 2 year deal.

Stone gets league minimum 500K and 1 year, if he even stays.

Chorney gets 1 year, 1 way QO.

No reason to lock any of these guys up long term when 3-5 years down the road the team needs to worry about Eberle, MPS and Hall/Seguin coming out of their entry level deals. Let's see what we have.
I don't see Brule getting much more then 2mil. At this point he only has this season to prove his worth, not sure that gets him close to 3mil. I do however agree on the rest.

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01-15-2010, 10:00 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Mentallydull View Post
I see Stone and Potulny as definite keepers for our 3rd/4th lines as they're both still fairly young and they're solid players.

There's no way in hell Gagner OR Brule should be getting 2.8/year. The only argument I could see for Gagner getting more than 2 is because of his 'potential'. I sincerely hope that isn't the case though.

I'd even keep Nilsson around for 1-1.5 for another 1-2 years and see if he can keep up his current pace.
Nilsson has a 2.5mil salary with 2mil cap hit for next year already.

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01-15-2010, 10:02 AM
  #41
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This organization has proved it gives out albatross contracts based on "potential". I hope they give the guys very short terms to prove themselves and the players will probably want that as well. I'd puke if they got over 2.5 million. Brule is my favourite out of all three. Gagner is only 20 as well. I think some people forget that sometimes.

Management has to be very careful as to who they ged rid of. When a team is down in the dumps like the Oilers are, sometimes you just want to get rid of everybody.

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01-15-2010, 10:02 AM
  #42
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I'd like to let Potulny and Pouliot to either walk or get a low pick for them. They are AHL players and we need to make room for Eberle and MPS over the next couple of years. We need to stop signing a plethora of 3rd and 4th liners. These guys are a dime a dozen, easily replaceable. The guys we would be holding out of these spots are not.

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01-15-2010, 10:04 AM
  #43
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Based on age and they type of seasons everyone is having, is there any reason to give the remaining RFA's (assuming atleast one or two will be traded) more than a one year contract this summer?

One of the reasons Edmonton is in the bind they are is because they have been handing out long term contracts like candy based on potential.

The only possible exception would be Grebeshkov and even in his case you have to think that he is in the mix of defencemen that will be shopped so it may be a non-issue.

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01-15-2010, 10:04 AM
  #44
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I would like to know where the oilers are going to get some of this money that people are tossing around.

I think one player that will be moved--one way or another--it Grebs

doing some math last night--if Souray, or Lubor or Gilbert are not moved(one of them)--I don't see the oilers being able to keep Grebs next season--if he is not traded--I say he ends up in the KHL next year

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01-15-2010, 10:11 AM
  #45
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I'm 50/50 on Grebs. Overall, I don't think I'd mind if he goes. He could improve greatly, but he's a turnover machine. This team really needs some solid stay at home dmen that are also tough. Overall Souray is our only "nasty" dman. Smid can be too. Staois is old and I know he's a warrior. Gilbert is basically a woman playing defence. Lubo is great, but small. I'd keep him if they can get some better dmen around him.

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01-15-2010, 10:11 AM
  #46
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Nothing would make me happier than moving Grebs and slotting in Chorney next year. I'm sick of living and dying by Grebs' mental mistakes.

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01-15-2010, 10:12 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
I would like to know where the oilers are going to get some of this money that people are tossing around.

I think one player that will be moved--one way or another--it Grebs

doing some math last night--if Souray, or Lubor or Gilbert are not moved(one of them)--I don't see the oilers being able to keep Grebs next season--if he is not traded--I say he ends up in the KHL next year
They have 12mil available to them next year. Gagner, Brule, Grebeshkov, Cogliano, Pouilot, Stortini, Stone, Jacques, Potulny, JDD, DD and Peckham are RFA's.

The last 8 will probably make around 5-5.5mil. Leaving you with 6.5mil to sign the main 4, which worse case scenarios is 2mil to short. Add to it that we are most likely moving someone this year that makes over 2mil and it looks pretty easy to sign all those guys. Move one of Moreau, Staios or Grebs and you have the money.

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01-15-2010, 10:15 AM
  #48
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Nilsson has a 2.5mil salary with 2mil cap hit for next year already.
Sorry, I wasn't clear, I was meaning after his contract is up.

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01-15-2010, 10:20 AM
  #49
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Sorry, I wasn't clear, I was meaning after his contract is up.
I'm not opposed to the idea, but that would really depend on what he does next year. That is if he isn't moved to make room for prospects.

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01-15-2010, 11:31 AM
  #50
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They have 12mil available to them next year. Gagner, Brule, Grebeshkov, Cogliano, Pouilot, Stortini, Stone, Jacques, Potulny, JDD, DD and Peckham are RFA's.

The last 8 will probably make around 5-5.5mil. Leaving you with 6.5mil to sign the main 4, which worse case scenarios is 2mil to short. Add to it that we are most likely moving someone this year that makes over 2mil and it looks pretty easy to sign all those guys. Move one of Moreau, Staios or Grebs and you have the money.

lets do the math

you need 20 players to play hockey

lw 9.2
1--Penner 4.25
2--POS 2.95
3--Moreau 2
4

c--7.5
1--Horcoff 5.5
2---Nilsson 2
3
4

rw--4.7
1--Hemsky 4
2-- Stortni .700
3
4

d --19mill
1--Lubor 5.6
2---souray 5.4
3---Gilbert 4
4--staois 2.7
5--- Smid 1.3
6

g(3.75)
1---Habby 3.75
2

so that is 44.15 willing missing a back up goalie, number 6 d, 2 centers and 2 rw and 1 lw and one extra guy to have around

cap is say 56 mill-so you have 11.85 to spend--IF YOU WANT TO SPEND RIGHT TOM THE CAP AND GIVE NO WIGGLE ROOM

UFAs
Pisani 2.5
comrie 1.25
Strudwick .700

Pisani and comrie are gone--the numbers game--lets resign Strudwick at.700--we are now down to 11.15 remaining for 6 players 2-c 2-rw 1-lw 1-d 1 back up goalie

lets address the back up goalie--How much is JDD going to get next year? his cap his is .625 this year--does he sign for that number again? if I am his agent I would try to 1.5--but I think the oilers and the agent will agree on 1million a year.

10.15 remaining till we cap out

Sam Gagner is getting .8 as a base and will get about 1.6 to 2 mill depending on the length of the contract--I am think 2mill a year

8.15 left now--needing 1-d, 1c, 2lw, 1rw

brule 1.5 would be my guess

7.35 till we cap out needing 1-d 1lw 1rw--lots and lots of room

remaining RFA
Cogliano
MAP
Stone
JFJ
Potulny
Grebs

who to keep who to dump

first guy on the list I keep is Potulny--He takes over the from Pisani and I say get .750 a year and takes the number 3rw role---6.6 left--

needing

1d, 1rw, 1lw, 1 c

insert rookie eberle at this point in time and his 1.187 rookie contract leaving 5.413 for 3 position.

who to keep who to toss--eberle takes Cogliano's position in the line up--for the last two spots up front we have JFJ, Stone and MAP.

Due to his size and his willingness to use it sometimes lets re-sign JFJ for lets say .8

4.6million for 2 spots lots of room right?

at the draft table we have traded Cogliano for a second and third rounder.

Stone and Map made a combined 1.3 for this season--but for this game we can only keep one--I pick stone at .750 for the year cap hit and this is when you yell at me and say that leaves 3.86 for Grebs who we can sign for say 3mill a year down from his 3.150 he got this year

so after GM Jumptheshark has dealt with the current roster

you are looking at

Penner
POS
Moreau
JFJ

Horcoff
Gagner
Brule
eberle

Hemsky
Stortini
Potulny
Stone

souray
Lubor
Gilbert
Smid
Staois
Grebs

JDD
Habby

so pretty much the same line up we had at the start of this season--just instead of the smurf named Cogliano we have a smurf named eberle. and we have 800k to spend--

obviously if i was the GM and gave you this line up as owners of the oilers(did I mention HFoil bought the oilers and named me GM)--as owners you would point out that this was the same line up we had at the start of this season when we knew we would be lucky to make the playoffs. You guys if the roster the once over and you tell me to give it another go.

first change i do is instead of signing grebs--I trade him for a pick and a prospect or he rejects my contract offer and signs in rooskie land khl.

Add either Pekham or Chorney to the line up.
Looking at the line up--i am unhappy with a few things--POS, Nilsson, Staois, Moreau-- I either trade Nilsson for a pick or outright to the minors and then resign Pisani for 1mill a year(down from the 2.5 he was getting and 1mill less then what Nilsson gets). moreau while a good soldier over the past ten years needs a change of address--at 2million he is not that bad and he gets moved for either a prospect or a pick.

I look at the UFA market and offer jordon tooto a 2million contract

I try to move POS--but only get offerd players with the same contracts in return
Staois is almost untradable till the next dead line 2.7 for a 37 year old d-man is a hard sell

while I have reduced the cap space problem by a couple of million--oilers are still not a playoff team and have some huge holes that can only be filled by spending money

that is why--I realize I need to move a player who is making 4mill_+ a year. horcoff is untradable. hemsky is the top guy and is cheap compared to the others.

That means I need to find a home for one of teh fallowing Penner, Souray, Lubor or Gilbert-- I can take 2 contracts that equal the one I am moving --all players are signed long term, 2 have no trade clauses--to address the problems and holes I have on my roster--one of those 4 has to be moved either for a 30goal man or to free up money to get one. Penner's number rely on playing with good players--when he is the goto guy he fails. Until as GM I address the problem of goal scoring my oiler team will not get near the playoffs and address the physical problem of grit and to address those needs--one of those four needs to go to free up money to get someone to solve the problem

Omark and MPS are not factors--tossing that many rookies into the oilers in one swoop is bad and would hurt them and Omark is a small 5-6 and the oilers do not need any more smurfs right now and MPS is signed till the end of next year is sweden and when he does come--lander is in his suitcase

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