HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Chris Drury

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-19-2010, 10:49 AM
  #51
King of cool
The winning hat
 
King of cool's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Under your skin
Country: France
Posts: 2,001
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by clmetsfan View Post
The thing that cracks me up the most on this board is a bunch of internet users who think that they know what kind of captain a player is. Chris Drury has earned the utmost respect from just about everyone he has ever played with, against, and under, and yet people around here who have quite literally zero first-hand knowledge of the guy's leadership and demeanor are convinced that he's a bad captain.

It just blows my mind that some people think that watching games on MSG is all you need to evaluate how well a guy performs his duties as captain.

Of course he's vastly overpaid and disappointing offensively. But that doesn't mean that he's a useless player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by clmetsfan View Post
Chimp, you need to calm down. No one has ever said that Drury is justifying his salary or that he is an elite player. All we're saying is that he is still a very useful player to this team. Obviously salary should be taken into account when evaluating a player, which is why Drury is a disappointment. But get a little perspective. Drury still helps the team win games; he just doesn't help as much as we'd all like him to. And to completely ignore his positive contributions is just as stupid as ignoring his salary (which no one is actually doing).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
A little tidbit for the folks who don't believe in the whole "No PP time" argument:

Drury is on pace for almost identical even strength point totals this season in comparison to last season. He had 34 ESP last season, and is on pace for about 30 this season.

Who needs a guy who's scored double digit PP goals every season since the lockout on their powerplay, right? Ours is doing great as-is.


Amen. I understand our cap situation, and the importance to make beneficial an investment (a player) in today's NHL. But seriously people should chill out a bit. That's just insane the deluge of blind hate thrown up on this board each time Drury's name is mentioned. Sickening. People reacts like a jack in a box when you open it or like a dog chewing his bone and barking each time someone approaches. Chill out people. ****ing chill out.

Drury isn't worth 7,5 millions dollars, we ALL agree on this. Just forget the salary 2 minutes, Drury is still a very good hockey player, a great leader, and certainly not a liability for this team on the ice. Just put this salary cap aside 2 minutes from time to time, sit back and enjoy the game.


Last edited by King of cool: 01-19-2010 at 11:21 AM.
King of cool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 10:56 AM
  #52
eco's bones
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Elmira NY
Country: United States
Posts: 11,578
vCash: 500
What's he like in the locker room? Who knows--I suppose we can take what some of his teammates say for granted but what are they suppose to say? It's almost unheard of for players to rag on their captain--anywhere or at any time. In any case his leadership on the ice seems to be lacking. How many clutch moments has he had this year? Apart from blocking shots--pretty much none. He's been mentioned once the whole season in the three stars of the game and that was for third star. It is contracts like his that makes the team mediocre. It's not his fault that Sather gave him the money but the crucial thing is he's not earning it. Blame it all on his pwp time--on not having wingers who will set him up like he's the next coming of Phil Esposito--when you have always to find an excuse for a player's lethargic performance it should tell you something. The best thing he or Redden could do for the team is to retire like Naslund did.

eco's bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 10:57 AM
  #53
94now
Registered User
 
94now's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Snow Belt, USA
Country: United Nations
Posts: 6,412
vCash: 500
Chris Drury is a second coming of Bobby Holik to the Rangers. Both have been excellent two-way forwards that due to huge contacts were forced to play over their heads.

94now is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:05 AM
  #54
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,336
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
Yes, we all knew Drury wasn't an elite player when he came here and never has been. But that's not exactly making anyone feel better. Or what, should it be ok to uphold the NYR traditions of being a retirement home? Perhaps MSG should start the "Bobby Holik" foundation. The winner is some mediocre NHL bum who wins a golden contract in New York. I would be furious if I paid season tickets to watch this team live. I'm starting to believe there is some kind of hidden agenda here, because a GM can't be this bad. Perhaps the overpriced players are giving part of their salaries back under the table to $ather, for the scam to be upholded?
Drury is not a mediocre bum. He is overpaid. The fact is he had average Drury years here the first two seasons. Overpaying a player will not change what that player is.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:14 AM
  #55
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Drury is not a mediocre bum. He is overpaid. The fact is he had average Drury years here the first two seasons. Overpaying a player will not change what that player is.
Hank wouldn't be nicked "The King" if he was paid $6.75 million to play as an occasional backup. I think he would have been beheaded by now if such was the case. If Hank was paid $800k to play as a backup, not a bad word would've been mentioned.

If you're an elite 3rd liner/ borderline 2nd liner being paid $7 million to play as an elite third liner (who tops basically every "most overrated/ overpriced player in the NHL" list), I think you have to live with words such as "mediocre bum" flying around. Fine, take the "bum" out of the equation. You still have "mediocre" left. Even Matt Cullen got scolded for being overpaid as a $2.75 million third line center when the cap was lower. I don't think that many people were happy with Bobby Holik during his contract in New York.

Players will always have their contribution compared to their salary. Especially in a salary cap world, because then it's imperative that you get a + balance if you want to have a good team.

Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:17 AM
  #56
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,336
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
Hank wouldn't be nicked "The King" if he was paid $6.75 million to play as an occasional backup. I think he would have been beheaded by now if such was the case. If Hank was paid $800k to play as a backup, not a bad word would've been mentioned.

If you're an elite 3rd liner/ borderline 2nd liner being paid $7 million to play as an elite third liner, I think you have to live with words such as "mediocre bum" flying around. Fine, take the "bum" out of the equation. You still have "mediocre" left.

Players will always have their contribution compared to their salary.
Is Hank so much better than he was a rookie to make up for the difference in pay? He was "The King" as a rookie. Shouldn't he be "Emperor" now?

You want to kill Drury, fine. But do it because of his play, not his contract. That blame goes on Sather.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:25 AM
  #57
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Is Hank so much better than he was a rookie to make up for the difference in pay? He was "The King" as a rookie. Shouldn't he be "Emperor" now?
I don't see what entry level contracts have to do with it, but fine, I see where you're trying to go. Yes, Drury was an UFA. UFAs get overpaid. That's not much of a comfort, when he still is a strong candidate for every "Most overpaid/ overrated player in the NHL" list.

Sure, Drury and many other are doing their best, that's fine and dandy. So should we just stop criticizing everyone in this franchise, from Dolan down to huggybear in the stands? Because if they're doing their best, well, ok, fine, run along then.

"Winning isn't everything." The peewee league is that way. Either we can be humane and forgive everyone for everything, or we can at least hope to win a Cup in the next hundred years or so.
Quote:
You want to kill Drury, fine. But do it because of his play, not his contract. That blame goes on Sather.
Fine, I can somewhat agree to this statement, but then again not. If you accept the money, then you take the responsibility that goes along with it. When Drury accepts $7 million a year, he should expect that alot of responsibility and performance is demanded from him. 1 goal per million is not good enough. Being so bad that you're not a regular player on the PP is not good enough. Being completely invisible, night after night, when the team is struggling, is not good enough. Occasionally putting in a goal when the score is already 5-2, is not good enough.

If part of Drury's millions are there, because of "intangibles" and "clutchness" and the "intangibles" and the "clutchness" are never there, I think it's pretty safe to say that you can blame Drury for lack of performance and not just his contract. Then again, the "clutchness" and "intangibles" were probably just a myth anyway, so sure, give me an axe and I'll take care of $ather.


Last edited by Chimp: 01-19-2010 at 11:31 AM.
Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:29 AM
  #58
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,336
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
I don't see what entry level contracts have to do with it, but fine, I see where you're trying to go. Yes, Drury was an UFA. UFAs get overpaid. That's not much of a comfort, when he still is a strong candidate for every "Most overpaid/ overrated player in the NHL" list.

Sure, Drury and many other are doing their best, that's fine and dandy. So should we just stop criticizing everyone in this franchise, from Dolan down to huggybear in the stands? Because if they're doing their best, well, ok, fine, run along then.

"Winning isn't everything." The peewee league is that way. Either we can be humane and forgive everyone for everything, or we can at least hope to win a Cup in the next hundred years or so.
What exactly are you killing Drury for, if not his salary? He's having a bad year and now he's a mediocre bum? He basically met his average numbers for the first two seasons here. He's now down because he's struggling and he's seeing last PP time. At least he's finding a way to help this team when he's not scoring.

A lot of guys numbers are down this season.

And please tell me where I said stop criticizing people. You're putting words in my mouth again Chimp come on, you're better than that.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:39 AM
  #59
Trxjw
Moderator
Bored.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Land of no calls..
Country: United States
Posts: 15,790
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
Oh boy, here we go...


His career in New York started when he got here. And it - and the team - has been tumbling downwards ever since. In Buffalo, he could be babysitted by a bunchload of other players, which fitted him perfectly. And then he could actually go to the net for his occasional opportunistic goal, which he hasn't been doing since 2007. Sure, it's $ather's fault for being an incompetent GM, but Captain Average should know there will be some sort of expectations based on performance, compared to the cheque you will be given. It doesn't work that way just in hockey you know. I can't blame him for accepting a dream contract (I mean seriously, he must've laughed for days when he got the offer), but I can blame him for being part of dragging this franchise down into true mediocrity.
His career has been tumbling downwards? He led the team in goals his first season here. He was 3rd in goals last season. How is that "tumbling" downwards?

I don't understand this at all. You're blaming him for not living up to your own expectations, but you also acknowledge that his production in Buffalo was a result of opportunity. Which is it?


Quote:
Oh, you mean when he was doing something resembling his job? If he wasn't one of the top scorers on one of the most offensively pathetic teams in the entire league, while being the best paid player... I mean, seriously? Isn't that what should be expected? Or what, we need to actually praise him for that? What is the minimum Captain America has to perform on the ice for some of you to be satisfied with him? That he remembers to take off the skate guards when he goes out there and remembers to take out the rookies for pizza?
Again, all you're able to come up with is: "I paid too much for this Big Mac, and now I'm bitter because it's not Filet Mignon." If you expected to throw money at a guy who averages 25 goals over his career and suddenly he'll turn into an elite offensive threat, that's your own stupidity.

Not a single person here has argued that Drury isn't overpaid. Not a single one. Yet, that's all some of you are able to cling to.

Quote:
Why do you think Torts is taking Drury off the PP? It's not to be mean to him, it's because he's been utterly ineffective. The moment he has gotten the puck, he has consistently shot it along the boards for the giveaway. If I go nuts because he continously just did that, I bet Torts got even more furious at him for that. He has zero PP goals, after spending 1 hour and 9 minutes on the ice during power plays so far this season. You think it's a coincidence? Poor Drury, being undeservedly bullied by all these cranky people and the coach. Don't listen to them Drury, it doesn't matter that you are one of the top paid players on the team (and the league), while getting pushed down to the 3rd line. We still like you for helping us fulfilling the dream of mediocrity.
You have to be on the PP on a regular basis in order to be taken off. His average PP TOI/G is down 2 minutes from last season. That's 2/3rds reduction in PP time. Putting Drury at the point on the PP is like asking Lundqvist to play stand-up style goaltending. You take away a players best asset and now you're surprised he's slumping? That's asinine.

Drury belongs in front of the net on the PP, not at the point.

Quote:
I guess it's just another coincidence that after Jagr left and Fumblez and Dreary came in, NYR has had a continously pathetic PP effectiveness and still would have, if Gaborik hadn't stepped aboard. You know, one of those players who actually give full value back for the cheque you give him.

Captain Average's PP effectiveness is within the boundaries of the laws of averages. If you put him on the ice during PPs for long enough (some hours), he will eventually score. But that doesn't mean that he's particulary good at it (which happens to be his trademark).
I don't know what to tell you, but the year Drury and Gomez came in, Jagr was still here and the PP was 22nd in the league. Drury had 17 PP goals his last year in Buffalo, but you're arguing that he actually came in and hurt our production? Yikes.

You're right. Coaches put him on the PP just because if he's out there long enough, he'll eventually score a goal. He's been consistently lucky over his entire career.

Quote:
That he is on his worthless even strength pace for even strength points is fine and dandy, if it wasn't for that Drury is completely useless at even strength. You hope his line doesn't allow any goals, so he can be paid $7 million to kill some penalties (Betts and Shoe did it equally as well for $700k) and if he's been a good boy, can give the puck away some more on the PP, until Torts gets sick of him again and drops him.
So removing the source of a guy's production is a slight against the player, not the circumstance? Wow.

The guy has 10 giveaways on the entire season. Are you seriously criticizing a player for dumping the puck into the zone? Give me a break.

Betts and Sjostrom contributed nothing offensively. You pay Drury more than those guys because he contributes on both ends of the rink. One half of a bad season doesn't somehow negate everything he's done in his career to this point.

Quote:
But exactly what kind of persons do you think Tom Renney was referring to when he said the team "lacked leadership" after he was unable to steer the sinking ship upright? Sure, I give Captain America the benefit of the doubt, but don't expect me to have any confidence in him either for carrying this team anywhere.
So Tom Renney criticized the leadership, but dozens of coaches and players have praised Drury for his leadership. Your current coach, who is so brilliant to see that Drury is worthless on the PP, allowed him to keep the C and has not removed it. It's easy to pick and choose your attack points, but get out of here with this nonsense.

Quote:
All you Captain Average fanboys out there. Answer me this: What is your justification for ignoring the salary of a player when evaluating his performance? I would love to have a job where I can be evaluated without talking about my salary. "Sure, I'm a janitor, but I'm a pretty damn good janitor. What is it our CEO makes a year again? As an elite janitor, I should be paid the same."
It's because we realize what type of player Drury has always been, and what he brings to the table. The guy averages 25 goals and 55 points a season; Paying a player like a superstar doesn't make him a superstar. Why waste your time expecting him to turn into one?

This whole "If I had a job.." analogy is bogus. I can sit at my desk and point out a dozen people that make significantly more money than I do, but are considerably less productive. Giving Drury that contract was the equivalent of giving Cheechoo a huge UFA deal based on his 50 goal season in San Jose and not looking at his production since then. It was a stupid, stupid move by Sather to agree to those terms, but I'm not going to **** all over a player because he's doing the same thing he always has.

Trxjw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:40 AM
  #60
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
What exactly are you killing Drury for, if not his salary? He's having a bad year and now he's a mediocre bum? He basically met his average numbers for the first two seasons here. He's now down because he's struggling and he's seeing last PP time. At least he's finding a way to help this team when he's not scoring.

A lot of guys numbers are down this season.

And please tell me where I said stop criticizing people. You're putting words in my mouth again Chimp come on, you're better than that.
Yeah, that was probably out of line. Sorry for that one. I was just going to the extreme a little bit when I on one hand basically refuse to not see the player and his responsiblity for his accepted contract, while you choose and some others choose to ignore the contract while watching the player.

Your second line got edited in seconds after I started my reply, added in my response for that one. Oh well, we're not getting any further here. I'm axing Drury, mostly because of his horrible contract and the impact it has on the team, you choose to only criticize him for what he does on the ice, based on his averages.

Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:41 AM
  #61
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,336
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
Yeah, that was probably out of line. Sorry for that one. I was just going to the extreme a little bit when I on one hand basically refuse to not see the player and his responsiblity for his accepted contract, while you choose and some others choose to ignore the contract while watching the player.

Your second line got edited in seconds after I started my reply, added in my response for that one. Oh well, we're not getting any further here. I'm axing Drury, mostly because of his horrible contract and the impact it has on the team, you choose to only criticize him for what he does on the ice, based on his averages.
I kill Sather for the contract.

I'll kill Drury for lack of effort which I don't see.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:54 AM
  #62
clmetsfan
Registered User
 
clmetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 3,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I kill Sather for the contract.

I'll kill Drury for lack of effort which I don't see.
Exactly. People are angry at Drury for failing to live up to his contract, which he obviously hasn't done. But anyone who says that he doesn't care or isn't trying hard enough is completely blind.

As for people who say that he shouldn't have signed the deal in the first place, seriously, get a freaking clue. What person on the planet would decline an insane offer and insist on being paid less money?

clmetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 11:59 AM
  #63
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
Singn' - I mostly agree with you here. Actually, I am thinking along the exact same lines as you: Sather entered into a bad contract and Drury is not an effortless bum.

What we all need to remember is that it's virtually impossible to not look at a player and compare his results to his pay (and others'), especially since there is a salary cap and it affects the way in which the team was constructed. Of course, that all goes back to Sather, but the player is the one who will bear the brunt of the attack.

For Drury, I personally think he's pretty much done what I thought he'd do given his surroundings. He was always a support player. Anything that was represented that contradicted that would simply be a false statement. He made headlines because of his big goals, wins, etc., but forget that maybe a guy like Sakic, or Forsberg, or Roy had more to do with getting teams getting into situations where that one goal mattered. But again, that's something Sather was supposed to analyze and figure out.

This season has been tough. To say he's Blair Betts, to me, is unfair though. On the ice, he still will get some respect that will enable his linemates to have more room to skate (compared to Betts). The problem is, there isn't a stockpile of scoring wingers to complement him, and unfortunately that's what he needs (he's not Gaborik, who can turn a 40 point guy into a 60 point guy, or a 5 goal scorer into a 10-15 goal scorer). And the fact that this guy, the team's best shot from the left wing on the PP, didn't get the PP really makes me want to question the coach's moves. But in any event, that doesn't take away from the tough season, and it's fair to say he isn't, and hasn't, earned his $7MM+ per season during his tenure here. But, he is on this team and Sather made that mistake and he's not going away. The coach needs to now earn his money and figure out how to make him most effective on this team.

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 12:34 PM
  #64
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Fine, I guess I should calm down a little bit and give Drury some slack. It's not his fault he is who he is. It's not his fault he isn't better than he is.

You know what we can agree on? This franchise is friggin' sad. Very sad. And it all boils up towards the top. $ather is one of the most incompetent GMs I know of, who fails at surrounding himself with people who know anything about hockey and fails to have any sort of feeling for constructing successful teams.

You know which team was never picked by me or my friends in hockey games/ fantasy leagues or whatever when I grew up? The Rangers. Everyone considered them the biggest joke. The epitome of failure. That huge pile of money and resources, the biggest salary budget in the league, wasted on senseless crap. A team that knew nothing about team chemistry, that knew nothing about that it's actually a good idea to try to play defense once and then. A glass team with no identity and that knew very little about how to become successful in sports.

I was and am a huge fan of goalies and especially Lundqvist (big surprise). I decided that whichever team he ended up on, I would root for. And it was obviously the Rangers. Oh boy... my friends obviously laughed (mostly Detroit fans and even a Brodeur fan). I guess it's hard not to look like a complete idiot when your friends are either Red Wings or even a Devils fan, two true teams that have proven what it means to create a team identity, a real system that you get the players for, not the other way around.

Then the lockout luckily happened. Reality check hopefully happened. Now even the unknown idiot of a GM in New York, who I didn't even care to know the name of before the lockout, had to, was simply forced to build a team with common sense. He could literally not afford to not have defensive specialists and blue collar workers. He couldn't afford not to form a real team identity, a team strategy that you get the players for who are fit to play and be successful in, not that you first get a bunch of random players and then try to form something out.

"Wow!" I thought when I started checking out the Rangers lineup in 2005. "This might actually work." Boy, was I wrong.

4-5 years later, but the idiot behind the steering wheel is still the same man. You thought it would be impossible to completely screw up a team, even with salary cap room? I guess there are no boundaries what incompetence can accomplish. The team chemistry problems will continue to be an issue as long as $ather is a GM. He has no clue really what sort of image of a team he tries to create, it's like he randomly pushes a few buttons and have the long sightedness of a CEO preparing for the Q1 budget report. His two big questions each year are 1) "How much salary room can we create by moving around a bunch of players?" and 2) "What UFAs are available this summer, to throw boatloads of cash on?"

So here we are again, after 2 respectful years of hockey, with a bunch of years of yet again being the laughing stock of the league (along with the Leafs). I don't discuss team preferences with friends that much when we talk hockey. Guess why. This team is such a joke and I don't know why $ather's house and office hasn't been torched yet. If this was a normal company, $ather's parachute would've been triggered a long time ago. He would've been covered in tar, feathers and carried to the city border on a rail.

I'm not going to lie. If Lundqvist was traded or somehow not part of the Rangers organisation, I would ditch the sinking ship without a second thought. And it's all because of the moron with the whiskey and car keys. And yeah, the ******* who actually owns the franchise and doesn't have a thread of dignity in him to actually try to create a winning team.

But here we are and we're all stuck for various reasons. The New York Rangers is easily the team that has given me the most frustration out of any sports, of any clubs or franchises, ever. And that's from watching them for 5 measly years.

So yeah, I guess I could cut Drury some more slack, because the problems with him and his contract are nothing but a bird fart in the forest compared to you know who and you know who.


Last edited by Chimp: 01-19-2010 at 12:47 PM.
Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 12:58 PM
  #65
clmetsfan
Registered User
 
clmetsfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 3,613
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
4-5 years later, but the idiot behind the steering wheel is still the same man. You thought it would be impossible to completely screw up a team, even with salary cap room? I guess there are no boundaries what incompetence can accomplish. The team chemistry problems will continue to be an issue as long as $ather is a GM. He has no clue really what sort of image of a team he tries to create, it's like he randomly pushes a few buttons and have the long sightedness of a CEO preparing for the Q1 budget report. His two big questions each year are 1) "How much salary room can we create by moving around a bunch of players?" and 2) "What UFAs are available this summer, to throw boatloads of cash on?"
Ha! Just imagine your chagrin if you had been here for the 5 years beforehand as well. And the last 3 years of Neil Smith's regime.


Last edited by clmetsfan: 01-19-2010 at 01:06 PM.
clmetsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:09 PM
  #66
KreiMeARiver
PHI has potential!
 
KreiMeARiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Somewhere in Time
Posts: 6,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
In denial? Because I don't think Drury is a completely worthless player, and I'm not making baseless assertions that he's a terrible leader?

Drury is horribly overpaid and his offensive production is certainly disappointing. Is it because he's not seeing PP time? Maybe. Is he not seeing PP time because he's not producing at even strength? Who ****ing knows, I'm not the coach. But you're completely blind if you can't see anything positive in Drury's game.

If we had the option to cut him lose tomorrow and owe nothing at all, would I do it? Yeah, I would, his contract hurts. But that's not a possibility. But rather than just saying, "Because he's overpaid and underperforming, I can say the dude suuuuuucks and does nothing good and is a terrible leader," I try to look at Drury and his situation objectively.

You and a few others are blinded by hate something awful.
You aren't looking at anything objectively, you're simply playing the role of the eternal optimist (because you're a mod and now one of "them".) Whereas you try to always look at the glass of half-full, instead of what the situation really is. I'm not blinded by hate. I don't hate Drury. I dislike him very much, though. To me, he has no heart, no fire, no emotion. Ever since I saw him turtle-up like a little girl while Langenbrunner wailed on him I've had zero respect for the guy. He's not tough, he's a spoiled rich kid from Trumbull. This Ranger team is soft, and the "Captain" is the prime example of this. He is absolutely worthless, to me. As for the "baseless assertions", I think you need to open your eyes and see how this team plays from game to game. Do you see any examples of his positive impact on this team? At all? Do you see any leadership on this team besides HENRIK? I don't see it. I see a soft team with a soft leader. But I mean hey, what do I know...I'm just an "internet poster".

So yeah, I'm not totally blind, I do see a few good things about his game ie: work ethic, strength in his own zone. But that's pretty much where it ends, and the negatives, in my eyes, far outweigh the positives. We can't have any more soft players on this team making 7mm ever again...and that's all Sather knows how to acquire.


Last edited by KreiMeARiver: 01-19-2010 at 01:17 PM.
KreiMeARiver is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:14 PM
  #67
Kind of Blue
Registered User
 
Kind of Blue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 983
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Drury is not a mediocre bum. He is overpaid. The fact is he had average Drury years here the first two seasons. Overpaying a player will not change what that player is.
This is the bottom line. There is nothing else to say. Why this is so difficult for people to comprehend, I don't know.

Kind of Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:14 PM
  #68
haohmaru
#bdwyblueshirts
 
haohmaru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Fleming Island, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 4,471
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimp View Post

You know what we can agree on? This franchise is friggin' sad. Very sad. And it all boils up towards the top. $ather is one of the most incompetent GMs I know of, who fails at surrounding himself with people who know anything about hockey and fails to have any sort of feeling for constructing successful teams.

You know which team was never picked by me or my friends in hockey games/ fantasy leagues or whatever when I grew up? The Rangers. Everyone considered them the biggest joke. The epitome of failure. That huge pile of money and resources, the biggest salary budget in the league, wasted on senseless crap. A team that knew nothing about team chemistry, that knew nothing about that it's actually a good idea to try to play defense once and then. A glass team with no identity and that knew very little about how to become successful in sports.

I was and am a huge fan of goalies and especially Lundqvist (big surprise). I decided that whichever team he ended up on, I would root for. And it was obviously the Rangers. Oh boy... my friends obviously laughed (mostly Detroit fans and even a Brodeur fan). I guess it's hard not to look like a complete idiot when your friends are either Red Wings or even a Devils fan, two true teams that have proven what it means to create a team identity, a real system that you get the players for, not the other way around.

Then the lockout luckily happened. Reality check hopefully happened. Now even the unknown idiot of a GM in New York, who I didn't even care to know the name of before the lockout, had to, was simply forced to build a team with common sense. He could literally not afford to not have defensive specialists and blue collar workers. He couldn't afford not to form a real team identity, a team strategy that you get the players for who are fit to play and be successful in, not that you first get a bunch of random players and then try to form something out.

"Wow!" I thought when I started checking out the Rangers lineup in 2005. "This might actually work." Boy, was I wrong.

4-5 years later, but the idiot behind the steering wheel is still the same man. You thought it would be impossible to completely screw up a team, even with salary cap room? I guess there are no boundaries what incompetence can accomplish. The team chemistry problems will continue to be an issue as long as $ather is a GM. He has no clue really what sort of image of a team he tries to create, it's like he randomly pushes a few buttons and have the long sightedness of a CEO preparing for the Q1 budget report. His two big questions each year are 1) "How much salary room can we create by moving around a bunch of players?" and 2) "What UFAs are available this summer, to throw boatloads of cash on?"

So here we are again, after 2 respectful years of hockey, with a bunch of years of yet again being the laughing stock of the league (along with the Leafs). I don't discuss team preferences with friends that much when we talk hockey. Guess why. This team is such a joke and I don't know why $ather's house and office hasn't been torched yet. If this was a normal company, $ather's parachute would've been triggered a long time ago. He would've been covered in tar, feathers and carried to the city border on a rail.

I'm not going to lie. If Lundqvist was traded or somehow not part of the Rangers organisation, I would ditch the sinking ship without a second thought. And it's all because of the moron with the whiskey and car keys. And yeah, the ******* who actually owns the franchise and doesn't have a thread of dignity in him to actually try to create a winning team.

But here we are and we're all stuck for various reasons. The New York Rangers is easily the team that has given me the most frustration out of any sports, of any clubs or franchises, ever. And that's from watching them for 5 measly years.

So yeah, I guess I could cut Drury some more slack, because the problems with him and his contract are nothing but a bird fart in the forest compared to you know who and you know who.
This post is so ridiculous that I don't even know where to start...

"Laughing stock of the league along with the Leafs"

Really? How many teams in the east besides the Rangers have been in the playoffs every year since the lockout?

Are they a laughing stock along with the Devils? They have exactly the same playoff success since the lockout as NJ.

I'm all for criticism and debating Sather's moves, but since the lockout the Rangers have been one of the more successful Eastern conference teams. If your definition of success is a Cup, then only two Eastern teams have been successful in the past four years. Two out of 60 (15 Eastern teams x 4 years = 60). If your definition is making the playoffs for four years in a row then only two teams (one being the Rangers) is successful. If you want to argue that these teams can't compete for the Cup then neither could 29 other teams.

Would I have done a lot of things differently? Redden? Roszival? Sure. How do you think Calgary feels about Jay Bouwmeester making 6.8 million/season and having 2 goals in 50 games? Nearly every team has these contracts that they wish they could unload, that they wish they wouldn't have made, that they wish the player were what they thought he was, etc...

Sather has done an average to above average job since the lockout and I'm not a Sather fan by any means. But everyone seems to forget the good things he's done (Jagr) (Gaborik, Mcdonagh, and Higgins (basically) for Gomez) and just point out R & R and Drury.

haohmaru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:20 PM
  #69
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,311
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by hightide85 View Post
You aren't looking at anything objectively, you're simply playing the role of the eternal optimist (because you're a mod and now one of "them".) Whereas you try to always look at the glass of half-full, instead of what the situation really is. I'm not blinded by hate. I don't hate Drury. I dislike him very much, though. To me, he has no heart, no fire, no emotion. Ever since I saw him turtle-up like a little girl while Langenbrunner wailed on him I've had zero respect for the guy. He's not tough, he's a spoiled rich kid from Trumbull. This Ranger team is soft, and the "Captain" is the prime example of this. He is absolutely worthless, to me. As for the "baseless assertions", I think you need to open your eyes and see how this team plays from game to game. Do you see any examples of his positive impact on this team? At all? Do you see any leadership on this team besides HENRIK? I don't see it. I see a soft team with a soft leader. But I mean hey, what do I know...I'm just an "internet poster".
Hahah, okay. I'm one of "them", so my opinion is less valid. Gotcha.

To me, he has heart, he has fire, he has emotion. That he doesn't need to ***** and moan and throw trashcans and break sticks and engage in all those theatrics doesn't mean he's lacking in those qualities.

You're right, you are just an internet poster. As am I. I'm not denigrating your opinion because of that. But I'm more inclined to believe Drury's teammates--past and present, true hockey insiders in the media, people in the NHLPA (that I know personally) and the freaking GM of Team USA when they say that Drury is one of the finest leaders in the game.

And even if he was a poor leader, when I see the guy get thrown around like a ragdoll in the corner, then come out to block three consecutive slappers from the point, then get up to make a play and clear the puck, I see value.

__________________

It's just pain.
nyr2k2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:53 PM
  #70
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
This post is so ridiculous that I don't even know where to start...

"Laughing stock of the league along with the Leafs"

Really? How many teams in the east besides the Rangers have been in the playoffs every year since the lockout?

Are they a laughing stock along with the Devils? They have exactly the same playoff success since the lockout as NJ.

I'm all for criticism and debating Sather's moves, but since the lockout the Rangers have been one of the more successful Eastern conference teams. If your definition of success is a Cup, then only two Eastern teams have been successful in the past four years. Two out of 60 (15 Eastern teams x 4 years = 60). If your definition is making the playoffs for four years in a row then only two teams (one being the Rangers) is successful. If you want to argue that these teams can't compete for the Cup then neither could 29 other teams.

Would I have done a lot of things differently? Redden? Roszival? Sure. How do you think Calgary feels about Jay Bouwmeester making 6.8 million/season and having 2 goals in 50 games? Nearly every team has these contracts that they wish they could unload, that they wish they wouldn't have made, that they wish the player were what they thought he was, etc...

Sather has done an average to above average job since the lockout and I'm not a Sather fan by any means. But everyone seems to forget the good things he's done (Jagr) (Gaborik, Mcdonagh, and Higgins (basically) for Gomez) and just point out R & R and Drury.
Again, this was the common thought among my friends. When you're a rich franchise and underperform gravely if you look at the resources at hand, you get a certain reputation. And that reputation sticks. For every good signing $ather has made, 4 others go in the reverse direction.

As for why this team has managed to reach the playoffs every year since the lockout, I wouldn't exactly put that credit on $ather. Nevermind the years before the lockout that really gave this franchise its retirement home reputation. The decade after the golden 1994 cannot be described as nothing but an utter failure, despite the enormous resources the franchise had at hand to build a good team.

Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 01:56 PM
  #71
Fletch
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 20,486
vCash: 500
Chimp...

I only read the first couple sentences of your post, so forgive me if I missed something, but I don't know how one can consider this franchise as being "friggin' sad". We've all been upset with this team and have always felt that it could do better, but the fact of the matter is this team has been to the playoffs four straight seasons and has twice won a series. "Friggin' sad" is a relative statement. So the Islanders must be, what, totally downtrodden? And the Thrashers? Just not too happy? Or the Leafs, extremely malcontent?

I don't like Sather. I stand by me saying that he should not have been afforded the opportunity to coach this team after the lockout. But, while we continue to believe this team and organization is underachieving, I think their record over the past four full seasons has been better than average. Is that really that sad? I always hope for better, but it's hardly sad. And I'd guess each team has a share of duds on it that the fans wished were never signed.

And to be honest, it sounds like you're a fan of a player, not a team/organization. Why bother caring or getting worked up about the GM and everything else and just root on Henke to have a great career (I read the rest of the post).

Finally - how old are you? I'm just wondering in what period you grew up and the Rangers were considered the biggest joke. Personally, I really never cared what other people thought. I recognized bad years and periods, but still, didn't care what others were thinking since I've always been a fan and will always continue to be one; perhaps a bit less now than 20 years ago as age will do that to you (as well as having less time to care).

Fletch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 03:23 PM
  #72
NYR Sting
Heart and Soul
 
NYR Sting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 9,506
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeHamiltonsTan View Post
I personally would feel like a complete ass cashing those checks knowing the likes of blair betts could be doing the same exact job at a fraction of the price.

As for his so called leadership skills, sure we have no clue what goes on behind closed doors but based on the information available how could you NOT assume the worst. The guy only does interviews after wins, I have seen maybe 3 interviews after losses this year, meanwhile gabby and hank stand there and answer the same questions every night... wheres the leader? on his way to the bank, thats where.
Give me a break. You'd run, not walk, to the bank with glee. We all would. Hell, I'd get satisfaction simply out of knowing I was making an ******* like Sather look so stupid. Wouldn't blame Drury for that, either.

I never even said a thing about his leadership. His effort speaks for itself. Not his fault the team doesn't put him in position to succeed offensively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I kill Sather for the contract.

I'll kill Drury for lack of effort — which I don't see.
Right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
But everyone seems to forget the good things he's done (Jagr) (Gaborik, Mcdonagh, and Higgins (basically) for Gomez) and just point out R & R and Drury.
Jagr pretty much fell into his lap. Not like Sather made shrewd moves to pull that off. Getting Jagr was a mistake, anyway. Sent the team in the completely wrong direction. Jagr's acquisition sent this team into this cycle of mediocrity that we probably won't be exiting until Redden's contract ends, and that's assuming Sather doesn't make any more stupid moves before then (obviously no guarantee, since he made several this summer).

Quote:
Originally Posted by hightide85 View Post
You aren't looking at anything objectively, you're simply playing the role of the eternal optimist (because you're a mod and now one of "them".) Whereas you try to always look at the glass of half-full, instead of what the situation really is. I'm not blinded by hate. I don't hate Drury. I dislike him very much, though. To me, he has no heart, no fire, no emotion. Ever since I saw him turtle-up like a little girl while Langenbrunner wailed on him I've had zero respect for the guy. He's not tough, he's a spoiled rich kid from Trumbull. This Ranger team is soft, and the "Captain" is the prime example of this. He is absolutely worthless, to me. As for the "baseless assertions", I think you need to open your eyes and see how this team plays from game to game. Do you see any examples of his positive impact on this team? At all? Do you see any leadership on this team besides HENRIK? I don't see it. I see a soft team with a soft leader. But I mean hey, what do I know...I'm just an "internet poster".

So yeah, I'm not totally blind, I do see a few good things about his game ie: work ethic, strength in his own zone. But that's pretty much where it ends, and the negatives, in my eyes, far outweigh the positives. We can't have any more soft players on this team making 7mm ever again...and that's all Sather knows how to acquire.
Chris Drury was never particularly physical, just as he was never a very skilled offensive player. Never. Not in Buffalo, not in Colorado, not in Calgary. People simply expect him to be something he has never been because of his salary.

Apparently you expect a hockey team's captain to come packaged with magical powers that turn the likes of Dubinsky into stars and the likes of Kotalik and Higgins into top six forwards. What exactly is his leadership supposed to do? Transform these **** players into better ones? DRURY DOESN'T ASSEMBLE THE ROSTER. The roster SUCKS. That's not Drury's fault. If we had an average starting goalie, we would be in the lottery.

Drury doesn't acquire the players, nor does he hand out their paychecks. He collects one paycheck that was offered to him. Drury doesn't decide where he fits into the lineup, either. The team's acquisitions force Drury, a third-liner, to play in the top-6 with other third liners. A recipe for failure. Not Drury's decision, not Drury's fault.

NYR Sting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 03:45 PM
  #73
Chimp
Registered User
 
Chimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: In my food garden.
Country: Sweden
Posts: 10,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
I only read the first couple sentences of your post, so forgive me if I missed something, but I don't know how one can consider this franchise as being "friggin' sad". We've all been upset with this team and have always felt that it could do better, but the fact of the matter is this team has been to the playoffs four straight seasons and has twice won a series. "Friggin' sad" is a relative statement. So the Islanders must be, what, totally downtrodden? And the Thrashers? Just not too happy? Or the Leafs, extremely malcontent?
This has everything to do with have you view yourself and what goals you have. If you want to be a successful franchise, and with that I mean a consistent top team in the league, the Rangers are "friggin' sad". If the goal is to form a team that can struggle hard to reach the playoffs and be eliminated in the first round, the Rangers are doing just fine. I look at the potential this team could have with a good top in the pyramid. Mediocrity is not an option and should not be something to be content at being. Sometimes the best decisions are the decisions you don't make.

Everything is relative. Compared to poor franchices who had and has little to no money, Rangers is a powerhouse. Like a Real Madrid on soccer, who has all the money in the world, but can't form a championship team. They bring in tons of expensive players, but have nothing to show for it. A team with great resources who had all the opportunity, but wasted it, because earning money is more important than being successful in the actual sport. The product Real Madrid is worth alot more money wise than the actual product on the field.
Quote:
I don't like Sather. I stand by me saying that he should not have been afforded the opportunity to coach this team after the lockout. But, while we continue to believe this team and organization is underachieving, I think their record over the past four full seasons has been better than average. Is that really that sad? I always hope for better, but it's hardly sad. And I'd guess each team has a share of duds on it that the fans wished were never signed.
$ather should absolutely have been fired during the lockout, no question about it. After all, he is responsible for a to say it frankly, embarrassing stretch in Rangers history.

Yes, I think this current team is friggin' sad. So many underperformers, the team core is never there from season to season which means the team identity is bad, so few quality players and so many mercenaries that should be replaced.

I have no confidence in $ather whatosever in sorting this mess out, not with his history. I think more of him bringing this franchise further down, than further up.
Quote:
And to be honest, it sounds like you're a fan of a player, not a team/organization. Why bother caring or getting worked up about the GM and everything else and just root on Henke to have a great career (I read the rest of the post).
It started with rooting for Henke, but it wasn't hard to root for the Rangers that started the 2005/2006 season. Alot of players I liked, alot of players I grew to like. It was a good mix of star players and hard working blue collars which every team needs. I liked the core of that team and think the franchise was going in the right direction, until the complete rehaul for the 2007/2008 season, where too much fell apart too quickly. $ather's old, bad habits.

How many players are left from the original lineup 5 years ago? Two? That's not how you form a contender, $ather is working with this franchise like it's on Playstation and has for a very long time now.
Quote:
Finally - how old are you? I'm just wondering in what period you grew up and the Rangers were considered the biggest joke. Personally, I really never cared what other people thought. I recognized bad years and periods, but still, didn't care what others were thinking since I've always been a fan and will always continue to be one; perhaps a bit less now than 20 years ago as age will do that to you (as well as having less time to care).
I'm 29. The "joke era" I'm referring to is basically from 1997 and onto the lockout. Alot of underperforming UFAs were brought in, alot of key players retired/ switched teams/ were traded, yet instead of regrouping and forming a solid team, NYR was based on various, random, very expensive mercenaries and UFAs. Having such a hefty team salary, yet performing so badly on the ice, looks very, very bad.

The reason my friends and many others laughed at the Rangers was, which diversifies the franchise from other bad teams, the resources at hand.

NYR should be a powerhouse, but isn't close to being one and hasn't been close for a long time now, for too long. That's what's friggin' sad.


Last edited by Chimp: 01-19-2010 at 04:00 PM.
Chimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 03:52 PM
  #74
haohmaru
#bdwyblueshirts
 
haohmaru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Fleming Island, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 4,471
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post

Jagr pretty much fell into his lap. Not like Sather made shrewd moves to pull that off. Getting Jagr was a mistake, anyway. Sent the team in the completely wrong direction. Jagr's acquisition sent this team into this cycle of mediocrity that we probably won't be exiting until Redden's contract ends, and that's assuming Sather doesn't make any more stupid moves before then (obviously no guarantee, since he made several this summer).
I notice you didn't comment on the Gomez -> Gaborik, Higgins (let's not go here again) and McDonagh portion of the post.

Regardless - gotta disagree on the big man and on "mediocrity". Making the playoffs every year isn't mediocre - even by NHL standards and Jagr instantly put the Rangers back on the map, nearly won the Hart, and a bounce here and there and we could've been through to the conference finals.

haohmaru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-19-2010, 04:07 PM
  #75
Garv23
Registered User
 
Garv23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Rockland, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 948
vCash: 500
I'd love to see any of you internet jockeys purposely put your body in front of a 90mph slapshot to keep a puck out of your net.

I'm glad Drury is on this team and I'm glad he's the Capt.

Garv23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:26 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.