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Wilson forcing Kaberle to waive???

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:45 AM
  #26
WestIslander
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To Washington:

Tomas Kaberle

To Toronto:

Tomas Fleishmann + Karl Alzner + 1st round draft pick

_____________________________________________

If this happens, I will be convinced that Brian Burke is still a genius and that George McPhee is an idiot!

Why? Because the Capitals are more than Kaberle away from the cup and giving up on Fleishmann would hurt down the road.

However, with Fleishmann, Alzner and a pick in between 25th and 30th, the Leafs would be able to cover up for the stupid Kessel deal with Boston.

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:49 AM
  #27
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The loss of the offensive skills of Kaberle would exponentially out-weigh the gain of a more defensively sound defender. The value of carrying a puck out of your own zone unscathed 25 to 50 times a game is a benefit defensively that could only be measured with its absence.

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:50 AM
  #28
ULF_55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quakmybush View Post
you guys are looking into this way too hard. Let's be honest, on our defenceman depth chart in regards to defensive ability.

Beauch
White
Schenn (depending on if he's on or not)
Gunnar
Komi
Kaberle
Finger
Exelby
You are basing that on potential right?

Not based on the play this year?

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:51 AM
  #29
LTL
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I'll take Alzner, 1st and a 2nd vs the roster player. I'm sure the Caps want to add vs subtracting from the team.

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:58 AM
  #30
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not sure about fleischmann but alzner + 1st is a very good start imo.

regarding our defensive depth, we could potentially let alzner play 1 season with the marlies and trade one of beauch/komi at next years deadline.

white schenn
alzner gunnarson


looks like a good top 4.

its a moot point because caps wont give up alzner and probably not fleischmann. also, toronto needs forward depth way more then we need defensive help.

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:58 AM
  #31
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im up for trading kaberle, im also up for keeping him.

If he's traded, one of the keys coming back has to be a number #1 Centre or #1 Centre prospect coming back. We dont need more dmen, we have too many. Fleischman? Hes ok, but this team has had an abundence of Fleischman's in the past (Poni, Hagman, Stemniak, Stajan)

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01-20-2010, 09:59 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
I'm no Insider but it appears to be the return of Gunnarsson that reduced Kaberle's ice time.
Ding ding ding.

Imagine inserting a defenseman not named Finger and ice-time magically disappears for someone (or two).

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Old
01-20-2010, 09:59 AM
  #33
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I change my mind on Kaberle every day. I've gone from thinking we've got to trade him to being more of the opinion that he may have value, but there aren't a lot of players as good at what he does as he is, and he'd be hard to replace.

Some of the offers suggested for him sound more tempting than they actually are when the rest of the time we're discussing 'Stajan/Hagman/Ponikarovsky/etc etc for a 2nd'.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:00 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by EazyB97 View Post
It's funny how Kaberle's defensive play has absoloutely sunk when none of his skills or ability to think the game has. Makes me wonder if it's effort.
Tough to stay motivated when the team is constantly taking a beating.

And even still, the only defenseman who has been the cause of less goals than Kaberle is Ian White, and the lustre on his season is beginning to wear-off as well.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:02 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Hockey Talker29 View Post
Tough to stay motivated when the team is constantly taking a beating.

And even still, the only defenseman who has been the cause of less goals than Kaberle is Ian White, and the lustre on his season is beginning to wear-off as well.
I'm pretty sure some of our players are running out of gas because of the schedule.

White has played more minutes than he ever has combined with the tightened schedule. He is still playing well, but with more mistakes than the start of the season. I am curious to see how he bounces back after the olympics.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:06 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Talker29 View Post
Tough to stay motivated when the team is constantly taking a beating.

And even still, the only defenseman who has been the cause of less goals than Kaberle is Ian White, and the lustre on his season is beginning to wear-off as well.
Gunnarsson isn't quite there right now either, with a few bad passes. Beauchemin continuously makes poor decisions with the puck, and on pinches so he's been pretty consistent at his level of play.

Over the past couple seasons Komisarek is proving injury prone.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:07 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
You are basing that on potential right?

Not based on the play this year?
indeed

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:08 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Hockey Talker29 View Post
Tough to stay motivated when the team is constantly taking a beating.

And even still, the only defenseman who has been the cause of less goals than Kaberle is Ian White, and the lustre on his season is beginning to wear-off as well.
Kaberle has the potential to be a 25+ minute a night d-man who plays well in all situations, but he simply hasn't been the last few years. From what I see, he's just as talented and thinks the game as well, he just doesn't seem to put the effort in he used to. Could be the team, could be my eyes. He's not dogging it all the time, it just seems as the coaches have specialized his game, he's done the same.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:14 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by LTL View Post
I'll take Alzner, 1st and a 2nd vs the roster player. I'm sure the Caps want to add vs subtracting from the team.
How could anyone prefer a 2nd round pick to a 25 yr, talented winger who is on track to 30 plus goal?

Why do people just lump Fleishmann in with guys like Poni, Stemps and Hagman. Fleishmann is fairly big and has loads of talent.

1st, fleish and alzner would be a STEAL

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01-20-2010, 10:18 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildburns View Post
How could anyone prefer a 2nd round pick to a 25 yr, talented winger who is on track to 30 plus goal?

Why do people just lump Fleishmann in with guys like Poni, Stemps and Hagman. Fleishmann is fairly big and has loads of talent.

1st, fleish and alzner would be a STEAL
You're right, he probably is a better player than Poni, et al. But this team really needs to bring in strength down the middle. And our biggest asset trading is Kaberle.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:37 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildburns View Post
How could anyone prefer a 2nd round pick to a 25 yr, talented winger who is on track to 30 plus goal?

Why do people just lump Fleishmann in with guys like Poni, Stemps and Hagman. Fleishmann is fairly big and has loads of talent.

1st, fleish and alzner would be a STEAL
Caps have to fit Kaberle's contract in, and if the Leafs have to send more maybe the Caps also have to send contracts.

However, they might have space with Nylander gone.

Capitals:
Cap space $3,955,195
Acquisition space (full-season cap hit) $9,309,178

So Kaberle and Ponikarovsky for that package suggested would probably work for the Capitals, the question is whether they would do it. Maybe the Leafs take on the Nylander contract which runs through next season

Burke apparently can buy bad contracts. Right?

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01-20-2010, 10:41 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildburns View Post
How could anyone prefer a 2nd round pick to a 25 yr, talented winger who is on track to 30 plus goal?

Why do people just lump Fleishmann in with guys like Poni, Stemps and Hagman. Fleishmann is fairly big and has loads of talent.

1st, fleish and alzner would be a STEAL
Because he is roughly equivalent to Poni, Stemps, and Hagman, that's why.

It can't be much of a steal for the Leafs if Washington ends up with the best player in the deal.

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Old
01-20-2010, 10:48 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by mooseOAK View Post
Because he is roughly equivalent to Poni, Stemps, and Hagman, that's why.

It can't be much of a steal for the Leafs if Washington ends up with the best player in the deal.
I can't imagine a scenario where we trade Kaberle and end up with the best player in the deal.

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01-20-2010, 10:55 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by WestIslander View Post
To Washington:

Tomas Kaberle

To Toronto:

Tomas Fleishmann + Karl Alzner + 1st round draft pick

_____________________________________________

If this happens, I will be convinced that Brian Burke is still a genius and that George McPhee is an idiot!

Why? Because the Capitals are more than Kaberle away from the cup and giving up on Fleishmann would hurt down the road.

However, with Fleishmann, Alzner and a pick in between 25th and 30th, the Leafs would be able to cover up for the stupid Kessel deal with Boston.
Especially if they use the pick to draft Benjamin Conz.

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:04 AM
  #45
ULF_55
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Especially if they use the pick to draft Benjamin Conz.
Especially if they use the pick, and a 3rd. this year and 2nd. next year to move up into the top 10.

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:10 AM
  #46
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Dreger, stop making us delusional!

Nothing is happening this season. Nothing !

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:13 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Especially if they use the pick, and a 3rd. this year and 2nd. next year to move up into the top 10.
I can dream can't I?

Can you imagine that return for Tomas Kaberle?

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:20 AM
  #48
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Not that I believe there is any truth to this rumor, with Komisarek and Schenn in the mix, Alzner would be redundant. Swap Alzner for Carlson and we got a deal.

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:20 AM
  #49
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I can't imagine a scenario where we trade Kaberle and end up with the best player in the deal.
I agree but the unknown riches is where the best player will come from. Like the Kessel deal in reverse.

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Old
01-20-2010, 11:33 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Kaberle's not getting as much ice time these days, are they keeping him healthy to make a trade?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caesium View Post


Really? He's not getting traded unless he asks to be traded.
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Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
I'm just thinking out loud as to why he's getting way under 20 minutes a game. No need to be a cool guy with the facepalm.
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Originally Posted by Caesium View Post
Caesium understands how no trade clauses work and what it means when the player says he isn't waiving it, and when the GM turns red in the face telling people he isn't going to ask the guy to waive it. Caesium gets a little tired looking at delusional posts...
Caesium, looks like there might have been some validity to my delusional thinking after all...

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