HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Should Girardi have stepped in on the fight

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-22-2010, 05:11 PM
  #176
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,993
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
It's because the "snarl" isn't a natural element to his game. He's playing above his comfort zone whenever it is he's making tough, physical plays. His willingness to work on things he may not exactly be comfortable with is why he's made it to the NHL without being drafted, but most guys like this can't deliver on a consistent basis. Kind of inexplicable, but I don't think it's that rare.
If sticking up for a teammate, or pulling Carcillo away from Gabby, is out of Girardi's comfort zone, then he should probably consider a new profession.

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:12 PM
  #177
chip chipperson*
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 2,033
vCash: 500
every team knows they can run into lundqvist, now every team knows they can take a run at gaborik. for once i want a ranger to be the bad guy

chip chipperson* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:12 PM
  #178
DMPD
Mats, Zuke of NY
 
DMPD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Mysidia
Country: United States
Posts: 20,454
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeds2StepOpus View Post
That's a load of horse cra*p.

If you watch the video, ChickenSh*t charged at and grabbed Gaborik from behind and as they spun around, ChickSh*t had one hand/arm wrapped around Gabby's head. Gabby tried to grab hold of ChickenSh*t and they were pushing and tugging. ChickenSh*t threw a punch at Gabby with a gloved right hand.

That's when Gabby dropped one glove to hold on to ChickenSh*t's jersey. When Gabby dropped that one glove, ChickenSh*t dropped a glove and they both dropped their second gloves at the same time. Gabby was holding on ...pushing and tugging.

ChickenSh*t was throwing punches.
Come on man, take off the homer colored glasses. Despite the fact that Carcillo definitely instigated the ordeal, Gabs dropped them first.

__________________


rip
DMPD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:12 PM
  #179
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
CarciLOL
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Country: Greece
Posts: 7,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfPackFan07 View Post
Did Kovalchuk fight Boogaard? Datsyuk tangle with Orr? Malkin throw with Parros?

Didn't think so...only way you can equate those guys dropping their gloves, to what happened to Gaborik last night is if they fought a goon. Otherwise, your comparison makes little sense.
You're kidding me right? Boogard? Orr? Parros? If you're going to attempt a comparison, do a better job because Carcillo isn't even close to a heavyweight. He's an agitator, and plays a very similar role to Avery. Yup, Sean Avery. The same cat that has challenged many of the exceptional players I listed that have fought in this league.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:12 PM
  #180
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I disagree.

Del Zotto was keeping in mind that if he went below the faceoff circle, the faceoff would come outside. The fight was just starting then and nothing was really going on.

Once it got completely out of hand, Girardi was the bystander.
Girardi was keeping the same thing in mind, and at least realized the time came where it was time to cross the circles. If anything MDZ is more to at fault other than MAYBE the fact that he's a youngster. But it's not like this sort of thing is exclusive to the NHL.

I just have a hard time blaming either of them to be honest because as I've said there's so many things that someone could be considering in both of their positions, and before you know it Gaborik is on the ice. It all happened very fast, and I'm sure if there ever is a next time ANYONE on the team is probably going to go with instinct over discipline, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if they get crucified for it in forums, blogs, and columns the next day either.

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:17 PM
  #181
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
CarciLOL
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Country: Greece
Posts: 7,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
The fact that no one prevented the fight isn't the real issue. The issue is that the event itself should have been something the team used to build intensity. They played like a deflated whoopie cushion from the drop of the puck all the way through. Usually, when the players you named get pushed around, their teams don't just stick up for them right then and there. They make their point in the game.

The only point the Rangers made is that if any team that opposes them plays with any hint of physicality or intimidation, they'll back down like frightened poodles. They had no trouble going to the net against Montreal, and even less against the Bolts.
I'm more upset with how the team responded to what happened, rather than Girardi. The team still could have made a statement, either on the scoreboard, or with a blood. Some type of retaliation. If that happened years ago, Hollweg would have done his signature move and stapled someone from behind into the boards.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:18 PM
  #182
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
If sticking up for a teammate, or pulling Carcillo away from Gabby, is out of Girardi's comfort zone, then he should probably consider a new profession.
I was talking more about his "snarl", but whatever.

Anyone in Girardi's shoes would've probably hesitated, and with how quick everything happened that's all it took to not have time to do anything about it.

I can agree in hindsight he should've stepped in, but like i've said, I don't know how you can blame Girardi for this.

There are a lot of critical arguments of Girardi that i don't understand why they're not applied to everyone else that was on the ice.

Why didn't Girardi get in Carcillo's face after? Why didn't anyone? If I'm Dubi or Prospal or MDZ and I see what happened, why am I not getting free from the other scrum(Dubi+Prospal) or stepping in(MDZ) after either? Girardi's the only one to blame here?

Why didn't Girardi be the 3rd man in? Why didn't MDZ???? He was the one that was closer to begin with. The kid likes to hit, I'm sure he's had to answer the bell before, even if it's not at a professional level, you've gotta grow up sometime. Girardi's not exactly a veteran, and we seem to forget that because of MDZ, and to a lesser extent Staal, Gilroy and our prospects.

Why didn't Prospal say to himself "Dubi can hold his own, I just saw Carcillo pull Gabby out of this scrum to the corner"? Logic tells us it's because in these sorts of things everyone grabs a man, but we're being overcritical of Girardi, so why not Prospal too?

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:19 PM
  #183
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
I'm more upset with how the team responded to what happened, rather than Girardi. The team still could have made a statement, either on the scoreboard, or with a blood. Some type of retaliation. If that happened years ago, Hollweg would have done his signature move and stapled someone from behind into the boards.
They seemed to think that challenging the flyers to fights every shift and every whistle and getting in to about 4 was an appropriate response. They were hellbent on fights but it was like Colton Orr was here all over again, if they couldn't find a fight or even if they did, they had no intention of going blow for blow with the Flyers and going after one of their stars.

This is what I figured Brashear would be good for. Woops...

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:19 PM
  #184
peacepipe
Registered User
 
peacepipe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Philadelphia,PA
Posts: 867
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeds2StepOpus View Post
That's a load of horse cra*p.

If you watch the video, ChickenSh*t charged at and grabbed Gaborik from behind and as they spun around, ChickSh*t had one hand/arm wrapped around Gabby's head. Gabby tried to grab hold of ChickenSh*t and they were pushing and tugging. ChickenSh*t threw a punch at Gabby with a gloved right hand.

That's when Gabby dropped one glove to hold on to ChickenSh*t's jersey. When Gabby dropped that one glove, ChickenSh*t dropped a glove and they both dropped their second gloves at the same time. Gabby was holding on ...pushing and tugging.

ChickenSh*t was throwing punches.
no whats a load of horse crap is how much your making gaborik look like a complete victim here. your post makes no sense..if he didnt want to fight why did the gloves come off at all, and get out of here with the "pushing and tugging" he was throwing punches at carcillo and his gloves did come off first

peacepipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:23 PM
  #185
Doctor Strange
 
Doctor Strange's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Brooklyn NY
Country: United States
Posts: 47
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyko1827 View Post
We know were soft and we tried to address this in the off-season by going after chris neil very hard, but he declined and took less money to stay with ottowa. would've loved to have him in the line-up every night and have the option of suiting up brashear for scummy teams like philly
I would not have minded Neil myself, but I do not mean in the manner of "adding grit" as in any particular players.
The players that are already here are soft.
I do not expect everyone on the team to drop the gloves...but they should not allow themselves to be tossed around the way they are.

Doctor Strange is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:26 PM
  #186
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
CarciLOL
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Country: Greece
Posts: 7,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Just curious, why did you think a guy like Adam Graves found it necessary to step in when someone fought Messier, a guy who could more than hold his own?
Whenever there was an after-whistle scrum, Gravey was there for his Captain. But Messier had countless fights on his resume where he didn't need assistance from #9... Messier wouldn't even allow his opponents to get a clean check on him, often raising his elbows before the collision. And the relationship between Mess and Gravey was a lot stronger than any two players on this current franchise. Lastly, Graves did a number of things that were extraordinary. If we're going to be comparing current Rangers to #9, they are all going to fall short.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:28 PM
  #187
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by peacepipe View Post
no whats a load of horse crap is how much your making gaborik look like a complete victim here. your post makes no sense..if he didnt want to fight why did the gloves come off at all, and get out of here with the "pushing and tugging" he was throwing punches at carcillo and his gloves did come off first
Gaborik's gloves may have come off first but Carcillo was throwing punches with his gloves on, so honestly, what difference does it make? If I'm getting punches thrown at me, with or without gloves on, I'm throwing mine. Carcillo was the aggressor, and that's not something anyone can argue.

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:29 PM
  #188
HAPPY HOUR
Registered User
 
HAPPY HOUR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 5,253
vCash: 500
Rodents take:


http://hockeyrodent.com/

HAPPY HOUR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:30 PM
  #189
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,993
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post

Why didn't Girardi get in Carcillo's face after? Why didn't anyone? If I'm Dubi or Prospal or MDZ and I see what happened, why am I not getting free from the other scrum(Dubi+Prospal) or stepping in(MDZ) after either? Girardi's the only one to blame here?


Why didn't Prospal say to himself "Dubi can hold his own, I just saw Carcillo pull Gabby out of this scrum to the corner"? Logic tells us it's because in these sorts of things everyone grabs a man, but we're being overcritical of Girardi, so why not Prospal too?

Are you serious with these arguments?

The last comment concerning Prospal leads me to believe you didn't even watch the fight. Prospal wasn't even near Dubi, he wasn't even pulling Tollefson away from Dubi. He was paired off with Bartulis near the boards.

Prospal and Dubi were TIED UP with other people. They were engaged in their own battles and probably didn't realize that Carcillo and Gaborik were squaring off.

Girardi wasn't paired up with anyone. He was standing right there, he was the player closest to Gaborik. I think you need to watch the fight again.

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:32 PM
  #190
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
CarciLOL
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Country: Greece
Posts: 7,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
lets not overrate Carcillo's fighting ability. He's a middleweight agitator that's VERY similar to Sean Avery. And Avery did fight Kovalchuk, and it wouldn't be the first time or the last time a star faught a middleweight. Just playing devil's advocate to a point, but YOUR comparison makes even less sense than the original.
I didn't make any comparison's. I just listed a bunch of good to great players on various teams that have dropped the gloves at one point or another in their careers. There's a lot of overreacting going on here because our beloved Gaborik got in a scuffle. The point I was trying to make, is that there are numerous exceptional players in this league that have had to drop the gloves and take care of things on their own, w/o one of their peers babying them. Expecting Girardi to interfere with a fight Gaborik ultimately agreed to by dropping his gloves, is more of an insult than standing there and watching a 4th line loser make an ass ot of himself.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:32 PM
  #191
peacepipe
Registered User
 
peacepipe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Philadelphia,PA
Posts: 867
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
Gaborik's gloves may have come off first but Carcillo was throwing punches with his gloves on, so honestly, what difference does it make? If I'm getting punches thrown at me, with or without gloves on, I'm throwing mine. Carcillo was the aggressor, and that's not something anyone can argue.
yeah but gaborik was throwing punches as well...which is why im assuming there was no instigator penalty because it takes two to tango

peacepipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:33 PM
  #192
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Are you serious with these arguments?

The last comment concerning Prospal leads me to believe you didn't even watch the fight. Prospal wasn't even near Dubi, he wasn't even pulling Tollefson away from Dubi. He was paired off with Bartulis near the boards.

Prospal and Dubi were TIED UP with other people. They were engaged in their own battles and probably didn't realize that Carcillo and Gaborik were squaring off.

Girardi wasn't paired up with anyone. He was standing right there, he was the player closest to Gaborik. I think you need to watch the fight again.
Prospal's behind the net not doing anything just like MDZ and Girardi were, for the most part, above or at the faceoff dots doing nothing. Prospal's sitting there hugging Betts watching the fight. If we're going to sit here and say there's no question that in all circumstances someone should step in if Gaborik is about to get in to a fight then why is Prospal not trying to get over there? If that's truly the case he should be acting the way Jason Strudwick did when Chris Simon faught Ryan Hollweg in our pre-season linebrawl with the Islanders and be shrugging people off and still trying to seperate it. Doesn't matter to me if he's paired up with someone or not, you can't tell me Betts was stopping him if he went to try and get inbetween. And even if Betts did, the effort wasn't there, so who cares?

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:34 PM
  #193
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 24,035
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
Whenever there was an after-whistle scrum, Gravey was there for his Captain. But Messier had countless fights on his resume where he didn't need assistance from #9... Messier wouldn't even allow his opponents to get a clean check on him, often raising his elbows before the collision. And the relationship between Mess and Gravey was a lot stronger than any two players on this current franchise. Lastly, Graves did a number of things that were extraordinary. If we're going to be comparing current Rangers to #9, they are all going to fall short.
So unless you're really close to the guy you don't need to protect your star player?

Sorry me man, but someone throws one punch at Gaborik and i'm on him like he murdered my family, thats how serious our players should have taken that incident. Like I said, even Girardi admitted he was wrong and should protect his guy if it happens again.

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:34 PM
  #194
HAPPY HOUR
Registered User
 
HAPPY HOUR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 5,253
vCash: 500
Cerneys take on the game.


http://rinkrap.blogspot.com/

HAPPY HOUR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:35 PM
  #195
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by peacepipe View Post
yeah but gaborik was throwing punches as well...which is why im assuming there was no instigator penalty because it takes two to tango
I don't disagree with that, I'm just saying, Carcillo's the clear aggressor here and the reason why it went on. Gaborik's trying to pair off and take someone off the pile, Carcillo comes along, drags him in to the corner, and punches are being thrown the next thing we all know.

If roles were reversed and lets say Avery comes in and does what Carcillo did to Gaborik, to Briere or Carter, are you going to be pleased with the way Avery's acted? Are you going to think he's in the wrong?

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:36 PM
  #196
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
I didn't make any comparison's. I just listed a bunch of good to great players on various teams that have dropped the gloves at one point or another in their careers. There's a lot of overreacting going on here because our beloved Gaborik got in a scuffle. The point I was trying to make, is that there are numerous exceptional players in this league that have had to drop the gloves and take care of things on their own, w/o one of their peers babying them. Expecting Girardi to interfere with a fight Gaborik ultimately agreed to by dropping his gloves, is more of an insult than standing there and watching a 4th line loser make an ass ot of himself.
I was disagreeing with whoever the poster was that mentioned Boogard and Orr making the same point you just made haha

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:38 PM
  #197
peacepipe
Registered User
 
peacepipe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Philadelphia,PA
Posts: 867
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
I don't disagree with that, I'm just saying, Carcillo's the clear aggressor here and the reason why it went on. Gaborik's trying to pair off and take someone off the pile, Carcillo comes along, drags him in to the corner, and punches are being thrown the next thing we all know.

If roles were reversed and lets say Avery comes in and does what Carcillo did to Gaborik, to Briere or Carter, are you going to be pleased with the way Avery's acted? Are you going to think he's in the wrong?
we can play the what if game all night but can we agree on if gaborik doesnt do anything he is very capable of drawing a penalty and i know it isnt easy to sit back and take a couple punches but i see it all the time to draw penalties but tensions were running high

peacepipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:38 PM
  #198
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,993
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
Prospal's behind the net not doing anything just like MDZ and Girardi were, for the most part, above or at the faceoff dots doing nothing. Prospal's sitting there hugging Betts watching the fight. If we're going to sit here and say there's no question that in all circumstances someone should step in if Gaborik is about to get in to a fight then why is Prospal not trying to get over there? If that's truly the case he should be acting the way Jason Strudwick did when Chris Simon faught Ryan Hollweg in our pre-season linebrawl with the Islanders and be shrugging people off and still trying to seperate it. Doesn't matter to me if he's paired up with someone or not, you can't tell me Betts was stopping him if he went to try and get inbetween. And even if Betts did, the effort wasn't there, so who cares?
You seem to be dense or just totally ignoring the fact that Prospal was ENGAGED IN HIS OWN BATTLE WITH BARTULIS, he was NOT doing nothing like Girardi just standing there. It does matter if he was paired up because it means he had his own business to attend to and couldn't devote his attention to Gaborik.

There was NO ONE there to prevent Girardi from stepping in. He was all by himself unlike Prospal. If you don't see the difference between Prospal's situation and Girardi's situation, then I don't know what to tell you.

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:42 PM
  #199
Boom Boom Geoffrion*
CarciLOL
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Country: Greece
Posts: 7,552
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
So unless you're really close to the guy you don't need to protect your star player?

Sorry me man, but someone throws one punch at Gaborik and i'm on him like he murdered my family, thats how serious our players should have taken that incident. Like I said, even Girardi admitted he was wrong and should protect his guy if it happens again.
I think guys like Girardi can protect Gaborik, and set an example, w/o intefering with that specific fight. If I'm Voros, for example, next time I'm on the ice I'm going to barrel-over Emery. Or take a 2-handed whack at Pronger's knee. Or pounce in Briere. I would retaliate in a different manner,rather than interfering and getting a third-man in penalty over a scrum Gaborik was already engaged in. If Girardi was able to seperate the fight before they squared off, I would have expected that from him as well, but from the replay's I've seen, he couldn't have known what was going to happen, until it was too late.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-22-2010, 05:44 PM
  #200
RangerFan10
Registered User
 
RangerFan10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Long Island/Plattsbu
Country: United States
Posts: 5,328
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to RangerFan10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
You seem to be dense or just totally ignoring the fact that Prospal was ENGAGED IN HIS OWN BATTLE WITH BARTULIS, he was NOT doing nothing like Girardi just standing there. It does matter if he was paired up because it means he had his own business to attend to and couldn't devote his attention to Gaborik.

There was NO ONE there to prevent Girardi from stepping in. He was all by himself unlike Prospal. If you don't see the difference between Prospal's situation and Girardi's situation, then I don't know what to tell you.
I see the difference, but you act like something special was going on with prospal. If it's so clearcut that someone should step in there, I don't understand why Prospal's even attempting to go over there and help either. Bartulis and him were not in a "battle", they were sitting there watching Carcillo pound his fist into Gaborik's visor.

I get he's got a guy there already, and I get that he PROBABLY couldn't have done much, but if we're really going to fault Girardi for being unsure of whether or not to be the 3rd guy in, why are we not faulting the rest of the guys that, even if they couldnt have gotten there, didnt try to get there. The only one I think deserves a pass in this situation, if we're going to be THIS critical of ONE player and suggest it was a complete no-brainer to jump in, is Dubinsky, because the scrum started around him and his partner there was actually engaged with him, rather than just pairing off. And after all, Prospal's the veteran here. He wears an A. If you're going to hold Girardi accountable, why not Prospal? Just saying. I don't think either deserve to be blamed, but if someone is going to blame Girardi(there are people that have posted he needs to be traded and/or benched because of this), spread the blame to other players as well, MDZ in particular, and Prospal as well.

RangerFan10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:25 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.