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Flames trades part 2

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Old
02-02-2010, 03:14 PM
  #126
LeftCoast
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This will probably go down as the 2nd worst Calgary - Toronto trade ever!

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Old
02-02-2010, 03:25 PM
  #127
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Haha apparently Olli Jokinen's wife didn't care for Puck Daddy's article about the trade:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puck Daddy
This trade is like someone with a lactose intolerance swapping two spoiled milkshakes for a slice of day-old pizza; at least there's still a chance you can hold your nose and enjoy the pepperoni.

Yet less than 24 hours after the trade (finally) became official, there are some interesting minority opinions on what the majority sees as a slam-dunk for Glen "Fire" Sather. Has Olli Jokinen's game and reputation regressed to the point where even an apparent steal can turn sour? Are there reasons to worry about Olli, beyond the ready availability of a good razor in the Rangers locker room to take care of that follicle nightmare on his upper lip?

[...]


UPDATE 3:20 p.m. EST: We dish it out, we can take it. So in the interest of fairness, we yield the floor to Katerina Jokinen, whose email address we've independently verified as being that of Mrs. Olli Jokinen. From the PD inbox, unedited:
Quote:
I have a pretty thick skin when it comes to articles written about my husband and I'm not very easily disturbed or get upset so I don't want you to think about what I'm about to say comes from a wrong place but PLEASE consider changing your proffession if writing crap like this is it.

I honestly cannot remember reading a worse article in my life! Really really really BAD writing.

Yikes!
If she only knew how much support she has among Puck Daddy readers for those comments ...
The part I quoted is pretty much the only one where they're directly critical of Olli, I wonder if she's really sensitive about his moustache

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Old
02-02-2010, 06:08 PM
  #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
You know, this isn't the worst group of forwards in the Western playoffs. I'd argue that they are still better than Phoenix and Colorado.

The difference is those teams can play together and squeak out wins. Maybe that's the key to the whole thing? Move out players who cannot or will not adapt to Brent's style of play, and bring in guys who have excelled under such systems in the past?

The bad asset management is obvious, but the damage was probably done last spring and summer, not with these latest trades. That Jokinen trade will go down as one of the worst trades of the decade. And Phaneuf should have been moved soon after they signed Bouwmeester, when lots of teams still had cap space and his reputation was still pretty decent.

Maybe Darryl actually deserves some credit for this week? Most GM's would have ridden things out and then blamed other factors. But Darryl was willing to take some egg on the face. Whether or not his new vision for the team is a competitive playoff team, you have to acknowledge that moving Phaneuf and Jokinen were probably "addition by subtraction" moves after losing 9 straight and the apparent problems in the dressing room.
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Originally Posted by Agent007 View Post
That's a good point.

Realistically the only problem I'd have if I were a Flames fan was that IMO Sutter didn't get full value in return but he did at least get some solid players that should help round out his team.

Stajan is a 2nd/3rd line center that can produce 50+ points. Out of the three key Leafs players that the Flames got this one has the highest success or bust chance. He's shown that he's capable of putting up points in a Leafs jersey but he'll need to show that he can do the same with the Flames. At the end of the day in the short run he's likely the most important peice of this deal.

Hagman IMO will be a good fit on the Flames and he'll be a solid 25-30 goal scorer for them moving forward. He seems to be a Sutter type of player and he was likely the best players on the ice last night as well.

White is going to be a real solid 2nd pairing defencemen for the Flames. In the short run he'll replace the production that Phanuef was producing and in the long run he'll likely round out as a solid middle pairing guy.

Higgins is worth a shot and if he can find his game then it's worth it and if not then he moves on after this season.

Kotalik is a real interesting player here. He's got the potential to be a solid 20-25 goal scorer but if it doesn't work out then

All in all I do believe that Sutter did a reasonable job in shaking up the locker room and adding some new peices that could work out better for them.

Regher hasn't played well this season and maybe it was because of the reported situation in the locker room with Phanuef. It'll be real interesting to see if he suddenly finds his game because if he doesn't then the Flames are in real trouble.

Overall I do believe the first trade will be one that the Leafs come out as winners in the long run but in the short run the Flames will likely be better off.

Whether we like to admit it or not but as a Canuck fan I can admit that Dion Phanuef does have a ton of potential and it would have been pretty scary if he ever did reach that potential in Calgary. None of the players the Flames got will get close to that potential.

The Flames did improve themselves in the short run but they'll pay for it down the line.

They've got a tough schedule but they do look like a playoff team. A lot of it will depend on how quickly these new guys can gell together with the team.
I gotta agree with these two posts. My thoughts on this whole Calgary ordeal are:

Honestly, there has to be a reason why Phaneuf was moved for so little. Sutter isn't the brightest, but IMO, it's no coincidence that both Jokinen and Phaneuf were moved within a day of each other, to the East, for minimal packages. There must've been stuff in the locker room going on.

Secondly, while Phaneuf should've garnered more than Stajan/White/Hagman/Mayers, it's only because of his future potential, not his current play. No, Ian White isn't as good as him, but the downgrade from Phaneuf right now to White right now is marginal. Adding Stajan and Hagman, who are decent players, over Sjostrom, is great for the Flames who are trying to win now. However, Sutter is an idiot for trading Aulie, who while he is apparently their 4th best d prospect, still is coming off quite a showing with Myers at the WJC.

The Jokinen experiment was a disaster. Plain and simple. But I think most of the GM's around the league know something about Olli now. I won't say he's a cancer, but clearly he's not the most popular guy. Who knows, maybe Sather was the only GM oblivious enough to take Jokinen, and even then, it's not like he gave Sutter a king's ransom in return.

Still, the Flames are better today than they were 3 days ago. 3 years from now, their screwed. If you consider Phaneuf and Jokinen cancers, then they did decent. While Stajan is not a first line center, and Hagman maybe shouldn't be on a first line (let's say he's playing with Iginla), they're still upgrades (albeit small) on Glencross. Or Dawes. Or the many other plugs that Calgary has had to use this season in scoring roles.

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Old
02-02-2010, 06:24 PM
  #129
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cap space

I haven't seen anything on the cap implications .... would this allow them a better shot at Kovalchuk?

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Old
02-02-2010, 06:39 PM
  #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billvanseattle View Post
I haven't seen anything on the cap implications .... would this allow them a better shot at Kovalchuk?
Saves them about 1 million this season. So not a lot. So they would have to move a good chunk of cash in any trade.

Sutter laughed at the prospect of trading for Kovalchuk. GMs can lie, but it really didn't sound like he was even interested.

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Old
02-02-2010, 06:45 PM
  #131
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"Kotalik is a real interesting player here. He's got the potential to be a solid 20-25 goal scorer but if it doesn't work out then "


Ya if he played the entire game on the PP. Hes useless 5 on 5. One of the worst players in the league.

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Old
02-03-2010, 11:36 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
Unless they have something else in store.

They just single handedly blew up the flames in 2 trades.
I am a flames fan,, you gotta get that jokinen and dion were the only 2 guys we got rid of that were of any real impact on the flames. That bieng said, they were both not performing to the level they were expected to perform.. therefore..highly overpaid imo. The defense is in no way worse than before. There are way too many forwards and with all the secondary talent now, i hope sutter guts 3 or 4 more guys for a BONIFIED scoring first liner i.e. lecavalier.. call it wishful thinkin but these are the steps it would take to go that way,,

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Old
02-03-2010, 12:02 PM
  #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajomaa View Post
I am a flames fan,, you gotta get that jokinen and dion were the only 2 guys we got rid of that were of any real impact on the flames. That bieng said, they were both not performing to the level they were expected to perform.. therefore..highly overpaid imo. The defense is in no way worse than before. There are way too many forwards and with all the secondary talent now, i hope sutter guts 3 or 4 more guys for a BONIFIED scoring first liner i.e. lecavalier.. call it wishful thinkin but these are the steps it would take to go that way,,
Except players like Lecavalier and Kovalchuk don't come for free. Unless you think the Flames can bend over other GMs the way Sutter got bent over by Burkie and Sather.

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Old
02-03-2010, 12:05 PM
  #134
cgychieffan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pauser View Post
Except players like Lecavalier and Kovalchuk don't come for free. Unless you think the Flames can bend over other GMs the way Sutter got bent over by Burkie and Sather.
funny,, never said they come for free.. i said wed have to get rid of 3 or 4 players for him.. tampa would rather not have lecavs salary on thier books

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Old
02-03-2010, 12:13 PM
  #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajomaa View Post
funny,, never said they come for free.. i said wed have to get rid of 3 or 4 players for him.. tampa would rather not have lecavs salary on thier books
Well the only players Calgary has that are worth anything in terms of superstar trading value would be Iginla, Bouwmeester, Kipprusoff and Regehr...and as for prospects I would say Backlund. Slim pickings...very slim.

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Old
02-03-2010, 12:50 PM
  #136
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I hope the Flames trade the farm for Lecavalier. He's not producing like a $7.7 million player NOW and the money in his contract doesn't start to dip significantly until 2017-18!

Even if you think he's turned it around, is he really going to produce at that dollar level for the next 8 years?

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Old
02-03-2010, 12:56 PM
  #137
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Flames vets called on the carpet by GM Sutter:
Quote:
One by one they trooped down the hall Tuesday, past the FAN 960 broadcast area, up the stairwell and into the Calgary Flames’ executive offices for a chat. Regehr, Jarome Iginla, Daymond Langkow, the old deck hands on a ship run aground on the rocks. To be chastised like the naughty little boys they’ve been lately.

“What do you think? Not a visit you look forward to,’’ sighed Regehr. “He’s not a happy man.
http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...794/story.html

Next up on the carpet (ownership version) - GM Darryl Sutter?

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Old
02-03-2010, 04:48 PM
  #138
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Calgary not in the Kovy sweepstakes according to Bob McKenzie

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Old
02-03-2010, 05:06 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by One95 View Post
Calgary not in the Kovy sweepstakes according to Bob McKenzie
one big fish down, lets see who else they want

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