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Missing persons report: John Tavares

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Old
02-10-2010, 02:33 PM
  #26
macleod50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter07 View Post
WAAAAA John Tavares
Basically.

Then you have the peanut gallery throwing in their two cents about who the Islanders should have drafted.

As for Tavares's numbers over the last stretch, Duchene had 7 points in his first 20 games and was a -8.

Ups and downs are commonplace for 1st year players. Some people need to take a Xanax and calm the hell down.

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Old
02-10-2010, 02:41 PM
  #27
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As long as Tavares stops his soft passes (especially from the backhand) I'll be fine with the scoring slump.

But he should sit out a game.

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02-10-2010, 02:52 PM
  #28
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If JT wasn't so overhyped the chances are Snow would have drafted somone else .Snow would have been under tremendous pressure had he not drafted JT .If JT doesn't pan out no one will blame Snow for drafting hin because he was the concensus num. 1 .

JT's like the college QB who puts up huge numbers but has a weak arm . In the NFL draft that player would have dropped , but in the NHL , JT's hype carried him to number 1 overall .


Last edited by hotpaws: 02-10-2010 at 02:57 PM.
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Old
02-10-2010, 03:19 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
If JT wasn't so overhyped the chances are Snow would have drafted somone else .Snow would have been under tremendous pressure had he not drafted JT .If JT doesn't pan out no one will blame Snow for drafting hin because he was the concensus num. 1 .

JT's like the college QB who puts up huge numbers but has a weak arm . In the NFL draft that player would have dropped , but in the NHL , JT's hype carried him to number 1 overall .
And that's what makes it the correct pick, even if Duchene does turn out to be the better player (high possibility). Snow & Co needed to stop trying to outsmart everyone. The Islanders organization has done this many times in history and it rarely ever seems to work out. Go with the concensus for once and you won't have fans calling for your head. (However, it may just be horrible luck that the one time we go with the hype, it turns out to be the wrong move).

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02-10-2010, 03:33 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
And that's what makes it the correct pick, even if Duchene does turn out to be the better player (high possibility). Snow & Co needed to stop trying to outsmart everyone. The Islanders organization has done this many times in history and it rarely ever seems to work out. Go with the concensus for once and you won't have fans calling for your head. (However, it may just be horrible luck that the one time we go with the hype, it turns out to be the wrong move).
It was the right move. If NYI picked Duchene and he stumbled or was average and Tavares did well somewhere else Snow would be gone in an instant and NYI would have even more egg on their face than the 10,000 eggs they had prior to picking Tavares.

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Old
02-10-2010, 03:47 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
And that's what makes it the correct pick, even if Duchene does turn out to be the better player (high possibility). Snow & Co needed to stop trying to outsmart everyone. The Islanders organization has done this many times in history and it rarely ever seems to work out. Go with the concensus for once and you won't have fans calling for your head. (However, it may just be horrible luck that the one time we go with the hype, it turns out to be the wrong move).
Your team has drafted well over the years , you just traded the players away . ( i.e. Luongo )

When i said JT was the concensus pick at num. 1 , it was more a media creation than reality . There were huge concerns about JT's skating but they were ignored by the media and the fact that a swede might get picked num. 1 over JT had the canadien media in a tizzy .

JT was also the most known jr. and would have created the most excitment among the L.I. fans and that was a huge reason why Snow drafted him over Hedman or Duchesne .

I don't think you would catch much jr. games in your city so you wouldn't be able to view the different players . Snow was in a no win situation and really had no other option but to draft JT , even if he wanted somone esle .

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Old
02-10-2010, 03:49 PM
  #32
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JT's skating was very well chronicled actually by the scouts. They all said skating was a weakness.

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Old
02-10-2010, 04:09 PM
  #33
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"Patiently" ?


The kid has been a professional hockey player for months now though that's enough patient waiting!!!

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Old
02-10-2010, 04:14 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
Your team has drafted well over the years , you just traded the players away . ( i.e. Luongo )

When i said JT was the concensus pick at num. 1 , it was more a media creation than reality . There were huge concerns about JT's skating but they were ignored by the media and the fact that a swede might get picked num. 1 over JT had the canadien media in a tizzy .

JT was also the most known jr. and would have created the most excitment among the L.I. fans and that was a huge reason why Snow drafted him over Hedman or Duchesne .

I don't think you would catch much jr. games in your city so you wouldn't be able to view the different players . Snow was in a no win situation and really had no other option but to draft JT , even if he wanted somone esle .
Still would rather have JT over the other 2.


Key thing you did not talk about was hockey sense. JT and Dehaan were top 2 in that area.

And your thoughts on why we chose JT because of media hype was wrong.

Snow had other options and we chose the one he wanted. Snow didn't make a draft pick because of the fans or the media. He made draft because he and many see JT as BPA in the draft.

In five years, maybe MD and VH are better. JT will be a good NHL hockey player and when you draft, I think you rather have that.

Lets talk about who is the better player in 5 years

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02-10-2010, 04:20 PM
  #35
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if duchene was drafted instead of tavares wed have had a thread in october about how snow should have taken the consense 1 pick and how dumb he was because JT was scoring goals and duchene was on the - side of +/-.

lets look forward for a change instead of constantly looking back.

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02-10-2010, 05:25 PM
  #36
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I still LOVE the Tavares pick, and think he was and will be the best player in the 2009 draft. I'm just worried about right now, what is wrong ? I think there is something physically wrong with him. There have been several slow, or below average skaters who have done great things in the NHL, for instance, Adam Oates never won any fastest skater contests, yet still produced at a high level, and scored over 1000 points. Brett Hull wasn't a speedster, neither was Mike Bossy. This seems to be more than a slump, players don't slump for 30 games. To not even notch 7 or 8 assists over a 30 game period for a #1 center is unheard of. Being he is a goal scorer, to notch only 1 goal over a 30 goal period, this is more than a slump. I think there is something physically wrong with him. If I'm wrong, and it's all in his head, we have major problems.

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02-10-2010, 05:33 PM
  #37
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I have a strong feeling we will see a high scoring game tonight, with JT getting multiple points.

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Old
02-10-2010, 05:33 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SUNRISE27EMTK View Post
Still would rather have JT over the other 2.


Key thing you did not talk about was hockey sense. JT and Dehaan were top 2 in that area.

And your thoughts on why we chose JT because of media hype was wrong.

Snow had other options and we chose the one he wanted. Snow didn't make a draft pick because of the fans or the media. He made draft because he and many see JT as BPA in the draft.

In five years, maybe MD and VH are better. JT will be a good NHL hockey player and when you draft, I think you rather have that.

Lets talk about who is the better player in 5 years
JT hockey sense is way over rated . Floating around in open space waiting for the puck to come to him is not what i call great hockey sense . Hovering around the net waitng for a pass or a rebound to come to him while everyone else is engaged in the play is not what i call great hockey sense .

JT didn't put up his numbers in jr by playing a 3 zone game . JT was always the first out of his zone and the last one back . JT had 4 years in jr to develope his game and chose not to .

Snow could have picked somone else or he could have traded down but how would have the fans on Long Island reacted had he not taken JT .

JT will be a good player for you but his skating will never allow him to be a elite player and thats what you hope to get with the first overall pick .

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Old
02-10-2010, 05:44 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
JT hockey sense is way over rated . Floating around in open space waiting for the puck to come to him is not what i call great hockey sense . Hovering around the net waitng for a pass or a rebound to come to him while everyone else is engaged in the play is not what i call great hockey sense .

JT didn't put up his numbers in jr by playing a 3 zone game . JT was always the first out of his zone and the last one back . JT had 4 years in jr to develope his game and chose not to .

Snow could have picked somone else or he could have traded down but how would have the fans on Long Island reacted had he not taken JT .

JT will be a good player for you but his skating will never allow him to be a elite player and thats what you hope to get with the first overall pick .
Ummm, knowing where to be on the ice is very important and not every player is good at it. Obviously, JT is. Knowing where to be/go to getopen is hard to do. And from everything I have ever read or heard about the kid is that he always wants to work to get better so I don't know where you got that from.

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Old
02-10-2010, 05:47 PM
  #40
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I expected 40 to 50 points. So not too disappointed. If I'm alarmed by anything, it's that he started off so well and now looks like he doesn't belong. Which is a sign of poor conditioning and/or lack of creativity. It's the complete opposite of Stamkos lat year.

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Old
02-10-2010, 06:05 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
JT hockey sense is way over rated . Floating around in open space waiting for the puck to come to him is not what i call great hockey sense . Hovering around the net waitng for a pass or a rebound to come to him while everyone else is engaged in the play is not what i call great hockey sense .

JT didn't put up his numbers in jr by playing a 3 zone game . JT was always the first out of his zone and the last one back . JT had 4 years in jr to develope his game and chose not to .

Snow could have picked somone else or he could have traded down but how would have the fans on Long Island reacted had he not taken JT .

JT will be a good player for you but his skating will never allow him to be a elite player and thats what you hope to get with the first overall pick .
This kind of analysis only looks half acceptable because JT is struggling. We have to stop pretending like skating is an attribute that cannot be improved. Many players, regardless of their height have improved their skating mightily. As far as natural finishing ability, JT's is much higher than that of Duchene. Duchene is faster, and that is what makes him better in the other 2 zones. However, once JT gets stronger and faster, he'll be an offensive force. And it's not a matter of if as far as I'm concerned. He will become both faster and stronger. He's on pace for 45 points. If that's a failure to some of you at the age of 19. I'll take that for year one. Duchene is on pace for 56 points, but be objective and realize that he has Stastny, Wolski, and Hejduk on his team as well. Both will be great, time is all they need.

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Old
02-10-2010, 06:07 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by IslesFanatic View Post
Ummm, knowing where to be on the ice is very important and not every player is good at it. Obviously, JT is. Knowing where to be/go to getopen is hard to do. And from everything I have ever read or heard about the kid is that he always wants to work to get better so I don't know where you got that from.
I watched him since he was 13 years old when he was playing against my nephew and i watched for 4 years in jr. . He never changed his style of play and he never attempted too .

Come up to Toronto and i'll show you a bunch of kids that play minor hockey the exact same way he does , it's not a real hard way to play .

Todays game is very fast and the players don't have alot of time or space to work with and with JT's lack of speed and size he's going to struggle until he adds some strength and picks up a step or 2 .

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Old
02-10-2010, 06:29 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
I watched him since he was 13 years old when he was playing against my nephew and i watched for 4 years in jr. . He never changed his style of play and he never attempted too .

Come up to Toronto and i'll show you a bunch of kids that play minor hockey the exact same way he does , it's not a real hard way to play .

Todays game is very fast and the players don't have alot of time or space to work with and with JT's lack of speed and size he's going to struggle until he adds some strength and picks up a step or 2 .
If its such an easy way to play then why dont more people have his goal totals? Just sayin...

And to re-iterate what JP said, I would hardly call a 45 point rookie season "struggling", especially when your main competitor is on pace for less than 10 points more.

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Old
02-10-2010, 06:52 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
And that's what makes it the correct pick, even if Duchene does turn out to be the better player (high possibility). Snow & Co needed to stop trying to outsmart everyone. The Islanders organization has done this many times in history and it rarely ever seems to work out. Go with the concensus for once and you won't have fans calling for your head. (However, it may just be horrible luck that the one time we go with the hype, it turns out to be the wrong move).
This!


I'm not ready to label Tavares a bust, nor am I ready to declare Duchene the better player (and vice versa)

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Old
02-10-2010, 07:25 PM
  #45
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these threads and arguments just make me laugh.
He is 2nd in rookies in scoring!!!
He is 19.
C'mon people!!!

He hasnt changed the way he played?? Good!!! He broke Gretzky's records. Why change???
Give him more then 60 games in the nhl to find his game in the nhl.

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Old
02-10-2010, 09:07 PM
  #46
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The thing about JT that has me worried is that I can't remember the last time i've seen a rookie (let alone a #1 overall) on his back so much. He is such an incredibly weak skater, much more so than ANY of us thought/realized. Maybe its his age, maybe its the better competition, maybe it'll improve greatly over time...god I hope so because I can't remember seeing a first overall with such a skating deficiency.

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Old
02-10-2010, 09:20 PM
  #47
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The thing about JT that has me worried is that I can't remember the last time i've seen a rookie (let alone a #1 overall) on his back so much. He is such an incredibly weak skater, much more so than ANY of us thought/realized. Maybe its his age, maybe its the better competition, maybe it'll improve greatly over time...god I hope so because I can't remember seeing a first overall with such a skating deficiency.
At this point he's squeezing the stick so tight you can practically see sawdust coming from his gloves. If he hits one more post we might need to put the kid on suicide watch. Never seen anything like this. Between bad luck and more frequently--simply choking---this streak is becoming epic.

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02-10-2010, 09:23 PM
  #48
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The thing about JT that has me worried is that I can't remember the last time i've seen a rookie (let alone a #1 overall) on his back so much. He is such an incredibly weak skater, much more so than ANY of us thought/realized. Maybe its his age, maybe its the better competition, maybe it'll improve greatly over time...god I hope so because I can't remember seeing a first overall with such a skating deficiency.
His skating is definitely choppy, but even on his slump he's been able to get in good scoring position. Tonight for example he run one off the post from the slot and flubbed one wide open in front of the net.

He was drafted #1 because he has elite finishing skills. He showed in the first half that he can use them. He's shown in the second half that he's not quite ready physically or mentally for a full NHL season. Just like almost every rookie his age. Joe Thornton and Rick DiPietro were both brutal at the beginning of their careers, and they progressed because they have skill.

Tavares has skill too, and I think he'll be a 40 goal scorer in this league in due time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYISchremp44
At this point he's squeezing the stick so tight you can practically see sawdust coming from his gloves. If he hits one more post we might need to put the kid on suicide watch. Never seen anything like this. Between bad luck and more frequently--simply choking---this streak is becoming epic
Upsettingly, we saw pretty much the same thing earlier this season from our other prized young forward. Okposo couldn't buy a goal.

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Old
02-10-2010, 09:28 PM
  #49
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hmm...maybe wearing #91 as a 1st overall pick is bad luck?

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Old
02-10-2010, 09:33 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatientlyWaiting View Post
Out of shape? Too rigid of a schedule? What is contributing to John Tavares' invisible act?

I'm starting to think a stint in the AHL might be what the doctor ordered. He needs his confidence back, and he needs it fast.
Hes 19 & is a rookie.

What exactly did you expect ...150 pts?

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