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Habs trade 2nd rounder (2011) for Dominic Moore

View Poll Results: What's your take on the trade?
Happy with it 37 21.26%
Lateral move 22 12.64%
Gave too much for a pending UFA 4th liner 99 56.90%
Very angry with the move! Fire Gauthier! 16 9.20%
Voters: 174. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:00 AM
  #926
shealy04
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Great trade! Maybe a 2nd is a bit of an overpayment, but it keeps looking more and more like we're going to make the playoffs (knock on wood, obviously) and our bottom 6 hasn't been getting it done all season.

Post Olympics break:

Andrei-Pleks-Cammy
Pooh-Gomez-Gionta
Pyatt-Moore-Sergei

...looks much better than what we're currently throwing out there right now.

Also, if these crazy Frolov rumours come true, this looks even better:

Andrei-Pleks-Cammy
Pooh-Gomez-Gionta
Frolov-Moore-Sergei


All in all, I really like the Moore trade. Second rounders aren't guaranteed to work out, and I really like this move for the team right now.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:10 AM
  #927
Erik Estrada
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It's expensive but with the huge amount of injuries there's some scarcity on the market... He's an upgrade on Metropolit who's too slow, and Lapierre who hasn't had a great season... He can fill in a Top-6 role if either Gomez or Plex goes down.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:11 AM
  #928
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shealy04 View Post
Great trade! Maybe a 2nd is a bit of an overpayment, but it keeps looking more and more like we're going to make the playoffs (knock on wood, obviously) and our bottom 6 hasn't been getting it done all season.

Post Olympics break:

Andrei-Pleks-Cammy
Pooh-Gomez-Gionta
Pyatt-Moore-Sergei

...looks much better than what we're currently throwing out there right now.

Also, if these crazy Frolov rumours come true, this looks even better:

Andrei-Pleks-Cammy
Pooh-Gomez-Gionta
Frolov-Moore-Sergei


All in all, I really like the Moore trade. Second rounders aren't guaranteed to work out, and I really like this move for the team right now.
Frolov would definitely play with Cammy so you can definitely switch Andrei and Frolov.

I know that a lot will not agree but if we were to get Frolov, I would used the Kostitsyn to get a REAL number 2 defenseman to play with Markov.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:12 AM
  #929
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I don't know if many of you realize how bad a 2rd pick in 11' is.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:12 AM
  #930
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
It's expensive but with the huge amount of injuries there's some scarcity on the market... He's an upgrade on Metropolit who's too slow, and Lapierre who hasn't had a great season... He can fill in a Top-6 role if either Gomez or Plex goes down.
Didn't you read the thread back in late November, Metro is Moses lol

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:13 AM
  #931
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Maxwell was clearly not cutting it and getting Moore (who can also play on the wing) is an upgrade over him. He's also excellent defensively and is a good penalty killer. Basically, he makes the Habs a better team now by improving the bottom lines.

A 2nd round pick in what is perceived as a very bad draft year isn't a very big price to pay (except on HFboards, where some people care more about draft picks than winning games...).

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:14 AM
  #932
shealy04
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Originally Posted by 79 André Marcoux View Post
Frolov would definitely play with Cammy so you can definitely switch Andrei and Frolov.

I know that a lot will not agree but if we were to get Frolov, I would used the Kostitsyn to get a REAL number 2 defenseman to play with Markov.
Regardless how you combine the top 9 skaters, the point is that it looks a helluva lot better than our current lineup.

I'm sick and tired of Metro (love him and his sweet hands) because he's slow, takes bad penalties, and is bad defensively and Lapierre has clearly played himself out of a top 9 role this year (if not entirely off the team).

This is a solid trade. I wish people would relax and stop acting like we just traded away a huge piece of a future by sending away a 2nd rounder in a weak draft class.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:21 AM
  #933
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Originally Posted by shealy04 View Post
Regardless how you combine the top 9 skaters, the point is that it looks a helluva lot better than our current lineup.

I'm sick and tired of Metro (love him and his sweet hands) because he's slow, takes bad penalties, and is bad defensively and Lapierre has clearly played himself out of a top 9 role this year (if not entirely off the team).

This is a solid trade. I wish people would relax and stop acting like we just traded away a huge piece of a future by sending away a 2nd rounder in a weak draft class.
I agree with you. But I still think that we should upgrade our defense before our offense...

Let's say we trade Lapierre and Weber to LA for Frolov... does that mean that we will have traded three solid assets for two players that won't be back next year?

I wouldn't be opposed to those moves if we were contenders but we are clearly not.

My guess is that it was our only move (except maybe Mara for a pick) and people will be upset.

Another exciting end of season to come in Habsland...

EDIT : I really doubt that the plan is to roll three offensive lines. If it was the case, Gauthier would have give a little more to get Matt Cullen instead.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:22 AM
  #934
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Originally Posted by Gman3 View Post
I don't know if many of you realize how bad a 2rd pick in 11' is.
I don't know if you've realized that pick could've been part of package for a better rental (or straight up for that matter) this year or the next.

It's not just the pick, it's an asset that's thrown away for a dime a dozen player.

People not figuring that out make me seriously .

Unless it's to allow us to trade Metro for a higher price (which is doubtful, would you give up a 2011 first or 2010 2nd for Metro?), this is seriously some terrible long-term asset evaluation.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:31 AM
  #935
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Almost 40 pages for Dominic Moore. Habs fans rule. I wonder if this means trading Metro. Mara can also go to a team needing depth. We could get some picks back and even things out.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:33 AM
  #936
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Some of you need to realize this was a lateral move in which we overpaid for a dime a dozen player.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:34 AM
  #937
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 79 André Marcoux View Post
I agree with you. But I still think that we should upgrade our defense before our offense...

Let's say we trade Lapierre and Weber to LA for Frolov... does that mean that we will have traded three solid assets for two players that won't be back next year?

I wouldn't be opposed to those moves if we were contenders but we are clearly not.

My guess is that it was our only move (except maybe Mara for a pick) and people will be upset.

Another exciting end of season to come in Habsland...

EDIT : I really doubt that the plan is to roll three offensive lines. If it was the case, Gauthier would have give a little more to get Matt Cullen instead.

I hear what you're saying about us not being contenders this year, but I still think it's nice to see us make a move to make us a more solid team heading into the stretch run/hopefully the playoffs.

See the line-up I posted above (IF Frolov trade goes through), gives us three lines that can score for sure, but I don't look at them just as "offensive" lines... all three has at least two solid defensive players (even on the third line you'd have Moore and Sergei who are both very solid in their own end).

The move I'm most surprised about isn't the Moore trade but the Subban call-up! I honestly thought PK would spend the entire year in Hamilton... and he might still if he gets sent down for the Olympic break after the two Philly games and remains there.
But anyways, I totally didn't see that one coming at all! I hope he thrives up in his first stint!

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:34 AM
  #938
Erik Estrada
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Originally Posted by hotcarle View Post
Almost 40 pages for Dominic Moore. Habs fans rule. I wonder if this means trading Metro. Mara can also go to a team needing depth. We could get some picks back and even things out.
We're almost at 1000 posts. Can't wait to see "Moore-Part 2". lol

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:37 AM
  #939
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Well when you see how the Sharks gave up a 2010 2nd rounder for Wallin (#5 D with a Cup ring), this trade isn't that bad market value wise if you look at Moore as a good 3rd liner.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:37 AM
  #940
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Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
Some of you need to realize this was a lateral move in which we overpaid for a dime a dozen player.
Just about to say the same thing.
How is Moore an upgrade from Metro?

Metro buries this guy, and we overpaid.

People were outraged about Gainey and Gomez - but I keep saying lets wait till playoffs before making final judgements on him.

Sorry, but I hate almost every move Gauthier has done so far - getting rid of White - bringing up Pyatt ?

And now Moore - I mean what is this Midget Hockey ?

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:40 AM
  #941
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Well when you see how the Sharks gave up a 2010 2nd rounder for Wallin (#5 D with a Cup ring), this trade isn't that bad market value wise if you look at Moore as a good 3rd liner.
They also gave up Gorges and a 1st for a marginal top 4 Dman who was benched.

What's the point?

They also are miles ahead of us in terms of contending ability. So throwing away an asset for a better shot at the Cup makes perfect sense.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:40 AM
  #942
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and why is it 40 pages about Moore ?
not because of the impact of trade, but its the 1st thing Gauthier does and it clearly shows hes off his rocker.
Damn Houle looks good to me right about now.

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Old
02-12-2010, 07:57 AM
  #943
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Originally Posted by Erik Estrada View Post
We're almost at 1000 posts. Can't wait to see "Moore-Part 2". lol
no maybe the NEXT TRADE will all make us forget about Moore.....

like "oh may $@$ we gave a 1st rounder for Joel Perrault?"

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02-12-2010, 07:58 AM
  #944
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Originally Posted by Gman3 View Post
I don't know if many of you realize how bad a 2rd pick in 11' is.
Although you are correct in many scouts assessment's of the '11 draft being one of the weakeast in years, this applies to a lack of bonafide top end talent for high first round picks.

The scouts talk about how there are no clear cut elite talents emerging at this point (like a Tavares, Crosby, etc) that you will be able to draft in the Top 5 and expect them to be playing and making an impact in the NHL the following season.

Too many people have generalized this claim as applying to the entire draft; that there isn't any good talent to be had. Its more of a case of no players standing out and scouts being able to say "this kid is going to be a legitimate star in the NHL". Because these lines have been blurred and no one is standing out, it appears as you may find yourself a top end talent (not superstar) in the 2nd or 3rd round (or later) since the players so far haven't separated themselves.

And yah, history will show us, weak draft or not, that approximately only 3-5 players taken in the 2nd round make it to the NHL as regulars. And the number of players that could be considered top paring talent is even fewer. Odds are, good draft year or not, that a 2nd rounder is not going to turn into anything of value. You really only have about a 10-20% chance of a second round pick turning into a top paring NHL regular.

But the fact is, this low percentage is still better than finding these types of players in the 3rd round and below.

I think people are upset that instead of having this 10-20% chance, we now have a 0% chance. Where a Dominic Moore type of player is a dime a dozen.

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Old
02-12-2010, 08:01 AM
  #945
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Originally Posted by MTLPacman67 View Post
They also gave up Gorges and a 1st for a marginal top 4 Dman who was benched.

What's the point?

They also are miles ahead of us in terms of contending ability. So throwing away an asset for a better shot at the Cup makes perfect sense.
NHL market value of Moore might be higher than we think.

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Old
02-12-2010, 08:02 AM
  #946
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Well when you see how the Sharks gave up a 2010 2nd rounder for Wallin (#5 D with a Cup ring), this trade isn't that bad market value wise if you look at Moore as a good 3rd liner.
This is a terrible move. We probably could have had Ponikarovski for a 2nd rounder. Pony is 3x better than Moore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by koivu View Post
Metro buries this guy, and we overpaid.

Sorry, but I hate almost every move Gauthier has done so far - getting rid of White - bringing up Pyatt ?
QFT and I hate the way HF posters over value Metro, but Metro is also better than Moore ainec.

Quote:
Originally Posted by koivu View Post
and why is it 40 pages about Moore ?
not because of the impact of trade, but its the 1st thing Gauthier does and it clearly shows hes off his rocker.
More sad but true. The quicker we get a replacement, the better. He's trying to make the playoffs his first year as GM and he's pissing away assets to do so.

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Old
02-12-2010, 08:07 AM
  #947
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Hmm, still processing so the quality should improve later.

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Old
02-12-2010, 08:08 AM
  #948
Em Ancien
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
NHL market value of Moore might be higher than we think.
The point is more or less you might as well stay pat if you have to pay such a price for an average player.

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02-12-2010, 08:10 AM
  #949
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Its a 2011 second round pick to show just how bad it is


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_NHL_Entry_Draft

This page list all trades for any pick in 2011, my personal favorite is this one,

"The Leafs traded a second round pick in 2011 and a third round pick in 2011 for there second round pick in 2010"

"The Philadelphia Flyers' second-round pick will go to the Phoenix Coyotes as the result of a trade on March 4, 2009 that sent Daniel Carcillo to Philadelphia in exchange for Scottie Upshall and this pick."

Not exactly a blockbuster return eh?

In this year there have already been 12 picks traded two years away, to give you an idea of how many usually get traded last year there were only a handful of trades made that weren't done on the day of.

These websites say what I already have mentioned

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...king-weak.html

A few quotes,

“I’ve been in this racket for 15 years and straight across the board this is the weakest draft. Straight across the board, without question.” – Canadian Hockey League scout.

“It’s funny you say that,” the scout said. “We were somewhere watching a game and there was a Russian scout there and he said, ‘You know what, in Russia it’s the same thing.’ That shocked me. I figured, ‘Holy, is this worldwide? Do we have bad water or something?’ ”

http://thepipelineshow.blogspot.com/...aft-watch.html


"It might be a bit of a down year for the OHL, compared to recent years, but does that make 2001 a weak draft class all on its own? Of course not but still I am told that the overall depth won't be the same as we've had with 2008, 2009 and the group available in June of 2010."

So top end talent will be good but there will be no depth like past drafts,

The pick is worth the equivalent of a 3rd round this year and from that you cannot say we could package it for an impact forward of any kind.

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02-12-2010, 08:11 AM
  #950
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I think he can be a decent 3rd line player... but I feel a 2nd rounder for him was a bit much... regardless if it is thought of as a "weak draft" or not .
Who says it is a weak draft anyways? there is still a season to be played next year...

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