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Team MVP(s) to This Point of the Season: You Rank 'Em

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Old
02-16-2010, 05:38 PM
  #76
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Again I think Richards struggles have a lot to do with Gagne.

he is on pace for 2 more goals than last year, just like 15 less assists. How can a playmaker get assists if his linemates can't finish?

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Old
02-16-2010, 05:48 PM
  #77
Mr Oysterhead
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Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Again I think Richards struggles have a lot to do with Gagne.

he is on pace for 2 more goals than last year, just like 15 less assists. How can a playmaker get assists if his linemates can't finish?
That's a really good point. If Gagne had been healthy and played like the Gagne we know all season Richie's numbers would probably be better than they were last year.

Also, not playing point on the power play as much as last year could be indicative of his lack of assists and increase in goals.

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Old
02-16-2010, 11:53 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Our bottom 6+ (Giroux, JVR, Asham, Powe, Betts, Lappy, and Carcillo) have combined to score: 48 goals (25 by Giroux and JVR). We have scored 179 goals as a team. So, the bottom 7 players on this roster have accounted for 27% of the teams goals. 2 of them, have accounted for 14% of the teams goals.

It's great to celebrate the bottom 6, but if they were the ones leading this team...we wouldn't be the 6 seed in the East as of today.
The bottom six's job isn't primarily to score goals...though it's always a welcome thing, you also want energy, checking, strong defensive play, and players who can play a role on the PK, giving the top six guys an opportunity for a bigger bite ES and on the PP. These are all important aspects to team success and Betts gives you competency in all of those areas. If you had to pick one guy on the team who consistently plays over his salary (i.e, is underpaid), it's Betts...which, in my book, kind of elevates him further into consideration.

This "MVP" thing is subjective, and each person has their own criteria. Stats are nice, but to limit it to just goal scoring seems a bit myopic. Look at Goals Against per 60 mins played, and see that Betts is a close second best on the team behind Carcillo, with a somewhat decent QUALCOMP. He's also among the team top face-off guys and arguably it's best PKer...and he rarely takes penalties. Look at the team's record with him in versus him out...and compare the PK % too.

I know it's hard to believe, that a role player making 600k can be that important, but when you consider the impact he has on the team, Betts I feel does grade out to be one of the team's top 5 most valuable players...for me:

Pronger
Carter
Timonen
Richards
Betts

HM: Leighton

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Old
02-17-2010, 12:28 AM
  #79
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I know it's hard to believe, that a role player making 600k can be that important, but when you consider the impact he has on the team, Betts I feel does grade out to be one of the team's top 5 most valuable players...for me:
Yeah, well, I've spent the last 2+ seasons asking for a third line center...so, I'm all about the role players. But your bottom 6 being a good bottom 6 does not make 'em MVPs...and it's especially disingenuous to celebrate our bottom 6 and act like the top 6 has done nothing this year.

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Old
02-17-2010, 12:37 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Yeah, well, I've spent the last 2+ seasons asking for a third line center...so, I'm all about the role players. But your bottom 6 being a good bottom 6 does not make 'em MVPs...and it's especially disingenuous to celebrate our bottom 6 and act like the top 6 has done nothing this year.
If this was a single MVP situation, where you have to choose one at the exclusion of all others, then sure, very few if any people would designate Blair Betts, but in a format like this, where you can single out a few outstanding players, he's worthy of consideration, no? He's 5th on my list...and lots of others on here have him on their lists. So, by whatever criteria people have amalgamted in their heads, it seems Betts grades out as one of the team's most valuable players...that's not to say that I'd rather lose certain other players before losing Betts if you want to think in those terms, but he just kind of deserves the designation for his outstanding contributions, at an outstanding pricetag.

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Old
02-17-2010, 12:41 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by fauxflex View Post
If this was a single MVP situation, where you have to choose one at the exclusion of all others, then sure, very few if any people would designate Blair Betts, but in a format like this, where you can single out a few outstanding players, he's worthy of consideration, no? He's 5th on my list...and lots of others on here have him on their lists. So, by whatever criteria people have amalgamted in their heads, it seems Betts grades out as one of the team's most valuable players...that's not to say that I'd rather lose certain other players before losing Betts if you want to think in those terms, but he just kind of deserves the designation for his outstanding contributions, at an outstanding pricetag.
You kind of missed what caused that conversation to ensue, apparently. It had nothing to do with putting one of the bottom 6 on the list. I think you can make a very strong argument for Betts to be on the list.

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Old
02-17-2010, 12:46 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
You kind of missed what caused that conversation to ensue, apparently. It had nothing to do with putting one of the bottom 6 on the list. I think you can make a very strong argument for Betts to be on the list.
Ok sorry, I didn't read the whole thread.

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Old
02-17-2010, 08:25 AM
  #83
JXC
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I'd say the impact is large. I haven't looked at numbers to back it up but I'd say our offense isn't as good as it was last year and our defense is much better. He also greatly elevated the level of Carle's play (not to discredit Carle, but this isn't the first time Pronger has made his linemate considerably better)
Surely. It is hard to estimate, I guess, the value of a given single player unl;ess he is superstar like a Ovechkin.

Pronger does that the great QUIMQUOM and the atmospheric TIMTAM numbers, not to mention his GIGLI rating ( )...

I just think Richards really helped the team plow through the bad times and I think the Flyers would suffer moreso if he went down than they would with anyone else.

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Old
02-18-2010, 12:59 AM
  #84
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Pronger
Richards
Laviolette
Leighton
Betts


So many people have Carter and Timonen on their lists. I agree they have both played exceptional the last month, but the season is almost 4 months old and I still remember the first 2 months of Kimmo playing hurt/like crap and Carter floating.

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