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Who Is The Best Local Hockey Player At Each Position?

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Old
02-16-2010, 04:24 PM
  #26
NY Ranger86
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What a surprise... Brodeur doesn't start in Olympics.

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02-16-2010, 04:25 PM
  #27
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What a surprise... Brodeur doesn't start in Olympics.
Milbury wasn't too happy about that.

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Old
02-16-2010, 04:32 PM
  #28
NY Ranger86
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Milbury wasn't too happy about that.
I know lol

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Old
02-16-2010, 05:27 PM
  #29
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Right now-
Gaborik>>>Kovalchuk
Martin>>>Rangers Defense
Lundqvist>>>>>>Broduer

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02-16-2010, 05:33 PM
  #30
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it's unfortunate that a lot of our opinion needs to be based on stats, whether directly or indirectly. I can't say I've seen a heck of a lot of Devils' games, but I can say that I don't think Marty's had to deal with what Henke has had to deal with in terms of what's happening in front of him: quality shots, odd man rushes, etc. Sure, Brodeur has more shutouts, but his GAA isn't significantly better and if you're 7-2 in terms of shutouts, and that's part of an argument, the GAA must be significantly better. It would imply that Lundqvist has had less hills and valleys (although that's hard to believe given his lumpy ride). But we all do know that from watching these Rangers Lundqvist has kept his team in a position to get a point in many, many games, as I'm sure Marty has.

Bottom line, Rangers fans are fine keeping Henke and Devils' fans are fine keeping Marty.

At forward, I'd personally go with Gaborik, if we're talking about best forward based on his overall contribution to the team this season. I don't even think it's that close. Kovalchuk may end up being the better guy, but to date, Gabby's done a heck of a lot more as a forward to the Rangers than any other forward has done for either team.

On defense...I'd have to think there's a defenseman on the Devils that's better than the Rangers' 6.

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02-16-2010, 05:42 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by NY Ranger86 View Post
its a team game, he didn't do it on his own.

a defensive system has carried this slightly above average goaltender his whole career.
No. Just... no. This is such an flawed perspective.

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02-16-2010, 05:48 PM
  #32
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Bottom line, Rangers fans are fine keeping Henke and Devils' fans are fine keeping Marty.
Exactly. Not sure why this becomes so contentious.

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02-16-2010, 06:02 PM
  #33
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its a team game, he didn't do it on his own.

a defensive system has carried this slightly above average goaltender his whole career.
...really? Hating on Fatso is fun and all, but that's just absurd.

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Old
02-16-2010, 06:02 PM
  #34
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it's been a neverending debate since the Devils won the Cup. Marty's one of the most prolific goaltenders of all time but won't get respect from more than a handful of Rangers fans. Even though he was consistent, through rule changes, new coaches and new teammates over 15 seasons, Rangers fans will always find a reason why he's overrated.

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Old
02-16-2010, 06:15 PM
  #35
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marian/marc/martin

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Old
02-16-2010, 06:20 PM
  #36
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...really? Hating on Fatso is fun and all, but that's just absurd.
Agreed. At this point, with all he's accomplished, his ability to stay healthy, the fact that he's started 67 or more games every season but one since the '95-'96 season, you can't claim its the system.

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:01 PM
  #37
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I'd honestly rather have Gabby than Kovy if I'm building a team. Martin wins defense, Lundqvist goaltender.

Sad that no one on the Isles is even in this discussion. I guess Streit can have an honorable mention.

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:12 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by NY Ranger86 View Post
its a team game, he didn't do it on his own.

a defensive system has carried this slightly above average goaltender his whole career.
I'll agree with this,put hank on martys teams and in that system and he wouldve done the same exact thing, hank is better

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:15 PM
  #39
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I'll agree with this,put hank on martys teams and in that system and he wouldve done the same exact thing, hank is better
That is a ridiculous thing to say, there is no way of knowing something like that. Cups and records for longevity mean a lot more than head-to-head record.

If this is true, when Brodeur retires his replacement in theory should go on to finish 1st or second in all time wins after him? I call ********.

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02-16-2010, 07:18 PM
  #40
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I've said this before and I'll say it again. Wasn't backstrom a stud last year? what happened this year oh yeah hes no playing in a defensive system. wasn't roloson a stud under lemaire in minny as a goalie in his 30's, oh yeah it was in a defensive system. now compare clemmensens stats from last year with martys, is it just a coincidence that they are almost identical, with clemmensen having an edge in the stats department. my point is in this kind of system even average goalies are made look great.


clemmensen 2008-2009 Devils 40 25 13 - 1 2 94 1,138 .917 2.39
brodeur 2008-2009 Devils 31 19 9 - 3 5 73 870 .916 2.41

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:20 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Fitzy View Post
That is a ridiculous thing to say, there is no way of knowing something like that. Cups and records for longevity mean a lot more than head-to-head record.

If this is true, when Brodeur retires his replacement in theory should go on to finish 1st or second in all time wins after him? I call ********.
so this is just all one big coincidence youre telling me? roloson backstrom and clemmensen i guess this is just one big coincidence?

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02-16-2010, 07:21 PM
  #42
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So the Devils, who won only one of their cups under Lemaire, we just so freaking awesome with a defense of Mike Mottau, Johnny Oduya, and other "studs" just make an average goaltender in Brodeur look great, is that what i'm to understand here?

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02-16-2010, 07:23 PM
  #43
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Uncle Daddy has given up 3 or more goals in 16 of his last 27 games...conversely Henrik has given up 3 or more just 7 times during his past 27 games...and hes only given up more than 3, 3 times in that span, VS 6 times by Brodeur.

Lundqvist has faced 34 more shots than Broduer despite playing in 4 fewer games (29 Shots per game for Lundqvist, only 26 for Brodeur.)

If youve ever watched a Ranger game, you know Henrik faces probably 10 breakaways every 2-3 games... If youve ever watched a Devils game Broduer faces probably 10 breakaways every 10-15 games.

Lundqvist>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brodeur

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:24 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Fitzy View Post
So the Devils, who won only one of their cups under Lemaire, we just so freaking awesome with a defense of Mike Mottau, Johnny Oduya, and other "studs" just make an average goaltender in Brodeur look great, is that what i'm to understand here?
theyve played a defensive system no matter who their coach has been. Lou has that system in place and that is why they value their homegrown talent so much. they learn that system from the second they step on the ice in trenton thats why they can just roll players into the line-up because they already know the style.

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:26 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by kyko1827 View Post
theyve played a defensive system no matter who their coach has been. Lou has that system in place and that is why they value their homegrown talent so much. they learn that system from the second they step on the ice in trenton thats why they can just roll players into the line-up because they already know the style.
There is no system that good. If there was every team would implement it. Has Minnesota won cups? no. Gaborik's offensive production hasn't improved under a "offensive" coach in Torts.

I understand dislike of Brodeur. I dont like him much either, I think hes a bit of a doochebag. But people who think he isnt one of the best of all time are blind.

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02-16-2010, 07:27 PM
  #46
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Some of these posts are absurd.

Marian Gaborik is probably the best forward, yes.

Anyone who says the best defenseman is NOT Paul Martin has not watched him play enough. Dude's a stud.

Like someone above me said, hating on Maaaaaaaarty is fun, but get real people, he's a top 3 ALL-TIME goalie. But right now the King is playing better.

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:30 PM
  #47
Inferno
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Originally Posted by Fitzy View Post
There is no system that good. If there was every team would implement it. Has Minnesota won cups? no. Gaborik's offensive production hasn't improved under a "offensive" coach in Torts.

I understand dislike of Brodeur. I dont like him much either, I think hes a bit of a doochebag. But people who think he isnt one of the best of all time are blind.
its a regular season system imho. it doesnt work as well in the playoffs, especially post lockout.

The Devils had some of the greatest teams ever assembled playing a system that protected their goalie and took advantage of some really ridiculous speed players in Mogilny, and some very fast skating defenseman...they revolutionized that aspect of hockey, having fast, mobile defenseman in favor of big lumbering ones...

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Old
02-16-2010, 07:38 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Fitzy View Post
There is no system that good. If there was every team would implement it. Has Minnesota won cups? no. Gaborik's offensive production hasn't improved under a "offensive" coach in Torts.

I understand dislike of Brodeur. I dont like him much either, I think hes a bit of a doochebag. But people who think he isnt one of the best of all time are blind.
he has 35 goals and 34 assists is 58 games his career high is 42 goals 41 assists in 77 games, right now hes on pace for 46 goals 45 assists if he were to play 77 games although its not drastic it has improved. and i dont think a defensive system really hurts a players offensive productive as much as it inflates goaltenders stats

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Old
02-16-2010, 09:23 PM
  #49
darko
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Originally Posted by NY Ranger86 View Post
its a team game, he didn't do it on his own.

a defensive system has carried this slightly above average goaltender his whole career.
Haha yeah all the way up to 2nd or 3rd greatest goalie of all time. Come on now dude, take your Devil-hating glasses off for a second or two.

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Old
02-16-2010, 09:24 PM
  #50
darko
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Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
Some of these posts are absurd.

Marian Gaborik is probably the best forward, yes.

Anyone who says the best defenseman is NOT Paul Martin has not watched him play enough. Dude's a stud.

Like someone above me said, hating on Maaaaaaaarty is fun, but get real people, he's a top 3 ALL-TIME goalie. But right now the King is playing better.
Definitely. Shows how underrated Martin really is. He is probably 1 of the most underrated players in NHL.

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