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Joe getting bashed!

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Old
02-22-2010, 04:37 PM
  #26
Kitten Mittons
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Originally Posted by yadadaiholla View Post
Your boy is getzlaf. You always take him in a battle between thornton and getzlaf. I felt i had to bust your chops
Oh... I guess I could use the "he just came off an injury" excuse. But at least Getz was chirping at Kesler a little bit - Joe had 0 emotion as always.

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02-22-2010, 04:38 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by CrazedZooChimp View Post
I thought you were talking about Semenov
No, Semenov is Tomahawk214's boy

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Old
02-22-2010, 04:38 PM
  #28
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No, Semenov is Tomahawk214's boy
That ******* cheated on me????

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02-22-2010, 04:43 PM
  #29
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I wonder just what it would take for our media to blame Crosby for anything. After the Swiss game it was that he didn't get enough ice time, now it's that they just don't know who to play with him. Hmm, the guy seems to do fine with Bill Guerin and Pascal Dupuis, so in a situation where you can draw names out of a hat and give him elite linemates, maybe it's Crosby himself who's playing poorly.

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Old
02-22-2010, 04:52 PM
  #30
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Gotta love posts like this
Just one of many
Though I'm finding the Luongo>Brodeur battle even more amusing.

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Old
02-22-2010, 04:56 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Thresher View Post
Gotta love posts like this
Just one of many
Though I'm finding the Luongo>Brodeur battle even more amusing.
Many are talking about Fleury too

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:00 PM
  #32
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the only thing that im surprised about is that a bunch of canadians on this board apparently know nothing about hockey. how they blame JT for their woes when the sj line is the only reason they even have an OT win against the swiss. have they not noticed perry, who probably is the worst player on the ice? or pronger and neids? or getzlaf? or bergeron? nash has been pretty bad, iggy has been invisible aside from norway, and on and on. i wouldn't even place JT in the bottom half of fwds, let alone anywhere near worst. infuriating how the hfboard hivemind works.

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:12 PM
  #33
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Just a thought for the fans bashing this or that player whether it is JT or Brodeur or . . .

One of the wonderful things about hockey is that it is a team sport. It is a great combination of skill and athleticism. Perhaps the people bashing these individuals should look at the basis. Athletes are elevated to god-like status, yet they are human. Perhaps there is overvaluation of the individual contributions within the sport rather than the team aspect or an overvaluation of skill over athleticism or athleticism over skill. Whose fault is that? The fans? The management of hockey, Bettman and the GMs? The financial incentives of the elevation of the individual are apparent to the marketing people. Perhaps it is time to demand that the people who set the valuations go back to base principles, the elevation of the team, the insistence on athleticism which is hard work off the ice. Skill (vision and touch) is nice, but it rarely goes anywhere without hard work.

There are people within the sport who have understood the principle. Some of the great teams were a collection of people who were hitting the gym hard before their time. Niedermayer was a guy who put learning skating above all else. The Russians of the 70s and Lemaire worked systems to perfection where it is was much less the individual and much more the team and it succeeded. Even Herb Brooks understood the issue when he assembled the Miracle team. I would suggest that the Wings of recent history are similar in team emphasis in this respect.

Maybe it is time for us as fans to hold the powers that be, whether it is Hockey Canada or the NHL to quit tempting us with elevation of the individual and instead cut a new path towards the emphasis of teamwork and hard work.

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:16 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Just a thought for the fans bashing this or that player whether it is JT or Brodeur or . . .

One of the wonderful things about hockey is that it is a team sport. It is a great combination of skill and athleticism. Perhaps the people bashing these individuals should look at the basis. Athletes are elevated to god-like status, yet they are human. Perhaps there is overvaluation of the individual contributions within the sport rather than the team aspect or an overvaluation of skill over athleticism or athleticism over skill. Whose fault is that? The fans? The management of hockey, Bettman and the GMs? The financial incentives of the elevation of the individual are apparent to the marketing people. Perhaps it is time to demand that the people who set the valuations go back to base principles, the elevation of the team, the insistence on athleticism which is hard work off the ice. Skill (vision and touch) is nice, but it rarely goes anywhere without hard work.

There are people within the sport who have understood the principle. Some of the great teams were a collection of people who were hitting the gym hard before their time. Niedermayer was a guy who put learning skating above all else. The Russians of the 70s and Lemaire worked systems to perfection where it is was much less the individual and much more the team and it succeeded. Even Herb Brooks understood the issue when he assembled the Miracle team. I would suggest that the Wings of recent history are similar in team emphasis in this respect.

Maybe it is time for us as fans to hold the powers that be, whether it is Hockey Canada or the NHL to quit tempting us with elevation of the individual and instead cut a new path towards the emphasis of teamwork and hard work.
So, basically we shouldn't have traded for Heatley?

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:24 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by CrazedZooChimp View Post
So, basically we shouldn't have traded for Heatley?
In principle NO, the Sharks shouldn't have. We should be insisting that DW and Sharks management put team over the individual. We are tempted into thinking that the assemblage of the proper pieces is the key to the kingdom, the silver thingy. IMO, that key is not the one that will unlock the door although it is very easy to market that strategy to engage fan interest.

In reality, it is possible that Heatley will help the level of teamwork and work ethic. If he doesn't, I would severely castigate the decision. I will leave it up to everyone here to figure it out.

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:32 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
In principle NO, the Sharks shouldn't have. We should be insisting that DW and Sharks management put team over the individual. We are tempted into thinking that the assemblage of the proper pieces is the key to the kingdom, the silver thingy. IMO, that key is not the one that will unlock the door although it is very easy to market that strategy to engage fan interest.

In reality, it is possible that Heatley will help the level of teamwork and work ethic. If he doesn't, I would severely castigate the decision. I will leave it up to everyone here to figure it out.
Name me the last Cup winner to not have at least a couple Class A stars? Hurricanes maybe?

Marleau was drafted and until we "lucked" into JT, San Jose could not attract any "Star" players in their prime to play here. Since then DW has been able to acquire Boyle and Heatley.

We may not have the right ingredients of players to win it all this year or in the near future. Maybe we have to much top end talent, but to say that a team in the NHL right now is not built around top talent, be it from the goalie out, top defense ala Pronger Neid's, etc..., is just flat out wrong IMO. I think you just don't like the talent DW has brought in or like I said, maybe a little too top heavy.

We will just have to see.

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Old
02-22-2010, 05:51 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
Name me the last Cup winner to not have at least a couple Class A stars? Hurricanes maybe?

Marleau was drafted and until we "lucked" into JT, San Jose could not attract any "Star" players in their prime to play here. Since then DW has been able to acquire Boyle and Heatley.

We may not have the right ingredients of players to win it all this year or in the near future. Maybe we have to much top end talent, but to say that a team in the NHL right now is not built around top talent, be it from the goalie out, top defense ala Pronger Neid's, etc..., is just flat out wrong IMO. I think you just don't like the talent DW has brought in or like I said, maybe a little too top heavy.

We will just have to see.
Canes and Bolts and to an extent the Stars. Despite people's temptation to point at Lecavalier, he isn't that high in the top end nor was Boyle at the time. Beyond that winning teams that do have top end, tend to spread it out, less marketing of one superstar. Dynasty teams are decidedly homegrown. Homegrown is a hallmark for teams who repeat cup wins. Acquired talent is the hallmark of one and done teams. I can name a whole bunch of class A's that have failed at attaining the pinnacle especially where they were "the guy", despite the worship of their fanbase. I can also point to a whole lot of teams who spread the credit who do succeed.


Last edited by SJeasy: 02-22-2010 at 09:59 PM.
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Old
02-22-2010, 07:00 PM
  #38
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Thornton was invisible, has a history of being invisible, and therefore is being called out on it (understandably so).

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Old
02-22-2010, 07:05 PM
  #39
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This is exactly why Joe isn't a team leader and will never win anything except that Swiss Championship, he only got that for marrying a Swiss model, anyone can do that.

Joe needs to quit being an attention hog...he needs to let the Ducks trio or Crosby in on some of the action.

Bad Joe. Just come back to SJ.

No matter what anyone of these anti-Joe people say if he was on their team they wouldn't be picking on him.

I love how we have the two most hated Canadians, Thornton & Heatley.

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Old
02-22-2010, 09:34 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Canes and Bolts and to an extent the Stars. Despite people's temptation to point at Lecavalier, he isn't that high in the top end nor was Boyle at the time. Beyond that winning teams that do have top end, tend to spread it out, less marketing of one superstar. Dynasty teams are decidedly homegrown. Homegrown is hallmark for teams who repeat cup wins. Acquired talent is the hallmark of one and done teams. I can name a whole bunch of class A's that have failed at attaining the pinnacle especially where they were "the guy", despite the worship of their fanbase. I can also point to a whole lot of teams who spread the credit who do succeed.
I have a small bit of an issue with this post, st louis was a top end talent lecavalier isnt that i agree. Boyle had just established himself as a top end talent. He was near the top in defenseman scoring both in 03 and 04.

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Old
02-22-2010, 09:54 PM
  #41
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Old
02-23-2010, 04:34 AM
  #42
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Nobody on Canada is doing really well right now, except maybe Heatley.

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Old
02-23-2010, 08:26 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
Thornton was invisible, has a history of being invisible, and therefore is being called out on it (understandably so).
What he said...When the games become bigger...Joe becomes smaller...Let's see if he can change that with the games left in the Olympics and in the playoffs..

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Old
02-23-2010, 08:53 AM
  #44
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I have a small bit of an issue with this post, st louis was a top end talent lecavalier isnt that i agree. Boyle had just established himself as a top end talent. He was near the top in defenseman scoring both in 03 and 04.
Ya exactly, I'm thinking St. Louis, Lacavalier, and Richards qualify as a pretty amazing top 3.

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02-23-2010, 10:27 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Abooch68 View Post
What he said...When the games become bigger...Joe becomes smaller...Let's see if he can change that with the games left in the Olympics and in the playoffs..
I agree with this in this tournament as far as the USA game goes... however, in the other two games, Joe was hitting, skating, controlling the puck, and making decent plays in the offensive zone (coupled with requisite turnovers). So, I think this huge Joe backlash is a combo of him actually playing badly in the US game like lots of guys, plus a symptom of a general panic that's happening with Canadians right now.

Boyle - definitely playing a key role. We should be proud of this guy.

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Old
02-23-2010, 10:32 AM
  #46
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*shrug*

Looked like a typical Joe performance.

Let's be honest here. Come playoff time, has there ever really been a game where you sit back after a win and say "Dang, if it wasn't for Joe, we'd have lost that game."

He's talented, but he's obviously a supporting talent. Maybe having Heatley this time around and Marleau and Nabby having career years will be enough. But anything Thornton does in April and May will come as a pleasant surprise to me. Fool me once...

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02-23-2010, 10:53 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by superroyain10 View Post
Thornton was invisible, has a history of being invisible, and therefore is being called out on it (understandably so).
There is a difference between playing poorly and just playing. He hasnt been playing poorly. He isnt doing what he needs to do to be a difference maker but to be honest, I dont know that he needs to be in this tournament. Would I like him to be? Hell ya but really, he isnt even in the bottom half of players playing poorly on that team.

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02-23-2010, 11:18 AM
  #48
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Let's be honest here. Come playoff time, has there ever really been a game where you sit back after a win and say "Dang, if it wasn't for Joe, we'd have lost that game."
Calgary game 4, was it?

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Old
02-23-2010, 11:46 AM
  #49
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Calgary game 4, was it?
Yup. I was just gonna post the same thing. HE SCORES HE SCORES HE SCORES!

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Old
02-23-2010, 11:47 AM
  #50
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Part of me feels like Thornton gets bashed so much by others because others are kinda jealous. They know how many points Thornton has racked up in the last few years...they know how good the sharks have been since the trade...and they know that the Sharks fleeced Boston in that trade and wish that they could have gotten him. Now, since they don't have him and they werent able to get him as easy as the Sharks did, they bash him in order to make themselves feel better. And since its so easy to do so, they continue. In the last 5 years or so nobody has been as good as the Sharks minus Detroit...even though we haven't won a cup I'm sure that most people wish their team was as good as the Sharks the last 5 years.

I know this probably isn't really the case...but I dunno why but I do feel like this belief subconsciously lies in the back of some peoples minds.. or maybe I just have a really creative imagination lol.

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