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If Bettman Does Not Continue NHL Participation In The Olympics...

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Old
02-28-2010, 07:30 PM
  #51
God Bless Canada
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If we could get circumstances like this - Canada-U.S. on a Sunday afternoon, close to prime-time, all NHL players involved, fantastic hockey - then I think Bettman would be a strong voice for Olympic participation. But situations like Turin - two European nations, gold medal game relatively early on a Sunday morning, hockey that wasn't always great to watch - make the NHL hesitant. In fact, if the Olympics weren't in North America this time around, I don't think the NHL would have been involved.

It's easy to sit back after some of the hockey we've seen the last week-and-a-half - starting with Slovakia/Czech Republic - and say "the NHL has to be there." But this is the perfect situation for the NHL. When the games are held in Russia, it won't be. If an American city was bidding for the 2018 games, I think the NHL would be more willing to participate in 2014. But that won't happen.

What will be interesting to see is how many NHL players bail to the KHL for the 2013-14 season, since there isn't a transfer agreement.

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02-28-2010, 07:30 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by ArizonaPride View Post
I don't care what the sport is in the Olympics just stop sending the pros.
Olympics are not supposed to be about the pros!
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It's the world stage, why would a country not want to send it's very best to compete?

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02-28-2010, 07:31 PM
  #53
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Its about pros, because there would be only 2 countries in competition if it were otherwise.

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02-28-2010, 08:04 PM
  #54
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A little while ago, I got back home from a "hockey party" (very similar to a super bowl party) thrown by a couple who hasn't watched hockey since the 1980's, Miracle on Ice. However, after the US's first win over Canada, they have watched not only all of USA's games, but also RUS-CAN, (which they thoguht was great), SUI-BEL and all of Finland's games.

Today there was 11 adults there. I was the only hockey fan, and had to answer about 6 million questions about why there wasn't a call at one point or the other, when clearly the same thing happened a few moments earlier and resulted in a penalty, etc.

However, one of the ladies almost peed herself when the US pulled its goalie, and the room totally exploded when the US tied it up. Rules didn't matter at that point.

I can't really explain the silence in the room when Crosby killed them, but there were no big "Nooo's" or comments at all. Just confusion, kinda' like "What happens now?!"

They all had a hard time making sense of what had just happened, so I explained how the U.S. defenseman blew his assignment on Crosby and really did nothing but skate out the way for Crosby to cut to the net. The lights came on with most everybody in there, and the host's comments says it all, "Well, I'll tell you, I'm exhausted, but I could go for one more." So, he got on the internet, got txs, and they're all (but me and another person) marching their buns down to the Winterhawk game beginning at 7 pm, with a stop at the local brew pub before the game! Prolly enjoying a local brew right now. True story.

So, to say that the olympics are not good for the NHL seems a bit out there I think. Making sure the game is called exactly according to the rule book and nothing else, so people, new to the game, can understand what they are watching and what happens and why should be the leagues #1 priority in my mind.

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02-28-2010, 08:31 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
If we could get circumstances like this - Canada-U.S. on a Sunday afternoon, close to prime-time, all NHL players involved, fantastic hockey - then I think Bettman would be a strong voice for Olympic participation. But situations like Turin - two European nations, gold medal game relatively early on a Sunday morning, hockey that wasn't always great to watch - make the NHL hesitant. In fact, if the Olympics weren't in North America this time around, I don't think the NHL would have been involved.

It's easy to sit back after some of the hockey we've seen the last week-and-a-half - starting with Slovakia/Czech Republic - and say "the NHL has to be there." But this is the perfect situation for the NHL. When the games are held in Russia, it won't be. If an American city was bidding for the 2018 games, I think the NHL would be more willing to participate in 2014. But that won't happen.
I don't get your argument at all although I heard those very words from Bettman himself. Makes no sense to me.

A) The NHL is clearly trying to grow the interest internationally. Why else would they fly teams over to Europe for season openers and what not? What do you think draws in more people to the NHL, the olympics or an early regular season game?

B) Asia is not a small market... and the timing isn't awful for them.

C) The final was on a Sunday, so bingo, but the rest of the games have been on while normal people work, which means they missed them or TiVod them. Those with a DVR will probably be able to program it for 2 am, just like they did for 2 pm., and those wihtout a DVR are just as screwed.

Bettman's arguments are nothing but smoke and mirrors. It's a bargaining chip to use in future negs with the NHLPA. Nothing else.

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02-28-2010, 08:35 PM
  #56
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I just watched the game with a bunch of people that never cared about hockey...

They have all become proud owners of tickets to an upcoming Flyers game.

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02-28-2010, 08:41 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Ribban View Post
I don't get your argument at all although I heard those very words from Bettman himself. Makes no sense to me.

A) The NHL is clearly trying to grow the interest internationally. Why else would they fly teams over to Europe for season openers and what not? What do you think draws in more people to the NHL, the olympics or an early regular season game?

B) Asia is not a small market... and the timing isn't awful for them.

C) The final was on a Sunday, so bingo, but the rest of the games have been on while normal people work, which means they missed them or TiVod them. Those with a DVR will probably be able to program it for 2 am, just like they did for 2 pm., and those wihtout a DVR are just as screwed.

Bettman's arguments are nothing but smoke and mirrors. It's a bargaining chip to use in future negs with the NHLPA. Nothing else.
Asia isn't a small market? Thanks, Captain Obvious. And what does that have to do with anything? Bettman and the powers that be in the NHL don't give a damn about Asia. More than anything else, they care about the NHL, their teams, and about interest levels in North America. There is interest in growing the game in Europe, but their foremost priorities are themselves and North America. And the ratings just aren't going to be there for an Olympics held in Russia in 2014, and wherever they'll be held in 2018. And if the ratings won't be there, if the North American interest won't be there (especially if we have a Sweden-Finland gold medal game again), then it's going to be hard to convince the NHL to send players overseas in four years, especially since there isn't a carrot for 2018.

I loved these Olympics. I'd like to see the NHL players in Sochi in four years, even though the hockey won't be as good since it will be on big ice. But I'm definitely realistic about the slim likelihood that you'll see NHL players in Sochi.

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02-28-2010, 10:16 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by rojac View Post
I don't really see that the NHL gains anything by taking part.
http://www.iihf.com/channels/iihf-wo...e-century.html

"It was a shocking and unexpected victory, but more importantly, it inspired a generation of American kids to play the game. When USA won its next important international event, the 1996 World Cup of Hockey, almost every player on that team pointed to the Miracle on Ice game as their inspiration for wanting to play hockey."

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02-28-2010, 10:37 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Thepainter View Post
Bettman is gonna let Crosby sleep in the bed tonight.
As much as I hate the Bettman-has-a-hardon-for-Crosby silliness, that was pretty funny

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Old
02-28-2010, 11:37 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
Asia isn't a small market? Thanks, Captain Obvious. And what does that have to do with anything? Bettman and the powers that be in the NHL don't give a damn about Asia. More than anything else, they care about the NHL, their teams, and about interest levels in North America. There is interest in growing the game in Europe, but their foremost priorities are themselves and North America. And the ratings just aren't going to be there for an Olympics held in Russia in 2014, and wherever they'll be held in 2018. And if the ratings won't be there, if the North American interest won't be there (especially if we have a Sweden-Finland gold medal game again), then it's going to be hard to convince the NHL to send players overseas in four years, especially since there isn't a carrot for 2018.

I loved these Olympics. I'd like to see the NHL players in Sochi in four years, even though the hockey won't be as good since it will be on big ice. But I'm definitely realistic about the slim likelihood that you'll see NHL players in Sochi.
Oh. I'm sorry for questioning you, your highness.

Perhaps, and I am only throwing it out there as a remote possibility despite knowing that you have already contemplated that and know the answer, the NHL looks over at UEFA. UEFA has nothing to do with Asia per se, however, the UEFA Champions league was and still is heavily marketed in Asia, which renders quite impressive TV contracts, which generates money for the league. Now if Bettman is not familiar with the UEFA story, he might have heard about the NBA, and the fact that they also struck gold in Asia.

As you seem to be quite in tune with how Bettman and the NHL owners think, I know you are right when you say that they are completely focused on NA, and to some extent Europe, and couldn't care less about Asia.

I'm only proposing the humble idea that they could, and if not, should, be very interested in low hanging fruit (easy cash) from Asia to help build the league at home, as the U.S. plan seem to need a little bit more work.

The funniest thing you wrote however, is that when we do have a best of the best, and countries like Sweden or Finland complain about not getting the same shake as the crowd favorites, we are all labeled as conspiracy nutballs, yet you pretty much make the point that these tournaments become a financial disaster if you get a final between Sweden and Finland. Wonder why we display concerns at times? You are quite a piece of work, Sport!

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Old
02-28-2010, 11:49 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
Asia isn't a small market? Thanks, Captain Obvious. And what does that have to do with anything? Bettman and the powers that be in the NHL don't give a damn about Asia. More than anything else, they care about the NHL, their teams, and about interest levels in North America. There is interest in growing the game in Europe, but their foremost priorities are themselves and North America. And the ratings just aren't going to be there for an Olympics held in Russia in 2014, and wherever they'll be held in 2018. And if the ratings won't be there, if the North American interest won't be there (especially if we have a Sweden-Finland gold medal game again), then it's going to be hard to convince the NHL to send players overseas in four years, especially since there isn't a carrot for 2018.

I loved these Olympics. I'd like to see the NHL players in Sochi in four years, even though the hockey won't be as good since it will be on big ice. But I'm definitely realistic about the slim likelihood that you'll see NHL players in Sochi.
BTW, so after you have concluded that it is not in the best interest of the NHL to have any other country but the North AMericans in the final, and we still should all be excited about having NHL refs in all the games because "they are unbiased and professionals concerned about their careers," you further state that the ratings in the US and Canada would not be there if they were in the finals becasue of time. Little inventions such as DVR, or tape delay, which is used all the time, you dismiss?
If you do a little research and check on ABC and FIFA World Cup, 2014, 2010, 2006, and 2002, you might expand on your options of reality, but then again, you might not. One can lead a horse to water...

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Old
03-01-2010, 12:00 AM
  #62
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Gary Bettman, whether we like him or not, does bring up some valid points when he claims that the NHL will need to decide whether going to the Olympics is beneficial to the league.

There is no doubt that the NHL benefits from having the games played in North America, where the media devours Olympic ice hockey (yes, even the American media), there is a very irrelevant time difference, and fans have the opportunity to actually witness the games live.

The truth is, for many Americans with jobs, especially 9-5 jobs, the Sochi Olympics are going to be similar to the Torino Olympics; "GO USA! I'll catch the highlights online." Bettman knows this, and he also knows the sport grows most when Americans are watching it. I can honestly tell you that I watched far more of Team Canada than I did of Team USA (live) during these Olympics because the US was playing at noon, and that is simply not going to cut it for many of us. Now, imagine what the hell is going to happen in Sochi, which is what amounts to close to a 9-12 hour difference away from North America? I'm guessing Russia will have the same "prime-time" slot Canada got this year, and American/Canadian games are going to be played at random times of the morning, or very late at night. Is it worth shutting down the league for two weeks for games that are going to be very difficult for the average viewer to watch?

The NHL will go to Sochi. But those of you mindlessly spewing crap over Bettman for "debating" the validity of shutting down an entire league for two weeks, especially for games that are going to be played at a very inaccessible time in North America, need to gain some perspective.

God Bless Canada is spot on.

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03-01-2010, 12:39 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades of Glory View Post
Gary Bettman, whether we like him or not, does bring up some valid points when he claims that the NHL will need to decide whether going to the Olympics is beneficial to the league.

There is no doubt that the NHL benefits from having the games played in North America, where the media devours Olympic ice hockey (yes, even the American media), there is a very irrelevant time difference, and fans have the opportunity to actually witness the games live.

The truth is, for many Americans with jobs, especially 9-5 jobs, the Sochi Olympics are going to be similar to the Torino Olympics; "GO USA! I'll catch the highlights online." Bettman knows this, and he also knows the sport grows most when Americans are watching it. I can honestly tell you that I watched far more of Team Canada than I did of Team USA (live) during these Olympics because the US was playing at noon, and that is simply not going to cut it for many of us. Now, imagine what the hell is going to happen in Sochi, which is what amounts to close to a 9-12 hour difference away from North America? I'm guessing Russia will have the same "prime-time" slot Canada got this year, and American/Canadian games are going to be played at random times of the morning, or very late at night. Is it worth shutting down the league for two weeks for games that are going to be very difficult for the average viewer to watch?

The NHL will go to Sochi. But those of you mindlessly spewing crap over Bettman for "debating" the validity of shutting down an entire league for two weeks, especially for games that are going to be played at a very inaccessible time in North America, need to gain some perspective.

God Bless Canada is spot on.
With all due respect, I believe the Fans of the NHL are not going to be fewer after an Olympic tournament, even if broadcasted on an inconvenient time.

The NHL will benefit in North America if the USA competes for an Olympic medal with its best team no matter where they play in the world. Jrs and amateurs do not cut it in the U.S. History CLEARLY tells us that.

By showcasing it's stars in other parts of the world, in a format greatly appreciated and respected internationally, the NHL will increase its global fan base for a much smaller dime than it could do in any other way. Seriously, what else are they going to do, and what will that cost the league? Please be somewhat specific.

Flip it around, they don't go. What is the cost of not going?

Fans turning away from the NHL?

Players leaving or looking for other alernatives, which ultimately will render a lesser product?

The NHL sinks back in the ranks to become a Canadian Only Club?

The NHL creating a reputation for trying to sabotage the global hockey movement?

The NHL will only be involved with tournaments that favor its base, North America, which automatically lead to fair play speculations and diminish the creditability of any NHL sponsored event?

You are of course entitled to your opinion, and so is God Bless Canada, but I will have to disagree with you, and remain in my stands that this is nothing but an attempt to hijack an issue for negotiation purposes down the road.

Bettman looks silly to say the least.


Last edited by Ribban: 03-01-2010 at 01:45 AM.
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Old
03-01-2010, 12:44 AM
  #64
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I still say the simple solution is for the IOC to drop hockey from the Winter Olympics. It solves both the competitive problems with women's hockey and the issue of whether or not the NHL should go.

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03-01-2010, 01:21 AM
  #65
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I heard on CTV that Gary Bettman asked some official on the IOC if hockey could be played in the summer games, and the official didn't even let him finish his question.


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03-01-2010, 01:23 AM
  #66
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I wouldnt understand why he wouldnt let them go. I mean Ovechkin is going no matter what. And i mean why would you say no to the olympic games, but at the same time send your teams to England or Sweden?

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03-01-2010, 01:53 AM
  #67
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I say we riot if Bettman does this.

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03-01-2010, 01:58 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by PolskiCanuck View Post
I heard on CTV that Gary Bettman asked some official on the IOC if hockey could be played in the summer games, and the official didn't even let him finish his question.

It's not like it's a horrible suggestion... it's not that hard to maintain a rink in a warm climate.

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03-01-2010, 02:00 AM
  #69
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It's not like it's a horrible suggestion... it's not that hard to maintain a rink in a warm climate.
The major problem would be hockey interest in the summer, lots of people are out of school, some are out of work travelling enjoying the nice weather. I just dont think hockey would be very interesting in the summer.

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03-01-2010, 02:03 AM
  #70
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The major problem would be hockey interest in the summer, lots of people are out of school, some are out of work travelling enjoying the nice weather. I just dont think hockey would be very interesting in the summer.
I don't know... in the pre-Olympic era, nobody ever complained about the Canada/World Cup being the summer.

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03-01-2010, 02:06 AM
  #71
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he better tell whoever has the rights to sochi he doesn't want curling to interrupt the beginning of games

and i would hate hockey in the summer. sure i'd watch it but in the warmer conditions, what would the ice look like and more importantly, don't guys want to take their summers off?

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03-01-2010, 02:12 AM
  #72
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I wouldnt understand why he wouldnt let them go. I mean Ovechkin is going no matter what. And i mean why would you say no to the olympic games, but at the same time send your teams to England or Sweden?
Once again, it's not up to Bettman.

As for Ovechkin, as I've said before, if the NHL doesn't agree to go, the IIHF is unlikely to let any NHL player play. So, he may be going as a spectator only.

As for sending teams to Europe, that's real NHL teams playing real NHL games and, in my mind, a far better promotion of the NHL and its brands than the Olympics.

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03-01-2010, 02:12 AM
  #73
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Today I had 11 people in my much too small living room. All screaming at the TV, living and dying with every play. Of the 11, 7 were Canadian, 2 were American, 1 was Chinese and 1 was Mexican.

I was the only serious fan and perhaps 2 of the other Canadians have a good grasp of the rules and strategy. Now I'm taking all of them to a game later this season.

NHLers in the Olympics is great, I think it can only improve people's opinion of hockey.

Will it lead directly to more money for the NHL? I don't know, but even if a person doesn't start going to NHL games, them having a better opinion of hockey is a great thing.

For example, a Chinese-Canadian friend of mine, wanted to play hockey when growing up. He parents, particularly his father, disliked hockey and were strongly opposed to their child playing, so he never got to outside of some road hockey (oh, and just to be clear, they had the $$$ for him to play).

I talked to my friend earlier this week and he said that his Dad had bought a team Canada jersey for these Olympics and was watching the games religiously. This guy may never go to an NHL game, but he will be proud and supportive grandfather when his grandchildern play.

It's stuff like this that make the Olympics important.

The learning curve for the NHL is rather steep. All the teams, 82 games seasons, playoffs til June not to mention all the player movement and salary cap stuff.

The Olympics are easy to care about. It's very simple, the best of one nation against the best of another.

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03-01-2010, 02:42 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rojac View Post
Once again, it's not up to Bettman.

As for Ovechkin, as I've said before, if the NHL doesn't agree to go, the IIHF is unlikely to let any NHL player play. So, he may be going as a spectator only.

As for sending teams to Europe, that's real NHL teams playing real NHL games and, in my mind, a far better promotion of the NHL and its brands than the Olympics.
Meh, its hard to promote hockey when its being played by amateurs. Its much better to send your NHL players to promote the skill and ability of the NHL. Broadcasters bring up which team they play for. If these people have the awareness of the NHL they might catch some games from time to time.

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03-01-2010, 02:44 AM
  #75
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How much I hate stopping the league for two weeks, I'm actually a huge fan of sending the pros. That's just me.

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