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Buffalo proposal for Ovechkin

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Old
04-28-2004, 10:57 AM
  #1
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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Buffalo proposal for Ovechkin

Satan
Briere
Afinogenov
Kotalik
Tallinder
2004 1st rounder
2005 1st rounder (protected - if top 5 pick, then 2006 1st rounder instead)

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04-28-2004, 10:59 AM
  #2
Drake1588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LALALALALALAFONTAINE
Satan
Briere
Afinogenov
Kotalik
Tallinder
2004 1st rounder
2005 1st rounder (protected - if top 5 pick, then 2006 1st rounder instead)
Too much salary. The only sort of offer the Caps can afford to consider is a ton of youth/prospects. Even then, they really don't have a lot of motivation to deal the pick.

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04-28-2004, 12:08 PM
  #3
EroCaps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588
Too much salary. The only sort of offer the Caps can afford to consider is a ton of youth/prospects. Even then, they really don't have a lot of motivation to deal the pick.
Drake, I keep hearing the "too much salary" negation. The only player we couldn't afford was Jagr. Bondra was dealt to get value, and the rest were casualties of a rebuilding process. Leonsis directly rejected the idea that we were trading players to slash payroll several times. It doesn't hold water, IMO.

I don't really like the deal BTW, not the high-end youth I'd expect.

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Old
04-28-2004, 12:11 PM
  #4
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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I can understand that. I was wondering whether I'd be able to turn a deal without giving up Vanek, Roy or Kalinin.

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04-28-2004, 12:13 PM
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ErnestoGuevara
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I think he meant too much salary for a rebuilding team...If the Caps trade the #1 it'll be to trade down to number 3 spot or something like that (like Florida did last year). That's if they prefer a guy like Olesz or Barker over Ove...

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04-28-2004, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErnestoGuevara
I think he meant too much salary for a rebuilding team...If the Caps trade the #1 it'll be to trade down to number 3 spot or something like that (like Florida did last year). That's if they prefer a guy like Olesz or Barker over Ove...
If Mcphee trade that pick to move down his hockey life would not be worth anything >> Would never get another GM job ever >> You do not trade franchise players and if you do you deserve to be ridden out of town on a rail up your _ _ _
fill in the blanks

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04-28-2004, 02:45 PM
  #7
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Originally Posted by BIGTRAIN
If Mcphee trade that pick to move down his hockey life would not be worth anything >> Would never get another GM job ever >> You do not trade franchise players and if you do you deserve to be ridden out of town on a rail up your _ _ _
fill in the blanks
ok.... as much as it his unlikely McPhee will trade the #1 pick, it's more likely he'll trade it to move down to #3 or #4 and receive a good player (some teams might be ready to give up really good core players to get Ovechkin) than it is that he will trade the pick for a package of players....

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04-28-2004, 02:55 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
Drake, I keep hearing the "too much salary" negation. The only player we couldn't afford was Jagr. Bondra was dealt to get value, and the rest were casualties of a rebuilding process. Leonsis directly rejected the idea that we were trading players to slash payroll several times. It doesn't hold water, IMO.

I don't really like the deal BTW, not the high-end youth I'd expect.
I think they want to rebuild primarily with youth, not by adding new veterans right away. They are willing to see payroll increase over time, commensurate with the progress of that pool of youth, but they are not about to absorb an extra $9-10 million on veterans in order to be competitive next season.

The deal itself is quite generous. There are some very good players there, but the amount of money coming back really would give them pause. I suspect that the sort of deal that it would take to dislodge the #1 pick would be a package of blue-chip prospects and picks, not established stars.

If that deal as listed above inserted a great prospect in place of Satan, I think Washington would be quite interested.

.


Last edited by Drake1588: 04-28-2004 at 02:59 PM.
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04-28-2004, 03:30 PM
  #9
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Am I the only one who finds that deal absolutely ludicrous.

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04-28-2004, 03:47 PM
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ewwww....people are acting like this guy is the next gretzky....I can't wait to see the proposals for Crosby...

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04-28-2004, 03:56 PM
  #11
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You'd pretty much have to give up Vanek, Kalinin, Briere, and picks for Ovechkin.

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04-28-2004, 04:26 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock
Am I the only one who finds that deal absolutely ludicrous.
No. It doesn't make sense for either team. Ovechkin won't help Buffalo as much as all those players would, and those players wouldn't come close to saving Washington. It makes both teams worse off.

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04-28-2004, 04:37 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
You'd pretty much have to give up Vanek, Kalinin, Briere, and picks for Ovechkin.
Something I would not do. Briere is a 30 goal scorer and vanek looks like he can be one too or more. What is better? Two 30 goal scorers or a possible 50 goal scorer? I would rather have the 2 players to spread out the offense and make it harder for the other two teams to check. I also haven't seen much but from what people are saying Kalinin is looking to becoming a stud as well.

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04-28-2004, 04:55 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick - Flames Fan
Something I would not do. Briere is a 30 goal scorer and vanek looks like he can be one too or more. What is better? Two 30 goal scorers or a possible 50 goal scorer? I would rather have the 2 players to spread out the offense and make it harder for the other two teams to check. I also haven't seen much but from what people are saying Kalinin is looking to becoming a stud as well.
Quality over quantity.

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04-28-2004, 04:58 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick - Flames Fan
Something I would not do. Briere is a 30 goal scorer and vanek looks like he can be one too or more. What is better? Two 30 goal scorers or a possible 50 goal scorer? I would rather have the 2 players to spread out the offense and make it harder for the other two teams to check. I also haven't seen much but from what people are saying Kalinin is looking to becoming a stud as well.
NO KALININ FOR YOU!!


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Old
04-28-2004, 05:22 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
Quality over quantity.
Except in this case the "quantity" also has quality as well.

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04-28-2004, 05:23 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by JOHNBOY
NO KALININ FOR YOU!!

Sorry where I come from we don't need him with the likes of Leopold, Regher, Phaneuf.

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04-28-2004, 05:54 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LALALALALALAFONTAINE
Satan
Briere
Afinogenov
Kotalik
Tallinder
2004 1st rounder
2005 1st rounder (protected - if top 5 pick, then 2006 1st rounder instead)
you are not serious about this are you tahts absurd , why dont everyone get oiver this kid he will be if anyting just like kovalchuk whioch is a great thing you people are acting like he is gonna score 2oo points a season every season, and the next season you will all be doing the same for crosby or who ever it is. you people actr like this kid is going to bring whatever team hes on the stanley cup every year, none of u souind like hockey fans if u know a single player cant make a team so why give up 5 guys for 1 bsolutley insane

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04-28-2004, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Koltsov
ewwww....people are acting like this guy is the next gretzky....I can't wait to see the proposals for Crosby...
you and brock are the most intellegent people i seen on this hf boardsin days , replying to your reaction to ovechkin its is absolutley insane, if they are this crazy over him what about crosby. gretz says he is the next great one, he also said the kid will break his whiole record what are u people willing trade away a whole team and let crosby play alone? proabably i wouldnt doubt it

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04-28-2004, 06:04 PM
  #20
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Originally Posted by jay 'n skeeta
you and brock are the most intellegent people i seen on this hf boardsin days , replying to your reaction to ovechkin its is absolutley insane, if they are this crazy over him what about crosby. gretz says he is the next great one, he also said the kid will break his whiole record what are u people willing trade away a whole team and let crosby play alone? proabably i wouldnt doubt it
This is a similar situation to Eric Lindros.

He was clearly the #1 overall pick for a while prior to the draft.

This isn't "just another prospect", he's a sure-fire NHL player... he's also considered one of the most skilled players in the world... including the NHL.

A trade for Ovechkin or Crosby would have to be something like what Quebec got for Lindros.

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04-28-2004, 06:40 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
This is a similar situation to Eric Lindros.

He was clearly the #1 overall pick for a while prior to the draft.

This isn't "just another prospect", he's a sure-fire NHL player... he's also considered one of the most skilled players in the world... including the NHL.

A trade for Ovechkin or Crosby would have to be something like what Quebec got for Lindros.
If that's the case, why is there any of these trade proposals to begin with? Some of these proposals are acting like Ovechkin is the best player in the NHL eventhough he hasn't even played a game yet, it's bloody insane. Would Buffalo trade all those players/prospects/picks for Joe Thornton or Jerome Iginla? No, and he's an established NHL superstar, Ovechkin is not. The 5 players Buffalo would trade would amount to 100 goals, max Ovechkin gets in this day and age is 50 goals(and that's best case scenario, 30-40 a year is more likely), sure seems like a great deal to me.... Not to mention the fact Buffalo would be trading their next two 1st round picks on top of that, and Buffalo would turn into the Penguins of a couple years ago. Buffalo has a very bright future, no reason to make that trade, especially for an unproven talent.

It seems like every year there is one prospect that is hyped to be the "next one", only to seem them not match the hype. This year it seems to be Ovechkin, next year it will probably be Crosby and then a few years down the road it will be Dustin Rose. :lol

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04-28-2004, 10:46 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koltsov
If that's the case, why is there any of these trade proposals to begin with? Some of these proposals are acting like Ovechkin is the best player in the NHL eventhough he hasn't even played a game yet, it's bloody insane. Would Buffalo trade all those players/prospects/picks for Joe Thornton or Jerome Iginla? No, and he's an established NHL superstar, Ovechkin is not. The 5 players Buffalo would trade would amount to 100 goals, max Ovechkin gets in this day and age is 50 goals(and that's best case scenario, 30-40 a year is more likely), sure seems like a great deal to me.... Not to mention the fact Buffalo would be trading their next two 1st round picks on top of that, and Buffalo would turn into the Penguins of a couple years ago. Buffalo has a very bright future, no reason to make that trade, especially for an unproven talent.

It seems like every year there is one prospect that is hyped to be the "next one", only to seem them not match the hype. This year it seems to be Ovechkin, next year it will probably be Crosby and then a few years down the road it will be Dustin Rose. :lol
The really great thing is that they are not the Sabres GM. I agree with you guys. Ovechkin may be a great player, but you don't give up that much talent and potential talent for one player.

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04-29-2004, 08:36 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafaholix
You'd pretty much have to give up Vanek, Kalinin, Briere, and picks for Ovechkin.
Hahaha,I wouldn't trade Vanek and Kalinin for Ovechkin let alone add another 60 point player and picks.Vanek is a potential 40 goal scorer and 80 point player...I don't see AO's potential a lot higher then that and then to add one of the most highly skilled young d-men with incredible potential is just laughable.

You're going to be surprised when you find out that Ovechkin won't be this amazing player that totally dominates the league.I see him more as a Hossa type then a Gretzky type.

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04-29-2004, 10:46 AM
  #24
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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Originally Posted by djhn579
The really great thing is that they are not the Sabres GM. I agree with you guys. Ovechkin may be a great player, but you don't give up that much talent and potential talent for one player.
Philly did in the Lindros trade. Craig Patrick is on record saying Ovechkin is the best prospect since Lemieux. I didn't offer enough for Ovechkin.

Forsberg
Ricci
Hextall
Simon
Huffman
Duchesne
2 1st rounders
$15M

I offered:

Satan (negligible trade value because of $5.25M contract)
Briere (65 points, 26 year old)
Afinogenov (31 points, 24 year old)
Kotalik (26 points, 25 year old)
Tallinder (5/6 defenseman, possible 3/4 defenseman, 25 year old)
2004 1st rounder (#13)
2005 1st rounder (protected - if top 5 pick, then 2006 1st rounder instead)

Basically, the Sabres give up two players who were a top 2 line player for Ovechkin. You replace Briere with Ovechkin, and replace Satan with Vanek (which may happen anyway). Afinogenov and Kotalik are 3rd line players, and Tallinder isn't (yet) a top 4 defenseman. I understand why the Caps wouldn't want to do it. I don't understand why the Sabres wouldn't.

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04-29-2004, 10:49 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brock
Am I the only one who finds that deal absolutely ludicrous.
Ludicrous is being nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by LALALALALALAFONTAINE
Craig Patrick is on record saying Ovechkin is the best prospect since Lemieux. I didn't offer enough for Ovechkin.
everyone who is supposed to go #1 overall is the best prospect since Lemieux. Too many people fall into the hype.

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