HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

[MTL/STL] Matt D'Agostini for Aaron Palushaj

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-03-2010, 10:32 AM
  #226
montreal
Go Habs Go
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Balearic Islands
Posts: 23,297
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Sounds like we have another Corey Locke. LOL at anyone bringing up HF scouting reports.
No, he's nothing like Locke, the only thing they have in common is their playmaking abilities. I don't recall seeing Palushaj in the AHL this year in the 2 games vs Hamilton, but I saw him a good bit at Michigan where he was impressive both years.

At Michigan he would get his nose dirty, and didnt shy away from contact, but his passing imo was his best asset (although I'll get a better feel for him after some games with the dogs) I also recall he got a lot of praise while in the USHL.

montreal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 10:36 AM
  #227
overlords
Global Moderator
Jack Arse
 
overlords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
No, he's nothing like Locke, the only thing they have in common is their playmaking abilities. I don't recall seeing Palushaj in the AHL this year in the 2 games vs Hamilton, but I saw him a good bit at Michigan where he was impressive both years.

At Michigan he would get his nose dirty, and didnt shy away from contact, but his passing imo was his best asset (although I'll get a better feel for him after some games with the dogs) I also recall he got a lot of praise while in the USHL.
so i take it it's a trade you're pretty happy with?

overlords is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 10:42 AM
  #228
montreal
Go Habs Go
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Balearic Islands
Posts: 23,297
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
so i take it it's a trade you're pretty happy with?
Yea, it should be a good one for us, but that's going off what he did at the NCAA level. Once I see more of him at the AHL level, we'll see what we got.

montreal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 11:07 AM
  #229
Mike8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 11,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nidema View Post
Lol sure. Not sure what I don't understand. If I read all your posts correctly, you have insisted Palushaj has fallen out of favor which is why we got him for almost nothing.

I don't agree with that all. Not sure what I don't understand about disappointment. But sure, whatever makes you feel right. I have layed out my points pretty clearly, if you don't get it, I'm not going to pursue it.
It's simple: teams don't trade prospects they're happy with. The very definition of a prospect is potential, and teams evaluate potential according to its maximum potential and likelihood in attaining that level. Teams do not trade players they believe have good potential because of the risk in that player attaining that potential, and subsequently holding more value. Potential rarely holds significant trade value, which is why it is difficult and not worth trading potentially good players.

Strickland, the Blues beat writer, just wrote about St.Louis being disappointed in Palushaj. But you go on making your 'clear points' and posing these intellectual rhetorical questions.

Mike8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 12:10 PM
  #230
Fish on The Sand
Untouchable
 
Fish on The Sand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Nanaimo
Country: Canada
Posts: 48,803
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
It's simple: teams don't trade prospects they're happy with. The very definition of a prospect is potential, and teams evaluate potential according to its maximum potential and likelihood in attaining that level. Teams do not trade players they believe have good potential because of the risk in that player attaining that potential, and subsequently holding more value. Potential rarely holds significant trade value, which is why it is difficult and not worth trading potentially good players.

Strickland, the Blues beat writer, just wrote about St.Louis being disappointed in Palushaj. But you go on making your 'clear points' and posing these intellectual rhetorical questions.
I would like to qualify your statements by saying teams do not trade prospects for other prospects if they have not fallen out of favor.


Last edited by Habs10Habs: 03-03-2010 at 12:55 PM. Reason: Fixed my mistake
Fish on The Sand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 01:12 PM
  #231
HABitual
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Kirkland Lake, Ontar
Posts: 5,706
vCash: 500
Bring on the Stanley Cup!! We got the missing piece!!

HABitual is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 01:52 PM
  #232
Le depisteur
Registered User
 
Le depisteur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Québec
Posts: 3,799
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal View Post
No, he's nothing like Locke, the only thing they have in common is their playmaking abilities. I don't recall seeing Palushaj in the AHL this year in the 2 games vs Hamilton, but I saw him a good bit at Michigan where he was impressive both years.

At Michigan he would get his nose dirty, and didnt shy away from contact, but his passing imo was his best asset (although I'll get a better feel for him after some games with the dogs) I also recall he got a lot of praise while in the USHL.
I remembered at his draft, some said he was so soft and it was the main reason because he was ranked not really high, but his numbers in USHL was really impressive, better than Pacioretty and Leblanc... But I understand his play isn't soft at all??? He changed his play or what???

Le depisteur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 02:03 PM
  #233
montreal
Go Habs Go
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Balearic Islands
Posts: 23,297
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Le depisteur View Post
I remembered at his draft, some said he was so soft and it was the main reason because he was ranked not really high, but his numbers in USHL was really impressive, better than Pacioretty and Leblanc... But I understand his play isn't soft at all??? He changed his play or what???
Well he wasn't soft at Michigan, that's the only thing I can say for sure. I saw him once in the USHL All Starr game (along with Pacioretty) but the only thing I remember was that I was told to keep an eye out for him for the draft. So I don't know what he was like in the USHL other then looking at his stats.

We'll see how he does with the Dogs, if he's physical or not.

montreal is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 02:22 PM
  #234
Habsfan18
Global Moderator
The Future
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,105
vCash: 500
Some notes on Aaron from the Blues section from HF:

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...ects_fall2009/

Quote:
Palushaj continues to show all of the signs of becoming a top-six forward in the NHL. He does not stray away from physical play, and has one of the quickest wrist shots out of the Blues' prospects. Palushaj's decision to become pro makes his eventual NHL debut that much sooner.

The reason his stock continues to rise is because of his consistency. Palushaj never takes a night off, and was Michigan's go-to guy for a big goal. While he is a passer first, Palushaj's goal numbers will go up as the level of talent he plays with does. It is likely Palushaj will get his first taste of the NHL at some point this season.
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...spects_update/

Quote:
Like Sonne, Palushaj is in his first season with the Rivermen. He has just two goals and 12 assists in 27 games. However, Palushaj's defensive game has looked solid, and he does not appear intimidated with the higher level of play. He is +1.

The former Michigan Wolverine is not a huge player, but is not afraid to get physical. He makes solid passes, but is not much of a goal scorer.

Habsfan18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 02:39 PM
  #235
overlords
Global Moderator
Jack Arse
 
overlords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
the whole passfirst/shoot maybe mentality is something i see in patches. So if we got a guy who has the potential of a guy like patches but is a bit more defensively reliable and not as big, i'll take it.

overlords is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 02:52 PM
  #236
HabuseMoi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,328
vCash: 500
he kinda sound like a playmaking version of Gionta from what I read.

HabuseMoi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 03:00 PM
  #237
Le depisteur
Registered User
 
Le depisteur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Québec
Posts: 3,799
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabuseMoi View Post
he kinda sound like a playmaking version of Gionta from what I read.
Without the speed, intensity and 5'7"...

Le depisteur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 03:03 PM
  #238
overlords
Global Moderator
Jack Arse
 
overlords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabuseMoi View Post
he kinda sound like a playmaking version of Gionta from what I read.
gionta is 'not much of a goalscorer' ?

overlords is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 04:40 PM
  #239
kent_carlson
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 763
vCash: 500
I don't know if I'm late on this one, but there was this article on Canoe.

http://fr.canoe.ca/sports/nouvelles/...03-160643.html

It's in french but a copy and paste in Google translate should do the job

kent_carlson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 05:00 PM
  #240
Top Corner2
Registered User
 
Top Corner2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,541
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
It's simple: teams don't trade prospects they're happy with. The very definition of a prospect is potential, and teams evaluate potential according to its maximum potential and likelihood in attaining that level. Teams do not trade players they believe have good potential because of the risk in that player attaining that potential, and subsequently holding more value. Potential rarely holds significant trade value, which is why it is difficult and not worth trading potentially good players.

Strickland, the Blues beat writer, just wrote about St.Louis being disappointed in Palushaj. But you go on making your 'clear points' and posing these intellectual rhetorical questions.
With all due respect Mike, I read what Strickland wrote...but I think this deal really has more to do with timing than anything else.

The Blues have a ton (I mean a ton) of good prospects....but they need someone to step in right away. The habs have a ton of young players that are breaking into the NHL....but they need some players that they can wait on a little longer.

I'm sure the habs don't dislike D'ago & the same goes for the Blues with Palushaj. It's just that the habs want more time & cant get it from D'ags & the blues want a player now....

I'm not saying Palushaj was their best prospect or anything...but I don't buy that he is spoiled because they traded him...just as D'ago isn't a bust either....I think this will be a good deal for both teams

Top Corner2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 05:06 PM
  #241
Top Corner2
Registered User
 
Top Corner2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,541
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by David_99 View Post
The question is, who will be the third amigo?
KRISTO!!!! Speed Speed Speed GO USA Speed Speed Speed

Top Corner2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:05 PM
  #242
Habsfan18
Global Moderator
The Future
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,105
vCash: 500


Looks a bit like Luongo, or is it just me?

Habsfan18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:20 PM
  #243
JeromeHP
@Jerome_Berube
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,580
vCash: 500
pretty funny reading scouting report and fan opinion on Palushaj

-some say he's fast, another one say he's not that fast
-some say he's not affraid of going in the corner, some say he's soft

tough to get a clear idea of the players he his but one thing is clear he work his ass off. i have not read one scouting report or fan say he's lazy and doesnt work hard

looking for to see him play with the dogs for the rest of the year and playoff

JeromeHP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:27 PM
  #244
Habsfan18
Global Moderator
The Future
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Markov79fan View Post
pretty funny reading scouting report and fan opinion on Palushaj

-some say he's fast, another one say he's not that fast
-some say he's not affraid of going in the corner, some say he's soft

tough to get a clear idea of the players he his but one thing is clear he work his ass off. i have not read one scouting report or fan say he's lazy and doesnt work hard

looking for to see him play with the dogs for the rest of the year and playoff
He plays a nice, gritty game. At least from what I saw at the WJC when he was part of the US team. Hard worker, good passer. While he may not have the quickest wheels, he's definitely not slow.

Habsfan18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:29 PM
  #245
CrAzYNiNe
Registered User
 
CrAzYNiNe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,957
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to CrAzYNiNe
Andy Stricklands view as a St. Louis blogger: http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Andy-...lushaj/5/26713

CrAzYNiNe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:34 PM
  #246
HCH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: The Wild West
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,601
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Top Corner2 View Post
With all due respect Mike, I read what Strickland wrote...but I think this deal really has more to do with timing than anything else.

The Blues have a ton (I mean a ton) of good prospects....but they need someone to step in right away. The habs have a ton of young players that are breaking into the NHL....but they need some players that they can wait on a little longer.

I'm sure the habs don't dislike D'ago & the same goes for the Blues with Palushaj. It's just that the habs want more time & cant get it from D'ags & the blues want a player now....

I'm not saying Palushaj was their best prospect or anything...but I don't buy that he is spoiled because they traded him...just as D'ago isn't a bust either....I think this will be a good deal for both teams
Finally, a post that makes some sense.

HCH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:39 PM
  #247
Harry Kakalovich
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
By the way, I'm actually entirely shocked that St-Louis did two things here:

1) gave up on Palushaj. I understand that he's still a medium to long shot type of player, given his attributes and limitations concerning the role he can play on a team, but actually giving up on a prospect is a rare move. Palushaj has less than stellar stats at the AHL level, but he started the season at 19-years old. And this is after excellent performances at the NCAA level. The fact that a strong scouting team in St-Louis has given up on him is peculiar, and begs the question why. This leads into the following point...

2) I'm shocked that D'Agostini carried any value whatsoever. I thought he might have some marginal value sufficient enough to be claimed on waivers by some middling team, but completely dismissed the notion that he'd carry any substantial value.

So I suppose the question is: did D'Agostini carry any value, or did St-Louis just give up on Palushaj altogether?

Or, more likely, was it a bit of both?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Once again, I wrote all of this originally, and yet you continue to argue my points against me. It's entirely bizarre.




It's not. At all. I wrote admitting that I was wrong that D'Agostini had any value, which is why this discussion has been irritating. You and the other guy are insisting on things that I've already stated myself.

...

As for him not being a disappointment, you just don't understand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
It's simple: teams don't trade prospects they're happy with. The very definition of a prospect is potential, and teams evaluate potential according to its maximum potential and likelihood in attaining that level. Teams do not trade players they believe have good potential because of the risk in that player attaining that potential, and subsequently holding more value. Potential rarely holds significant trade value, which is why it is difficult and not worth trading potentially good players.

Strickland, the Blues beat writer, just wrote about St.Louis being disappointed in Palushaj. But you go on making your 'clear points' and posing these intellectual rhetorical questions.
I think the thing is that your original post seems to imply that the Blues gave up on Palushaj, and that D'Agostini has little value. Granted you then qualify that a little by saying you are surprised, and that maybe you are/were wrong about these things.

But as your last post states, you obviously do feel vindicated by a comment that the Blues gave up on Palushaj. Thus it seems you are hedging a little here about what you are actually saying.

The other two guys (Hoff + Nidema) seem pretty clearly to be saying that D'Agostini probably had more value than Hab fans thought, and thus that D'Agostini's value was something like a 2nd (or Palushaj). Thus, I believe (and I could be wrong) they are disputing with you believing that you think D'Ags isn't worth that (a 2nd/decent prospect).

So I think the confusion lies in that first post, and what your actual opinion is on the matter, whether you think that D'Ags has potential and is worth a second, or not. Also whether you think the Blues "gave up" on Palushaj, or whether it was more a calculated timing trade, where the Habs get a guy who's able to clear, and the Blues get a guy who can maybe help them right now pot some goals.

Personally, I think it's a smart trade for the Habs, as D'Ago needed a change of scenery.

Harry Kakalovich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 06:50 PM
  #248
Mike8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 11,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Kakalovitch View Post
I think the thing is that your original post seems to imply that the Blues gave up on Palushaj, and that D'Agostini has little value. Granted you then qualify that a little by saying you are surprised, and that maybe you are/were wrong about these things.

But as your last post states, you obviously do feel vindicated by a comment that the Blues gave up on Palushaj. Thus it seems you are hedging a little here about what you are actually saying.

The other two guys (Hoff + Nidema) seem pretty clearly to be saying that D'Agostini probably had more value than Hab fans thought, and thus that D'Agostini's value was something like a 2nd (or Palushaj). Thus, I believe (and I could be wrong) they are disputing with you believing that you think D'Ags isn't worth that (a 2nd/decent prospect).

So I think the confusion lies in that first post, and what your actual opinion is on the matter, whether you think that D'Ags has potential and is worth a second, or not. Also whether you think the Blues "gave up" on Palushaj, or whether it was more a calculated timing trade, where the Habs get a guy who's able to clear, and the Blues get a guy who can maybe help them right now pot some goals.

Personally, I think it's a smart trade for the Habs, as D'Ago needed a change of scenery.
No, I stated clearly in #2 that I dismissed the notion that D'Agostini carried any value. Obviously, I was wrong. The evidence is right there.

It's also clear that Palushaj's value to the Blues had diminished: teams don't trade prospects they covet unless it's for substantial short-term gains. Never happens.

It's equally evident that D'Agostini's value, while perhaps higher in the Blues' perspective, is not the equivalent of a 2nd rounder, as many strong depth players were moved for 2nd rounders today. Further, many players that share roughly the same success as D'Agostini had been available for cheap.

I'm not 'vindicated' by Strickland's article since the very trade is evidence of Palushaj's diminished value. That's not my opinion or interpretation, it's more fact-based given that these deals just don't happen with coveted prospects unless it's for an impact player.

And I don't mean to say you're wrong in this assessment of things, just that when I re-read that original post of mine, I had clearly stated that I was wrong to have dismissed D'Agostini's value as being virtually nil.

Mike8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-03-2010, 07:42 PM
  #249
Harry Kakalovich
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 879
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
No, I stated clearly in #2 that I dismissed the notion that D'Agostini carried any value. Obviously, I was wrong. The evidence is right there.

It's also clear that Palushaj's value to the Blues had diminished: teams don't trade prospects they covet unless it's for substantial short-term gains. Never happens.

It's equally evident that D'Agostini's value, while perhaps higher in the Blues' perspective, is not the equivalent of a 2nd rounder, as many strong depth players were moved for 2nd rounders today. Further, many players that share roughly the same success as D'Agostini had been available for cheap.

I'm not 'vindicated' by Strickland's article since the very trade is evidence of Palushaj's diminished value. That's not my opinion or interpretation, it's more fact-based given that these deals just don't happen with coveted prospects unless it's for an impact player.

And I don't mean to say you're wrong in this assessment of things, just that when I re-read that original post of mine, I had clearly stated that I was wrong to have dismissed D'Agostini's value as being virtually nil.
Gotcha. I would more or less agree, except that (on the receiving end) I think it is also a case of both teams believing that the players are simply having hard years, and therefore the new teams are hoping to salvage the previously perceived values.

Harry Kakalovich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-04-2010, 08:28 AM
  #250
Le depisteur
Registered User
 
Le depisteur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Québec
Posts: 3,799
vCash: 500
Quote:
Palushaj was St. Louis’ second-round pick (44th overall) in the 2007 NHL Entry Draft, and was Peoria’s most skilled forward. He had a terrific NHL training camp with St. Louis last fall, but a laceration to his foot in October slowed his progress, and a high ankle sprain last month shelved him again.

“To be honest, I don’t know why they dealt me, but it means another team wanted me so that’s a good thing. D’Agostini is a good NHL player, so it’s an honor to be traded for him. Hopefully, I can get to Hamilton and help that team keep winning, and eventually earn a chance with Montreal.”
http://www.pjstar.com/breaking/x1013...-in-late-trade

Le depisteur is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:56 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.