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Buff/Van trade proposal

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Old
05-06-2004, 05:08 PM
  #1
membleypeg
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Buff/Van trade proposal

To Buffalo - Sedin + Sedin + Sopel
To Vancouver - Pyatt + Afinoginov + McKee

Buffalo get a jump in offense, while Vancouver picks up some needed grit and speed.

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05-06-2004, 05:40 PM
  #2
Peter Griffin
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Yuck. Horrible deal for the Canucks. The Sedins are going to stay in Vancouver unless some team overpays. This is nowhere near overpayment.

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05-06-2004, 05:47 PM
  #3
monster_bertuzzi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
Yuck. Horrible deal for the Canucks. The Sedins are going to stay in Vancouver unless some team overpays. This is nowhere near overpayment.
No doubt, but you have to remember that Pyatt and Afinogenov are both extremely young and have almost, or the same amount of potential that the Sedins have.

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05-06-2004, 05:48 PM
  #4
Peter Griffin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi
No doubt, but you have to remember that Pyatt and Afinogenov are both extremely young and have almost, or the same amount of potential that the Sedins have.
But the Sedins have continually improved, Pyatt and Afinogenov haven't.

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Old
05-06-2004, 05:57 PM
  #5
GSG #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by membleypeg
To Buffalo - Sedin + Sedin + Sopel
To Vancouver - Pyatt + Afinoginov + McKee

Buffalo get a jump in offense, while Vancouver picks up some needed grit and speed.
That's a solid deal for the 'Nucks who get some big bodies (in McKee and Pyatt) and also some scoring ability, without really losing any future scoring ability. My main concern in dealing the Sedins would be that the Canucks would really miss them in a few years when guys like Naslund and Bertuzzi either retire or move elsewhere.

I don't know whether the Sabres would do it - maybe because Sopel is a pretty good offensive defenseman and the Sedins are beginning to emerge - but I can't really see them doing it.

Perhaps if that didn't really work, some sort of a Sopel for McKee deal would work...

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05-06-2004, 06:07 PM
  #6
Peter Griffin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSG #18
That's a solid deal for the 'Nucks who get some big bodies (in McKee and Pyatt) and also some scoring ability, without really losing any future scoring ability. My main concern in dealing the Sedins would be that the Canucks would really miss them in a few years when guys like Naslund and Bertuzzi either retire or move elsewhere.
What's the use of having a big body if you don't use it(Pyatt)? Pyatt is basically Marek Malik as a forward. Big body, but not guts, physical play.

Quote:
Perhaps if that didn't really work, some sort of a Sopel for McKee deal would work...
McKee interests me. When healthy, he's the type of d-man the Canucks need(Sabres need as well incidently). Solid defensively, gritty, solid hitter, but over the past two seasons, he's had injury problems and his game has suffered. A healthy, hungry McKee is tempting, the current form, not so much.

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Old
05-06-2004, 06:35 PM
  #7
Weezel RX7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
But the Sedins have continually improved, Pyatt and Afinogenov haven't.
well, Afinogenov got a concussion and suffered about 3/4 of a season. but hes found his legs again. Pyatt is a piece of work. but i wouldnt do that trade in buffalos POV cuz Mckee has stepped up with Brad Brown on the roster and i just love Afinogenovs play especially with Derek Roy up and coming.

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05-06-2004, 06:38 PM
  #8
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You could throw in the Sabres 1st round pick and I'd still say no. Twins aren't going anywhere.

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05-06-2004, 06:52 PM
  #9
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as for the origanal deal

r u on ** **ing drugs!!!!!

Pyatt is not Bertuzzi--Saw him play this year(10 times!!!!) HE IS A THIRD LINER untill he gets his foot speed up and learns to play away from the puck--Af is injury prone--the sisters finally are showing life and heart--toss in 2 1st and then we will talk--toss in Sopel is a joke--McKee would be part of the 3rd d-par for nucks---


BTW

The sisters are the younger of all the players involved!


Last edited by jumptheshark: 05-06-2004 at 06:55 PM.
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05-07-2004, 10:13 AM
  #10
Weezel RX7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark
as for the origanal deal

r u on ** **ing drugs!!!!!

Pyatt is not Bertuzzi--Saw him play this year(10 times!!!!) HE IS A THIRD LINER untill he gets his foot speed up and learns to play away from the puck--Af is injury prone--the sisters finally are showing life and heart--toss in 2 1st and then we will talk--toss in Sopel is a joke--McKee would be part of the 3rd d-par for nucks---


BTW

The sisters are the younger of all the players involved!
afinogenov is not injury prone...ur ********. hes had one major injury, the concussion, and hes recooperated from it. he hasnt had any other significant injuries, just those that any other hockey player receives thru a course of 82 games which are just bumps and bruises and i hardly see his play affected by it

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05-07-2004, 11:52 AM
  #11
ErnestoGuevara
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With a new GM in Vancouver, even thoug he's been with the organization for a while, and a new CBA, we probably won't see any big trades this summer.

I don't see why the Nucks would want to trade the Sedins, they are finnaly starting to play well and more physical, the Nucks should be looking for someone to play on their line instead of looking to trade them. Afinogenov has more value to the Sabres than to the Nucks and I'm not sure what to think about Pyatt... IMO he's not good enough for the second line but perfect for the 3rd line... he just needs to play with a little more enthusiam and determination. The thing with Pyatt is that he still has to potential to be a top line PF and IMO is the player who holds the most value in this proposal.....

I deal Mckee and Sopel would make more sense but I don't tihnk the Sabres are intersting to move McKee.

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05-07-2004, 12:12 PM
  #12
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yuk from a sabres POV.

two small players who have had 1 good season but really dont impress me. the usual canuck think of overrating average players. we get rid of one of the fastest guys in the league, one of our most improved defensman, and a player who tho pisses us off, is still at project stage, not bust.

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05-07-2004, 12:16 PM
  #13
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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We get rid of two of the fastest guys in the league. Remember that Afinogenov is almost as fast as Pyatt.

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05-07-2004, 12:32 PM
  #14
SabresRule
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LALALALALALAFONTAINE
We get rid of two of the fastest guys in the league. Remember that Afinogenov is almost as fast as Pyatt.
i thought pyatt was average in speed? or am i being stupid? i know Max is fast, but pyatt!?

anyway, i dont like the deal. sorta seems like you dont. 3 times we've agreed. cant make it a habbit now.

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05-07-2004, 01:09 PM
  #15
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well I guess both sides can agree... cause outside of the thread starter, most canuck fans wouldn't want to see this deal.

I think this deal is horrible from the canucks POV... are we then left with Chubarov as our #2 center?? or Linden there?? or Kesler in his 2nd year (really 1st real season)??

without Henrik this team doesn't have a 2nd line center.

And while I like Pyatt (who's not had the best of seasons, but IMO will still get better and will be a solid forward), we already have a better version of him in Cooke - he does everything you'd want to see from Pyatt, except he's doing it now, and fits our team like a glove... I don't see the need of moving 2/3rd of our 2nd line to bring in another 3rd line guy, and a right winger who's exactly what we're trying not to get.

Afinegenov is more up and down than most players I've seen... while he has nice speed, and quick moves, he's also not excatly one to bring any grit to our team... the Sedins are grittier than he is - being solid on the boards, strong defensively and are not small players - they are 6'2" and getting stronger every year - and are tough to knock off the puck (that's their game!)... also while Sabres fans will argue that Afinegenov isn't injury prone, the fact is that he's had a concussion, and not just a small minor one at that... we're not talking Lindros type concussions, but any type of concussions you *have* to be careful about, because they never completely leave and can affect him throughout the rest of his career... he gets hit again in the wrong spot at the wrong time, and it compounds what he's experienced before.... he's a risk player.

While adding McKee is nice, and I'd do a McKee-Sopel deal, the rest of the deal just makes no sense from the Canucks POV...

The Sedins have gotten better each year, and broke out in many ways last season... they're showing signs of being able to do things we'd hope from them for a long time, and with each season have been doing it more consistently... so now, coming off their strongest seasons, when both have been consistently producing for longer stretches than ever before - at 23 yrs of age - you deal them??

if Nonis deals the Sedins at this stage, without getting a sure-fire bet to step into our 2nd line - bonafide 60-70+ pt players - then Nonis is an idiot and should be fired before he makes any other bad moves... if nothing else, the Sedins have proven they continue to get better in *every* area of the game each year... trading them now is just plain stupid unless you are getting overpaid... Pyatt and Afinegenov is picking up risks, not overpayment... besides, look at the Sedin's icetime and their point totals... they are producing like 2nd line forwards without 2nd line icetime... what more could you expect from a couple of 23 yr olds??

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05-07-2004, 01:12 PM
  #16
Epsilon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
i thought pyatt was average in speed? or am i being stupid? i know Max is fast, but pyatt!?

anyway, i dont like the deal. sorta seems like you dont. 3 times we've agreed. cant make it a habbit now.
There is an inside joke on the board about Pyatt being one of the fastest players in the NHL. It started over on the prospects board I believe.

Deal is a bad one for the Canucks. Pyatt has never impressed me and I don't think he's progessing anywhere. He's not the next Bertuzzi, he's the next Isbister (of course, there are morons who still want to believe HE is the next Bertuzzi, although that's a rank I'll save for another day).

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05-07-2004, 01:13 PM
  #17
ErnestoGuevara
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresRule
i thought pyatt was average in speed? or am i being stupid? i know Max is fast, but pyatt!?

anyway, i dont like the deal. sorta seems like you dont. 3 times we've agreed. cant make it a habbit now.
Afinogenov is one of the fastest guys in the league..... but Pyatt???????

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05-07-2004, 01:18 PM
  #18
NFITO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsilon
There is an inside joke on the board about Pyatt being one of the fastest players in the NHL. It started over on the prospects board I believe.

Deal is a bad one for the Canucks. Pyatt has never impressed me and I don't think he's progessing anywhere. He's not the next Bertuzzi, he's the next Isbister (of course, there are morons who still want to believe HE is the next Bertuzzi, although that's a rank I'll save for another day).
I wouldn't really call Pyatt the next Isbister... at least IMO.

He's like most young players at this stage in his development - inconsistent... I think he'll improve, but I think he levels off somewhere near where Cooke is now... or Cole... I don't expect to see him get to Bertuzzi's level - really we have so many PF-types coming into the league all the time, from Isbister, to Cole, to O'Neill, and many in between... and how many of them are Bertuzzi types - guys who can dominate a game physically while being one of the top 10 scorers in the game?? not many... I don't see Pyatt ever getting there.

Doesn't mean he won't be a valuable player... Cooke is certainly a huge player for our team, and he value to our team can't be underrated.... but he's not a guy that will dominate physically (he can throw some nice hits and change momentum, but he's not one that will just wear out dmen consistently and be the most physical player in most game), nor will he ever get to the 40 goal or 80-90 point level that Bertuzzi is more than capable of doing consistently (if he can get his head outta his ass)....

I'd take a chance at Pyatt, I think he'll get better... but he's not really a need for the Canucks at this stage, so I wouldn't be moving any key players off our roster (like the Sedins) to get him.

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05-07-2004, 10:00 PM
  #19
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsilon
There is an inside joke on the board about Pyatt being one of the fastest players in the NHL. It started over on the prospects board I believe.

Deal is a bad one for the Canucks. Pyatt has never impressed me and I don't think he's progessing anywhere. He's not the next Bertuzzi, he's the next Isbister (of course, there are morons who still want to believe HE is the next Bertuzzi, although that's a rank I'll save for another day).
Pyatt's speed is because he was timed as the fastest skater of the prospects measured before his draft year.

Size makes a player look slower. Lemieux can fly, but it doesn't look like it. Same with Jean Luc Grand Pierre, who is also faster than Afinogenov.

The stopwatch doesn't lie, unless it's at Virginia Tech.

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05-07-2004, 10:02 PM
  #20
LALALALALALAFONTAINE
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Speaking of guys who don't use their size to crush people, why does Pyatt get mentioned (who got injured throwing a bodycheck) and Sopel doesn't?

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Old
05-07-2004, 10:07 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LALALALALALAFONTAINE
Pyatt's speed is because he was timed as the fastest skater of the prospects measured before his draft year.

Size makes a player look slower. Lemieux can fly, but it doesn't look like it. Same with Jean Luc Grand Pierre, who is also faster than Afinogenov.

The stopwatch doesn't lie, unless it's at Virginia Tech.
and Bryan Allen clocked in as the 2nd fastest Canuck in the skills competition. doesn't mean he uses that speed in a game situation.

how fast you go in a circle around the rink isn't exactly a good indicator of how fast you'll be when it counts.

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