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looking at the Gomez trade today...

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Old
03-08-2010, 08:48 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by HSD19 View Post
It's so funny to see all the rangers fans hating on Gomez and his contract, yet if he was still on their team they would be defending him. Happens with each fan base I guess.
You obviously haven't been on the Rangers board this year, last year, two years ago... If Gomez got a 7th round pick back, we would have been happy. Fans are hoping Redden gets dumped in the AHL. People rag on Drury daily. Trust me, NYR fans are not defending Sather's blunders. Go check the fire Sather thread.

And it's actually reversed. It was fans of every other team saying the Rangers could never unload Gomez due to his horrible contract and play [Montreal fans included]. The only difference is, once he was traded, some Montreal fans changed their tune to defend him. I will say though, I have no issue defending a player on your team, but let's be realistic here. If Montreal fans enjoy having Gomez and his cap hit, then that's good. Atleast he is on a team where the fans will appreciate his performance.

And the reason the Rangers are in a worse position this year is because the team is very poorly constructed. It has nothing to do with Gomez. If we had Gomez instead of Gaborik... we would have atleast 25 less goals this season. This is what happens when you only have one 1st line player, a suspect defense and a team littered with plugs and bottom 6 players.

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03-08-2010, 09:09 AM
  #77
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I find it funny that the rangers are bragging about the trade of Gomez. You had 3 out of 10 worst contract of the league. That's something to brag about right they're. It's looks to be fun being a ranger fan, so much joy in such small accomplishment.


Like I said later, you won the trade but it's still good for the 2 teams. You unload salary to sign a good player (Gaborik) and you have been lucky since he didn't injured himself this year (Miracle).


Gomez even if he isn't the ideal was what we needed. He help the habs win and he is playing for his salary 37 pts in 41 games with Moen as one of his winger for a big chump isn't bad at all. The trade turned good for both teams except the habs are winning more.

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03-08-2010, 09:14 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by BodamsHjammer View Post
Letting Koivu and Kovalev walk were good decisions in my opinion. Koivu hasn't really done anything this year and well, Kovalev is Kovalev. We all know that.

I still can't believe they offered Kovalev the captaincy if he returned.
it's not just about stats, plus Koivu is playing on L2 with Salenne who he hasn't really had good chemistry with this year. Plus Koivu was the heart and soul of MTL. I agree about the Kovalev thing, no idea how they could offer him the captaincy, it would be like offering Jagr the C (ohwait ).


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Originally Posted by CN_paladin View Post
Cammy said himself that Gomez was the reason he signed in Montreal, implying that an aging Koivu would not have been attractive enough to him.

Any, Gomez still make way too much but at least he's been playing great in the final stretch.
of course he said that lol, it's not like there was anyone else he could've said that about (except Markov). Plus Gomez really? is he really and elite player? I could see that case being made about Gionta since Gomez and him player together.

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03-08-2010, 09:26 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by hlundqvist30 View Post
So let me get this straight...

The Habs acquired a 30 year old 7.5 million dollar player on pace for a 14 goal and 60 point season and a 22 year old with 1 goal and 3 assists through 25 games.

The Rangers acquired the cap space necessary to add a 27 year old 7.5 million dollar player on pace for a 46 goal and 92 point season, a defenseman lose to NHL ready who is in the top 5 of what is considered an elite prospect pool, and a player who helped them get a center who so far has put up 7 points in 9 games with the team.

And the Habs won the trade. Got it.
Please...if trading Gomez allowed the Rangers to sign Gaborik, then the acquisition of Gomez allowed the Habs to sign Cammalleri & Gionta, so as it stands now, looks like BOTH teams got what they wanted.

As for your dman prospect Ryan McDonagh...he's a good prospect but hasn't really taken the next step in his development and if anything, has stalled. He's not even the best dman on his team...and Valentenko the other prospect acquired by the Rangers in this deal may never come back to North America at all

We all know Gomez is overpaid, that's Sather's doing...but the Habs acquired a very good player in Scott Gomez and I find it hilarious that people think the Habs are somehow screwed because they have 1 overpaid player, especially when you look around the league at other teams who have multiple bad contracts (#1 example being your Rangers) and those teams survive just fine.

As I said...Gomez sure is overpaid, but at least he's still a productive player. I can live with the 2.5M overpayment which is Gomez, because it allowed the Habs to be players in the free agent market with Gionta & Cammalleri and after a slow start for Gomez, he's been a PPG player the last 30+ games.

As it stands now, the trade was a wash for both teams... However, I stated at the time of the trade that in a few years we will look back and while everyone made fun of the Habs for acquiring Gomez, they're gonna be the winners in the deal at the end of the day.

I liked this trade from day 1 because I don't think the Habs gave up alot of value for a pretty good player and as I mentionned, having Gomez overpaid by about 2.5-3M per/year is easily manageable. Teams like the Hawks survive with bad contracts (Campbell, Huet), Rangers (Roszival, Redden, Drury), Flyers ( Brière, Pronger) yet everyone just talks about the Habs with Gomez...please

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03-08-2010, 09:28 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by FuriousBob View Post
I find it funny that the rangers are bragging about the trade of Gomez. You had 3 out of 10 worst contract of the league. That's something to brag about right they're. It's looks to be fun being a ranger fan, so much joy in such small accomplishment.
Ranger fans did not make this thread. Ranger fans do not keep making threads about which team team won this trade. Ranger fans do not make threads about how the players in the trade are doing on the main boards. We are happy with our end of the trade. Hopefully Montreal fans are too but apparently not since this thread turned into a 'rip apart the Rangers' thread.

But kudos to you for ripping our team for an issue we are well aware of. But if you are looking for the people that are bragging, start by looking towards the brand-new Gomez fan base, not the Ranger fans. But hey, what do I know.

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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Please...if trading Gomez allowed the Rangers to sign Gaborik, then the acquisition of Gomez allowed the Habs to sign Cammalleri & Gionta, so as it stands now, looks like BOTH teams got what they wanted.
I agree with the both got what they wanted. So can these threads stop popping up regarding Gomez. We get it, you like him. We were damn happy to unload him as well. So both teams won in their own eyes.

But as to that logic, it doesn't make much sense to me. The unloading of Gomez gave us direct cap space to sign a player. If you have kept Koivu, I doubt that anyone can say there is a 100% chance Gionta or Camm wouldn't sign for sure.

But in the end, the arguement is pointless. You like Gomez, we liked the extra cap space. End of story. Hopefully next time this gem of a thread can stay where it belongs, on the Habs board.


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03-08-2010, 09:37 AM
  #81
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Gomez still has a few good years in him. I think within those years he'll produce a lot working with his buddy Gionta again, as well with Cammalleri. He's good for playoffs as well, and can make almost any young sniper look good, which is what he's doing with Pouliot right now. Sure he has a big cap hit, but people are getting ridiculous on HF with big cap hits. It seems like 7+ million dollar contracts are the mark of satan around these boards.

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03-08-2010, 09:38 AM
  #82
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3M-3.5M overpaid (caphit), it's way to much, at this price I prefer Spezza by far...

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03-08-2010, 09:43 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by qwertyaas View Post
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You obviously haven't been on the Rangers board this year, last year, two years ago... If Gomez got a 7th round pick back, we would have been happy. Fans are hoping Redden gets dumped in the AHL. People rag on Drury daily. Trust me, NYR fans are not defending Sather's blunders. Go check the fire Sather thread.
As bad as Gomez' contract is, if Sather could of dumped Drury or Redden instead, he would of done it in a mili-second. Again, while Gomez IS overpaid, he's still a very good player in this league. You guys have Chris Drury making 1st line money while producing 23pts and a -13 rating. OUCH!, furthermore he's not getting any better or younger. I won't even get into Redden and/or Roszival's contracts. So you can sit here and claim that Rangers fans would of been happy with a 7th round pick for Gomez but you and I both know that's bull****! Gomez is and also was for you a productive player, not a 7.3M productive player but still much better bang for your buck than Drury, Redden and Rosival combined!

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And it's actually reversed. It was fans of every other team saying the Rangers could never unload Gomez due to his horrible contract and play [Montreal fans included]. The only difference is, once he was traded, some Montreal fans changed their tune to defend him. I will say though, I have no issue defending a player on your team, but let's be realistic here. If Montreal fans enjoy having Gomez and his cap hit, then that's good. Atleast he is on a team where the fans will appreciate his performance.
Some people have this illusion that overpaid players can't still be good players and contribute to team success. Once again, everyone knows Scott Gomez makes about 2.5-3M too much per year, however, he's still a very good player and a legit top 6 center on any team in the NHL. Sather's made a mistake throwing all that money at Gomez, but he compounded his mistake by not surrounding him properly...some of the other contracts he doled out were MUCH more handcuffing than Gomez' contract. Here we are 3 years after Sather spent all that money on Gomez and now he does the same for Gaborik, who is a great player, but he has the same problem as he had when Gomez was on the team, he's got no one to play with. So while all Rangers fans thought Gomez' contract was the one handcuffing them, he's gone now and they're still handcuffed...weird
Quote:
And the reason the Rangers are in a worse position this year is because the team is very poorly constructed. It has nothing to do with Gomez. If we had Gomez instead of Gaborik... we would have atleast 25 less goals this season. This is what happens when you only have one 1st line player, a suspect defense and a team littered with plugs and bottom 6 players
Again...If the Rangers could have BOTH Gaborik & Gomez, MINUS Drury Redden and/or Roszival, I think they'd have 25 MORE goals. Your GM has no clue how to build a team, none whatsoever and I think it's sad Gainey was ridiculed all year for acquiring Gomez when IMO, the real joke is on Sather

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03-08-2010, 09:49 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by qwertyaas View Post

I agree with the both got what they wanted. So can these threads stop popping up regarding Gomez. We get it, you like him. We were damn happy to unload him as well. So both teams won in their own eyes.

But as to that logic, it doesn't make much sense to me. The unloading of Gomez gave us direct cap space to sign a player. If you have kept Koivu, I doubt that anyone can say there is a 100% chance Gionta or Camm wouldn't sign for sure.

But in the end, the arguement is pointless. You like Gomez, we liked the extra cap space. End of story. Hopefully next time this gem of a thread can stay where it belongs, on the Habs board.
I find this argument about signing Koivu a joke even from Habs fans. I'll always have a ton of respect for what Koivu did with the Habs and everything he went through during his tenure here (he deserved more) but Saku Koivu today, is a shadow of his former self. Re-signing Koivu was simply not an option for a team looking to overhaul his core. Cammalleri & Gionta BOTH went on record to state that Gomez acquisition played a big factor into their decision to sign, of course i'm sure other factors such as the money they got from Gainey also played into it, but there's NO DOUBT the Gomez trade helped both of them sign in MTL. Saku Koivu simply does not have the same caché evidently...just look back through UFA history the last 10 years and show me a time the Habs were as active, and many times they were in the running to sign guys like Shannahan, Hull, Brière but all those players chose to sign elsewhere instead of coming to play in Montreal with Koivu

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03-08-2010, 09:51 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by alpine4life View Post
3M-3.5M overpaid (caphit), it's way to much, at this price I prefer Spezza by far...
Gomez makes 7.3M/yr...give his age, experience and production. He should probably be making around 5-5.5M. So he's actually, he's about 2-2.5M overpaid.

In other words...it's not the end of the world and not nearly as damaging as many here and in the media would have you believe. You can trust that there are teams in MUCH worse situations than that across the NHL.

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03-08-2010, 09:58 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by qwertyaas View Post
Ranger fans did not make this thread. Ranger fans do not keep making threads about which team team won this trade. Ranger fans do not make threads about how the players in the trade are doing on the main boards. We are happy with our end of the trade. Hopefully Montreal fans are too but apparently not since this thread turned into a 'rip apart the Rangers' thread.

But kudos to you for ripping our team for an issue we are well aware of. But if you are looking for the people that are bragging, start by looking towards the brand-new Gomez fan base, not the Ranger fans. But hey, what do I know.



I agree with the both got what they wanted. So can these threads stop popping up regarding Gomez. We get it, you like him. We were damn happy to unload him as well. So both teams won in their own eyes.

But as to that logic, it doesn't make much sense to me. The unloading of Gomez gave us direct cap space to sign a player. If you have kept Koivu, I doubt that anyone can say there is a 100% chance Gionta or Camm wouldn't sign for sure.

But in the end, the arguement is pointless. You like Gomez, we liked the extra cap space. End of story. Hopefully next time this gem of a thread can stay where it belongs, on the Habs board.

This thread got ripped by both fanbase. My first post here was stating that the trade was good for both teams but Ranger fans where still saying how it was one sided. You won the trade, it's the 3rd time I say it in this thread but the trade is still good for the 2 teams.


My statement is: Gomez is our no.1 A-B center and I really don't see who we would put at this spot if it wasn't him. Nobody can say that Cammalleri signed with the habs for gomez but I think it's a good guess saying Gionta did. He is giving us good hockey for the biggest part of the season (37pts in is last 41 games).


What I was looking to say with my last thread is the way you rangers fan just see what was good for you guys and you are not looking what the trade did for us. You get to unload a big salary and we get one of the only center who was available and he is performing very well as of late.

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03-08-2010, 10:00 AM
  #87
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Obviously the rangers won the trade. But Gomez has been playing very well for the Habs and has aided in Pouliot emerging as a big body goal scorer.

Rangers won the trade, but they aren't any better today then they were a year ago today. Neither are the Habs. The standings say so. So Ranger fans fapp'n to this trade shouldn't be because your team is still mediocre, and my fellow hab fans shouldn't be so ******** when people say we lost the trade, because we did...In the end, still two mediocre teams.

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03-08-2010, 10:04 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
As bad as Gomez' contract is, if Sather could of dumped Drury or Redden instead, he would of done it in a mili-second

...

Again...If the Rangers could have BOTH Gaborik & Gomez, MINUS Drury Redden and/or Roszival, I think they'd have 25 MORE goals. Your GM has no clue how to build a team, none whatsoever and I think it's sad Gainey was ridiculed all year for acquiring Gomez when IMO, the real joke is on Sather
Oh I absolutely agree with you. Gomez had tons more value than both Redden and Drury (although Drury has a full NTC/NMC so that isn't an option regardless). He was the easiest movable contract from the 3.

Although Sather does pull some good trades from the Rangers perspective, most are just made to remedy his previous blunders (Gomez, Kotalik...). If you expect us as fans not to know Sather's issues you are dead wrong. Take a look at the Rangers boards.

We are well aware of where Sather put the Rangers with these horrible UFA signings. To us, Gomez was just another one of those. That's why we don't miss him. We were glad to get rid of the contract. We would have been glad to get rid of any of the three. We could have received a 7th round pick for Gomez and be glad that we had extra cap space. This is not a insult to Gomez, but to Sather for putting the Rangers in that position of needing to offload contracts that don't fit the team.

But as for Gomez and Gaborik speculation, who knows how that would have turned out. We said the same with Jagr, Naslund and Gomez. Although this season is a pretty big letdown, it was expected with this roster. Although I can't say any Ranger fans are disappointed with Gaborik [he is one of the few brightspots of the season] and Prospal as his linemate for a little over $1m.

In the end, both teams got what they wanted out of this trade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FuriousBob View Post
My statement is: Gomez is our no.1 A-B center and I really don't see who we would put at this spot if it wasn't him. Nobody can say that Cammalleri signed with the habs for gomez but I think it's a good guess saying Gionta did. He is giving us good hockey for the biggest part of the season (37pts in is last 41 games).
As I said also, both teams got what they were looking for. There doesn't have to be a winner and loser to a trade. Trades can work out for both sides. It worked out for the Rangers and it filled a void on the Habs so it obviously worked out as well.

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03-08-2010, 10:06 AM
  #89
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In other words...it's not the end of the world and not nearly as damaging as many here and in the media would have you believe. You can trust that there are teams in MUCH worse situations than that across the NHL.
NYR: Rozival (5M caphit), Redden (6M caphit), the same team that got rid of Gomez

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03-08-2010, 10:08 AM
  #90
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This thread got ripped by both fanbase. My first post here was stating that the trade was good for both teams but Ranger fans where still saying how it was one sided. You won the trade, it's the 3rd time I say it in this thread but the trade is still good for the 2 teams.
LOL...how do do the Rangers win this trade? The trade was Gomez + Pyatt + Busto for Higgins + McDonagh + Valentenko. Rangers fans want to try to extrapolate this trade into Gaborik which IMO, makes no sense and just serves to hide the fact they gave up an overpaid but productive player for almost nothing. The actual trade as i've indicated it here is a clear win for Montreal as it stands now...Higgins is gone, Valentenko is in Russia and your guess is as good as as if he will ever come over and even if he does, no one knows the type of impact he'll have, McDonagh is a good prospect but hasn't quite developped as much as many expected and by the time he reaches maturation and is ready to make any kind of impact in the NHL with the Rangers, Gomez will probably be gone

Quote:
While Scott Gomez plays and contributes on the 1st line in Montreal and Tom Pyatt has been quite a find for the Habs. So please explain to me how the Rangers won this trade (and again, I don't buy the Gaborik angle and if you do, then you need to use the Cammaller/Gionta angle as well, which makes this trade a wash)
While it's foolish to think Gomez was the sole reason Cammaller & Gionta signed in Montreal, it's equally as foolish to think it didn't play a factor.

Quote:
What I was looking to say with my last thread is the way you rangers fan just see what was good for you guys and you are not looking what the trade did for us. You get to unload a big salary and we get one of the only center who was available and he is performing very well as of late
Exactly...both teams paid a price to get what they wanted.

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03-08-2010, 10:11 AM
  #91
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Terrible trade.

It's still a 60 pt, 15 goal scorer for $7.2 mil. year for 4 more seasons..

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03-08-2010, 10:16 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by FuriousBob View Post
This thread got ripped by both fanbase. My first post here was stating that the trade was good for both teams but Ranger fans where still saying how it was one sided. You won the trade, it's the 3rd time I say it in this thread but the trade is still good for the 2 teams.


My statement is: Gomez is our no.1 A-B center and I really don't see who we would put at this spot if it wasn't him. Nobody can say that Cammalleri signed with the habs for gomez but I think it's a good guess saying Gionta did. He is giving us good hockey for the biggest part of the season (37pts in is last 41 games).


What I was looking to say with my last thread is the way you rangers fan just see what was good for you guys and you are not looking what the trade did for us. You get to unload a big salary and we get one of the only center who was available and he is performing very well as of late.
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Oh I absolutely agree with you. Gomez had tons more value than both Redden and Drury (although Drury has a full NTC/NMC so that isn't an option regardless). He was the easiest movable contract from the 3.

Although Sather does pull some good trades from the Rangers perspective, most are just made to remedy his previous blunders (Gomez, Kotalik...). If you expect us as fans not to know Sather's issues you are dead wrong. Take a look at the Rangers boards.

We are well aware of where Sather put the Rangers with these horrible UFA signings. To us, Gomez was just another one of those. That's why we don't miss him. We were glad to get rid of the contract. We would have been glad to get rid of any of the three. We could have received a 7th round pick for Gomez and be glad that we had extra cap space. This is not a insult to Gomez, but to Sather for putting the Rangers in that position of needing to offload contracts that don't fit the team.

But as for Gomez and Gaborik speculation, who knows how that would have turned out. We said the same with Jagr, Naslund and Gomez. Although this season is a pretty big letdown, it was expected with this roster. Although I can't say any Ranger fans are disappointed with Gaborik [he is one of the few brightspots of the season] and Prospal as his linemate for a little over $1m.

In the end, both teams got what they wanted out of this trade.
Agreed...the trade served it purpose and both teams paid a penalty for it.

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03-08-2010, 10:18 AM
  #93
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I'm not a fan of either team, but seriously how are you defending the gomez trade by saying NYR have other ****** contracts?

The gomez trade was AWFUL and will only get worse. There's not way around it. None at all.

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03-08-2010, 10:20 AM
  #94
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Terrible trade.

It's still a 60 pt, 15 goal scorer for $7.2 mil. year for 4 more seasons..
Habs are banking on the hope that Gomez can bring that production up into the 70-75pt mark and truthfully, had it not been for all the injuries. He'd probably be on par for that.

So 7.3M for a 70-75pt scorer is an overpayment...but not by much and definitely one we can live by.

I find it hilarious (in a ridiculous kind of way) that everyone think that because of Scott Gomez' contract, the Habs are somehow doomed! It's especially funny when you look through other teams rosters and look at some of their contracts and everyone think they'll be just fine! lol

Truth is, there isn't one single team in the NHL without a bad contract

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03-08-2010, 10:21 AM
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I'm not a fan of either team, but seriously how are you defending the gomez trade by saying NYR have other ****** contracts?

The gomez trade was AWFUL and will only get worse. There's not way around it. None at all.
If that's what you summarized from what I wrote...then you have trouble reading or comprehension. So I won't bother explaining it again

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03-08-2010, 10:22 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Habs are banking on the hope that Gomez can bring that production up into the 70-75pt mark and truthfully, had it not been for all the injuries. He'd probably be on par for that.

So 7.3M for a 70-75pt scorer is an overpayment...but not by much and definitely one we can live by.

I find it hilarious (in a ridiculous kind of way) that everyone think that because of Scott Gomez' contract, the Habs are somehow doomed! It's especially funny when you look through other teams rosters and look at some of their contracts and everyone think they'll be just fine! lol

Truth is, there isn't one single team in the NHL without a bad contract

Chicago, Pittsburgh, Washington? They may have a 'not great' contract on the roster, but none of them have an albatross.

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03-08-2010, 10:25 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Blue'sClues View Post
"today"..... both teams fighting for their playoff lives, no clear winner as of now.
Exactly. I am not a fan of the move but I guess I'll have to live with it. Unless Gomez suddenly puts up 2-3 years of 25 goals and 85 points, he will never live up to this contract.

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03-08-2010, 10:32 AM
  #98
UAGoalieGuy
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So how exactly are the Habs suppose to re-sign their #1 center and point scorer in Plekanec, one or both of Price/Halak, Pouliet, Lapierre, and fill out the rest of their roster with about $12 million in cap space?

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03-08-2010, 10:34 AM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czwalga View Post
Chicago, Pittsburgh, Washington? They may have a 'not great' contract on the roster, but none of them have an albatross.
You can't be serious. Huet and to a lesser extent, Campbell have horrible, crippling contracts. Just ask Chicago fans how they're gonna keep all those forwards around for next season.

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03-08-2010, 10:37 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by kanuck87 View Post
You can't be serious. Huet and to a lesser extent, Campbell have horrible, crippling contracts. Just ask Chicago fans how they're gonna keep all those forwards around for next season.
That and the debacle last summer with Chicago's RFA's. They are going to have to move some combination of Sharp, Bolland, Vertseeg, or Barker.

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