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Anyone else catch Chicken Parm's comments on Mess last nite?

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04-29-2004, 01:13 PM
  #1
Laches
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Anyone else catch Chicken Parm's comments on Mess last nite?

In the context of a discussion about who should prevail in a conflict between a coach and a star player, Ferraro and Melrose said that in a good situation, the GM stands behind the coach. Ferraro said that he had seen it both ways, and cited the Vinny situation in Tampa as the right way, and the Rangers when he was here as the wrong one. He said something to the effect of "I played with Mark Messier and believe me, it was Mark Messier, not the coaches, making most of the decisions", and talked about how that was not a good thing. I wonder how many others felt that way.

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04-29-2004, 01:33 PM
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charliemurphy
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Yikes!!! It was obvious that Sather adored and still adores Messier.
Mark Messier should stay away from the Garden.
Wouldn't be shocked if others felt or still feel that way.

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04-29-2004, 01:46 PM
  #3
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He'll be back...I hope his boat sinks.

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04-29-2004, 02:19 PM
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True Blue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laches
He said something to the effect of "I played with Mark Messier and believe me, it was Mark Messier, not the coaches, making most of the decisions", and talked about how that was not a good thing. I wonder how many others felt that way.
I'm betting a lot. This is not just another shot at Messier, but it has long been speculated that no trades are done unless they are first discussed with him. It is undeniable that Messier wielded more power than any other player on any other team. He wielded more power on the Rangers than some coaches had.

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04-29-2004, 02:27 PM
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Nothing like being the punching bag of the NHL. Anything wrong, blame it on or compare it to the Rangers. Thank you Glen Sather

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04-29-2004, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
I'm betting a lot. This is not just another shot at Messier, but it has long been speculated that no trades are done unless they are first discussed with him. It is undeniable that Messier wielded more power than any other player on any other team. He wielded more power on the Rangers than some coaches had.
I don't think Mess was consulted on the Leetch trade....

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04-29-2004, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Slewfoot
I don't think Mess was consulted on the Leetch trade....
That's about the one. I can't remember if he was still here when Kovalev was traded either.

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04-29-2004, 02:39 PM
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He wasn't here...

if you're talking about the Kovalev for Nedved trade back in 1998.

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04-29-2004, 02:50 PM
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Fotiu22
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mess rules...hope he comes back for another year!! (and plays no more than 12min/game..how's that?)

(go ahead, now you can all abuse me for being like the ONE person on here that feels that way)


p.s. charliemurphy: that is THE funniest name/avataar ever :lol

OKAYYYY!! WHATTT!! YEAH!! :lol

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04-29-2004, 02:58 PM
  #10
Bluenote13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotiu22

p.s. charliemurphy: that is THE funniest name/avataar ever :lol

OKAYYYY!! WHATTT!! YEAH!! :lol
It's getting so old already though.

Chappelle is great

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04-29-2004, 02:58 PM
  #11
Fletch
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I wouldn't slam you...

for saying that to start this season. To go into next season...I'm not 100% sure at this point. First, I like how Mess ended it - it seemed as though he did end it and to come back may dilute that somewhat. Of course one's career should not be decided based on that, but it is time to move on. Could he be helpful as a fourth liner with many of these kids? Most likely, but is there a kid who can be as productive as a 44 year old Mess would be. I was fine with his play this season, but he's really getting up there and the team's going (or should be going) in another direction.

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04-29-2004, 02:59 PM
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Melrose_Jr.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fotiu22
go ahead, now you can all abuse me for being like the ONE person on here that feels that way
:beatup:

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04-29-2004, 03:03 PM
  #13
Fotiu22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
:beatup:

haha... that is funny... ok, ok, maybe i'm hanging onto the past too tightly...

hmmm come to think of it, maybe i should stop calling my high school sweetheart everytime im drunk too??

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04-29-2004, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13
It's getting so old already though.

Chappelle is great

Bluenote I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU. don't get me wrong, last month i spent an entire weekend telling every girl in new orleans that i was rick james. but it is getting a little old.

ohh and chappelle is my favorite comedian ever, and i listen to alot of stand up (drive from school is 5 hours, anyone out there who takes long drives i recommend burning downloaded stand up). and his show is amazing too.

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04-29-2004, 03:29 PM
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Mesier wielded the same power as Gretzky, Mario, Yzerman and more than a few other players have yielded in their career.

But hockey is like a business. When the big cheese leads you to a championship no one has a freakin thing to say. When you don't win, everyone has a comment to make.

Ferraro is still pissed about being traded during the 96 season.

As for player input into trades, i dont see anyone mentioning how Nedved was consulted about the dvorak and hlvac trades and was also asked more than a few questions about brendl pre draft.

Lots of players get asked about trades and have input and even some sway. But the Rangers haven't won so people point at the captain. That is just the way it goes, and that is why some people can't be captains or leaders on a team.

If anyone thinks Messier was inside on the Leetch, Simon and Barnaby trades, you're out of your mind. Purinton was also a favorite of Messier but you don't see him getting 20 minutes a night. Kovalev was a Messier favorite too.

Ironically if I remember correctly Ferraro was also given some insight with the Islanders as well {the Turgeon trade, a few others come to mind}. But i guess it's a lot easier to talk when you're in a broadcast booth and your target is on his way out of the league. C'mon Ray you had 8 years to make a comment, your timing was weak.

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04-29-2004, 03:53 PM
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Evgeny Oliker
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i dont think you can compare messier to nedved or anyone else for that reason. it is ok to consult certain players to a CERTAIN EXTENT. nedved was consulted ONLY about czech players like hlavac and dvorek, which makes total sense since nedved is czech and should know a thing or two about czech players. finally, nedved was only CONSULTED about certain players, whereas MESSIER basically had a HUGE say in not just certain players, but many players, of many different countries. no matter how smart messier might be about players and such, allowing a player, captain or not, destroys the respect that the rest of the team has for the coach and the GM, the two people who should have enough brains to make their own decisions. as i said, its ok to CONSULT a player at times, but its not ok with let him rule your team to such a great extent.






Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
Mesier wielded the same power as Gretzky, Mario, Yzerman and more than a few other players have yielded in their career.

But hockey is like a business. When the big cheese leads you to a championship no one has a freakin thing to say. When you don't win, everyone has a comment to make.

Ferraro is still pissed about being traded during the 96 season.

As for player input into trades, i dont see anyone mentioning how Nedved was consulted about the dvorak and hlvac trades and was also asked more than a few questions about brendl pre draft.

Lots of players get asked about trades and have input and even some sway. But the Rangers haven't won so people point at the captain. That is just the way it goes, and that is why some people can't be captains or leaders on a team.

If anyone thinks Messier was inside on the Leetch, Simon and Barnaby trades, you're out of your mind. Purinton was also a favorite of Messier but you don't see him getting 20 minutes a night. Kovalev was a Messier favorite too.

Ironically if I remember correctly Ferraro was also given some insight with the Islanders as well {the Turgeon trade, a few others come to mind}. But i guess it's a lot easier to talk when you're in a broadcast booth and your target is on his way out of the league. C'mon Ray you had 8 years to make a comment, your timing was weak.

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04-29-2004, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2forsbergaura1
i dont think you can compare messier to nedved or anyone else for that reason. it is ok to consult certain players to a CERTAIN EXTENT. nedved was consulted ONLY about czech players like hlavac and dvorek, which makes total sense since nedved is czech and should know a thing or two about czech players. finally, nedved was only CONSULTED about certain players, whereas MESSIER basically had a HUGE say in not just certain players, but many players, of many different countries. no matter how smart messier might be about players and such, allowing a player, captain or not, destroys the respect that the rest of the team has for the coach and the GM, the two people who should have enough brains to make their own decisions. as i said, its ok to CONSULT a player at times, but its not ok with let him rule your team to such a great extent.
If it wasn't for Messier's input in 1994 , Brian Leetch would have been traded away by Keenan/Smith.....

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04-29-2004, 05:22 PM
  #18
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For starters Chicken Parm is a moron. Much like Pang he was a loser player who couldn't get it done so he has to run his mouth on T.V. to make himself feel better. The bottom line is that none of these buffoons have any clue what goes on with Messier and the coaches. Chicken Dope is assuming. Probably because he didn't play much and thought Messier was the reason instead of the fact that he stunk as a hockey player.


The Rangers only problem till this year was failure to trade of vets, stock pile picks and prospects and play as much youth as possible in an attempt to build a young nucleus. You could have hired the best coach in the world and it wounldn't have saved these old dopes from losing games.

This team needed to build a nucleus of at least 2-3 young defenseman, 2-3 young, above average grinders and 3-4 young, productive offensive players. Goal we are set at. I'm not worry about the defense or grinders. It's the offense I'm concerned about. We need to hope Balej, Wiseman and Moore can give us something on offense to build on till


Dawes is ready. All hail Dawes! All hail Dawes!

 
Old
04-29-2004, 09:42 PM
  #19
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Weak on no

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge
Mesier wielded the same power as Gretzky, Mario, Yzerman and more than a few other players have yielded in their career.

But hockey is like a business. When the big cheese leads you to a championship no one has a freakin thing to say. When you don't win, everyone has a comment to make.

Ferraro is still pissed about being traded during the 96 season.

As for player input into trades, i dont see anyone mentioning how Nedved was consulted about the dvorak and hlvac trades and was also asked more than a few questions about brendl pre draft.

Lots of players get asked about trades and have input and even some sway. But the Rangers haven't won so people point at the captain. That is just the way it goes, and that is why some people can't be captains or leaders on a team.

If anyone thinks Messier was inside on the Leetch, Simon and Barnaby trades, you're out of your mind. Purinton was also a favorite of Messier but you don't see him getting 20 minutes a night. Kovalev was a Messier favorite too.

Ironically if I remember correctly Ferraro was also given some insight with the Islanders as well {the Turgeon trade, a few others come to mind}. But i guess it's a lot easier to talk when you're in a broadcast booth and your target is on his way out of the league. C'mon Ray you had 8 years to make a comment, your timing was weak.
and I agree that it was kind of suspect timing, BUT, if it's something that players were feeling then, they are surely feeling the same way now which creates dissention in the lockerroom. Quiet brooding is a nasty cancer. Should that individual player suck it up and go with the program? Or should the GM have the balls to be a GM and ask for opinions and not look for a decision sharing situation.

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04-29-2004, 11:07 PM
  #20
Edge
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This happens in EVERY locker room where you have a personality like Messier. It happened during the oilers hey day and it happened during the Rangers cup run. You're always going to have that.

The thing with sports is that when you win NO ONE cares but when you win EVERYONE has something to say. I can tell you Gretzky, Mario, Messier, Yzerman they all do the EXACT same things.

I really believe the fundamental problems with this team come from its make up, not its captain. I believed that when Gretzky was here, I believe that when Messier was here.

They're are people who will tell you they hate messier and people who love him. That's always going to come into play with a personality like Mark's. It's what he lives and dies by, but it's unchanging. It was that "political" movement that played a big part in both the 1990 cup with Edmonton and the 94 cup with the Rangers.

I just don't buy it. I have nothing again Ray Ferraro but whom did he ever lead to anything in life to criticize a style that someone uses that has shown results when in the right situation.

I can't tell you i know everything going on behind closed doors but i do remember that Ferraro and Messier are not exactly "friends" so to speak.

the biggest problem with this team is that it has serious design flaws during it's building phase. But i guess guys like Fleury and Holik and other amazing personalities over the past 7 years have been entirely blamed on Messier. From rapists to alcoholics to people who run their mouth but aren't interested in helping a team, it all must be because messier "made" sather do it. Messier made Sather hire Trottier and Low and all those other coaches.

You know who had the biggest people pissed at him this year? Everyone's buddy Holik. Their were guys on this roster who wanted to drill him into next weekend. Ironically enough this teams lockerroom wasn't incredibly divided so much as it didn't have a LW, or consistent goaltending or a solid defense for most of the year.

But either way they failed and so they become open season for shots from everyone. Including someone who was a part of an annual St. Louis Blues collapse in the post season.

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04-29-2004, 11:36 PM
  #21
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It's a low blow.... the Rangers continue to be the whipping boys of the NHL...

I like Ferraro, but I think this comment was stupid. Criticizing teammates is something that I have no patience for. I would like to think players would have a brotherhood, and just keep their mouths shut in public.

What great thing has Ferraro done to let him tarnish the reputation of a top 5 player of all-time like Mess?

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04-29-2004, 11:57 PM
  #22
charliemurphy
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I don't think Ferraro's comments have tarnished Messier's reputation.
Not in my mind anyway.
I think Sather and the Rangers have earned the right of being the whipping boys of the NHL.

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04-30-2004, 02:49 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charliemurphy
I don't think Ferraro's comments have tarnished Messier's reputation.
Not in my mind anyway.
I think Sather and the Rangers have earned the right of being the whipping boys of the NHL.
Agreed.

It's hard to find any b'caster that has a positive thing to say the NYR. I personally can't find too many things to jump up & down about, and I'm a fan.

@ ESPN, Melrose especially likes to take any chance he gets he takes a jab at the team. It almost seems like he has an agenda.

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04-30-2004, 02:54 PM
  #24
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Melrose can rip the Rangers all he wants. He has picked them for the playoffs the past 3 years. He went on record this year saying they have so much talent they can't miss the playoffs. Basically our Rangers have made him look like a total idiot much like they have done with the fans.

 
Old
04-30-2004, 03:19 PM
  #25
Edge
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For me it wasnt the comment about the team that bothered me. Heck i say that all the time. It was the comment about Messier and knowing the history between them and knowing that the second highest scorer in NHL history just likely retired I felt it was out of line and honestly untrue.

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