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Old
03-24-2010, 02:12 PM
  #26
bleedgreen
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my point about greensboro was only made in terms of the players struggling, and wondering how you can base your opinions on their performance in this situation. they went from being heroes and recognized everywhere they went living near the center of it all, to mostly living 90 minutes away from practice/games leaving families every day to a mostly empty arena where no one knew the rules. of course they struggled with it. burke/sandy were traded because of comments they made in a SI article where they mentioned they had realized how good they had it in hartford and missed it. jr was having issues with the teams identity, and realized they needed a new start with guys who werent looking over their shoulder a bit and did this move. he decided to gut the locker room of the former leadership he had inherited.

these were ugly days by any angle. i dont mean to diss greensboro, im sure there were a lot of people around - but you cant honestly say it was good for the players at all. the move was tough, and sandy and burke paid the price. if jr actually used this burke incident as smoke screen for why he was really doing it, then shame on him even more. burke was the guy hugging the cancer kids and giving money to everything, and jr was always the first to pimp him that way. if he hung him out to you guys for this incident after acting the way he did for those years in hartford he is a complete ****** bag.

im not knocking greensboro but it was what it was. not ideal for anyone, and the easiest way for karmanos to get out of town when he did. if you had seen what they went from to what they went to, you would understand my point. not trying to hijack the thread, geehad wanted to go there with the burke thing and im gonna defend the guy. the notion that he got turned into a wife beater to you guys is nauseating.

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03-24-2010, 02:16 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by karparules View Post
Give me a break. I'm sure she really whipped his butt.
im a paramedic. i respond to these multiple times a week. youd be shocked at how often the female has the upper hand. guys take a beating. this happens next door to everyone every day. give me a break. especially in those days the guy was automatically assumed at fault, seeing there were actual charges against her thats pretty telling.

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03-24-2010, 02:38 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
its a shame you guys werent around for sanderson/burke in their primes. sanderson was the fastest winger in hockey, with one of the hardest shots - he was as exciting a player as we've ever had. he is still the best home grown winger we've had since then, and aside from francis and staal he is the best forward in our modern era.

no offense to cam, but sean was our best goalie ever. ive never had the confidence level in cam that i had in sean. from day one he was the daddy mac. we were a better team the first day he played, ive never seen a bigger difference in a team from one player. its like the difference in the hawks when they got kane and toews.

thats no slight on cam, its just he hasnt had the the consistent body of work yet. when he is on he one of the best in the league, when he isnt he is average. he seems to be getting there, but if it was one game at their best id take sean.
I watched hockey my whole life and Burke was good, but he couldn't hold Cam's jockstrap

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03-24-2010, 02:39 PM
  #29
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Alright, let's smoke the peacepipe Bleedgreen.

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03-24-2010, 02:40 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post

i dont buy domestic charges at all, as it is law that the guy goes to jail in any domestic incident regardless of what really happened or who called
WTF are you talking about, please don't mention things that you have no clue about

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03-24-2010, 02:43 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by karparules View Post
Alright, let's smoke the peacepipe Bleedgreen.
we're good, i meant no offense.

and hurricane youre high on karpas peacepipe if you think cam is better then burke was in hartford. in the parlance of our hf times "...and its not even close". he probably will be when its done but he hasnt done it yet at all. he has had a few good stretches aside from the cup run, but i think we all notice that he has his down times. he has improved every year, and will be a top goalie for a long time if his back holds up, but burke defied logic with the whale.

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03-24-2010, 02:44 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
WTF are you talking about, please don't mention things that you have no clue about
i feel comfortable in my knowledge of them. before we repeat the whole conversation, at least read the rest of the thread.

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03-24-2010, 02:46 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
i feel comfortable in my knowledge of them. before we repeat the whole conversation, at least read the rest of the thread.
You just said.. IT"S THE LAW THAT THE GUY GOES TO JAIL... You are COMPLETELY wrong, I don't care about the rest of the conversation... That was a complete lie

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03-24-2010, 02:47 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
we're good, i meant no offense.

and hurricane youre high on karpas peacepipe if you think cam is better then burke was in hartford. in the parlance of our hf times "...and its not even close". he probably will be when its done but he hasnt done it yet at all. he has had a few good stretches aside from the cup run, but i think we all notice that he has his down times. he has improved every year, and will be a top goalie for a long time if his back holds up, but burke defied logic with the whale.
Simple case of over estimating someone after they are gone... Your memories are MUCH bigger than that man was in net... He was a good goalie, but no way was he better than Cam...

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03-24-2010, 02:50 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
You just said.. IT"S THE LAW THAT THE GUY GOES TO JAIL... You are COMPLETELY wrong, I don't care about the rest of the conversation... That was a complete lie
in the 90's thats the way it worked. if someone called 911 on a domestic and the cops showed up, the guy got arrested.

on my job...this year....ive seen guys beaten with pipes and the lady didnt have a single scratch on her but she called 911 and said he hit her. dude goes to jail....after the hospital of course. maybe these things get worked in court, maybe they dont - but the absolute truth is if your lady calls 911 and says you hit her even if she changes her mind once the cop is there you are going to jail.

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03-24-2010, 02:52 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
Simple case of over estimating someone after they are gone... Your memories are MUCH bigger than that man was in net... He was a good goalie, but no way was he better than Cam...
simple case of overestimating the guy in front of you know who you root for every night and love. it happens. i love him too.

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03-24-2010, 02:52 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
in the 90's thats the way it worked. if someone called 911 on a domestic and the cops showed up, the guy got arrested.

on my job...this year....ive seen guys beaten with pipes and the lady didnt have a single scratch on her but she called 911 and said he hit her. dude goes to jail....after the hospital of course. maybe these things get worked in court, maybe they dont - but the absolute truth is if your lady calls 911 and says you hit her even if she changes her mind once the cop is there you are going to jail.

Not the truth... sorry pal... and you stated it's the LAW... You can take one guess why I know you're full of ****, btw

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03-24-2010, 02:54 PM
  #38
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still doesnt mean we had any idea what happened between him and his wife. we have no idea if he had any injuries at all, what caused the fight - basically none of the details aside from she had a bruises. if you take that as your only data to what happened your likely missing much of the story. judging the guy from this incident when we dont know any of the details is a ridiculous reason to hang the guys character out. is that quote from jr? it wasnt mentioned during the trade was it?

looked up some info, after his conviction all he had was a $200 fine and probation with a class. there are a lot of questions about what really happened there. that isnt a stiff penalty. i stand by my assertion you cant throw this guy under the bus for this.
You "don't buy it" and think it's a character assassination, yet this reply shows you didn't know the first thing about it.

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03-24-2010, 02:57 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
You can take one guess why I know you're full of ****, btw
Ooh ooh ooh...I know the answer to this one!

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03-24-2010, 03:00 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
simple case of overestimating the guy in front of you know who you root for every night and love. it happens. i love him too.
Burke post a .90x save % while he was with our franchise... He only had a 2-3 year stretch in Phoenix where he was anywhere near Cam... Cam is also clutch, sure as a young net minder he had some bad stretches, but every year he's gotten better (except this injury year) and even this year his stretch where he came back from his stitches, he was one of the best in the league... We will see how his back holds up though

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03-24-2010, 03:04 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
Not the truth... sorry pal... and you stated it's the LAW... You can take one guess why I know you're full of ****, btw
because ive seen the cops say it. i heard them say it in CT. ive heard them say it here.

this guy sounds like he himself went through this and needs some anger management, this is not a good example of my point but this guy obviously went through the ringer cuz of this.
http://www.nytimes.com/2000/10/23/sp...l?pagewanted=1

found that because i was researching when roy went to jail because his wife called 911, it was even said at the time that this is what happens. im trying to find proof of THAT but it was a long time ago. they went to his place after a 911 hangup, found some damage to a closet and dragged him off to jail calling it criminal mischief, then it was called domestic violence when they admitted they had argued.

if you think im full of ****, get out of your court or wherever you practice and get out on the streets. this happens all the time. if by the letter of the law this isnt true then im wrong, but why is this the case in every domestic ive ever seen on the streets? the law does not match with the practice.

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Old
03-24-2010, 03:04 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by karparules View Post
Not sure why this became a big argument. I never said anything disparaging about either Goeff or Sean's time in Hartford. I actually knew all about them and had seen them play with the Whalers. Both had great NHL careers. So, by your definition, any player that has been on waivers is a spare part? I guess Jussi Jokinen is a spare part. If I'm not mistaken, after leaving Carolina, Sanderson was left unprotected and claimed in the expansion draft by Columbus. That's just as much a dark point in a player's career as being placed on waivers. And I'm not saying that this makes him a bad player.
I was one of those fans in Greensboro and though I don't have a link to back it up, I remember hearing/reading that Geoff was really unhappy with the move. I'm not saying I blame him, as I know that the 2 years in Greensboro were difficult for everyone. It isn't ridiculous for management to want to move guys who aren't happy with their new team.
As far as Sean Burke is concerned, I have no problem with moving him at all, regardless of his on-ice performance. Nobody's perfect, but I don't have any respect for men that hit their wives and I don't put sports stars on enough of a pedestal to overlook this.
Finally, as always, I have to take issue with your description of the Greensboro days. We all know that they were far from ideal. I fail to see why it is a "joke" that icing/offsides were announced. Breaking news!!!-many people from the area were unfamiliar with hockey!!! By announcing these calls, they allow interested fans to ask the question, "hey, what is icing?"
Of course, attendance was low at the Canes games in Greensboro, so that makes the people there stupid. However, if you bothered to dig a little deeper, you might find out that many native Greensboronians were determined to not support the Hurricanes. As with many other parts of the country, there is somewhat of a rivalry between Greensboro and Raleigh (not to mention Raleigh and Charlotte). Greensboro had a long-standing tradition of minor league hockey that was well supported. The Canes stop in Greensboro drove the Monarchs from their arena and they folded. So, the locals saw that their team was replaced by a team that wasn't really theirs and would just be moving to Raleigh as soon as their real home was built. I hardly find it that unreasonable that many from Greensboro decided to stay away and not get emotionally invested. Of course, there are some fantastic diehard fans from the Greensboro area, but you can't really pretend that everything happens in a vacuum.
If the Carolina Panthers moved to Hartford and the fans needed announcements explaining what a yellow flag on the field means I think you would be pretty pissed about that.

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03-24-2010, 03:05 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
You "don't buy it" and think it's a character assassination, yet this reply shows you didn't know the first thing about it.
i remember the case and remember thinking it was blown out of proportion. the evidence backs it up.

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03-24-2010, 03:07 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by bleedgreen View Post
if you think im full of ****, get out of your court or wherever you practice and get out on the streets. this happens all the time. if by the letter of the law this isnt true then im wrong, but why is this the case in every domestic ive ever seen on the streets? the law does not match with the practice.
I'm a cop you moron!!!!!!!!!!!! Been one for 14 years... Now you try to get out on the streets and see domestic violence before we radio that the scene is clear...

You going to tell me to hit the streets and see how the law is 'practiced on the streets' again?

I will tell you again... You are full of complete ****!!!!!!!!!!!

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03-24-2010, 03:11 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Hurricane_SVT View Post
I'm a cop you moron!!!!!!!!!!!! Been one for 14 years... Now you try to get out on the streets and see domestic violence before we radio that the scene is clear...

You going to tell me to hit the streets and see how the law is 'practiced on the streets' again?

I will tell you again... You are full of complete ****!!!!!!!!!!!
i thought you were a lawyer?! whats wrong with that? i am not full of ****, i have seen it many times here in denver! if the wife says she was hit the guy goes to jail! they dont mess around with the details, they arrest the guy, sometimes the girl too and it all gets figured out later. im not making this up! maybe its different there but thats how it is here! Ive seen it! Im not full of ****!

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03-24-2010, 03:12 PM
  #46
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Also, I have to question you intelligence if you really actually thought that legislatures anywhere actually passed a law into the books that says... "regardless of what you police find on the scene through your investigations, you will arrest the male party involved"

Yeah, that makes any sense...

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03-24-2010, 03:13 PM
  #47
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i thought you were a lawyer?! whats wrong with that? i am not full of ****, i have seen it many times here in denver! if the wife says she was hit the guy goes to jail! they dont mess around with the details, they arrest the guy, sometimes the girl too and it all gets figured out later. im not making this up! maybe its different there but thats how it is here!
You should really stop typing now... You are full of ****... Everyone knows it, you've been called out... I knew you'd pull the ole, 'well in Colorado where I am it might be different' card... Admit you were wrong and move on...

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03-24-2010, 03:15 PM
  #48
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Also, I have to question you intelligence if you really actually thought that legislatures anywhere actually passed a law into the books that says... "regardless of what you police find on the scene through your investigations, you will arrest the male party involved"

Yeah, that makes any sense...
then why does it go that way? im not saying any of it makes sense. i dont! thats why i questioned everything in the first place.

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03-24-2010, 03:16 PM
  #49
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Burke post a .90x save % while he was with our franchise... He only had a 2-3 year stretch in Phoenix where he was anywhere near Cam... Cam is also clutch, sure as a young net minder he had some bad stretches, but every year he's gotten better (except this injury year) and even this year his stretch where he came back from his stitches, he was one of the best in the league... We will see how his back holds up though
In the end, I hope Cam will be considered the better goalie, but Sean Burke was out of this world with the Whalers. That team played played next to no defense the entire time he was there and he would just stand on his head every night. Cam has had a somewhat competent team around him for the most part(and this year when he didn't his stats sucked) Burke never had that luxury with the Whalers. I don't really want to argue, I just think "couldn't hold his jock strap" is complete bs.

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03-24-2010, 03:18 PM
  #50
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http://www.dvmen.org/dv-11.htm

two references in there about MANDATORY ARRESTS. one in the first section, one in the second in the first sentence ans another later in that paragraph mentioning a law in 1994. its here in denver, but obviously it wouldnt be the same where you are for sure. id heard of it in CT growing up, and it obviously happens here in denver, sorry i mistook that for everywhere.

i remember when it was referenced in burkes case, though obviously there was evidence - and they BOTH got arrested. it happened to roy, and ive seen it many times myself on calls.


http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

im having a hard time with you lighting me up about this.
http://www.abanet.org/domviol/docs/D...tate_11_07.pdf

NC is one of the states that has officers discretion. while i obviously wasnt aware of NC's way when we started this, i think youve been out of line a bit.


Last edited by bleedgreen: 03-24-2010 at 03:29 PM.
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