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PHANTOMS and 2010 Flyers Prospect Discussion Thread - Bring on the Future

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Old
06-28-2010, 08:05 AM
  #951
Larry44
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Originally Posted by NWO View Post
The fact matsumoto never even go into 1 game is very odd. What would it have hurt to try him on wing or laya few games. One of the starnger situations
They have training camp for a reason. It's obvious that they don't think he can play with or against NHL players. That happens a lot in the AHL. It's called 'career minor leaguer.'

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06-28-2010, 08:15 AM
  #952
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They have training camp for a reason. It's obvious that they don't think he can play with or against NHL players. That happens a lot in the AHL. It's called 'career minor leaguer.'
Thanks for the insight. The flyers always give guys in the ahl a chance when they are performing. This guy they didnt was my point and it is a bit odd. Shooter or paddock has said he isnt ready at the end of the year that still hasnt stopped them in the past giving guys a game or 2. IMO there is something else

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06-28-2010, 08:24 AM
  #953
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IMO there is something else
You're looking for something that isn't there. There are a half dozen guys they like better.

They didn't even bring him along to be one of the Black Aces. Instead, they had Nodl, Ross, Kalinski, Laliberte, Legein, Maroon, etc. The something else is that they like a half dozen players on the Phantoms better. They never call someone up just for mercy's sake. If he'd earned a chance, he would have got it. I have nothing against Matsumoto, but I'm pretty sure he isn't the next Patrick Sharp.

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06-28-2010, 08:29 AM
  #954
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You're looking for something that isn't there. There are a half dozen guys they like better.

They didn't even bring him along to be one of the Black Aces. Instead, they had Nodl, Ross, Kalinski, Laliberte, Legein, Maroon, etc. The something else is that they like a half dozen players on the Phantoms better. They never call someone up just for mercy's sake. If he'd earned a chance, he would have got it. I have nothing against Matsumoto, but I'm pretty sure he isn't the next Patrick Sharp.
i dont think he is either. He did earn a chance based on his ahl play over the last few years. As i said they almost always give a guy a cup of coffee. They didnt and to me that is odd is all. They have called up so many scrubs over the years 1 more wouldnt matter so to speak. They also had those guys up because they will all be back next year, with the exception of ross but he did play in last years playoffs. They knew mato would not be back so why have him around.

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06-28-2010, 08:51 AM
  #955
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i dont think he is either. He did earn a chance based on his ahl play over the last few years. As i said they almost always give a guy a cup of coffee. They didnt and to me that is odd is all. They have called up so many scrubs over the years 1 more wouldnt matter so to speak. They also had those guys up because they will all be back next year, with the exception of ross but he did play in last years playoffs. They knew mato would not be back so why have him around.
They called up so many "scrubs" because they had much more to offer at the NHL level.

You call up Matsumoto, fine. Now what? You give him a role in the top 9 when he doesn't necessarily have NHL-quality offensive abilities. So you throw him on the wing, where players like Asham, Carcillo, Laliberte, Kalinski, and even Powe can be more effective based on their given talents.

Matsumoto can't be physical. He can't play defense. Sure he's as offensively gifted, maybe more so than Asham, Carcillo, Laliberte, Kalinski, and Powe, but you lose other abilities in translation.

Matsumoto is the kind of player that is just decent offensively and offers absolutely nothing else. You call up Laliberte, and he provides a better option on the wing than Matsumoto. Laliberte has a better shot, and he can feed off of good lineups as opposed to Matsumoto. Laliberte is also better offensively without the puck. He knows how to get into position and play through zones. Matsumoto's offense is generated with the puck on his stick. You want him with the puck or any of his other linemates should he get a call-up?

There is a reason Matsumoto never got a shot.

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06-28-2010, 09:03 AM
  #956
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Originally Posted by NWO View Post
i dont think he is either. He did earn a chance based on his ahl play over the last few years. As i said they almost always give a guy a cup of coffee. They didnt and to me that is odd is all. They have called up so many scrubs over the years 1 more wouldnt matter so to speak. They also had those guys up because they will all be back next year, with the exception of ross but he did play in last years playoffs. They knew mato would not be back so why have him around.
The scrubs they were calling up were mostly wingers to cover injuries. When Carter got hurt they were in a playoff scramble, so they moved Briere over and called up wingers like Laliberte and Nodl.

They could not risk throwing Matsumoto into the top lines at centre, which is really why he didn't get a chance. When they needed a C to replace Betts, they called up Ross.

The season situation had a lot to do with how the recalls were handled. They needed guys they could trust in their own end.

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06-28-2010, 09:18 AM
  #957
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They called up so many "scrubs" because they had much more to offer at the NHL level.

You call up Matsumoto, fine. Now what? You give him a role in the top 9 when he doesn't necessarily have NHL-quality offensive abilities. So you throw him on the wing, where players like Asham, Carcillo, Laliberte, Kalinski, and even Powe can be more effective based on their given talents.

Matsumoto can't be physical. He can't play defense. Sure he's as offensively gifted, maybe more so than Asham, Carcillo, Laliberte, Kalinski, and Powe, but you lose other abilities in translation.

Matsumoto is the kind of player that is just decent offensively and offers absolutely nothing else. You call up Laliberte, and he provides a better option on the wing than Matsumoto. Laliberte has a better shot, and he can feed off of good lineups as opposed to Matsumoto. Laliberte is also better offensively without the puck. He knows how to get into position and play through zones. Matsumoto's offense is generated with the puck on his stick. You want him with the puck or any of his other linemates should he get a call-up?

There is a reason Matsumoto never got a shot.
My point is rather simple. The flyers always give a guy a game or 2 when they perform well in the ahl. He never got the chance. Doesnt matter if he isnt an nhl player as over the years plenty have played a game or 2 that are nto nhl players. not arguing that matsomuto is going to be this sharp like player as i am not. I myself again just find it odd he never got 1 game in over the last 2 yeras. That is all.

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06-28-2010, 09:34 AM
  #958
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Originally Posted by NWO View Post
My point is rather simple. The flyers always give a guy a game or 2 when they perform well in the ahl. He never got the chance. Doesnt matter if he isnt an nhl player as over the years plenty have played a game or 2 that are nto nhl players. not arguing that matsomuto is going to be this sharp like player as i am not. I myself again just find it odd he never got 1 game in over the last 2 yeras. That is all.
Well, regardless of Matsumoto's success, it's kind of hard to get a call-up when Downie, Ruzicka, Potulny, Giroux, Powe, Nodl, J. Gratton, Cote, Kalinski, B. Kane, Raduns, Ross, vanRiemsdyk, Pyorala, Laliberte, and Maroon (who would've gotten a chance before Matsumoto as well) are all viewed as more useful at the NHL level over the course of three seasons. That's not including all of the regulars.

That gives you kind of a taste of just how far back on the call-up depth chart Matsumoto is.

Assuming the roster stays like the following next season:

Gagne - Richards - Carcillo
Hartnell - Briere - Leino
vanRiemsdyk - Carter - Giroux
Powe - Betts - Laperriere
Cote

Here are the call-ups that would've come before Matsumoto:

Nodl, Kalinski, Maroon, and Legein are obvious. Laliberte and Ross would be pending new contracts. It's likely Wellwood, Testwuide, and Holmstrom would have been called up before Matsumoto as well.

So where does Matsumoto even fit in next season in terms of opportunity for a call-up?

He's virtually at the bottom of the barrel for good reason despite his success in the AHL.

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06-28-2010, 09:57 AM
  #959
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Jonathan Mastsumoto=Jason Krog

maybe thats how the Flyers view him as.

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06-28-2010, 11:25 AM
  #960
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
There is a reason Matsumoto never got a shot.
Yeah and that jackass's name is John Paddock. He might be a good development coach, but he's a lousy assistant GM. And when Matsumoto goes on to put up decent numbers in Carolina, we can all thank Paddock and Idiot Stick for running him out of the Flyers organization........

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Old
06-28-2010, 12:59 PM
  #961
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Incase anyone didnt know, Rinaldo and Wellwood were both signed to EL contracts

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06-28-2010, 01:12 PM
  #962
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Incase anyone didnt know, Rinaldo and Wellwood were both signed to EL contracts
Months ago, haha. Still waiting on word of Labrecque.

I do know that DeSerres is no longer our problem either.

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06-28-2010, 01:14 PM
  #963
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Months ago, haha. Still waiting on word of Labrecque.

I do know that DeSerres is no longer our problem either.
Yea I thought so, but according to capgeek their contracts went up then. Check out capgeek.


Quote:
Lots of 18- and 19-year-old players on entry-level deals have new cap hits after "slides" push their contracts back a year.

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06-28-2010, 01:18 PM
  #964
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Yea I thought so, but according to capgeek their contracts went up then. Check out capgeek.
I thought Rinaldo and Hostetter were slides when the season began.

Wellwood I thought we signed mid-season.

Not sure what you mean though. Could you clarify? Capgeek seems to be having "technical difficulties." It says come back in 5 minutes.

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06-28-2010, 01:19 PM
  #965
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I guess we lose Labreque if he isn't signed. I know many others don't like him, and I haven't seen him a ton outside of prospect camp and maybe 3 or 4 games throughout the year, but I like him enough to sign him and see what he can contribute in the A. Actually in the prospects game last year, aside from JVR and Lehtviour, he was my next favorite player. Of course, the other guy I really liked was Sinasalo and they didn't even offer him a contract so it shows what I know.

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06-28-2010, 01:24 PM
  #966
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I guess we lose Labreque if he isn't signed. I know many others don't like him, and I haven't seen him a ton outside of prospect camp and maybe 3 or 4 games throughout the year, but I like him enough to sign him and see what he can contribute in the A. Actually in the prospects game last year, aside from JVR and Lehtviour, he was my next favorite player. Of course, the other guy I really liked was Sinasalo and they didn't even offer him a contract so it shows what I know.
We do not lose Labrecque. We have until June 1st, 2011 to sign him. He's a 2009 draft pick. DeSerres was a 2008 draft pick. We would've had to sign him, but he opted to re-enter the draft. He was not taken though, so he becomes a free-agent anyway.

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06-28-2010, 01:36 PM
  #967
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I thought Rinaldo and Hostetter were slides when the season began.

Wellwood I thought we signed mid-season.

Not sure what you mean though. Could you clarify? Capgeek seems to be having "technical difficulties." It says come back in 5 minutes.
Personally, I dont know about it fully. I was just reading his twitter:

http://twitter.com/capgeek

Dont know about the slides and such

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06-28-2010, 01:40 PM
  #968
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I guess we lose Labreque if he isn't signed. I know many others don't like him, and I haven't seen him a ton outside of prospect camp and maybe 3 or 4 games throughout the year, but I like him enough to sign him and see what he can contribute in the A. Actually in the prospects game last year, aside from JVR and Lehtviour, he was my next favorite player. Of course, the other guy I really liked was Sinasalo and they didn't even offer him a contract so it shows what I know.
I liked Sinisalo also... if I remember correctly, he had like 2 or 3 points that game. I do wonder why they didnt sign him,and signed someone like f'ing Lukas Kaspar...or Ward

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06-28-2010, 01:46 PM
  #969
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Personally, I dont know about it fully. I was just reading his twitter:

http://twitter.com/capgeek

Dont know about the slides and such
Well those contracts count as "slides" if those players remain in the CHL after signing a contract.

In this case, since Hostetter and Rinaldo were signed prior to the 2009-10 NHL season, they counted as slides. That way they didn't lose a year of eligibility on their ELCs, and the Flyers did not use up one of their 50 allotted contracts.

Wellwood, Pither, Gustafsson, Testwuide, Bobrovsky, etc; all those guys we signed in the spring. They got signed to ELC contracts pending July 1st. If they played with the Phantoms before the end of the season, it's because they had an ATO in place to take them up until their contract eventually kicked in.

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06-28-2010, 04:03 PM
  #970
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We do not lose Labrecque. We have until June 1st, 2011 to sign him. He's a 2009 draft pick. DeSerres was a 2008 draft pick. We would've had to sign him, but he opted to re-enter the draft. He was not taken though, so he becomes a free-agent anyway.
Good. For some reason I though he was the same year as Desseres. I guess had I spent 2 minutes looking it up instead of two minutes typing my question the post wouldn't have been needed.



I guess this one wouldn't be needed either then. Hmmmmmm. I need to adjust my thinking.

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06-28-2010, 05:43 PM
  #971
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I went on a fishing trip this past weekend and didn't get a chance to see the results of the draft until now and boy, did the Flyers ever blow it with regards to the draft this year. It's almost as bad as 2004. I'm glad to see though that Jon Matsumoto got traded to an organization where he's going to get a shot at playing. I still find it hard to believe that this organization just let him go for nothing and didn't bother trying him on the wing. I'm telling everyone, he's the second coming of Patrick Sharp.

As for Dan Hamhuis, I'm shocked and disappointed at how much of a dirtbag he and his agent were during contract negotiations. I really want to see someone from this team hurt him next season and hurt him real bad for acting like a prima donna during negotiations. Maybe it's best he is gone from the organization because if he were signed to the terms he and his agent were asking, someone on this team would kill him. Now that he's going to be a player elsewhere and for all the crap he put the Flyers through, I hope someone gets him real good. I wouldn't mind seeing an elbow to the teeth or a hit similar to Downie on McAmmond.
Completely disagree with you on our draft. I like it. Time will tell. Pat could play defense. Jon does not have a clue. As for Hamhuis I am with you here. I hope he gets his butt handed to him every time he plays us.

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06-28-2010, 07:15 PM
  #972
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Months ago, haha. Still waiting on word of Labrecque.

I do know that DeSerres is no longer our problem either.
this was a 3rd round pick 2 years ago. how can a team miss that badly on a goalie pick. i reviewed the flyers draft picks ,the flyers have drafted 16 goal tenders since the 2000 draft and only cechmanek has played above one game in the nhl. i not an expert on evaluating players but i understand evaluating an organization. if the flyers organization performs this poorly in this aspect of their job, someone in upper mngt (luukko and/or snider) needs to ask the gm why and get it fixed. the more i look the the flyers organization the more fault i see in the top people not holding the gm accountable.

i know ed snider did not become a sucess in the business world by not holding employess accountable. however in dealings with his sport teams, he holds no one accountable. the flyers have been a disaster the last 2 years on the cap and there has been nothing done to correct it. look at his basketball team. the gm signs a stiff
(elton brandt ) for $78m, overpays Iguodala and hires the worst coach since roy rubin and still has his job.

i know paul has been taking a lot of heat but maybe snider needs to be looked at. maybe comcast needs to hold mr snider accountable for the operation of his teams.

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06-29-2010, 08:38 AM
  #973
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this was a 3rd round pick 2 years ago. how can a team miss that badly on a goalie pick. i reviewed the flyers draft picks ,the flyers have drafted 16 goal tenders since the 2000 draft and only cechmanek has played above one game in the nhl. i not an expert on evaluating players but i understand evaluating an organization. if the flyers organization performs this poorly in this aspect of their job, someone in upper mngt (luukko and/or snider) needs to ask the gm why and get it fixed. the more i look the the flyers organization the more fault i see in the top people not holding the gm accountable.

i know ed snider did not become a sucess in the business world by not holding employess accountable. however in dealings with his sport teams, he holds no one accountable. the flyers have been a disaster the last 2 years on the cap and there has been nothing done to correct it. look at his basketball team. the gm signs a stiff
(elton brandt ) for $78m, overpays Iguodala and hires the worst coach since roy rubin and still has his job.

i know paul has been taking a lot of heat but maybe snider needs to be looked at. maybe comcast needs to hold mr snider accountable for the operation of his teams.
I think adding Little to the scouting staff has made all the difference. Yes he was off on Desseres (some I guess, the kid did have a bit of a bouce back this year) but since he has come around we have drafted Ericksson, and Riopel and Morrison, and signed Bobo and Backlund. Goalies are always tough to draft I think but I have some faith in Little.

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06-29-2010, 03:50 PM
  #974
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Ok, Im kinda happy. Prospect camp opens up Monday.

http://flyers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?...id=DL|PHI|home

List of players are on that site. We also have a few players trying out:




Offense:

Justin Dowling: 19 yrs old, plays in the WHL, had 78 points.

Brian Flynn:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=116630

Blake Gal:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=112338

Phil Ginald:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=107558

Gregor Hanson:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=107696

Kyle Mountain:
http://www.pointstreak.com/prostats/...&seasonid=4216

Everett Sheen:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=93092


Defense:

Mike Banwell:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=94799

Jason Beattie:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=103556

Jesse Dudas:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=74661

Jordan Hill:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=107045


Goalie:

Chris Rawlings
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=99805



Eriksson isnt showing up, but Bob is.


Last edited by sa cyred: 06-29-2010 at 03:56 PM.
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06-29-2010, 04:07 PM
  #975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Offense:

Justin Dowling: 19 yrs old, plays in the WHL, had 78 points.

Brian Flynn:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=116630


Gregor Hanson:
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=107696
Those are the tryouts I have particular interest in. I'm particularly pulling for Hanson.

As for Bobrovsky, it's obvious he had to come to a prospect camp. The Flyers will probably give him a heavy look earlier in the week and then spread his load out to Riopel, Morrison, and Stewart later in the week. I don't expect Phillips or Rawlings to get a heavy look.

Eriksson not coming shouldn't be a surprise either. He's got his own team in the SEL to worry about now. He's going to be competing for that starting job, and I for one want him to get it.

Prospects In Attendance (if you're too lazy to click)

Forwards: Chaput, Harper, Holmstrom, Labrecque, McGinn, Pither, Ranford, Rinaldo, Rowe, Testwuide, Wellwood
No: Kalinski, Klotz, Legein, Maroon, Nodl, Popov

Defensemen: Blidstrand, Bourdon, Gustafsson, Hostetter, Lauridsen, Luukko, Marshall
No: Bartulis, Bertilsson, Bodrov, Lehtivuori

Goalies: Bobrovsky, Morrison, Phillips, Riopel, Stewart
No: Eriksson

RFAs not attending: Beaulieu, Bellamy, Clackson, Duchesne, Laliberte, Teslak

Bold denotes player I'm going to watch heavily (or player that I'm noting in particular that he's not in attendance when he should be).

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