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Are Habs Prospects Really That Good?

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05-04-2004, 07:43 AM
  #1
Sir Habalot
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Are Habs Prospects Really That Good?

Please believe me when I say I don't mean any disrespect. Is Hockey's Future affiliated with any professional scouting organization? My fear is that the site is operated by mostly Habs fans, and the number one ranking is based on biased opinion. I realize nobody can tell the future, but I have been a Habs fan since I could walk. Should I be getting my hopes up? This is an awesome site by the way!

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05-04-2004, 07:51 AM
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All I can say is that our future looks very good.

I beleive in our farm team

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05-04-2004, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Habalot
Please believe me when I say I don't mean any disrespect. Is Hockey's Future affiliated with any professional scouting organization? My fear is that the site is operated by mostly Habs fans, and the number one ranking is based on biased opinion. I realize nobody can tell the future, but I have been a Habs fan since I could walk. Should I be getting my hopes up? This is an awesome site by the way!
Although there are no potential Gretzkys in Montreal's crop of prospects, there are many Habs' prospects who may someday be very productive in the NHL. Overall I do think our prospects out-rank most of the other teams'...

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05-04-2004, 09:28 AM
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You misread totally Montreal had been moving up for last three years

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Habalot
Please believe me when I say I don't mean any disrespect. Is Hockey's Future affiliated with any professional scouting organization? My fear is that the site is operated by mostly Habs fans, and the number one ranking is based on biased opinion. I realize nobody can tell the future, but I have been a Habs fan since I could walk. Should I be getting my hopes up? This is an awesome site by the way!

it wasn't done over night they went from sixth to fourth and fourth to 1st and to make things interesting I read that Montreal moderator missed the vote so it feels much better knowing all other fans voted Montreal to have best prospects.

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05-04-2004, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs4ever
it wasn't done over night they went from sixth to fourth and fourth to 1st and to make things interesting I read that Montreal moderator missed the vote so it feels much better knowing all other fans voted Montreal to have best prospects.
Let's also keep in mind that the current rankings are as of February 2004 when we still had Balej in the system. Things change of course as we are all well aware, but in any event we should all be pleased with the developments in our overall organization following the mismanagement of the 90's.

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05-04-2004, 09:35 AM
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Are Habs Prospects Really That Good?

Short answer...yes.

long answer....if you look at the amount of decent to good prospects the habs have in their stable, you soon realize that the overall quality is quite good. We might not have a top 10 overall prospect in the system, but we have a ton who could be considered top 50. Higgins, Perezhogin, Kastitsyn, Hainsey could all be considered first tier prospects while Plekanec, Hossa, Danis, Korneev and others are also highly regarded. When you look at many other teams list of prospects you soon realize that although many some are comparible, its very hard to find an org. that boost a better overall group of prospects.

Now thanks to Andre Savard!!!!!

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05-04-2004, 09:52 AM
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I agree with the others here.. it's not so much that we have a lot of top line material but mostly that we have a lot of prospects that have the potential to have NHL careers (and pretty good ones at that). There might be 2 or 3 top two line capable players and a few 3rd and 4th line players in there as well. Only time will tell how they will fare in the NHL but I wouldn't be surprised to see Perezhogin, Plekanek, Higgins, Kastitsyn, Hossa and Hainsey join the NHL within the next 2 or 3 years.

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05-04-2004, 10:07 AM
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For the first time in a long, long time I am happy to see the Habs with some future players in thri system. For to long we looked like the Leafs look now... with an empty farm team.

I feel we are deep at all 3 positions!

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05-04-2004, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Prrebel
...
I feel we are deep at all 3 positions!...
... but my wife doesn't agree. She should know, I guess.

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05-04-2004, 10:22 AM
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05-04-2004, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Habalot
Please believe me when I say I don't mean any disrespect. Is Hockey's Future affiliated with any professional scouting organization? My fear is that the site is operated by mostly Habs fans, and the number one ranking is based on biased opinion. I realize nobody can tell the future, but I have been a Habs fan since I could walk. Should I be getting my hopes up? This is an awesome site by the way!


Well I am the cause of a lot of hype of our prospects, but I had nothing to do with the #1 ranking, and I have no idea how they came up with that number. It doesn't mean anything to me. What I want to see is our prospects all showing signs of improvement and progression especially in their weaker areas.

I've been a Hab fan for close to 20 years, and over the last 5 or so years (due mostly to the internet) I started to follow all of our prospects as much as I could. I've gone to some games, listened to tons of games on the radio, talked with professional scouts, read all different kinds of scouting reports and have tapes of most of our prospects. From all I've seen, the player that sticks out by far is Andrei Kastsitsyn. As big of a Komisarek fan since his days at Michigan, Kastsitsyn is the most skilled prospect I've seen in the Habs system since I've been closely following the prospects.

This doesn't mean that he won't bust or become an average player, but the combination of skating, speed, and offensive abiliites are worth getting excited over. Like every prospect he'll have lots of things he needs to improve, but to watch him play it's hard not to see the talent. To me he has to be signed this summer if theres a way, don't know what the IIHF/NHL deal will impact signing him but it would be great to see him in Hamilton, and if signed I would think he'll get some games in with the Habs if theres a season at some point next year.

After Kastsitsyn you still have some impressive prospects in case he doesn't work out. Komisarek although not considered a prospect is still on 22 and should only get better over the next few years. Then there's Perezhogin, who I consider our 2nd best prospect now that Komo is an NHLer. Perezhogin has the skating, speed, shot and offensive abilities to one day be an effective NHLer. I am concerned over the recent incident, as I really hope it doesn't effect him personally. But he's highly skilled and at 20 still has a few years to continue to progress. If that's not enough, Chris Higgins is right there with Perezhogin. He also has a nice shot, skating, speed and is one of the smarter players you'll see. He knows the game well, where he should be and is strong in every area of the game except face-offs. I also expect big things from him as well. Kastsitsyn, Komisarek, Perezhogin, Higgins are our future, imo and this team will be in good shape when they start to reach their peak.

If thats not enough you have 2 guys who have not had a great year but have tons of skill in Marcel Hossa and Ron Hainsey. I can not say what will happen to them, but the skill is there. It becomes interesting to see what they will do next year as it's time for them to bring their A game to the Habs or get traded for something of value.

Still not impressed? Tomas Plekanec, Maxime Lapierre, Yan Dannis, Cory Urquhart, Michael Lambert. Plekanec has shown me a lot and although on the small side he's got a ton of skill as well. If not for having Higgins, Perezhogin and Kastsitsyn, Plekanec would be much more hyped imo. Very effective offensive player that is good on draws, plays with an edge and while small is strong on his skates with good lower body strength. Lapierre is still a few years away, but hopefully is starting to show what he can bring to the Habs. He's got size, skating, speed, and plays the game like it should be played while showing improvement in his offensive game. Next year should be a big one for him. Dannis is the least talked about, but having Theodore/Garon around and coming out of Brown University, it's not a big surprise, but when you put up the numbers he's put up, and you are the top goalie in the entire NCAA this year, that tells you he's got a lot of skill, while going to one of the top schools in the USA which demands intelligence. Urquhart and Lambert are 2 guys with tons of skill as well. They put on a show in the Q this year, now the question is can they do it at the next level. Urquhart has so much skill but his lack of physical game could hurt him down the road. Lambert has the size/skating/speed/shot going for him, can he put it together?

Still not done, there's Korneev, Halak, Locke, O'Byrne, Korpikari, Milroy, Archer. Korneev made the Russian National team at 19 (Perezhogin as well) and has been a regular in the RSL for 2 years now and still hasn't turned 20 yet. Size is an issue, but he has to have some good skills to play where he is at a young age. Halak at 18 is many years away, but when you see a kid put up great numbers in every league he's played in this year, that's worth taking notice. Locke has amassed an impressive amount of points, can he do it at the next level? O'Byrne is a few years away, but defensemen with his size, skating, speed and physical play are rare. Hopefully a few years at the top defensive program in the NCAA will do wonders for him. Cornell is an excellent program and has been for the last few years. While O'Byrne still has a lot to learn, he's worth keeping an eye on. Korpikari is not hyped much due to playing in Finland. But to make the mens league at 19 is a good start for his career. I would think he'll stay over in Finland a few years to round out his game. Milroy is a former WHL star, who had troubles in his first pro season. Could he be the next Balej in terms of similar situations? Both were great in the WHL, had an injury in their 1st pro season, had a tough time producing much in their rookie year. Balej we saw what he did, and while Milroy doesn't posses the skating, speed or cannon of a shot, he is a smart player who can play in all areas and has a wicked wrist shot. Archer is similar to Milroy in that an injury may have set him back a year, but you can't overlook his safe simple play. Next year should be a big year for him hopefully.

If you still want to hear about our prosects, there's longshots like Matt Shasby, Danny Stewart, Mark Flood, Christopher Lindberg, Ryan Glenn, Tomas Linhart, Andre Deveaux. Shasby is almost forgotten, but he had a solid career in the USHL/NCAA and played well in the ECHL from what I hear. Hopefully he gets shot in Hamilton next year. Stewart has a lot of areas to work on but he's got offensive abilities and who knows what effect playing with Crosby will have on him. Flood is considered the most improved player in the OHL this year, and could be in Hamilton next year. Lindberg is many years away still, but is considered the best goalie in his country in his age group ('86). Glenn isn't talked about much, and it's unclear what management will do with him, but he plays a solid all round game, and hopefully gets a contract. Linhart is considered a big disappointment to some, but at 19 he's getting some time in the mens league, and hopefully in a few years he will show why he was picked so high. Deveaux is a big boy that's good on draws, but it's unclear what management will do with him. Still he could be a late bloomer as he has shown signs of being a good player.

I know that most of these prospects won't make it. When you watch them you see the good things and areas they need to work on, but to look at this group and not be impressed is crazy. There is a bunch of skill in these prospects, then add what should be some good picks this summer as well, and you have easily one of the top prospect groups around. One problem I can see is too many good prospects, not enough space for them to all play. But that's not the worst problem you can have. At some point room will have to be made, and hopefully it starts next season. If say Plekanec and Higgins make the team, with Perezhogin and Hossa/Hainsey that would create a lot of room. Guys like Milroy and Archer should get more ice time, and hopefully Urquhart, Locke, Flood, and Lambert would get some time in the AHL.

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05-04-2004, 12:54 PM
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Very informative post, Montreal.

I know you get complimented all the time, but good job.

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05-04-2004, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal
Well I am the cause of a lot of hype of our prospects, but I had nothing to do with the #1 ranking, and I have no idea how they came up with that number. It doesn't mean anything to me. What I want to see is our prospects all showing signs of improvement and progression especially in their weaker areas.

I've been a Hab fan for close to 20 years, and over the last 5 or so years (due mostly to the internet) I started to follow all of our prospects as much as I could. I've gone to some games, listened to tons of games on the radio, talked with professional scouts, read all different kinds of scouting reports and have tapes of most of our prospects. From all I've seen, the player that sticks out by far is Andrei Kastsitsyn. As big of a Komisarek fan since his days at Michigan, Kastsitsyn is the most skilled prospect I've seen in the Habs system since I've been closely following the prospects.

This doesn't mean that he won't bust or become an average player, but the combination of skating, speed, and offensive abiliites are worth getting excited over. Like every prospect he'll have lots of things he needs to improve, but to watch him play it's hard not to see the talent. To me he has to be signed this summer if theres a way, don't know what the IIHF/NHL deal will impact signing him but it would be great to see him in Hamilton, and if signed I would think he'll get some games in with the Habs if theres a season at some point next year.

After Kastsitsyn you still have some impressive prospects in case he doesn't work out. Komisarek although not considered a prospect is still on 22 and should only get better over the next few years. Then there's Perezhogin, who I consider our 2nd best prospect now that Komo is an NHLer. Perezhogin has the skating, speed, shot and offensive abilities to one day be an effective NHLer. I am concerned over the recent incident, as I really hope it doesn't effect him personally. But he's highly skilled and at 20 still has a few years to continue to progress. If that's not enough, Chris Higgins is right there with Perezhogin. He also has a nice shot, skating, speed and is one of the smarter players you'll see. He knows the game well, where he should be and is strong in every area of the game except face-offs. I also expect big things from him as well. Kastsitsyn, Komisarek, Perezhogin, Higgins are our future, imo and this team will be in good shape when they start to reach their peak.

If thats not enough you have 2 guys who have not had a great year but have tons of skill in Marcel Hossa and Ron Hainsey. I can not say what will happen to them, but the skill is there. It becomes interesting to see what they will do next year as it's time for them to bring their A game to the Habs or get traded for something of value.

Still not impressed? Tomas Plekanec, Maxime Lapierre, Yan Dannis, Cory Urquhart, Michael Lambert. Plekanec has shown me a lot and although on the small side he's got a ton of skill as well. If not for having Higgins, Perezhogin and Kastsitsyn, Plekanec would be much more hyped imo. Very effective offensive player that is good on draws, plays with an edge and while small is strong on his skates with good lower body strength. Lapierre is still a few years away, but hopefully is starting to show what he can bring to the Habs. He's got size, skating, speed, and plays the game like it should be played while showing improvement in his offensive game. Next year should be a big one for him. Dannis is the least talked about, but having Theodore/Garon around and coming out of Brown University, it's not a big surprise, but when you put up the numbers he's put up, and you are the top goalie in the entire NCAA this year, that tells you he's got a lot of skill, while going to one of the top schools in the USA which demands intelligence. Urquhart and Lambert are 2 guys with tons of skill as well. They put on a show in the Q this year, now the question is can they do it at the next level. Urquhart has so much skill but his lack of physical game could hurt him down the road. Lambert has the size/skating/speed/shot going for him, can he put it together?

Still not done, there's Korneev, Halak, Locke, O'Byrne, Korpikari, Milroy, Archer. Korneev made the Russian National team at 19 (Perezhogin as well) and has been a regular in the RSL for 2 years now and still hasn't turned 20 yet. Size is an issue, but he has to have some good skills to play where he is at a young age. Halak at 18 is many years away, but when you see a kid put up great numbers in every league he's played in this year, that's worth taking notice. Locke has amassed an impressive amount of points, can he do it at the next level? O'Byrne is a few years away, but defensemen with his size, skating, speed and physical play are rare. Hopefully a few years at the top defensive program in the NCAA will do wonders for him. Cornell is an excellent program and has been for the last few years. While O'Byrne still has a lot to learn, he's worth keeping an eye on. Korpikari is not hyped much due to playing in Finland. But to make the mens league at 19 is a good start for his career. I would think he'll stay over in Finland a few years to round out his game. Milroy is a former WHL star, who had troubles in his first pro season. Could he be the next Balej in terms of similar situations? Both were great in the WHL, had an injury in their 1st pro season, had a tough time producing much in their rookie year. Balej we saw what he did, and while Milroy doesn't posses the skating, speed or cannon of a shot, he is a smart player who can play in all areas and has a wicked wrist shot. Archer is similar to Milroy in that an injury may have set him back a year, but you can't overlook his safe simple play. Next year should be a big year for him hopefully.

If you still want to hear about our prosects, there's longshots like Matt Shasby, Danny Stewart, Mark Flood, Christopher Lindberg, Ryan Glenn, Tomas Linhart, Andre Deveaux. Shasby is almost forgotten, but he had a solid career in the USHL/NCAA and played well in the ECHL from what I hear. Hopefully he gets shot in Hamilton next year. Stewart has a lot of areas to work on but he's got offensive abilities and who knows what effect playing with Crosby will have on him. Flood is considered the most improved player in the OHL this year, and could be in Hamilton next year. Lindberg is many years away still, but is considered the best goalie in his country in his age group ('86). Glenn isn't talked about much, and it's unclear what management will do with him, but he plays a solid all round game, and hopefully gets a contract. Linhart is considered a big disappointment to some, but at 19 he's getting some time in the mens league, and hopefully in a few years he will show why he was picked so high. Deveaux is a big boy that's good on draws, but it's unclear what management will do with him. Still he could be a late bloomer as he has shown signs of being a good player.

I know that most of these prospects won't make it. When you watch them you see the good things and areas they need to work on, but to look at this group and not be impressed is crazy. There is a bunch of skill in these prospects, then add what should be some good picks this summer as well, and you have easily one of the top prospect groups around. One problem I can see is too many good prospects, not enough space for them to all play. But that's not the worst problem you can have. At some point room will have to be made, and hopefully it starts next season. If say Plekanec and Higgins make the team, with Perezhogin and Hossa/Hainsey that would create a lot of room. Guys like Milroy and Archer should get more ice time, and hopefully Urquhart, Locke, Flood, and Lambert would get some time in the AHL.
Wow, thats one heluva list.

As for O'Byrne, whats his top end potential in your view????

Thanks Montreal!!!!!!!!!


Last edited by Mooch: 05-04-2004 at 01:03 PM.
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05-04-2004, 01:05 PM
  #14
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Originally Posted by Mooch
Wow, thats one heluva list.

As for O'Byrne, what round was he drafted in????

Thanks Montreal!!!!!!!!!

3rd round, 79th overall. A bit of a reach I guess, but they must of seen something in him they liked. He plays somewhat like Boris Valabik if you've seen him, although not as big but a better skater and quicker. Both are physical though, as O'Byrne had to learn to pick his spots a little better, as I had heard he was trying to hit everything that moved when he first started the season, from what the coaching staff said.

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05-04-2004, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal
3rd round, 79th overall. A bit of a reach I guess, but they must of seen something in him they liked. He plays somewhat like Boris Valabik if you've seen him, although not as big but a better skater and quicker. Both are physical though, as O'Byrne had to learn to pick his spots a little better, as I had heard he was trying to hit everything that moved when he first started the season, from what the coaching staff said.
Will he make the jump to ahl next season or is he still a year or two away???

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05-04-2004, 01:15 PM
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Wow, awesome post Montreal. In a way, it's probably a good thing that the Habs haven't had the first pick overall in a number of years. Most of these number ones come with so much baggage that they're not worth all the trouble.

I know Andre Savard has built a solid reputation at the draft table, and if some of these prospects turn out to be as solid as Ryder, that would be great.

I remember Savard saying he looked for skating ability and work ethic when he was evaluating potential draft choices. Do you think this view conflicts with Gainey's philosophy of grit and size? It would be nice to draft a player with all of these attributes, but of course, that's what every team wants. A lot of the Habs prospects seem to be lacking in size, but I think that is not an issue. If the Habs had 20 players who played like Begin or Koivu, that would be an exciting team for sure. Maybe in a few years, we will.

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05-04-2004, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Mooch
Will he make the jump to ahl next season or is he still a year or two away???

No way. I think it would be a bad idea to take him out of Cornell. Cornell should be strong again next year, as they shouldn't lose any big players except Vesce, and I hear they have some good freshman coming in again. I wouldn't mind seeing us grab one of their in coming freshmen, Sasha Grenier who played for Team Quebec U-17. He's a big defensemen, but I don't know too much about him other then what a few people have said here and there.

In my opinion, O'Byrne should stay next year and the year after at Cornell, and I would have no problem with him staying for his senior year as well. It's too early to say how long he will stay, but I can't see him signed this summer, so he'll be back to Cornell next year. I'll get to see him play a few games, and we'll see how he builds on this season.

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05-04-2004, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mooch
Will he make the jump to ahl next season or is he still a year or two away???
I can't see him leaving college unless he has academic troubles. So 3 years away from the AHL? And at least 5 years away from Montreal, if he pans out. In the most likely scenario.

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05-04-2004, 01:29 PM
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Ok, So i guess hes a few years away still, well lets wish him the best and hope he pans out, because hes a big right handed D, something we lack in our system!

Thanks again guys!

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05-04-2004, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darz
We might not have a top 10 overall prospect in the system
Actually, I think that if there weren't doubts of Kastsitsyn's health, he could've went in the top five.

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05-04-2004, 01:32 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Sir Habalot
Wow, awesome post Montreal. In a way, it's probably a good thing that the Habs haven't had the first pick overall in a number of years. Most of these number ones come with so much baggage that they're not worth all the trouble.

I know Andre Savard has built a solid reputation at the draft table, and if some of these prospects turn out to be as solid as Ryder, that would be great.

I remember Savard saying he looked for skating ability and work ethic when he was evaluating potential draft choices. Do you think this view conflicts with Gainey's philosophy of grit and size? It would be nice to draft a player with all of these attributes, but of course, that's what every team wants. A lot of the Habs prospects seem to be lacking in size, but I think that is not an issue. If the Habs had 20 players who played like Begin or Koivu, that would be an exciting team for sure. Maybe in a few years, we will.

To be honest I get the feeling that Gainey will not have much say in the draft, and that Savard/Timmins/Gauither will have the most say. I mean I'm sure he'll add some things here and there, but I don't see GM's as being a big part of the draft outside of the 1st pick.

I do think size is an issue but not a big one. I think we are starting to see a new NHL where smaller players can have a big impact. Every gm has to be rethinking their draft patterns, when you see a St. Louis going undrafted and then years later recking havoc on the league, they will start to pay more attention.

I do think Savard will continue to draft kids with speed, skating and good work ethic.

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05-04-2004, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy LaFleur
Actually, I think that if there weren't doubts of Kastsitsyn's health, he could've went in the top five.
Ya i was thinking the same. So i guess we do have atleast one top ten Propect.

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05-04-2004, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by montreal
To be honest I get the feeling that Gainey will not have much say in the draft, and that Savard/Timmins/Gauither will have the most say. I mean I'm sure he'll add some things here and there, but I don't see GM's as being a big part of the draft outside of the 1st pick.

I do think size is an issue but not a big one. I think we are starting to see a new NHL where smaller players can have a big impact. Every gm has to be rethinking their draft patterns, when you see a St. Louis going undrafted and then years later recking havoc on the league, they will start to pay more attention.

I do think Savard will continue to draft kids with speed, skating and good work ethic.
I think work ethic is one of the most improtant things.

Having said that, what made Savard draft Hainsey, did he have a good work ethic before he came to the ahl??

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05-04-2004, 01:47 PM
  #24
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Originally Posted by Mooch
I think work ethic is one of the most improtant things.

Having said that, what made Savard draft Hainsey, did he have a good work ethic before he came to the ahl??


Savard didn't draft Hainsey. Savard's first draft was '01.

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05-04-2004, 01:50 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal
Savard didn't draft Hainsey. Savard's first draft was '01.
Ah, ha. Now we i know why. LOL!

Thanks....

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