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Old
06-19-2010, 11:02 AM
  #1001
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Dedalus, I disagree - in fact, I actually think that I think that THIS is oversimplified. And I don't say that to be glib, I mean it.



This is how the anti-Kovy crowd chooses to conveniently perceive the pro-Kovy argument - despite the fact that almost none of the pro-Kovy crowd is actually saying this. There are precious few, if any, "OMGZ if we sign Kovy, the CUP will be ours!!! Rangers in '11! Book it!" posts. (Frankly, I can't think of a single one to that effect, but I don't want say that definitively, because if I do I'm sure you'll be able to find an example or two.) In reality, there are actually post after post pro-Kovy posters saying that this is about logical asset allocation, getting key pieces in place and then building around them, no more over-spending on middling players, etc...

...all of which are promptly ignored by those on the other side of the fence, who continue to shoot at the argument they want us to be making.



Again oversimplification - the UFA route of acquiring players has led to disaster in the past, ergo it must always be the wrong strategy? Because Sather convinced himself (and a large portion of the fanbase) that signing B-level players to A-level contracts would lead to a championship, the team should avoid signing A-level players when they become available? I fundamentally disagree. Every situation needs to be judged on its own merits and in its own context. Who cares about a "mindset" from 2007 if signing a particular player is the right move for a particular team in 2010?



Here's where I come out: You can't win without first line talent and you can't draft first line talent outside the top 5. Kovy is first line talent. So, you try to sign him to a contract that works within our cap situation (in previous posts I've shown this is somewhere around $9MM per year or less) and then build around him, progressing forward to a cup contender in 2-3 years (not this year).

If that doesn't work (he costs too much, wants to sign elsewhere, etc.), you need to be looking at other solutions that can bring you top 5 picks. Frankly, I would be looking to see what I can get for Gaborik and even Lundqvist. As to other trades, such as for a Horton, meh... look, you always try to improve your asset pool, so if you can trade assets worth X for assets worth X+1, you do it - but the options that have been discussed around here recently are clearly inferior options to signing Kovy for no assets, IMO.

Regardless, under NO circumstances do I sign any player not named Kovalchuk who's 27 or older to a contract that's worth more than $3MM per year or for more than one year this offseason - or likely next. No Volchenkovs, no Plekanecs, no Marleaus, no Thorntons, no Richardses.
B-B-B-B-Bingo.

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:10 PM
  #1002
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Flyers trade for Hamhuis' rights. Same thing they did with Nashville to get Timonen and Hartnell. I'd be shocked if Hamhuis didn't sign.

Their D corps will now be Pronger, Timonen, Hamhuis, Coburn, Carle...


And people think we would have been in the SCF if we won the shootout.

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06-19-2010, 12:12 PM
  #1003
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
Flyers trade for Hamhuis' rights. Same thing they did with Nashville to get Timonen and Hartnell. I'd be shocked if Hamhuis didn't sign.

Their D corps will now be Pronger, Timonen, Hamhuis, Coburn, Carle...


And people think we would have been in the SCF if we won the shootout.
even more the reason we need kovy, how can we possibly survive with 1 scoring threat going against teams with d-corps like this

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:17 PM
  #1004
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Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
even more the reason we need kovy, how can we possibly survive with 1 scoring threat going against teams with d-corps like this
yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyep.

or, we could always pray for a miracle that one of our ~10-20th positioned draft picks will be the next Wayne Gretzky, which seems to be what ppl want here.

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:27 PM
  #1005
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyep.

or, we could always pray for a miracle that one of our ~10-20th positioned draft picks will be the next Wayne Gretzky, which seems to be what ppl want here.
very true. we can develop 20-30 goal scorers with the picks we've had the past few years (kreider, grachev, etc.). but that elite, upper-tier, franchise player types only come in the 1-3 (sometimes 5) range.

i also love how people here are saying how kovy is just one-dimensional and doesn't help a team. well that one-dimension is goal scoring. but i forgot, this team definitely doesn't need any help in that department. his defense is very suspect, but for a team that is in dire straights in terms of scoring, we are in no position to be critiquing his defense. to say he makes those around him worse is a farce. gabby, for example, will already improve knowing there's someones else that can put the puck in the net. his linemates have more space, etc. he may not lift up their play, but to say he hurts their play (as some have alluded to with his time with the devils, never lifting up the thrashers, and so on) is ridiculous.

and about his contract, on the current construction and salary makeup of the team, it makes no sense and is impossible barring any major moves (redden to the minors, etc.). but in just 2 years time, there will be 12 mil off the books. considering it almost unimaginable that redden will still be here in 2012, that makes 18 mil of the books. 9 mil a year doesn't hurt so much then.

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:35 PM
  #1006
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Not sure this has been posted yet. Hamhuis to Philly for Parent and a pick.

Quote:
(Philadelphia, PA) - The Philadelphia Flyers have acquired the rights to one of the most sought after free agents-to-be on defense in Nashville Predators blueliner Dan Hamhuis.

On Saturday afternoon, the club announced it had traded defenseman Ryan Parent to Nashville for Hamhuis and a conditional pick in the 2011 NHL Entry Draft. Hamhuis is set to become an unrestricted free agent on July 1, so the Flyers will try to sign him to a deal as soon as possible.
http://flyers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?...id=DL|PHI|home

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:36 PM
  #1007
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Why do the Flyers always get players I like, this sucks

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:42 PM
  #1008
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
Flyers trade for Hamhuis' rights. Same thing they did with Nashville to get Timonen and Hartnell. I'd be shocked if Hamhuis didn't sign.

Their D corps will now be Pronger, Timonen, Hamhuis, Coburn, Carle...


And people think we would have been in the SCF if we won the shootout.
coburn is a rfa doubt they can keep him.

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:42 PM
  #1009
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Originally Posted by nyrfan444 View Post
Why do the Flyers always get players I like, this sucks
hahaha. i think the same thing. every other trade they make they grab a player i like/wish was in blue. and yea, this trade sucks. their d-corps is top, top notch. pronger, hamhuis, timonen, coburn...ugh

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Old
06-19-2010, 12:46 PM
  #1010
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
This is how the anti-Kovy crowd chooses to conveniently perceive the pro-Kovy argument
I assume you're not talking about me. Given that the very first word of this characterization is "some," it's an error to claim that I'm painting the entire "pro-Kovy crowd" with this or any other brush. In fact, that's been my point to you from my first response in post 986. You cannot judge the issue of patience on the desire or lack of desire for Kovalchuk.

That is true in some cases.

It is false in others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
In reality, there are actually post after post pro-Kovy posters saying that this is about logical asset allocation, getting key pieces in place and then building around them, no more over-spending on middling players, etc...
That's okay with me. One can build a perfectly good case for signing Kovalchuk.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
all of which are promptly ignored by those on the other side of the fence, who continue to shoot at the argument they want us to be making.
Well all I can say is, what you offer here doesn't apply to me, and I won't presume to speak for others.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Again oversimplification - the UFA route of acquiring players has led to disaster in the past, ergo it must always be the wrong strategy?
I find it ironic that you offer a strawman in the same breath you accuse me of oversimplification.

Please quote me saying what you've written above.

You complain that you are attacked by those who "shoot at the argument they want us to be making," and then you opt for precisely the tactic of which you complain.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Because Sather convinced himself (and a large portion of the fanbase) that signing B-level players to A-level contracts would lead to a championship, the team should avoid signing A-level players when they become available? I fundamentally disagree.
That's perfectly fair.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Every situation needs to be judged on its own merits and in its own context. Who cares about a "mindset" from 2007 if signing a particular player is the right move for a particular team in 2010?
That depends on what you see as the effect of that mindset on the players in the organization. To save myself time, I'll simply link to another post in another thread:
http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=935

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Here's where I come out: You can't win without first line talent and you can't draft first line talent outside the top 5. [etc]
That's all okay with me. You'll note that my response to your post says nothing about whether or not we should sign Kovalchuk.

The topic of my response is your characterization of posters, not your philosophy regarding Kovalchuk. As I said to Bleed Ranger Blue, "You cannot judge the patience or impatience of fans based on this issue, because their reasons for wanting or not wanting Kovalchuk are multiple."

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Old
06-19-2010, 01:14 PM
  #1011
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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
Talk about hypocrisy! What you just did is oversimplify / generalize the entire fanbase into two categories: Those who think Kovalchuk takes us to the Cup next year and those who think this is going to be another Redden scenario.
Wrong. Read again and more carefully this time.

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
You're leaving out a large contingent
Wrong. I have not split the Ranger fanbase into two camps. You only believe I have because you have not read carefully.

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
The insinuation that this organization has continuously bought "elite" talent instead of developing it from within is not only inaccurate
Let's start here. What elite talent has this organization drafted in the last decade? I will grant Neil Smith Lundqvist. Please proceed from there.

But perhaps you merely object to the word "elite"?

Okay. I'll change my original statement to read thus: "Signing him is another in a long series of attempts to buy quality first line talent instead of drafting and developing it."

Is that better?

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
but it's irrelevant. It doesn't really matter HOW you get ELITE talent. It's whether you have it or not. (Of course it'd be nice to have the #1 overall and pay tablescraps on an ELC compared to what the guy would get on the open market, but let's be realistic)
You say "how one acquires elite talent is irrelevant." Then you offer (in a parenthetical, as if it's a mere aside) one way it IS relevant; then you go on to dismiss your own concession as "unrealistic."

A convenient dismissal, wouldn't you agree?

You opinion that it doesn't matter how a team acquires elite talent is duly noted. I disagree. Your parenthetical is the first of several objections I would offer to the idea that "it is irrelevant."

See below: Chicago Blackhawks

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
Every successful team has a combination of drafted and developed personnel as well as BOUGHT talent.
True. Your point?

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
Since everyone points to the Hawks this time of year, look at Hossa. The Hawks signed the sexy UFA! Oh no! Obviously we're not the Hawks
Obviously not. Now, what is the difference between these two teams?

Put differently, why were the Hawks able to sign Hossa to that massive contract even while they fielded a team that was already very rich in talent.

(Here's a hint, remember that objections above that you offered was not realistic?)

You see, it really DOES matter how you acquire "elite" talent. Chicago proves that quite nicely, because if the Hawks had to buy all of Seabrook, Toews, Kane, Hossa, and Keith, the Hawks wouldn't have all those players.

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
but the point is it's not one way or the other. It's both. A mix. A balance.
As I've said in other threads.

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Originally Posted by DelZottoFutureNorris View Post
I don't need much time to think about it.
No indeed. Clearly you don't.

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Old
06-19-2010, 01:24 PM
  #1012
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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
I assume you're not talking about me. Given that the very first word of this characterization is "some," it's an error to claim that I'm painting the entire "pro-Kovy crowd" with this or any other brush. In fact, that's been my point to you from my first response in post 986. You cannot judge the issue of patience on the desire or lack of desire for Kovalchuk.

That is true in some cases.

It is false in others.
The implication of "some" in your original post is that a significant portion of the people discussing the subject felt this way. My response is that virtually no one (I stopped just short of saying absolutely no one, because I'm sure you can find one or two examples if you search) in fact does feel this way. Either you're saying it's a statistically relevant percentage of the folks in the pro-/anti-Kovy discussion, in which case my point stands - or you're referring to one or two outliers, in which case you are technically correct, but who cares?

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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
That's okay with me. One can build a perfectly good case for signing Kovalchuk.
Fair enough.

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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
Well all I can say is, what you offer here doesn't apply to me, and I won't presume to speak for others.
Fair enough.

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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
I find it ironic that you offer a strawman in the same breath you accuse me of oversimplification.

Please quote me saying what you've written above.

You complain that you are attacked by those who "shoot at the argument they want us to be making," and then you opt for precisely the tactic of which you complain.
Hardly. There are literally dozens upon dozens of posts in this thread and others saying something to the effect of "when are we going to learn we have to stop paying for big name FAs," "signing Kovy would be more of the same from Sather," etc. Your whole diatribe on the organizational "mentality" fits squarely into this category.

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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
That depends on what you see as the effect of that mindset on the players in the organization. To save myself time, I'll simply link to another post in another thread:
http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=935
In other words, you do think that you can - or to prevent you from coming back with a semantics-based argument, you think that it may be a valid argument to - paint all big-name UFA signings with the same brush. So, here all I can say is that I disagree and stand by my previous statement that each situation must be judged on its own merits and in its own context.

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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
That's all okay with me. You'll note that my response to your post says nothing about whether or not we should sign Kovalchuk.

The topic of my response is your characterization of posters, not your philosophy regarding Kovalchuk. As I said to Bleed Ranger Blue, "You cannot judge the patience or impatience of fans based on this issue, because their reasons for wanting or not wanting Kovalchuk are multiple."
Fair enough once again. Perhaps I should have carved out an exception for the anti-Kovy crowd who simply don't want to do anything and hope to improve organically. However, I am only aware of three popular stances on the subject:

1) Sign Kovy and sommit to a longer-term plan to be competitive for years based on the big three and filling in with internally developed prospects.

2) Don't sign Kovy and then use the available space to "address all our needs" this summer.

3) Don't sign Kovy and hope to improve through lucky later draft picks that will become legit top line scorers.

The other two options are sign Kovy hoping to win next year or rip the whole damn thing down (i.e. trade Lundqvist and Gabby) and do a Chicago/Pittsburgh style rebuild. However, I see almost no one advocating either of those paths as a first option. Of the prevelant opinions 1 and 3 clearly show more patience. Therefore the pro-Kovy crowd is, in general, based on the preponderance of the evidence, displaying more patience.


Last edited by BrooklynRangersFan: 06-19-2010 at 01:32 PM.
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Old
06-19-2010, 01:24 PM
  #1013
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* Kovalchuk $9,000,000
Marian Gaborik $7,500,000
Chris Drury $7,050,000
Ryan Callahan $2,300,000
Sean Avery $1,937,500
Brandon Dubinsky $1,850,000
Mats Zuccarello-Aasen ($850,000) $1,750,000
Aaron Voros $1,000,000
* Erik Christensen $950,000
Artem Anisimov $821,667
* Brandon Prust $750,000
Brian Boyle $525,000
Dane Byers $500,000
DEFENSEMEN
Michal Rozsival $5,000,000
* Marc Staal $3,500,000
* Daniel Girardi $2,800,000
* Kurtis Foster $2,000,000
Michael Del Zotto ($212,500) $1,087,500
Bobby Sanguinetti $855,000
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist $6,875,000
* Alex Auld $900,000
BUYOUTS
NONE
LOST VIA REENTRY WAIVERS
NONE
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER SIZE 21
SALARY CAP $58,800,000
PAYROLL $58,951,667
BONUSES $1,062,500
CAP SPACE $910,833

This is contingent on the cap going up the speculated 2 million, and sather being able to trade Brashear which for some reason I think will happen.

Dubi-Christensen-Gaborik
Kovy-Anisimov-Zuc
Avery-Drury-Cally
Prust-Boyle-Byers
voros

Staal-Girardi
Rozi-MDZ
Foster-Sangs

Hank
Auld

I think that teams legiittttt

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Old
06-19-2010, 01:36 PM
  #1014
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Signing free agents has really worked out so well with the Rangers so lets continue with the same formula.

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Old
06-19-2010, 01:40 PM
  #1015
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
Flyers trade for Hamhuis' rights. Same thing they did with Nashville to get Timonen and Hartnell. I'd be shocked if Hamhuis didn't sign.

Their D corps will now be Pronger, Timonen, Hamhuis, Coburn, Carle...


And people think we would have been in the SCF if we won the shootout.
Look at their cap situation. Hamhuis has them right where he wants them. $5 million. $6 million.

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Old
06-19-2010, 01:46 PM
  #1016
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Signing free agents has really worked out so well with the Rangers so lets continue with the same formula.
signing mid tier free agents to top money has not worked out for us. signing elite talents to top money has thus far. You can't say signing free agents is terrible, it's all about who you sign. kovalchuk=elite talent=sign his ass

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Old
06-19-2010, 02:00 PM
  #1017
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Originally Posted by NYRangers4Life1994 View Post
Im assuming Sather is gonna force the Panthers to take Redden like all his other trade offers so..

Redden and Dubi?

edit* Scartch Dubi. They have Frolik, and Matthias. Dont think Dubi would play over those guys.

Maybe Avery and Redden? They could use a LW.

Redden is Can NOT be traded. Especially to a team that does not sign those kind of contracts. We could not trade Redden if he was a 4 million cap hit...........Never mind 6.5

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Old
06-19-2010, 02:19 PM
  #1018
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
The implication of "some" in your original post is that a significant portion of the people discussing the subject felt this way.
A significant portion is not mandated here. A representative portion will suffice to make my point, and I would contend that we have a quite representative sample of people who don't want to sign Kovalchuk in the interests of drafting better as well as those like hpNYR who have argued that signing several smaller contracts is just as conducive to a rebuild. Further, if surpassingly few here are specifically saying "We're only one good player away," the evidence for that mindset is quite abundant in other threads.

(A good starting point is the "Why you always make the playoffs" thread.)

The maxims that support such notions are plentiful on the boards.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
in which case my point stands - or you're referring to one or two outliers, in which case you are technically correct, but who cares?
ARE there only one or two outliers?

I'd say the number of posters who disprove your initial observation are sufficient to prove the point. There are plenty here who don't want to sign Kovalchuk who are also perfectly patient, in some cases more patient than those who want to sign and still believe it will take time to build a contender.

But I agree. Whether there are many or few, I am technically correct.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
There are literally dozens upon dozens of posts in this thread and others saying something to the effect of "when are we going to learn we have to stop paying for big name FAs," "signing Kovy would be more of the same from Sather," etc.
But you opined that I was oversimplifying. The content of those posts has nothing to do with me.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Your whole diatribe on the organizational "mentality" fits squarely into this category.
Okay. My "diatribe" is below.

As a proposition: Does a mercenary mindset effect play, even the play of the most talented players?

I don't know whether or not Kovalchuk has such an attitude. I don't know if being top dog on the UFA market would create such an attitude. I also don't know if coming to the country club known as the NY Rangers would instill such an attitude. It has happened before though.

My point is, there are things to consider beyond the mere talent of these players, maybe the most important of which is the mindset of the team and its potential repercussions on the players it acquires - players of any talent level.

We have tried before saying, "Here's a boatload of money! Now deliver victory!"

The results have been very mixed, and I think rather disappointing overall.

This is what takes the discussion beyond a mere evaluation of Kovalchuk's talent/age and whether those things are comparable to past UFA signings.


I will leave your characterization of "diatribe" for others to decide. I'll simply ask this:

Is the italicized post above saying the same as "the UFA route of acquiring players has led to disaster in the past, ergo it must always be the wrong strategy?"

You have claimed I took the latter position. I have not. You have constructed a strawman.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
you think that it may be a valid argument to - paint all big-name UFA signings with the same brush.
I don't think that would be a valid argument; thus I haven't made it.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
each situation must be judged on its own merits and in its own context.
Meaning you want to judge the player on his merits and context. (Thus, "he's-27-and-at-the-height ..." etc.)

That's perfectly fine with regard to the player. We may agree that each player should be judged thus and still debate whether an organizational mindset regarding buying components is a faulty one.


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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Perhaps I should have carved out an exception for the anti-Kovy crowd who simply don't want to do anything and hope to improve organically.
That would certainly have made your position less simplistic, yes.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
However, I am only aware of three stances on the subject:

1) Sign Kovy and sommit to a longer-term plan to be competitive for years based on the big three and filling in with internally developed prospects.

2) Don't sign Kovy and then use the available space to "address all our needs" this summer.

3) Don't sign Kovy and hope to improve through lucky later draft picks.

The other two options are sign Kovy hoping to win next year or rip the whole damn thing down (i.e. trade Lundqvist and Gabby) and do a Chicago/Pittsburgh style rebuild.
So then we have five stances on the subject (although I could articulate a couple more), and I'd be willing to bet that the number of posters in this thread who have written the team can address "all our needs" this summer runs to about the same proportion of those who have written that Kovalchuk fulfills all the team's needs.

Ironically enough, not even the post by hpNYR that kicked off this little debate (#977) made such a claim. Rather, you imposed that claim on him in your follow-up.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
However, I see almost no one advocating either of those paths as a first option. Of the prevelant opinions 1 and 3 clearly show more patience.
You also see almost no one advocating #2 as an option.

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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Therefore the pro-Kovy crowd is, in general, based on the preponderance of the evidence, displaying more patience.
This is only true to the degree that those in the don't-sign-Kovalchuk camp believe that all other needs can be addressed next year. You have little - maybe nothing - to show they believe this.

That said, I do like your current wording and the thinking behind it. It is certainly less simplistic than: "those of us who want Kovy are actually the ones who are advocating taking the more patient, longer-term approach to building a cup winner."


Last edited by dedalus: 06-19-2010 at 02:44 PM.
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06-19-2010, 02:20 PM
  #1019
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Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
* Kovalchuk $9,000,000
Marian Gaborik $7,500,000
Chris Drury $7,050,000
Ryan Callahan $2,300,000
Sean Avery $1,937,500
Brandon Dubinsky $1,850,000
Mats Zuccarello-Aasen ($850,000) $1,750,000
Aaron Voros $1,000,000
* Erik Christensen $950,000
Artem Anisimov $821,667
* Brandon Prust $750,000
Brian Boyle $525,000
Dane Byers $500,000
DEFENSEMEN
Michal Rozsival $5,000,000
* Marc Staal $3,500,000
* Daniel Girardi $2,800,000
* Kurtis Foster $2,000,000
Michael Del Zotto ($212,500) $1,087,500
Bobby Sanguinetti $855,000
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist $6,875,000
* Alex Auld $900,000
BUYOUTS
NONE
LOST VIA REENTRY WAIVERS
NONE
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER SIZE 21
SALARY CAP $58,800,000
PAYROLL $58,951,667
BONUSES $1,062,500
CAP SPACE $910,833

This is contingent on the cap going up the speculated 2 million, and sather being able to trade Brashear which for some reason I think will happen.

Dubi-Christensen-Gaborik
Kovy-Anisimov-Zuc
Avery-Drury-Cally
Prust-Boyle-Byers
voros

Staal-Girardi
Rozi-MDZ
Foster-Sangs

Hank
Auld

I think that teams legiittttt


This is one of the best ideas I have seen to fit in Kovy. But where is Gilroy's Salary in all of this. And I really think Staal is going to want a little more than 3.5. Hopefully they give him a 10 year deal to squeeze his cap hit to 3.5. I am not a big Kovy fan coming , but this is the best looking proposal to bring him here........ But it takes a lot of "if's " to get this done

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06-19-2010, 02:27 PM
  #1020
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Originally Posted by bizzydizzy View Post
This is one of the best ideas I have seen to fit in Kovy. But where is Gilroy's Salary in all of this. And I really think Staal is going to want a little more than 3.5. Hopefully they give him a 10 year deal to squeeze his cap hit to 3.5. I am not a big Kovy fan coming , but this is the best looking proposal to bring him here........ But it takes a lot of "if's " to get this done
1) gilroys in hartford in this situation
2) staals going to sign something like 3-4 years 3.5 per. noooo way he'd sign a 10 deal 3.5 per. if we were to sign him to a 10 year deal he'd want at least 5 per.

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06-19-2010, 02:31 PM
  #1021
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Hamhuis to the flyers
Arnott back to the devils!!!!!!!

We need to do something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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06-19-2010, 02:33 PM
  #1022
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Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1) gilroys in hartford in this situation
2) staals going to sign something like 3-4 years 3.5 per. noooo way he'd sign a 10 deal 3.5 per. if we were to sign him to a 10 year deal he'd want at least 5 per.
This is pretty much my ideal Kovalchuk lineup, including the addition of Kurtis Foster, who would really help this club and could help one of our PP units.

Except I have Staal making 4 mil and Girardi making 3.1 which would make it a little more difficult, we likely couldnt carry 7 defensemen.

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06-19-2010, 02:44 PM
  #1023
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Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1) gilroys in hartford in this situation
2) staals going to sign something like 3-4 years 3.5 per. noooo way he'd sign a 10 deal 3.5 per. if we were to sign him to a 10 year deal he'd want at least 5 per.

I meant a 10 year deal front loaded , and lowering down to fit at 3.5-4 million. I really think he is going to at least want what Rosy is getting....imo

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06-19-2010, 02:55 PM
  #1024
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While I agree with some of what you said, how can you include Kovalchuk with Redden, Drury, Gomez, Kovalchuk is not in that group. Secondary scoring, how about primary scoring? Whether or not they sign Kovalchuk players like Callahan and Christensen will be playing out of position because the team can't fill positions internally because either prospects aren't ready or they have no depth there to begin with aka they signed Naslund, Prospal, possibly Kariya. Yes Kovalchuk hampers the cap, but that's more Sather for giving out stupid contracts. I know we aren't contenders next season, but if you can add Kovalchuk to a team with Gaborik and Lundqvist and some nice young players and prospects you go from there.
Nobody is saying Kovalchuk, Redden, and Drury are at the same talent level. It's not even close lol. Really?

What I'm saying is the mindset of this team didn't work. They went with the best or one of the best players available in the UFA pool. In this case, in this UFA pool it's Kovalchuk who is the best player available. But I've given my reasons as to why I'm interested in him.

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06-19-2010, 03:12 PM
  #1025
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Hamhuis to the flyers
Arnott back to the devils!!!!!!!

We need to do something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RIGHT NOW OR WE'LL NEVER WIN OMG AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

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