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Round 2: Detroit vs. San Jose (this is last years series 2010)

View Poll Results: Who and in how many games?
Detroit in 4 2 1.71%
Detroit in 5 16 13.68%
Detroit in 6 57 48.72%
Detroit in 7 13 11.11%
San Jose in 4 3 2.56%
San Jose in 5 4 3.42%
San Jose in 6 12 10.26%
San Jose in 7 10 8.55%
Voters: 117. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-28-2010, 08:34 AM
  #51
SharkMight
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Good luck to your team though, should be an exciting series.

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04-28-2010, 08:36 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by 8snake View Post
Bottom line....Datsyuk>Thornton and Zetterberg>Pavelski. Add to that Detroit's history of getting better as they advance and the sleeping giant Franzen and I don't see the Sharks ever dispatching Detroit "pretty easily". Detroit in 6. Just as an aside, I consider San Jose neither deep or fast, and while certainly more skilled definitely not as physical as Phoenix.
Pavelski isn't exactly the guy I'd be comparing to the Wings' 2 best players. Heatley isn't the two-way player that Z is but he's a better goal scorer. Marleau is very good too. So we'd be comparing Pavelski to Filppula if we want to make a fair comparison, and they are fairly comparable (though Flip has been playing fantastic so far this playoff).

I look at it this way - San Jose is better than Phoenix and the Wings barely scraped by Phoenix in 7. Phoenix was missing their captain, which didn't hurt them a whole lot as they still won 2 games after he went down, but it certainly didn't help them.

The Wings will need the kind of effort we saw in games 4, 5, and 7, and they will need it every single night to beat the Sharks. Can they do it? Of course. If both teams play their best I think this series is either a coin flip or a razor-thin Wings advantage. But the Wings have been so flaky it's hard to predict what team is going to show up.

It seems to me that they might be gassed to the point where they can't bring it full-bore every night. The last couple of years they have not had that problem - at least not until later in the playoffs when they had half the team with torn rotator cuffs, busted knees, half-broken wrists and detached testicles. They also seem like they don't play as hard at home and save their big efforts for road games.

I hope I'm wrong, but prediction isn't about picking who you want to win. Also, it never hurts for me to bet against my team because it seems to be good mojo.

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Old
04-28-2010, 08:44 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
Pavelski isn't exactly the guy I'd be comparing to the Wings' 2 best players.
Pavelski is arguably their best forward this post season so I'd say it's a valid comparison.

Quote:
I look at it this way - San Jose is better than Phoenix and the Wings barely scraped by Phoenix in 7. Phoenix was missing their captain, which didn't hurt them a whole lot as they still won 2 games after he went down, but it certainly didn't help them.
Not exactly the best way to look at things. The Wings barely squeaked by Nashville in '08 and were one bounce away from being down 3-2 while they had their Captain out. The 1st round is usually the toughest for the Wings and has been that way for a long time.

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The Wings will need the kind of effort we saw in games 4, 5, and 7, and they will need it every single night to beat the Sharks. Can they do it? Of course. If both teams play their best I think this series is either a coin flip or a razor-thin Wings advantage. But the Wings have been so flaky it's hard to predict what team is going to show up.
Did you watch the Sharks against Colorado?

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They also seem like they don't play as hard at home and save their big efforts for road games.
Good thing there's 4 road games this series then.

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I hope I'm wrong, but prediction isn't about picking who you want to win. Also, it never hurts for me to bet against my team because it seems to be good mojo.
It's also an easy win-win.

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04-28-2010, 08:57 AM
  #54
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Where do all of you get the idea that Nabokov choked in round 1? In the last 4 games of the series he allowed 4 goals and 1 of them was an own goal by Boyle.

He has a 1.78 GAA and .925 Save %.

His only bad game was game 2 and it was still a win

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04-28-2010, 08:58 AM
  #55
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The big difference between the Phoenix and SJ series will be the level of physical intensity the Coyotes brought as opposed to what SJ does.

Keep in mind, SJ was playing the Avs... and that team was complete crap for most of the year. And they didn't have Hejduk and Mueller, two of their top offensive players.

And they came very, very close to losing that series.

I look at the Sharks and I see a team with nobody on the blue line I am particularly impressed by, and top-tier forwards who haven't scored a goal yet (Thornton and Heatley).

Could the Sharks give the Wings a tough series? Absolutely. That's sort of the point when it comes to the Sharks, though. What they could do and what they actually do are two different things.

In a strange way, SJ having the home ice here could end up being a fairly big advantage for the Wings. Imagine for a moment if Detroit goes into SJ, fresh off having to play A+ hockey to beat the Coyotes, and just hands it to the Sharks in game 1. Beats them 4-1, outshoots them 35-27, something like that.

Given SJ's playoff history, you could almost hear their collars shrinking.

All the pressure, and I mean all of the pressure, is going to be on SJ to win game 1. Heck, if Detroit goes in there and flops, they could still take game 2, get home ice, and it's off to the races.

If SJ loses game 1, though... man. That series could go quick. Like, 4 or 5 games quick.

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04-28-2010, 09:01 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
Pavelski is arguably their best forward this post season so I'd say it's a valid comparison.
Samuelsson had more points in the first round than either Sedin, and there's no way in hell he's the best forward on that team. Stuart also had as many points as Lidstrom, and more than Kronwall or Rafalski. It's a statistical oddity that occurs over a 4-7 game stretch. Pavelski is their 4th or 5th best forward behind Jumbo, Heatley, Marleau, and maybe Clowe or Setogucci.

Quote:
Not exactly the best way to look at things. The Wings barely squeaked by Nashville in '08 and were one bounce away from being down 3-2 while they had their Captain out. The 1st round is usually the toughest for the Wings and has been that way for a long time.
They also had cakewalk series in most of those 2nd rounds to catch their breath. Last year they had a brutal 2nd round series and it caught up with them. It would be supremely stupid for anyone to think this series will be a Wings cakewalk.

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Did you watch the Sharks against Colorado?
Watched what I could, and I thought the Avs would take that series the way things were going early. But the Sharks got their act together and took care of business.

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04-28-2010, 09:14 AM
  #57
Evgeny Oliker
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...

I have an interesting question for Detroit fans:

Considering the Pavelski line was much better in Round 1 than the Thornton line, do you think Babcock might focus more on the Pavelski line?

In a somewhat related question...why not put Kronwall and Stuart against the Thornton line? Being that the Thornton line is big and a bit slow, I think this would make more sense. The Pavelski line is very fast and tricky, so Lidstrom and Rafalski would match up better against them I think, no?


Thanks!

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04-28-2010, 09:35 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nashology View Post
Where do all of you get the idea that Nabokov choked in round 1? In the last 4 games of the series he allowed 4 goals and 1 of them was an own goal by Boyle.

He has a 1.78 GAA and .925 Save %.

His only bad game was game 2 and it was still a win
They played the anemic offensive of the Avs, he only faced about 15-20 shots a game.

Edit: went looking for some SJ-Detroit tickets, and about all they have left are some in sec. 102 for about $240. By the time I got that, a place to park ($20 near the Pavilion), hotel, food/drink, I'd be looking at around $350-400. No thanks. Nosebleeds were $66, but all sold out.


Last edited by guinness: 04-28-2010 at 09:41 AM.
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Old
04-28-2010, 09:36 AM
  #59
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I don't really know what to expect in this series, the Sharks are a very good hockey team obviously, plenty of guns, on the other hand well it's the Sharks. The Sharks have home ice and HP Pavilion does provide a great home ice atmosphere. For the Sharks this series will be all about character and proving they have it, I think it will be tough for the Wings coming off a challenging 7 game series. We have a shot but we can rightfully be considered the underdogs in this series.

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Old
04-28-2010, 09:38 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
Samuelsson had more points in the first round than either Sedin, and there's no way in hell he's the best forward on that team. Stuart also had as many points as Lidstrom, and more than Kronwall or Rafalski. It's a statistical oddity that occurs over a 4-7 game stretch. Pavelski is their 4th or 5th best forward behind Jumbo, Heatley, Marleau, and maybe Clowe or Setogucci.
I didn't say anything about point totals. Go ask some Sharks fans if they think all of those guys are better than Pavelski in the post season. Note the operative word(s) is 'this postseason'.

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They also had cakewalk series in most of those 2nd rounds to catch their breath. Last year they had a brutal 2nd round series and it caught up with them. It would be supremely stupid for anyone to think this series will be a Wings cakewalk.
Cakewalk? No. But look up the definition of insanity. The Sharks logo is still there. I stick to my original post, this is a great opportunity for the Sharks, we'll see if they can do what needs to be done.

Quote:
Watched what I could, and I thought the Avs would take that series the way things were going early. But the Sharks got their act together and took care of business.
As did the Wings.

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04-28-2010, 10:04 AM
  #61
sarcastro
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Originally Posted by Heaton View Post
I didn't say anything about point totals. Go ask some Sharks fans if they think all of those guys are better than Pavelski in the post season. Note the operative word(s) is 'this postseason'.
My point is that Joe Pavelski is not the Sharks' best forward at any time, even if he has a good series. This postseason is also a long way from being over, so it remains to be seen who is better this postseason.

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Cakewalk? No. But look up the definition of insanity. The Sharks logo is still there. I stick to my original post, this is a great opportunity for the Sharks, we'll see if they can do what needs to be done.
If you look up the definition of cakewalk, you'll see the 2nd round 2008 Avalanche, the 2nd round 2002 Blues, the 2nd round 1997 Mighty Ducks, etc.

The Wings have had the Sharks' number lately but I still say that team is loaded with talent and speed and they have all the pieces. If they figure out how to put the puzzle together they could destroy this Wings team, because the Wings don't hold up so well against big, fast, skilled teams that are clicking. They barely got past the Sharks in 07 and lost to the Ducks because of that weakness.

Quote:
As did the Wings.
The Wings pooped the bed in a game 6 on home ice. The Sharks won 3 straight including 2 on the road, and took care of business the first time around when given the opportunity to eliminate an opponent. The Wings have not had that killer instinct. They found their game in game 7, but like I said, the Sharks are better than the Yotes so they won't be able to afford to take games off in this series.

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04-28-2010, 10:21 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by HockeyinHD View Post
Serious question: of Detroit's last 12 playoff rounds (07, 08, 09 and this year) how many have you predicted they would win?
Not directed at me, but just as a shutout to the people who like to say I don't actually root for Detroit,
I've picked Detroit for every round since the start of the 07 playoffs.

I've got Detroit taking this one in 7.

The seven game win over Phoenix wasn't convincing. Game 7 was, of course, But I really didn't see much to distinguish Phoenix and Detroit in games 4-6 except for bounces.

So, there are more caveats with this team than I've had in previous years, however.

A) Franzen must play better. He's five or six points are incredibly misleading.
B) Howard must play at least as good as he did in round one.
C) Defensive and neutral zone turnovers must be reduced.

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04-28-2010, 10:28 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
My point is that Joe Pavelski is not the Sharks' best forward at any time, even if he has a good series. This postseason is also a long way from being over, so it remains to be seen who is better this postseason.
The fact that you're thinking about putting Clowe and Setogucci ahead of Pavelski doesn't exactly give me the impression that you're aware of the performances Pavelski has been putting forth. Thornton is close to a PPG in the playoffs since joining the Sharks but he's never been considered their best post season player. Heatley has nice totals for his career but he hasn't done anything this post season or last. Marleau was a monster a few years ago but not lately.

Pavelski/Clowe/Setogucci has been their best line so far but Pavelski is the straw that stirs the drink.

Quote:
If you look up the definition of cakewalk, you'll see the 2nd round 2008 Avalanche, the 2nd round 2002 Blues, the 2nd round 1997 Mighty Ducks, etc.

The Wings have had the Sharks' number lately but I still say that team is loaded with talent and speed and they have all the pieces. If they figure out how to put the puzzle together they could destroy this Wings team, because the Wings don't hold up so well against big, fast, skilled teams that are clicking. They barely got past the Sharks in 07 and lost to the Ducks because of that weakness.
How long has this been said about the Sharks? How many times have people said the Wings don't look like they have it and exceed expectations?

Quote:
The Wings pooped the bed in a game 6 on home ice. The Sharks won 3 straight including 2 on the road, and took care of business the first time around when given the opportunity to eliminate an opponent. The Wings have not had that killer instinct. They found their game in game 7, but like I said, the Sharks are better than the Yotes so they won't be able to afford to take games off in this series.
Cool. Let's see if this is the year for SJ, you seem to believe in them (or at least more than the Wings). Every year in playoff brackets I see people waste ~$30 picking them.

The Sharks can definitely beat the Wings, but let's see if their 'killer instinct' and talent finally comes out.

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04-28-2010, 10:31 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by The Wingman View Post
This and the Van vs. Chi series are going to be awesome.

The East could be pretty awesome too if the Caps win tonight. As much as I'd love to see the Caps get upset by the Habs in the 1st round, I don't want Pitt to luck out and draw the Habs in round 2, the Habs would easily be the weakest team left.

San Jose vs. Detroit
Vancouver vs. Chicago

Pittsburgh vs. Boston
Washington vs. Philly

= AWESOME!!!!!
That one Van/Chi game was the best I seen in last years playoffs. I think the lead changed hands a dozen times or so. I really think these are the 4 best teams in the west, its great. Hoping for another Detroit/Chicago WCF!!

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04-28-2010, 10:43 AM
  #67
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I think this is going to be an epic series. I think the Sharks got a gorilla off their backs by coming back against the Avs.

Coming into this, I think these teams are virtually dead even. I'll make my prediction after witnessing game 1.
I call Detroit in 7, but who knows.
Maybe the Sharks are puffs and the Wings roll.
Or maybe they are puffs, and the Wings aren't that good, and it's a snooze.
Or maybe the Sharks are giants and they roll.
Or maybe the Stanley Cup final is in the second round this year.

Who knows? I really have no idea. This Red Wings team is really hard to peg. The Sharks are always hard to peg, because there's always this chance that, maybe today, they stop s((tting the bed in the playoffs.

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04-28-2010, 10:51 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
My point is that Joe Pavelski is not the Sharks' best forward at any time, even if he has a good series. This postseason is also a long way from being over, so it remains to be seen who is better this postseason.



If you look up the definition of cakewalk, you'll see the 2nd round 2008 Avalanche, the 2nd round 2002 Blues, the 2nd round 1997 Mighty Ducks, etc.

The Wings have had the Sharks' number lately but I still say that team is loaded with talent and speed and they have all the pieces. If they figure out how to put the puzzle together they could destroy this Wings team, because the Wings don't hold up so well against big, fast, skilled teams that are clicking. They barely got past the Sharks in 07 and lost to the Ducks because of that weakness.



The Wings pooped the bed in a game 6 on home ice. The Sharks won 3 straight including 2 on the road, and took care of business the first time around when given the opportunity to eliminate an opponent. The Wings have not had that killer instinct. They found their game in game 7, but like I said, the Sharks are better than the Yotes so they won't be able to afford to take games off in this series.
The Yotes were a faster, more physical team than the Sharks...though not as skilled. Sarcastro, it seems you keep confusing this Sharks teams with the big, fast Sharks teams of a few years ago. They have good speed on their bottom six (as does Detroit) but overall they aren't any faster or more physical than Detroit. They damn sure arent as physical as the Ducks of '09 or '07. You maintain if the Sharks "put it together" they could destroy Detroit...what do you mean? You see some kind of slumbering giant?

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04-28-2010, 11:05 AM
  #70
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Sorry if this has been posted.

Has the round two schedule been posted yet?

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04-28-2010, 11:12 AM
  #71
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the sharks can win but not if Nasbov plays like he did in round one. Wings in 5
Huh? Outside of Game 2 I believe he his GAA is sub 2.00.

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04-28-2010, 11:15 AM
  #72
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sharks fan here.

As much as I would like to say it's going to be different this time around, I wont. As long as the have Joe "Tin Man" Thornton and Patricia Marleau, this team will not make it past the second round.

I fully expect the sharks to lose this series and it would not be choking because it is expected. If the sharks win (very doubtful) it will be a nice suprise, if they lose Thornton, Marleau and Nabokov are gone.

I think Turco will be the starting goal tender for the sharks next season.

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04-28-2010, 11:16 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by sarcastro View Post
Pavelski isn't exactly the guy I'd be comparing to the Wings' 2 best players. Heatley isn't the two-way player that Z is but he's a better goal scorer. Marleau is very good too. So we'd be comparing Pavelski to Filppula if we want to make a fair comparison, and they are fairly comparable (though Flip has been playing fantastic so far this playoff).


My point is that Joe Pavelski is not the Sharks' best forward at any time, even if he has a good series. This postseason is also a long way from being over, so it remains to be seen who is better this postseason.
I enjoyed this, thank you. =D

Quote:
I look at it this way - San Jose is better than Phoenix and the Wings barely scraped by Phoenix in 7. Phoenix was missing their captain, which didn't hurt them a whole lot as they still won 2 games after he went down, but it certainly didn't help them.
Shane Doan's injury might not have helped them lose any games, but it is guaranteed he was missed.


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04-28-2010, 11:20 AM
  #74
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The Yotes were a faster, more physical team than the Sharks...though not as skilled. Sarcastro, it seems you keep confusing this Sharks teams with the big, fast Sharks teams of a few years ago. They have good speed on their bottom six (as does Detroit) but overall they aren't any faster or more physical than Detroit. They damn sure arent as physical as the Ducks of '09 or '07. You maintain if the Sharks "put it together" they could destroy Detroit...what do you mean? You see some kind of slumbering giant?
On paper, Sharks are the better team. They have depth that Wings can't match and they are actually bigger and thus it will be hard to win some board battles against them.

On ice, I think they have alot to prove. I think they have more chips on their shoulder this year after quite a few consecutive playoff failures. Wings proves to be a perfect target for them to redeem themselves. People WILL say it's a battle of ultimate performer vs choker. I don't know about you but I would be motivated like hell. Also they have quite a few guys on contract year.

or maybe I don't know what the heck I'm talking about... never seen any sharks games this year. After game 1, it should be clearer how the series will go. (obviously)

My bottom line is that Sharks are one of two best team in NHL this year (the other being Chicago) and Wings are a clear underdog.

btw Dan Cleary needs to step up BIG BIG time this series.

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04-28-2010, 11:34 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by HockeyinHD View Post
The big difference between the Phoenix and SJ series will be the level of physical intensity the Coyotes brought as opposed to what SJ does.

Keep in mind, SJ was playing the Avs... and that team was complete crap for most of the year. And they didn't have Hejduk and Mueller, two of their top offensive players.

And they came very, very close to losing that series.

I look at the Sharks and I see a team with nobody on the blue line I am particularly impressed by, and top-tier forwards who haven't scored a goal yet (Thornton and Heatley).

Could the Sharks give the Wings a tough series? Absolutely. That's sort of the point when it comes to the Sharks, though. What they could do and what they actually do are two different things.

In a strange way, SJ having the home ice here could end up being a fairly big advantage for the Wings. Imagine for a moment if Detroit goes into SJ, fresh off having to play A+ hockey to beat the Coyotes, and just hands it to the Sharks in game 1. Beats them 4-1, outshoots them 35-27, something like that.

Given SJ's playoff history, you could almost hear their collars shrinking.

All the pressure, and I mean all of the pressure, is going to be on SJ to win game 1. Heck, if Detroit goes in there and flops, they could still take game 2, get home ice, and it's off to the races.

If SJ loses game 1, though... man. That series could go quick. Like, 4 or 5 games quick.
If the Wings come out and smoke them in game 1, I'm not sure it would be a sign of SJ choking so much as Detroit just getting on a roll. And if the Wings are rolling, yeah, 5 games is very possible against anyone in these playoffs.

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