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The RFA goaltenders: options

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Old
04-27-2010, 11:26 AM
  #1
Teufelsdreck
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The RFA goaltenders: options

Let's not get smug about our goaltenders. Both Halak and Price will be RFAs, fine. That means they can't just bolt and sign with another NHL club (although Halak might consider the KHL). However, on the basis of this season Halak could demand a king's ransom, in which case the Habs might be forced to trade him. (I don't think Price would be in a similar position to make exorbitant demands.) Then there is the possibility of an offer sheet being extended to either or both. Gauthier wouldn't let both of them go elsewhere, so the Habs would have to match one of them.

Suppose just Halak receives an offer sheet for $4M or more per season. Should the Habs match or take the compensatory draft picks or try to work out a trade with the offering team? If it happened to be one of the elite teams (especially if it were Washington, and Washington won the Cup), I'd opt for players and/or prospects rather than draft choices because they'd be too low. If it were a team in the bottom 8 I'd definitely not match and would instead accept the draft choices. If it were a team in the 9 to 14 range, I'd have to think about which players or prospects under contract would have to be included along with the first rounder.

Accepting any trade or offer sheet involving Price would depend on whether Halak is signed.

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04-27-2010, 11:35 AM
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Oleg Petrov
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Halak is eligible for arbitration; therefore he will not be eligible to receive an offer sheet IF Montreal takes him to arbitration as it guarantees him a contract.

Price is the only threat of an offer sheet; so all the decisions have to revolve around him.

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04-27-2010, 11:40 AM
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I think at this point it's clear: Sign Halak before the 1st and package Price at the draft for a package.

I like both goalies, but as much as I drool over Price's potential, let's be honest here. If he turned out to be as good as Halak is right now, we'd all be happy. So why not take the guy that's already here?

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04-27-2010, 11:40 AM
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Gauthier should start by trying to get Price signed at a reasonable price, then try and do the same for Halak(obviously he will cost more than Price after this season), if it falls apart go to arbitration, at least it buys time and you don't risk the offer sheet crap.

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04-27-2010, 11:46 AM
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I think if this series has shown anything, it's that the Habs need BOTH goaltenders. Don't forget, Halak wasn't very good for almost 1/2 this series. Having Price there forced him to step up his game. I think these goalies can help each other. I'd be inclined to try to sign both as you won't get much for Price now but Halak seems to be the guy, at least for now.

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04-27-2010, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
I think at this point it's clear: Sign Halak before the 1st and package Price at the draft for a package.

I like both goalies, but as much as I drool over Price's potential, let's be honest here. If he turned out to be as good as Halak is right now, we'd all be happy. So why not take the guy that's already here?
I don't see why we should trade Price. Keep both unless someone blows us away with an offer. He's only 22, he'd still be a prospect on most teams. Clearly we need an amazing goalie to win, nothing wrong with having a backup plan if Halak falters. We're very weak in goal after Halak and Price so it's not like we got a good prospect to come in after we trade one.

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04-27-2010, 12:02 PM
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I think if this series has shown anything, it's that the Habs need BOTH goaltenders. Don't forget, Halak wasn't very good for almost 1/2 this series. Having Price there forced him to step up his game. I think these goalies can help each other. I'd be inclined to try to sign both as you won't get much for Price now but Halak seems to be the guy, at least for now.
Exactly. Why this team would be reluctant to solidify the most important position by signing BOTH of these guys, for less than a team would spend to lock up just ONE of Heatley, Kovalchuk, (Gomez ) etc, is beyond me. Pittsburgh spends a bajillion to keep both Crosby and Malkin. Even as high as $6-7 million to keep BOTH of Halak and Price (even if it's just for one or two more year) is a bargain when you consider their impact and importance to the team, and the value of having more time to let the situation (future) sort itself out.

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04-27-2010, 12:25 PM
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What if that rumor is true? What if Halak wants out NO MATTER WHAT because of how he feels he was treated from the Calder Cup playoffs when Price came in to the obvious Gainey and Co bias towards Price (justified or not) till this day.

There is that rumor that he's pissed off and wants out even if the org. says that Price is going to be traded in the summer.

I mean, if it is true, I can envision our team not having those 2 goalies in even a short future. Halak because he'll ask again for a trade, and Price because the pressure will be so on by the crowd, the fans, the media because Halak would have been traded, that he'll never fulfill his potential here, be a scapegoat and end up asking for a trade himself.

By the way, I'm NOT implying that's what Halak wants. Have no idea. But what if it is? How do we play that?

I personnally would keep both goalies but at one point, if a guy can't deal with the fact that he doesn't want to share the job AND that the favorite will always be the other one, you can't fault him for thinking that way. But if AT BEST, a promise to trade Price calm Halak down and make him reconsider whatever he had in mind, I mean, a decision will NEED to be taken. And probably in the summer though the best case scenario for me, would still be to keep both and 1 will definately prove his worth a little more than the other and then you make the necessary moves.....but that's what I want. Which has nothing to do with what both goalies may want....

Opinions on that?

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04-27-2010, 12:31 PM
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Win a win againts the Caps Halak could probably get 3M in arbitration while Price will be lucky to get 1.5M from the team.

Do you see this as a problem or not?

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04-27-2010, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
I think at this point it's clear: Sign Halak before the 1st and package Price at the draft for a package.

I like both goalies, but as much as I drool over Price's potential, let's be honest here. If he turned out to be as good as Halak is right now, we'd all be happy. So why not take the guy that's already here?
Because the other guy can be just as good. It's just poor management. If you have Drew Doughty, you don't say I don't need Tyler Myers. It's poor management. If both Halak and Price are worth the value of the contracts they demand, then they should both be kept. Cap wise it's not an ideal situation but trading a potential star player like Carey Price entails even bigger risks.

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04-27-2010, 12:32 PM
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I don't know why people make the Habs goaltending situation like it's a bad one. The habs are in an IDEAL situation with their goaltending, a handful of teams would LOVE to be in the position that the Habs are in.

Both Halak & Price are RFA's and the Habs hold pretty much all the cards...just sit back and enjoy, it will play itself out

I'm worried about alot of things in terms of the Habs future, but goaltending, is NOT one of them

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04-27-2010, 12:32 PM
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I still can't believe people are even thinking about trading Price. That would be beyond stupid.

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04-27-2010, 12:38 PM
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GordonGraham
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I still can't believe people are even thinking about trading Price. That would be beyond stupid.
Some want to trade Price cause they see halak playing 60 games a season and feel the team would be better with a weaker back up than Price but with better asset up front from the Price trade.

Like any other options it has positive and negative

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04-27-2010, 12:39 PM
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Because the other guy can be just as good. It's just poor management. If you have Drew Doughty, you don't say I don't need Tyler Myers. It's poor management. If both Halak and Price are worth the value of the contracts they demand, then they should both be kept. Cap wise it's not an ideal situation but trading a potential star player like Carey Price entails even bigger risks.
How can you compare goaltending to defense? If you have Doughty and Myers then they both still play and contribute to your team.

There's no reason to put yourself in cap trouble to keep a valuable asset on the bench. Especially when that asset can be moved to strengthen a position of greater need. (DEFENSE)

So what if either goaltender turns out to be the real deal? Both in my mind will be at worst solid #1 goalies who will give us a chance to win night in and night out. And that's all I'll ever ask from them anyway.

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04-27-2010, 12:39 PM
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What if that rumor is true? What if Halak wants out NO MATTER WHAT because of how he feels he was treated from the Calder Cup playoffs when Price came in to the obvious Gainey and Co bias towards Price (justified or not) till this day....

Opinions on that?
I'm sure he was heartbroken to play for Slovakia in the world championships, I mean playing for his country at what is considered to be major tournament in Europe was like being exiled in a prison colony.

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04-27-2010, 12:42 PM
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I have a real hard time believing both would want to be back next season.
Both are going to want to start and are probably not interested in being a backup for 60+ games.
You might be better off having one traded/signed away.
If you are in the middle of a playoff race in february, you dont want someone complaining they are not playing enough and they want out.

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04-27-2010, 12:44 PM
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Whitesnake
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I'm sure he was heartbroken to play for Slovakia in the world championships, I mean playing for his country at what is considered to be major tournament in Europe was like being exiled in a prison colony.
Well, again, not sure what I believe to be true or not in this, yet, you could still like a situation and hate another in the same time. You can like playing for your country, but hate not playing for YOUR team, the one you were a part of all year long. And then, if true, it wouldn't be about 1 incident but probably a number of events....IF TRUE, again.

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04-27-2010, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Lucius View Post
I think at this point it's clear: Sign Halak before the 1st and package Price at the draft for a package.

I like both goalies, but as much as I drool over Price's potential, let's be honest here. If he turned out to be as good as Halak is right now, we'd all be happy. So why not take the guy that's already here?
I agree. I have nothing against Price.. He had a good season despite the losses.. But the Habs have a great goalie in Halak and he's only 24. Why risk losing great to hope and have really great?

Keep Halak whatever it means...

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04-27-2010, 12:49 PM
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How can you compare goaltending to defense? If you have Doughty and Myers then they both still play and contribute to your team.

There's no reason to put yourself in cap trouble to keep a valuable asset on the bench. Especially when that asset can be moved to strengthen a position of greater need. (DEFENSE)

So what if either goaltender turns out to be the real deal? Both in my mind will be at worst solid #1 goalies who will give us a chance to win night in and night out. And that's all I'll ever ask from them anyway.
To give you some perspective on this, Spacek was a second pairing defenseman who averaged almost 22 mins/game over 74 games this season, for a total of 1613 mins of service this season. A backup need only play 27 games to put in the equivalent ice time contributing to his team's success.

Feeling completely confident in your goaltending for a full 82(+) games, instead of just whatever your #1 guy can give you, is just too valuable of a foundation (and one of the aspects that puts this team on par with anyone on a given night) to "give up" on for minor cap concerns or "opportunity cost", imo.

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04-27-2010, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
To give you some perspective on this, Spacek was a second pairing defenseman who averaged almost 22 mins/game over 74 games this season, for a total of 1613 mins of service this season. A backup need only play 27 games to put in the equivalent ice time contributing to his team's success.

Feeling completely confident in your goaltending for a full 82(+) games, instead of just whatever your #1 guy can give you, is just too valuable of a foundation (and one of the aspects that puts this team on par with anyone on a given night) to "give up" on for minor cap concerns or "opportunity cost", imo.
I don't think people realize just what a huge drop off there is between Price/Halak and the real backups that are available around the league. Look at LA: they ran Quick into the ground because Ersberg can't play. The same thing happened in Colorado with Budaj and Anderson. San Jose plays Nabokov as much as they can, too. Greiss is decent but there is a huge dropoff between our two goalies.

It doesn't hurt to have two good goalies as long as neither is making 5+ mil.

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04-27-2010, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 1SJSharkie1 View Post
I don't think people realize just what a huge drop off there is between Price/Halak and the real backups that are available around the league. Look at LA: they ran Quick into the ground because Ersberg can't play. The same thing happened in Colorado with Budaj and Anderson. San Jose plays Nabokov as much as they can, too. Greiss is decent but there is a huge dropoff between our two goalies.

It doesn't hurt to have two good goalies as long as neither is making 5+ mil.
And especially if, combined, they make only slightly more... which I fully expect ("worst" case, they might combine for a Laraque contract's worth more than 5 mil, a typical salary of other non-RFA "big game goalies," and in the end that's all the perspective I need to make the right choice).

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04-27-2010, 01:04 PM
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Playing in the World Championships in 2007 was an important step in Halak becoming Slovakia's preeminent goaltender. Some might say it doesn't mean much, his main competition is Peter Budaj, but still, that must mean something. Halak got some big game experience there at the World Championships.

Budaj had a good year this year but I guess that Colorado thought their margin of error was such that they felt they needed to play Anderson as much as possible and they had lost some confidence in Budaj after the last couple of years.

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04-27-2010, 01:09 PM
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In my humble opinion, trading Halak can't be an option anymore.

And keeping both goalies is going pretty damn tough, given our cap situation. We can't afford to spend too much just on two guys, we need every penny to strengthen our bottom-6 and re-sign Plekanec and possibly Moore. There are Sergei and Pouliot, as well.

Keeping both will be tough, but if it's impossible, I'd be willing to deal Price before Halak. There's no way Gauthier trades Halak after what he's doing right now. If Price ever becomes as good as Halak is right now, like Lucius said, we'd all be happy.

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04-27-2010, 01:17 PM
  #24
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In my humble opinion, trading Halak can't be an option anymore.

And keeping both goalies is going pretty damn tough, given our cap situation. We can't afford to spend too much just on two guys, we need every penny to strengthen our bottom-6 and re-sign Plekanec and possibly Moore. There are Sergei and Pouliot, as well.

Keeping both will be tough, but if it's impossible, I'd be willing to deal Price before Halak. There's no way Gauthier trades Halak after what he's doing right now. If Price ever becomes as good as Halak is right now, like Lucius said, we'd all be happy.
Why will it be tough? They're both RFA's??

Neither is really proven, what's so difficult?

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04-27-2010, 01:20 PM
  #25
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Because the other guy can be just as good. It's just poor management. If you have Drew Doughty, you don't say I don't need Tyler Myers. It's poor management. If both Halak and Price are worth the value of the contracts they demand, then they should both be kept. Cap wise it's not an ideal situation but trading a potential star player like Carey Price entails even bigger risks.
We can have better goaltending than teams like New Jersey Calgary Chicago by having 2 good young ones rather than one overworked guy that flops in the playoffs after a 70 game workload.

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