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Habs about to turn the corner?

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Old
05-09-2010, 06:17 PM
  #1
Tyson
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Habs about to turn the corner?

Is it possible that this franchise may no longer be fighting for the 8th playoff spot on the last day of the season in the future?

PG has some great assets with his goaltending which could land a bonafide 1st line player with size!
The possible emergence of PK Subban as early as next season; Players like Pacioretty, White, Carle that should make the jump and be pretty good players.
I only wish that Guy Boucher was given an assistant spot next season with the big club.
I am excited about this franchise for the first time in ages!!

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05-09-2010, 06:32 PM
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JrHockeyFan
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I'm ecstatic about how we are doing in these playoffs. But it would be a terrible mistake to look at this as any guarantee of things to come next year. Been there, done that

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05-09-2010, 06:35 PM
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Carle sucks. Technically, there's not even room next year for Subban. Hamrlik, Spacek, O'bryne, Markov, Gorges and Gill.

Personally, I'd like to see Hamrlik gone.

Pouliot - Gomez - Gionta
Cammalleri Big centre - >Big winger
Moen - Lapierre, or a centre similar - a winger who loves to hit and has some hands and can defend himself/his teammates
White - Pyatt(iirc he is a centre, or can play there)/lapierre Eager/Pyatt

I believe Lapierre is more affective at being the agitator when he knows if the other team tries to do something, he then doesn't have to be the person to go out there and defend his teammates.

Moen plays more physical and more in your face if he doesn't have to worry about being off and having the team defenseless against teams trying to push and shove the habs around.

Markov - O'bryne. Markov has a nasty/edgey side and since he's not all that tough, he'll need a big d partner to help him out.
Spacek - Subban -An offensive minded d pairing. Spacek can help Subban along.
Gill - Gorges. Solid pairing already

Halak
Price/other.

To me, a team like that would have enough size to compete. Enough speed to burn and enough leadership to pull through when times are tough.

With Markov + O'bryne with the Gomer line, you'll have Pouliot and O'bryne there to help control the crowd if things get rowdy. 2nd line, you'd have the centre and winger to help keep everything calm.

3rd line can take care of themselves, same with the 4th line. Also, the bottom 2 lines sow defensive reliability too along with the ability to score 5 on 5 and play their game, which is to punish, agitate and get underneath the opponent's skin.

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05-09-2010, 06:40 PM
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andy28
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Maybe, but I have not seen any indication of that yet. This same team fought for
8th this year. It depends on if Gauthier does what is needed. I like Moore, but one move does not prove he is a good GM. I am not pleased with Gainey's work over the past few years.

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05-09-2010, 06:59 PM
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LyricalLyricist
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A lot of tweaking needs to be done to be a contender.

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05-09-2010, 07:01 PM
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InglewoodJack
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Look at 07-08. Nothing carried over to the next year. But this year we have a much better core, so I wouldn't say that it's crazy to have this same success next season. Still need a star player though.

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05-09-2010, 07:04 PM
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look at the cap, what we have left to spend, and the RFA's and UFA's Bob left us with.

This team could take a huge step backwards next year if they don't make some gutsy, intelligent moves with their free agency fiasco they have coming soon.

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05-09-2010, 07:04 PM
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The Right Price
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
Look at 07-08. Nothing carried over to the next year. But this year we have a much better core, so I wouldn't say that it's crazy to have this same success next season. Still need a star player though.
Cammy could fill that spot??

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05-09-2010, 07:07 PM
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crappy team with hot goalie, wont make playoffs next year

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05-09-2010, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by reddog737 View Post
crappy team with hot goalie, wont make playoffs next year
you got the numbers for the next 649 draw?

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05-09-2010, 07:22 PM
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InglewoodJack
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Originally Posted by DainiusZubrus View Post
Cammy could fill that spot??
In your opinion could Cammy become a Patrick Kane, A J. Toews, a Marleau/Heatley, a Sedin or a Crosby Malkin?

I think we need a bonafide game changer, and while Cammy is a great finisher, he goes pointless for long streaks, and can't exactly change the pace of a season.

That being said, we've made to much progress to tank, so I'm not sure how we get a superstar.

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05-09-2010, 07:36 PM
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LyricalLyricist
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Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
In your opinion could Cammy become a Patrick Kane, A J. Toews, a Marleau/Heatley, a Sedin or a Crosby Malkin?

I think we need a bonafide game changer, and while Cammy is a great finisher, he goes pointless for long streaks, and can't exactly change the pace of a season.

That being said, we've made to much progress to tank, so I'm not sure how we get a superstar.
I think you're being unrealistic. Cammy has franchise player potential. Since when is a potential 40 goal scorer not a game changer? A lot of teams have several, think of SJS, they have thornton, heatley, marleau, boyle and so on as franchise players, we're not that fortunate, but to say cammy isn't a star player is a push. As soon as we signed him i knew what we were getting. I think it's unfair to compare him to malkin, crosby or even ovechkin because they are superstar players while cammy is a cut below and a star.

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05-09-2010, 07:36 PM
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We've got some holes but I like this nucleus more than last year's. For one thing, it's a lot younger. Kovy & Koivu were on the downside of their careers, while Gomez & Gio are in their prime and Cammy & Pleks have just arrived.

Pleks is just 27 don't forget. I think he's playing through a hip injury right now. We signed Cammy at 27. Cammy will score 30 - 40 goals a year for us on this contract.

Gionta 20-35 a year over his.

Our goaltending is young and solid. I'm hoping the Habs sign both Price & Halak this summer. Our D is not bad. Subban & OB need to be full-timers next year and I think they will be.

Hope to see a D next year of: Markov-OB, Gill-Gorges & Spacek-Subban. If we could put a package together to upgrade over Spacek that would be cool but I don't expect it with the cap problems we'll have.

Hamrlik needs to go, so do the Kostitsyn brothers. While others have suggested we trade them together I don't. SK is a goner, but I also think AK might be better without his pain-in-the-ass little bro around. If we can't trade AK I'm okay if he comes back. He's frustrating but not a disturbance to the team like SK is. Also, AK is playing for a contract next year so the team could benefit from him having a great year because he knows he needs a new deal.

Tentatively, though, we have a lot of holes:

Cammy - Pleks (hope he resigns) - ?
? - Gomez - Gionta
Pouliot - Moore (hope he resigns) - ?
Pyatt - Lapierre - Moen

We have two top 6 positions open upfront. I also think we need another top 9 forward that can provide some offense. Something that Moen, Lapierre or Pyatt will not do for us. I find Pouliot has played his best games lately with Moore as his centre. Moore keeps it simple, which seems to help Pouliot keep it simple. I think they should stay together to give us another "duo."

We need some size on the wings to help out Gio-Gomez, Cammy-Pleks. I'm not sure how Patches is progressing in the AHL, but I don't think he'll be ready to step into a top-6 role at the beginning of next year. Ryan White is another 4th liner.

There's still some building to do but the Habs will have a solid team next year. We'll compete for the division lead but I don't expect us to run away with anything.

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Old
05-09-2010, 07:56 PM
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jcpenny
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We are about to turn the corner for sure. Not because of the line up we have but more because of the change of culture, the new philosophy, the discipline and the structure that was brought into place by Jacques Martin. It took time, there were ups and downs, challenges and growing pains during the season but it all came togheter in the playoffs. Ive never seen such unity, courage, accountability and belief in a team in a long long time or ever for that matter. Ive liked Jacques Martin a lot because of the mentality he brings to a team. Give him better players that will buy his team concept and we'll be back to be a top team for years.

Many JM haters only saw the system and the players struggling to execute it but failed to see what he was trying to do with this team. Now that the foundation is there, lets bring on players that will fit the team ideology.

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Old
05-10-2010, 04:42 AM
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I think both the brothers will be packaged with Weber, and also I see Hammer being dealt.

I would like to see a Kost Brothers and weber in a package deal to get hartnell and carcillo from philly, have a line up something.

Cammy-Pleks-Hartnell
Pouilot-Gomez-Gionta
Patches-Lapierre-Carcillo
White-Trotter-Pyatt


Markov-O'Byrne
Spacek-Subban
Gill-Gorges

Halak/Price

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05-10-2010, 05:22 AM
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If Gauthier can work a little bit of magic this Summer, then we can turn the corner.

I think that most of us have a pretty good idea of what this team needs to add, and who this team can afford to ship out (and should ship out, in some cases). Now it's just a matter of getting what we need for what we can afford to ship out. What we can afford to ship out has about as much total player value as what we need, but getting it to all work cap-wise is the tricky part.

Aside from trades, we need to resign Pleks or find a suitable replacement. Our other UFAs may be nice to have (Moore) but are not really key components.

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05-10-2010, 05:42 AM
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TheBuriedHab
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As much as I loved pleks this year......I still think we need more size up front. If we keep pleks I think we have to package andrei k and maybe a goalie to get a big top 6 winger for that line.

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Old
05-10-2010, 06:07 AM
  #18
One Man Rock Band
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I wonder if Price & the Kostitsyn brothers could net us Patrick Sharp and something. Dustin B and Versteeg also seem to be available. Wonder what'd it'd take.

Cammy - Pleks - Sharp ---- $15
Pouliot - Gomez - Gionta ---- $13.5
Lappy - Moore - Buffy ---- $6
White - Pyatt - Moen ---- $3

Markov - O'Byrne ---- $7
Spacek - Subban ---- $5
Gill - Gorges ---- $3.5

Halak ---- $2.5
Sanford ---- $1

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05-10-2010, 06:17 AM
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Mmm still lots of tweaking up front. Not enough punch. Although I do think our defense will be one of the deepest in the league, with Gorges and Gill originally slated as a 3rd pairing playing like a 1st. This was Gorges' coming out party.

The decision he'll make in goaltending is obviously the most important one and could define the club for the next decade.

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05-10-2010, 06:19 AM
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TheBuriedHab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
I wonder if Price & the Kostitsyn brothers could net us Patrick Sharp and something. Dustin B and Versteeg also seem to be available. Wonder what'd it'd take.

Cammy - Pleks - Sharp ---- $15
Pouliot - Gomez - Gionta ---- $13.5
Lappy - Moore - Buffy ---- $6
White - Pyatt - Moen ---- $3

Markov - O'Byrne ---- $7
Spacek - Subban ---- $5
Gill - Gorges ---- $3.5

Halak ---- $2.5
Sanford ---- $1

I think Halak is definitely getting above 3 million now. Maybe closer to 4. I love the Idea of getting Sharp and Buffy tho.

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05-10-2010, 08:37 AM
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For one, anybody not including Moore in their line-ups is crazy. They traded a pick for him for a reason, he isn't just a loaner imo PG wants to keep his services.

Metro is likely gone.

Players I feel could be traded:

Hammer, Spacek, Andrei K, Sergei K, Price/Halak (Yes I still think they could trade Halak, even though personally I wouldn't)

I think a package containing one or both Kostitsyn's and a goalie could land us some very good players. We do need size, but I don't see us not signing Plek, I think despite all the stuff we've been hearing he will sign and take a small paycut in order to stay here, you can't let players like this go. With the money we save in other signings, we'll likely land a big forward we can afford via trade.

Next year I believe Pouliot will be a solidified top 6, give the kid one summer to work hard. Andrei K is a big body, but we need a player who is not only better than he is offensively but who uses his size more, Sergei would likely be a toss in as most teams wouldn't want to touch him unless he was the last piece.

I think Chicago does make an optimal trading partner for us, not that I think they'd be interested in our goalies with their current situation, but I think they could have interest in the Kostitsyn's. (Due to cap situation)

They dump some salary to us, get two young players with a ton of potential but attitude problems, and are out of their salary woes.

Another thing I was thinking is:

Chicago trades Huet to Philly or one of those teams desperate for a goalie (I think honestly Huet is a much better investment than Khabibulin was for Edmonton, they won't offload that contract)

I think a team will be willing to take the risk, then for sure we could do a deal like:

Price or Halak + Kosty Bro's for insert players we need from Chicago, Byfuglien being one of them. (Throw picks on either side to make the trade viable)

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Old
05-10-2010, 09:14 AM
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From what I gather, Sergei might bolt to the KHL and Andrei might be retained because of the low demand.

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05-10-2010, 09:15 AM
  #23
otto bond
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
A lot of tweaking needs to be done to be a contender.
This may varry in it own degree.

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Old
05-10-2010, 09:26 AM
  #24
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Is it possible that this franchise may no longer be fighting for the 8th playoff spot on the last day of the season in the future?
Maybe, but certainly not next year. For my money, that year will likely be a write-off. I'm probably going to elaborate in a later post, but the Cliff's Notes is that Halak's inevitable coming down to the stratosphere (him being merely excellent rather than otherworldly) will make up for any gain that's gotten and the team will continue to be plagued by a weak 5-on-5 systems game, ensuring continued mediocrity. Any improvement with young players (eg. Subban) is likely to run afoul of the coaching staff's unwillingness to deal with youth -- in the long term it may be best for Subban to stay in the AHL next year given young Habs' propensity to end up stapled to the doghouse and then shipped off. And losing Guy Boucher to another club may lose the Habs their best hope for short-term improvement.

Since the East is unlikely to be as godawfully weak as this year in the future, I think that "fighting for that 8th playoff spot" may prove to be a reach goal for Jacques Martin's Habs. Given the strength of the Habs' roster, that's a serious underachievement, but circumstances being what they are, I don't see the team improving much.

Gauthier may well manage to parlay a goaltending trade into an impact player, but I'm afraid such a move will fall afoul of the team's systemic problems and have limited impact.

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Old
05-10-2010, 09:31 AM
  #25
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Originally Posted by ashtraygirl View Post
you got the numbers for the next 649 draw?
His assessment of the team rings unfortunately true, with the caveat that the roster is not nearly as weak as it plays.

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