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Old
05-11-2010, 09:33 PM
  #76
Kestrel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awesomo View Post
This is true, this is pretty much the same for any type of software. When you buy it, you are buying the LICENSE to use it. They did not transfer the rights of the software to you.
Not entirely true - this has been fought out in the court system, and the software companies don't always win.

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05-12-2010, 12:23 AM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sined View Post
I disagree, Blizzard would never do such a bush league move.
They disabled LAN play to force Bnet authentication for multiplayer in StarCraft 2. Hope all your LAN parties have internet connections...

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19nazzy View Post


They split Starcraft 2 into 3 games to grab $180 instead of $60.
If that's how you want to look at it. Until you've played the game, I don't think such claims are fair. If there's a significant chunk of campaign on each release, is the complaint valid?

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Originally Posted by kurt View Post
Because the person that bought the title new gave them that money?
But used game sales and rentals artificially increase the amount of support required for each sale. They're getting no compensation for subsequent sales. This is a lot like dealership warranties not transferring to the new owner upon resale.

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05-12-2010, 01:04 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by RoadDoggFL View Post
But used game sales and rentals artificially increase the amount of support required for each sale. They're getting no compensation for subsequent sales. This is a lot like dealership warranties not transferring to the new owner upon resale.
Not really - I'd say it's more like getting a free 5 year added service along with the purchase of the car, and saying that service is non-transferrable. With a warranty, the manufacturer is potentially out thousands and thousands of dollars - games don't need warranty work, not in that sense. I don't really have anything against a transferrable warranty anyway - I think non-transferrable warranties are just a nice way for car manufacturers to cut their responsibilities and run.

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05-12-2010, 05:38 AM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kestrel View Post
Not really - I'd say it's more like getting a free 5 year added service along with the purchase of the car, and saying that service is non-transferrable. With a warranty, the manufacturer is potentially out thousands and thousands of dollars - games don't need warranty work, not in that sense. I don't really have anything against a transferrable warranty anyway - I think non-transferrable warranties are just a nice way for car manufacturers to cut their responsibilities and run.
Fair enough. It'd be like advertising something like OnStar or satelite radio and the service doesn't go a new owner.

Just saying, this isn't exactly unprecedented, and looking at it from EA's perspective I can't say I really blame them. Just a matter of determining whether the ill-will will be worth the added revenue. I'm sure it is to EA.

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05-12-2010, 09:58 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by dhasek3910 View Post
Doesn't this also screw over people who want to rent games? Wouldn't they need to pay $10 additional to rent the game too?? Ugh.
I believe you can get a 7-day trial for free.

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05-12-2010, 01:55 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by noobman View Post
This isn't much different from a product key on a PC game, so I have very little sympathy for those who are up in arms over this.
Yeah I totally spaced on the fact that with most games you can sell the game with the key and as long as you don't continue using the game/key, the person can still play online

Give us all a break here. You can buy a PC game used too if you trust the person you are buying it from. This isn't the same thing, they're flat out making it so only the console that originally played/registered the game can play it online, but what if I rent it, or lend it to a friend, you're expected to pay 10$?

Come on, lets be real here, this is nothing like PC games and their serial numbers, because those serial numbers can be transferred with the game, the EA style you can't even do that, they don't even give you the option to do so. This isn't the same thing at all.

I can sell my warcraft 3 + TFT to somebody and have it work online, I wouldn't be able to do the same thing say for NHL 11 though. So if it's the same thing, why the **** can't I?

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05-12-2010, 02:02 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Ashe View Post
What it does is force you to buy new.
Oh you want to buy a used game for 35 dollars? Well give us 10 dollars and you can get access to the other stuff.
Mass Effect/Dragon Age/Battlefield 2 do this.
It works well. It forces you that if you want free content/the downloadable stuff. That you are at least giving some money back to the company.

Its not greed. Its a company being smart to make sure they are always making money.

You dont care about playing 3 maps in battefield? Then dont spend the 10 dollars to get access to all the free content for being a VIP.
Dont want to get more weapons/quests/etc in mass effect/Dragon age? Then dont buy it.

What this does in the long run :

Lowers used game prices.
Keeps the company making money to bring more games out.
Keeps places like gamestop from ripping you a new one.



Peopel are paying 15$ to buy 5 ****** maps for ModernWarfare2.
Its like having a VIP card from places where they give you 15% off each time you go, But you have to pay 10$ to sign up.

I applaud them for this.
OK I would understand if the case was EA was charging 10$ for you to be able to play certain teams not originally included in the game.

But to charge 10$ just to be able play online with your friends, it's a joke, and no BF2 and the games you mentioned do not do this, they charge money for bonus content, there's a big difference between charging somebody for bonus content, and charging somebody to play a game online just because they bought it used.

The developers made their $ on the sale, if they feel used games are hurting their sales, mark them up 10$ and the resellers will need to do the same. Stop playing stupid games with people, I understand this is directed at Gamestop, but most consumers won't see it that way, and who do I speak to about buying games when I enter the store, EA's people or Gamestops? The consumer is going to hear Gamestop's side of the story, not EA's, and as a result it's only going to hurt EA and the consumer, not gamestop. Gamestop will likely continue selling games used and new, and may even give EA bad press. They might not even tell people they need to pay the 10$ to play it online and leave that up to the consumer to find out, who knows, but the bottom line is for the 90% of gamers out there who are casual, they aren't going to be realize this is EA trying to put GameStop in check for ripping people off (both developers and the consumers), they're going to feel EA is ripping them off and being how EA is going about this, I can't say I blame them.

If you make the games 10$ more expensive to begin with people are going to suck it up and still buy them, they buy NHL 10 because it's NHL 10, or else most people would just say **** it and buy NHL 2k10, which we all know isn't the case at all.

If you start to play stupid games with people on having to pay an extra 10$ after the fact, they're going to blame you, not gamestop or anyone else, plain and simple.

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05-12-2010, 02:06 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Zodiac View Post
i always buy my games new, so it doesn't matter to me.

i always thought it was pretty sad how Futureshop would sell the newer used games for like $5 less than a brand new copy. give me the new copy ...for $5 more i can make sure that i have a nice fresh clean copy. don't have to worry about some kid's snot nosed hands all over my instruction manual and disc ...no scratches, etc.

it'll suck for the people who love to rent and buy used games ...but since i do neither, i couldn't care less.
Agreed, I have no idea how there's even a market for this. Are there people out there who are really so cheap they'd rather spend 5$ less then have piece of mind? Let me tell you, especially in the case of futureshop, half the time when buying something new at BB or FS you can never be too sure how it'll turn out, half the time if the box is pretty clean they put it right back on the shelf even after somebody returns something saying it's broken.

Is that 5$ really worth your time, gas $, etc? I mean really, I'd rather just buy the new game. In futureshops case though I don't think I'd buy a single thing from them ever again. Call me crazy but I just prefer the peace of mind in knowing it's a new game, unscratched guaranteed etc. Obviously though I'd purchase the game elsewhere cause knowing FS somebody could've returned it, said it didn't work, and they put it back on the shelf.

If it's the difference of like 59.99$ versus like 20-30$ though, I'll take the risk and return it, then we're talking like 30-40$, but 5 bucks, lol.

I hate places like FS cause when I look at their prices on most things, used games inclusive, I always wonder are they trying to insult my intelligence or are people really that stupid?

But then again, I see they're still in business so, there must be some pretty dumb people out there. (They do have good deals sometimes don't get me wrong, some specials like any place can be good, but I see computer parts I could buy easily elsewhere at a 100%+ markup there)

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Old
05-12-2010, 02:14 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by RoadDoggFL View Post
They disabled LAN play to force Bnet authentication for multiplayer in StarCraft 2. Hope all your LAN parties have internet connections...



If that's how you want to look at it. Until you've played the game, I don't think such claims are fair. If there's a significant chunk of campaign on each release, is the complaint valid?



But used game sales and rentals artificially increase the amount of support required for each sale. They're getting no compensation for subsequent sales. This is a lot like dealership warranties not transferring to the new owner upon resale.
It would need to be fairly significant as the original games inclusive of warcraft all did have plenty of campaign already. If you're telling me it's three times the amount, I'd still have to say that isn't making it worth 3x the money, because to most people especially SC/WC fans, the online is what you are paying for, not the campaign. Sure the campaigns are fun, a lot of fun actually, but when I see that 69.99$ price tag on SC lets just say, when it first came out, I see 50$ for online, 19.99$ for campaign. Obviously it equates to different, but I'm just saying that's the difference in value to me and most big time SC/WC fans. I'd even be willing to argue some SC/WC fans would wipe their ass with the campaign and pay the 69.99$ just for the serial to go online. Obviously they'll make $ off the people who just have to play the 3 campaigns and own them all legitimately, just saying though, it's not really worth 3x the money.

If it was 69.99$ + 19.99$ + 19.99$ type thing, for an all inclusive price of 109.99$ I'd buy it with all 3, but because they split it up, I'm only going to buy one for 69.99$ or whatever it is. Some people will buy just one (most imo) others will buy all 3, but in the end, had they just priced it at 109.99$ for all 3 to begin with, I think they'd probably make more money as the SC fans aren't just going to not buy SC because it costs 40$ more, SC fans and blizzard fans play their games because they're diehard fans of either blizzard, RTS games or both.

Any serious RTS fan knows that any blizzard RTS is a must have in any fans collection. Whether or not all 3 campaigns is a must have though, remains to be seen. Imo it won't be and most people will just buy one, whatever their friends aren't getting.

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Old
05-12-2010, 02:33 PM
  #85
Neely2005
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Originally Posted by Toes View Post
For EA, this is a really smart move. They weren't earning any money from the used games sales.

It seems that EA is specifically targeting businesses like Gamestop now. Recently, there has been a lawsuit against Gamestop, suing them for selling games with cases that guarantees codes inside, when the previous owner had already used it.
How long before there's a lawsuit against EA over this?

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05-12-2010, 02:37 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by DrFeelgood View Post
I am by far against the used game market mostly because I just can't support something that takes the money out of a hard working developers pocket.
I am a member of the industry and know how much work goes into each game and to think that retailers such as Gamestop are turning such huge profits on someone else's hard work actually infuriates me to no end.

However, I do understand the approach from the budget gamer that doesn't necessarily have the money. I have no beef with the budget gamer, all of my beef is with the retailers that are taking money from the developers pocket. However, if you're getting a deal on the game you're playing, don't cry about having less services than full paying customers. That's just stupid, you should never expect to get more while paying less.
Are you against the Used Car market? I mean that takes hard earned money away from the Car Manufacturers.

How about Resale/Used Houses? That takes hard earned money away from the Construction Industry...

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05-12-2010, 02:39 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
Are you against the Used Car market? I mean that takes hard earned money away from the Car Manufacturers.

How about Resale/Used Houses? That takes hard earned money away from the Construction Industry...
Thank god when I buy a video game $125,000 doesnt got to EA. Id pretty much only be able to own 1 game in my life.

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05-12-2010, 02:47 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by RoadDoggFL View Post
If that's how you want to look at it. Until you've played the game, I don't think such claims are fair. If there's a significant chunk of campaign on each release, is the complaint valid?
Maybe not, but it's pretty clearly a money grab on their part. I'm not saying that it's a bad thing either, all 3 will probably sell like crazy. Great business move but lame for their customers.

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Old
05-12-2010, 03:13 PM
  #89
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It's been a while since my last post, so let me just clear up some misconceptions that appear to be running rampant.

The people who talked about software licenses are completely correct. When you purchase your game for 60 dollars, you are not buying full access to everything on the disc. You are buying access to what they have made available. That is the agreement being made when money changes hands. Most game discs now have both pre-order bonuses, exclusivity bonuses, collector's edition, and additional content on the disc. Your purchase of a retail game does not entitle you to this merely because the data is somewhere on the disc. If you don't think the content available is significant enough, vote with your wallet.

As an addendum, let me clarify that downloadable content is almost always created before the retail release, and was planned as additional content from pre-vis stages. There's this uninformed opinion that downloadable content was 'stripped out of the game', which is simply not true. I can go into more detail on this (though I could link you to past topics where I explain it in detail).

To this discussion about games now costing 10 dollars more... completely nonsensical. A vast portion of retailers don't sell used games. This move does nothing to hamper their business. Gamestop simply doesn't have the option to charge 70 dollars if Best Buy, FutureShop and WalMart are charging 60. From a business perspective, it's a complete no-go. If anything, this forces Gamestop to reduce the price of used games, and trade-in value.

For the people talking about Starcraft, your point is either based from ignorance (which is acceptable), or pure childish petulance. Any copy of Starcraft II will have full access to the multiplayer, which is probably why anyone is buying it. My friend is maining Protoss and building pylons as we speak. Starcraft the former was one campaign divided into three parts. Starcraft II is three campaigns, all of which with the depth that a full retail release requires. The Zerg and Protoss games/expansions will come with their own campaigns, and most likely new maps. This is entirely acceptable. Being upset about it is tantamount to thinking that purchasing World of Warcraft should give you Burning Crusade and Wrath of the Lich King free.

Lastly, I love you guys talking about "all EA does is release the same game every year". It's patently obvious that you only play sports games. Do you know why sports games are almost identical every year? Because sports don't change. After a while there's only so many video game specific gameplay elements you can tack on to a game where you throw a ball. Somehow I don't feel EA only releases the same thing when this is the company that publishes Dead Space, Battlefield Bad Company, The Sims, Burnout Paradise, Warhammer Online and Mass Effect.

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Old
05-12-2010, 05:54 PM
  #90
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http://www.industrygamers.com/news/e...-says-analyst/

An article from industry analysts on this topic, most of which has already been brought up and discussed throughout this thread.

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05-12-2010, 08:06 PM
  #91
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Willing to bet next year they're going to wonder why there are a lot less people playing online...

As if everyone can easily afford $60 games.

This will hurt them in the long run. FIFA, for instance, I haven't played in years, and I bought it used. Taking away the online features will discourage gamers from trying new sports by buying a used game for cheaper. If you make a good enough game, then the person who ventured into the new sport will buy the new game the following year anyway.

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05-13-2010, 12:43 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by SilverSeven View Post
Thank god when I buy a video game $125,000 doesnt got to EA. Id pretty much only be able to own 1 game in my life.
A little OT but where the hell are you able to buy a house for only $125,000? (I'm assuming that's what you're referring to)

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05-13-2010, 01:41 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
A little OT but where the hell are you able to buy a house for only $125,000? (I'm assuming that's what you're referring to)
20 years ago or a mobile home?

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05-13-2010, 02:25 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neely2005 View Post
Are you against the Used Car market? I mean that takes hard earned money away from the Car Manufacturers.
The value of a car is almost nothing by the time it's resold. Sure, the car company loses money, but it's a mere fraction of what it once cost... their loses are essentially irrelevant.

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05-13-2010, 02:26 PM
  #95
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A little OT but where the hell are you able to buy a house for only $125,000? (I'm assuming that's what you're referring to)
Actually, lots of places in the Midwest in the US have VERY affordable housing. States like Nebraska, Kansas, etc... have a ton of space and only a couple million people.

It is slowly changing, but I know there are subdivisions around where you can get a brand new, very nice house in a district with good schools for around $125,000

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05-14-2010, 04:34 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Bruins4Lifer View Post
Doesn't bother me. I haven't bought used since last gen. I'm actually a bit disgusted at how much Gamespot/EB Games charges for some used games so I could almost say I approve of this.
With the way gamestop has dominated the market i semi approve of this practice as well. I really hate how aggresive they are at trying to sell used games to you and to have you sell the games back to them for half price or less.

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05-14-2010, 06:44 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
But to charge 10$ just to be able play online with your friends, it's a joke.
That never seemed to stop Xbox users!


and some of you are complaining about this NOW.... When's it been going on since oh.... MID-2009


Plus this will just LOWER the cost of used games... meaning it'll end up being the same price for a used game NOW and you get the "DLC"

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05-14-2010, 07:55 AM
  #98
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To the people who say it doesn't bother them because they don't buy used games, what about renting games? I have GameFly and I rarely buy games anymore. My logic is why pay $60 for a game I'm probably not going to play longer than a month when I can pay for GameFly, split it with a few friends, and pay $10 a month to have one game out. That way I can beat it in a month, and I can go through a couple games for the same price as buying one. Now I won't be able to play most of the games I play online because GameFly isn't going to be sending me any codes.

Oh, and I highly doubt used game prices are going to drop by $10. If anything, it'll go down to $5 max. EA is trying to battle against Gamestop but it's also hurting GameFly.

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05-14-2010, 10:36 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Krejci46 View Post
To the people who say it doesn't bother them because they don't buy used games, what about renting games? I have GameFly and I rarely buy games anymore. My logic is why pay $60 for a game I'm probably not going to play longer than a month when I can pay for GameFly, split it with a few friends, and pay $10 a month to have one game out. That way I can beat it in a month, and I can go through a couple games for the same price as buying one. Now I won't be able to play most of the games I play online because GameFly isn't going to be sending me any codes.

Oh, and I highly doubt used game prices are going to drop by $10. If anything, it'll go down to $5 max. EA is trying to battle against Gamestop but it's also hurting GameFly.
As has been stated, there is a 7 day trial.

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05-14-2010, 11:10 AM
  #100
Jill Sandwich
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Lastly, are there a lot of you guys renting games for online? I rent singleplayer games I'm not willing to put 60 dollars down on. I got to play a lot of stuff I normally wouldn't.

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