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Old
05-10-2010, 09:25 PM
  #51
Sydor25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I agree that we MAY have the right prospects to fill the #2 center slot and the 3/4 defenseman position. It's going to be interesting to see if Lombardi thinks now is the time to roll the dice.
I'm certain the Kings don't have any players like Kovalchuk. The Kings will also not be picking in the top 5 for a while (hopefully). Talent like Kovalchuk are almost impossible to get via free agency.

Dean needs to roll all of the dice.

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05-10-2010, 09:26 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Does Sharp really add that much? Smyth, Brown, Williams and Simmonds are all potential 25 goal wingers. How many can get 50 or 60 goals? Who can even get 40 goals?

Sharp should be plan C or D.
That's my thinking. But if DL were to bring him in, he better add a top 4 D-Man as well. No point in sitting on $8M in cap space.

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05-10-2010, 09:33 PM
  #53
KINGS17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Does Sharp really add that much? Smyth, Brown, Williams and Simmonds are all potential 25 goal wingers. How many can get 50 or 60 goals? Who can even get 40 goals?

Sharp should be plan C or D.
Sharp has speed, he can play the point on the PP, he is responsible defensively, and can play center or wing. I'm not saying he is Kovalchuk, but the guy is damn good.

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05-10-2010, 09:37 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Sharp has speed, he can play the point on the PP, he is responsible defensively, and can play center or wing. I'm not saying he is Kovalchuk, but the guy is damn good.
I'm looking at it this way:

Kovalchuk
OR
Marleau + #5 D-Man
OR
Sharp/Versteeg + Top 4 D-Man

Any of those i'd be content with.

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Old
05-10-2010, 09:38 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Sharp has speed, he can play the point on the PP, he is responsible defensively, and can play center or wing. I'm not saying he is Kovalchuk, but the guy is damn good.
Yeah but is he better than our best forward because Kovy is.

Adding a Sharp would be interesting but I don't think he takes us to the next level like Kovy would.

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05-10-2010, 09:58 PM
  #56
Ziggy Stardust
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
Yeah but is he better than our best forward because Kovy is.

Adding a Sharp would be interesting but I don't think he takes us to the next level like Kovy would.
That's a good point. Comparing the top 6 forwards on the Kings/Hawks rosters...
  • Kopitar vs. Toews, at this point, have to give the edge to Toews.
  • Hossa vs. Smyth, this one is a no-brainer.
  • Kane vs. Brown, no contest here.
  • Sharp vs. Williams, Williams was supposed to be our version of Patick Sharp. Look at his numbers in Carolina to see what he was capable of. But again, no brainer. Patrick Sharp by a mile.
  • Versteeg vs. Simmonds, I'll take Simmonds here.
  • Handzus vs. Bolland, going to go with Handzus.
  • Frolov vs. Brouwer, Brouwer cracked 22 goals this season, but I'll cal this a wash or slight edge to Frolov.

In a nutshell, the Hawks top 3-4 forwards blow the Kings away. Inserting Sharp onto the Kings, I'm not sure how much better they will be. Sharp would be an upgrade over the likes of Frolov and Williams, but the Kings still need the extra fire power to add the extra "oomph" to the lineup.

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05-10-2010, 11:39 PM
  #57
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Anyone else think that also trading around would help us as well? Martin St. Louis I believe has wanted to get traded to an up and coming team. He has 1 year left with 4 mill. The guy still looks like he has it, a sniper who is lighting it up on a not too great team. I don't know who we could trade for him other than some draft picks and Stoll. Who else?

Top 9 Lines:
Smyth-Kopitar-St.Louis
Frolov-Richardson-Williams
Simmonds-Handzus-Brown

Scuderi-Doughty
Johnson-Hamhuis
Greene-Voynov

Something like that? Richardson really does not belong on the 4th line. His last playoffs shows it.

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Old
05-11-2010, 12:15 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Doughty8 View Post
Anyone else think that also trading around would help us as well? Martin St. Louis I believe has wanted to get traded to an up and coming team. He has 1 year left with 4 mill. The guy still looks like he has it, a sniper who is lighting it up on a not too great team. I don't know who we could trade for him other than some draft picks and Stoll. Who else?

Top 9 Lines:
Smyth-Kopitar-St.Louis
Frolov-Richardson-Williams
Simmonds-Handzus-Brown

Scuderi-Doughty
Johnson-Hamhuis
Greene-Voynov

Something like that? Richardson really does not belong on the 4th line. His last playoffs shows it.
I would do something like Stoll + Williams + Kozun + 1st for St Louis. Tampa still probably poops on that though.

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05-11-2010, 12:16 AM
  #59
KINGS17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
Yeah but is he better than our best forward because Kovy is.

Adding a Sharp would be interesting but I don't think he takes us to the next level like Kovy would.
Kovalchuk hasn't proven he can take a team to the next level. It's a fairly large gamble to just assume he can do it.

The St. Louis idea isn't bad BTW.

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05-11-2010, 12:18 AM
  #60
Ziggy Stardust
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If they can package Stoll and other assets to TB to get St. Louis and ship Justin Williams off to Philadelphia for Simon Gagne (saves Philly some cap space) ... then dip into free agency to sign a physical forward and middle pairing defenseman at reasonable contracts, the Kings could ice a competitive squad.

Gagne-Kopitar-Brown
Smyth-Schenn-St. Louis
Richardson-Handzus-Simmonds
Clune/Clifford-Lewis-Westgarth/Parse

Scuderi-Doughty
Johnson-Aucoin
Voynov-Greene
Martinez/Drewiske/Harrold

Quick-Bernier

That's a mighty fine competitive team with a balanced lineup.

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Old
05-11-2010, 12:20 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
If they can package Stoll and other assets to TB to get St. Louis and ship Justin Williams off to Philadelphia for Simon Gagne (saves Philly some cap space) ... then dip into free agency to sign a physical forward and middle pairing defenseman at reasonable contracts, the Kings could ice a competitive squad.

Gagne-Kopitar-Brown
Smyth-Schenn-St. Louis
Richardson-Handzus-Simmonds
Clune/Clifford-Lewis-Westgarth/Parse

Scuderi-Doughty
Johnson-Aucoin
Voynov-Greene
Martinez/Drewiske/Harrold

Quick-Bernier

That's a mighty fine competitive team with a balanced lineup.
Even if that's saving them some cap space, Philly won't do that.

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Old
05-11-2010, 12:26 AM
  #62
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I don't look at Kovalchuk as the catalyst for the team to take the next step, I look at him as a necessary cog in the wheel that Kopi, Doughty and Brown then must turn. Or perhaps, better yet, the grease that makes the wheel easier for the aforementioned Kings to turn.

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Old
05-11-2010, 12:33 AM
  #63
etherialone
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St Looey has already proven one time that he doesn't travel well in regards to socal. He was miserable as a "mighty" duck, so much so that he ran home back to fla. i wouldnt gamble on him.

I would go after Sidenberg as our ufa dman, stay at home guy who will likely be allot less cash than the big names and give us what we are looking for from our 5-6 guys. Stay at home and hammer em.

I like Sharp and Stteeg and would take a hard look at getting one or both of em.

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Old
05-11-2010, 12:36 AM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Kovalchuk hasn't proven he can take a team to the next level. It's a fairly large gamble to just assume he can do it.

The St. Louis idea isn't bad BTW.
Kovalchuk doesnt need to take us to the next level. We are at the next level. But having Kovalchuk may help Kopitar, Doughty, JJ and co take us to the next Level.

If we cant get Kovalchuk.

My ultimate plan be is Sharp+Versteeg that would be sick. But Chicago isnt going to trade to another Western Power house.

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05-11-2010, 12:51 AM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Kovalchuk hasn't proven he can take a team to the next level. It's a fairly large gamble to just assume he can do it.

The St. Louis idea isn't bad BTW.
He took an otherwise pretty crappy team to the playoffs.

and yes, i'm aware that Hossa & Kozlov were on that team as well.

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05-11-2010, 12:55 AM
  #66
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I keep seeing Martinez in the lineup proposals and so far all I have seen from him is a soft defenseman with little hockey sense in either zone and who looks lost 1/2 the time.

I don't doubt he has talent in there somewhere but I think he is a bit away from competing for a roster spot.

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Old
05-11-2010, 01:10 AM
  #67
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Kings need a legit top 4 dman. They don't need bridge or another O'donnel.

I'd take Hamhuis over Kovalchuk.

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05-11-2010, 01:11 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zad View Post
I keep seeing Martinez in the lineup proposals and so far all I have seen from him is a soft defenseman with little hockey sense in either zone and who looks lost 1/2 the time.

I don't doubt he has talent in there somewhere but I think he is a bit away from competing for a roster spot.
I agree with your assessment of Martinez. Drewiske is actually better. Problem is, Voynov isn't NHL ready (according to Manchester fans).

This is a big dilemma, as we currently only have 4 quality top 6 NHL defenseman.

If no one from Manchester is ready to step up, we'll need to sign 2 FA defenseman. And how are we going to afford Kovy/Marleau and 2 FA dmen? We can't.

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05-11-2010, 01:18 AM
  #69
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Kovalchuk+ development of our current roster players/prospects makes this team a Lord Stanley contender for at least the next 5+ years GUARANTEED.

DL knows this better than anybody and will try to do everything he can to bring this guy in. I don't doubt this for a second.

He has mentioned throughout the years that he will have one opportunity to add the final piece and he needs to make sure its the perfect fit. There are not a lot of Ilya Kovalchuk's in this league and I really don't want to waist my time arguing with anybody since it should be obvious.

Marleau would be a great fit but Kovalchuk he is not.

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05-11-2010, 01:41 AM
  #70
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Look, it's not complicated. You don't even have to go too far back to look for a parallel at work.

Forgive me Father for I am about to sin.

Kovalchuk is our Selanne. Add two inches, 30 pounds and keep all the positive attributes while losing the pacifier and incessant whining and that is what you have in Kovy. Do you begrudge Teemu because he doesn't play defense? He has had a role on the team and that is to put the puck in the net and make everyone around him as dangerous as he in the offensive zone. That my fellow freaks is exactly what Kovy will bring.

Every Stanley Cup team working backward 20 years has had a superstar offensive forward - one that buries the puck and is a scoring threat every time he touches the puck. They just come in varying degrees from generational talent (Crosby) to all star talent with other intangibles (Modano when the Stars won it as one example).

If you want the ultimate, you have to be willing to recognize certain ingredients without which the recipe does not work.

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Old
05-11-2010, 01:52 AM
  #71
AKAY47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KopitarFAN View Post
I'm looking at it this way:

Kovalchuk
OR
Marleau + #5 D-Man
OR
Sharp/Versteeg + Top 4 D-Man

Any of those i'd be content with.
I'm looking at it the exact same way.. My favorite option is the last, get Sharp or Versteeg and sign Hamhuis..

Sharp-Kopitar-Williams
Smyth-Stoll-Brown
Modin/Moller-Handzus-Simmonds
Richardson-Schenn-Lewis
Westgarth/Clune

Doughty-Scuderi
Johnson-Hamhuis
Greene-Voynov
Drewiske/Martinez

Bernier
Quick

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Old
05-11-2010, 02:27 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
Perhaps, you should pay closer attention to what I wrote before making accusations. What I said was a paycut or more likely a 4-5 yr deal.
Semantics. Still, you said "OR". Meaning one of those two would happen. Black or white, no gray area.

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05-11-2010, 02:31 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I would still prefer a stud #2 center, and a very good #3 or #4 defenseman, as I think that makes this team better and doesn't limit what can be done in the future.
A stud #2 center would be amazing, but Dean would likely have to find a new home for Stoll then -- opening up more cap room.

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Old
05-11-2010, 03:33 AM
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zad View Post
Look, it's not complicated. You don't even have to go too far back to look for a parallel at work.

Forgive me Father for I am about to sin.

Kovalchuk is our Selanne. Add two inches, 30 pounds and keep all the positive attributes while losing the pacifier and incessant whining and that is what you have in Kovy. Do you begrudge Teemu because he doesn't play defense? He has had a role on the team and that is to put the puck in the net and make everyone around him as dangerous as he in the offensive zone. That my fellow freaks is exactly what Kovy will bring.

Every Stanley Cup team working backward 20 years has had a superstar offensive forward - one that buries the puck and is a scoring threat every time he touches the puck. They just come in varying degrees from generational talent (Crosby) to all star talent with other intangibles (Modano when the Stars won it as one example).

If you want the ultimate, you have to be willing to recognize certain ingredients without which the recipe does not work.
I've been going back on forth on the topic of getting an elite sniper, but what you've written is basically what it all boils down to. You can't have a team full of hard, gritty character type guys trying to do it all and play their role well, because they will fail.

I don't know how much Kovalchuk will ask for, and if he really values playing for contenders instead of pretenders, but the Kings need to give it their best shot.

And some of these lineups are making me excited in an overly anxious way. This offseason should be interesting.

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Old
05-11-2010, 08:02 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by Kingz4life View Post
Kovalchuk+ development of our current roster players/prospects makes this team a Lord Stanley contender for at least the next 5+ years GUARANTEED.
I think 1 yr guaranteed, until DD, JJ, & Simmonds become free agents in '11, at which point we'd need to shed some serious depth b/c of salary cap. Then it becomes a question of how washed up guys like Symth become, cause I don't see people lining up to trade for his $6+mm cap hit.

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